Clinical Neuropsych Training and Career

[psyched-applicant]

I'm interested in pursuing a career as a clinical neuropsychologist and am particularly interested in neurodevelopmental disorders, testing, and educational consultation. I would love to work in a private or group practice! I think a PsyD program is a better match for me but would be open to PhD's that are open to their students pursuing clinical careers. Does anyone have any program recommendations for someone interested in neuropsychology or advance standing PsyD programs for students who already for graduate level credits?

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[WisNeuro]

I'm interested in pursuing a career as a clinical neuropsychologist and am particularly interested in neurodevelopmental disorders, testing, and educational consultation. I would love to work in a private or group practice! I think a PsyD program is a better match for me but would be open to PhD's that are open to their students pursuing clinical careers. Does anyone have any program recommendations for someone interested in neuropsychology or advance standing PsyD programs for students who already for graduate level credits?

The vast majority of clinical PhD graduates are in clinical careers.

 

[psyched-applicant]

Do you have any good programs/PIs you recommend prospective students look into?

 

[WisNeuro]

Do you have any good programs/PIs you recommend prospective students look into?

That is entirely dependent on one's research/clinical interests.

 

[psyched-applicant]

That is entirely dependent on one's research/clinical interests.

Totally fair! I am very interested in examining different interventions aimed at improving students with ADHD academic performance. I've come across different labs that look into educational interventions or coaching interventions, both seem interesting BUT it seems that most labs I come across were working on that a few years ago and have shifted away to other interests.

 

[WisNeuro]

Totally fair! I am very interested in examining different interventions aimed at improving students with ADHD academic performance. I've come across different labs that look into educational interventions or coaching interventions, both seem interesting BUT it seems that most labs I come across were working on that a few years ago and have shifted away to other interests.

Yeah, that'll be pretty slim pickings in clinical psych. I can't think of any labs off the top of my head in that niche.

 

[R. Matey]

Totally fