Chronic Fatigue Syndrome

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cather

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Hey, I was just wondering if anyone has had chronic fatigue syndrome or chronic mononucleosis and what your experiences have been with this illness. I may have CFS, however, I still have to see a neurologist. I have had memory and concentration problems, eye twitching, allergies, and fatigue for several months.

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cather said:
Hey, I was just wondering if anyone has had chronic fatigue syndrome or chronic mononucleosis and what your experiences have been with this illness. I may have CFS, however, I still have to see a neurologist. I have had memory and concentration problems, eye twitching, allergies, and fatigue for several months.

Get a liver profile done and if your indirect billi is high then you possibly have epstein bar virus. This is what typically leads to CFS. But, getting old does it too. Most of america is this way. I was always tired until I became a runner. Now I have tons of energy and I only sleep about 4-5 hours a night.

Diet and exercise will determine a lot of this. If you intake a lot of caffine, you may have a reflexive fatigue. America is the chronically fatigued nation. We work hard and our GNP shows it! So does our BMI 🙁
 
cather said:
Hey, I was just wondering if anyone has had chronic fatigue syndrome or chronic mononucleosis and what your experiences have been with this illness. I may have CFS, however, I still have to see a neurologist. I have had memory and concentration problems, eye twitching, allergies, and fatigue for several months.

It's more likely that you're depressed. You may even have PTSD from medschool. That's actually not uncommon. My money says, take an SSRI and your CFS will clear up nicely. 😉
 
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phoenixsupra said:
It's more likely that you're depressed. You may even have PTSD from medschool. That's actually not uncommon. My money says, take an SSRI and your CFS will clear up nicely. 😉
PTSD from med school ? This isn't a war-zone...
 
Blake said:
PTSD from med school ? This isn't a war-zone...
I've seen people in my class with major anxiety episodes. It's possible....
 
The fatigue of a CFS patient is not the same as your garden-variety 'I'm tired all the time because I get 5-6 hours of sleep a night' fatigue. It can be as bad as having to choose between eating and taking a shower, because you don't have the energy for both.

I've often wondered if someone with more than just a mild case of CFS/FMS could make it though med school.

Find a doctor who actually specializes in it. Do not skimp on diet or rest, and get regular moderate exercise like walking. If you have CFS, likely will be managable.
 
Thank you all for your insight. I had mononucleosis several months ago and it's possible that I still haven't recovered from it...I don't have debilitating fatigue but if I push myself too hard, I get sick and have to sleep for a day. I sleep 10 hours a day, which is normal from me...I am trying to improve my memory and concentration but if I push myself too hard, I seem to get a mental block where my brain just can't work anymore.

It's almost like my brain equates learning with stress and so if I stress my brain too much, it will shut down. This has been going on for months and it has been very frustrating. All I can say is don't take your intelligence for granted. You medical students have a great gift, intelligence. Cherish it.
 
I don't think EBV (mono) causeses chronic symptoms, but it stays in your system an dcan cause reaccuring illness at large intervals in your life. I may be wrong though.
 
cather said:
Thank you all for your insight. I had mononucleosis several months ago and it's possible that I still haven't recovered from it...I don't have debilitating fatigue but if I push myself too hard, I get sick and have to sleep for a day. I sleep 10 hours a day, which is normal from me...I am trying to improve my memory and concentration but if I push myself too hard, I seem to get a mental block where my brain just can't work anymore.

It's almost like my brain equates learning with stress and so if I stress my brain too much, it will shut down. This has been going on for months and it has been very frustrating. All I can say is don't take your intelligence for granted. You medical students have a great gift, intelligence. Cherish it.
Seriously cather, you're burned out and depressed. 😉
 
Phoenix -

How could he get an idea whether he had PTSD? Are there pretty good symptoms or is it a pretty vague thing?
 
MoosePilot said:
Phoenix -

How could he get an idea whether he had PTSD? Are there pretty good symptoms or is it a pretty vague thing?

Most likely that he's depressed. But PTSD is not uncommon in medschool and is actually very common in residency programs. 😉
 
phoenixsupra said:
🙄 ******
Take a chill pill and breathe. It wasn't my intention to piss anyone off. It's just that I always thought PTSD was only in cases like rape, assault, tsunami, or something.
 
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Blake said:
Take a chill pill and breathe. It wasn't my intention to piss anyone off. It's just that I always thought PTSD was only in cases like rape, assault, tsunami, or something.
That's fine Blake. 😎 "******" isn't a particularly strong word in my book. You'll know it if you really do piss me off 😉

The "trauma" that causes PTSD can be just about anything. It's all down to the patient's/person's perception. People can even get PTSD from implanted memorys, and events they havn't actually witnessed.

My school has recently gone through a great purge on this issue after an unfortunate incident with a one of the second years. It seems depression is endemic here and adjustment disorder/PTSD occurs on a regular basis. Up untill now this has been fairly taboo and the few times did get brought up, it tended to be covered under the vague rubric of "burnout".
 
Blake said:
Take a chill pill and breathe. It wasn't my intention to piss anyone off. It's just that I always thought PTSD was only in cases like rape, assault, tsunami, or something.

That's kind of the impression I got from some of the websites I was checking out, but I prefer Supra's definition. I think long term abnormally high stress can build up no matter what the cause.
 
Typically people with CFS sleep way more than 10hrs a day (more like 20). While it is entirely possibly you have CFS (and that is a serious thing if you do), it is more likely you are depressed or have an adjustment disorder.

Either way... exercise is one of the best things you can do. That is easy to say I know, but its true. Both people with CFS and depression benefit from exercise.
 
Hang in there Cather, there are a lot of treatable conditions that can cause the symptoms you've described. Have you had any bloodwork done?

I was diagnosed with FMS a year before starting medical school, and fortunately I have been able to manage it well for the most part. I had fatigue, myalgias, etc for several years before finally getting the FMS dx. I had a lot of people tell me I was depressed, that it was in my head, etc...I do suggest you do a trial of an SSRI, maybe even two. But if they don't work, don't think you're crazy or that it's all in your head.

And if you are diagnosed with CFS/FMS/etc, don't think you can't handle medical school. With the proper planning and medical support, it is possible.
 
This is actually an interesting forum to bring up the issue of CFS/FMS. It seems to me that Americans get upset if a doctor suggests something might be psychosomatic, and this doesn't make sense to me. It's obvious that our mind and body are intricately connected. Just because a physical syndrome is a result of psychological causes doesn't make it any less real; the pain is still pain and the fatigue is still fatigue. I don't think doctors who say CFS/FMS are completely pscyhological are claiming that people who have them aren't sick. Treating these syndromes with SSRIs seems to work fairly well, and I've known of cases in which psychotherapy and/or environmental changes were also significantly helpful. But when people claim that the syndromes are actually caused by brain chemistry or psychology, patients get extremely upset. Like if there isn't a physical cause for their suffering, it's somehow less real or substantial.

We've come a long way in this culture towards accepting psychological conditions as normal, treatable illnesses. It's become much less of a stigma to admit that you are being treated by a psychiatrist. But somehow it is still unacceptable for a physician to make the connection between psychiatric conditions and physical manifestations. I know of some doctors who say privately that FMS and CFS don't exist at all, that they're just a product of a messed-up American lifestyle and priorities. I know other doctors who will insist that these are very real diseases with physical causes. Perhaps part of the problem is that by their very nature at "syndromes," they could well include a variety of conditions, some of which have a physical basis and some of which are psychological, but none of which have yet been properly diagnosed.

I suppose I'm somewhat rambling. I'm very curious about this issue. GPs and FPs are seeing more and more patients present with complaints like those of CFS and FMS, and I think it's important that we try to understand these syndromes better so that we can better serve our patients.
 
tigress said:
GPs and FPs are seeing more and more patients present with complaints like those of CFS and FMS, and I think it's important that we try to understand these syndromes better so that we can better serve our patients.

This is very true. I have been working the past year at a FP center who's physicians and nurse practitioners specialize in FM/CFS. It has been my experience that these conditions are as some people say "the yuppy wife syndrom", in other words total BS.

While there may be some underlying immunologic respose associated with it, ie chronic viral infection such as Herpes or EBV, the majority of these cases are depression related. Wait a minute before you hate me, depression is an illness, and these patients should be treated accordingly, with either SSRI's or similar antidepressants, and proper diet and plenty of excersize.
But I find it absolutely absurd that these patients are consulted to pain managment and given massive amounts of pain meds so that in fact they can not engage in physical activity that would alleviate their symptoms. Maybe I will eventually find some compelling evidence to support such a diagnosis, but at this point I, like many physicians are more inclined to say, PUT YOUR BIG GIRL PANTS ON AND DEAL WITH IT!
 
Hey thank you all for your posts and taking time to write responses.
My doctor said I don't have CFS/fibromyalgia but that it is possible I may have a neurological problem. Anyway, I got some tests done and I will go see a neurologist. I have had very strange eye twitching for several months. The twitch used to be on the outer part of the eye, now it is in the inner part of my eye.
 
Doc 2b said:
This is very true. I have been working the past year at a FP center who's physicians and nurse practitioners specialize in FM/CFS. It has been my experience that these conditions are as some people say "the yuppy wife syndrom", in other words total BS.

While there may be some underlying immunologic respose associated with it, ie chronic viral infection such as Herpes or EBV, the majority of these cases are depression related. Wait a minute before you hate me, depression is an illness, and these patients should be treated accordingly, with either SSRI's or similar antidepressants, and proper diet and plenty of excersize.
But I find it absolutely absurd that these patients are consulted to pain managment and given massive amounts of pain meds so that in fact they can not engage in physical activity that would alleviate their symptoms. Maybe I will eventually find some compelling evidence to support such a diagnosis, but at this point I, like many physicians are more inclined to say, PUT YOUR BIG GIRL PANTS ON AND DEAL WITH IT!

I tend to agree that a lot of these cases are depression related. I think there are certainly some people out there who just don't feel like doing much of anything, and look for doctors who are going to validate them. In my case, I didn't feel depressed, I was (and I'd like to think I am still!) a well-adjusted, content individual. I've done trials of three SSRIs, none of which helped, which leads me to believe I'm probably not depressed. I just started to feel tired all the time. And it got worse, and worse. I've had I think six diagnoses at this point of what is wrong with me. At this point, I think it's just the way I am, sometimes I need a little help to stay awake, but mostly I do just fine.

Many of my patients with FMS/CFS tended to sort of wallow in the diagnosis, and use it as an excuse for doing or not doing things. I don't even think about it most days. I'm in med school, I love what I'm doing, I have a great life. What else is there to think about?
 
Your absolutely right about patients wanting doctors to validate their complaints. But if you don't think about it everyday, your probably not one of those, and are just tired, a good vacation might do you some good.

I think validationg is what you are supposed to do as a physician, you listen, reassure the pt, validate their concerns, and lead them down the road to good health. However, FM and CFS popped up when doctors were either to afraid to confront a patient about psychosomatic illnesses or found a patient that they could fit into the right box and that is unwilling to be healthy. Thus we end up with a diagnosis for which we cannot prove or disprove, the worst thing is you can get disabilty for it!

While some of you may think I'm a monster for saying this, I think in some ways Darwinian Theory applies here. If these patients weren't offered pain managment and consecutive (costly) therapies to treat these fictitious illnesses, the patients would effentually take care of themselves. While I think every patient should be cared for, there is a limit. Doctors need to learn how to say no, and tell these patients to get over it. Show them appropriate diet and physical activities and let them decide whether they want to get well. There has to be some amount of patient accountability.

Unfortunately we live in the era of Wal-Mart wastelines and pill popping patients that, 1) don't want to stop detrimental habits as long as there is a pill to mask the sxs it causes, 2) smoke more than ever, 3) are more sedintary than ever, 4) eat larger than ever, and 5) want immediate satisfaction. Until we improve our healthcare system to manage the chronically ill, CFS/FM and it's comorbidities (i.e, obeseity, substance abuse, etc, etc) will continue to drain our system and pockets.

Sorry I'll stop ranting, just another day at work, man I about turned this into and anti-fat people post, that would use up to much bandwidth.
 
I'm under the distinct impression that there are some findings in FMS patients that show that *something* is going on ... I recall something about lower ATP levels, but can't remember where I read it. I've always felt a little iffy about the tender point exam, since the doctor's technique can be variable.

I've been wondering lately about what CFS/FMS patients did before the syndromes were recognized, say 50 years ago or more. Literature is full of recluses, or weak pasty people who don't go out much, or non-specific invalids. Maybe they worked until they could no longer do so, then starved. Or maybe they contracted something and died faster than a healthier person would have.

My husband, who has several fun fun medical issues (including FMS), was quite rudely rejected from the chronic pain program he was referred to. A better doctor has since found other issues - celiac, for one - which help explain why he's so sick. It may be tempting to dismiss yuppie diseases, but one does risk overlooking other serious issues.
 
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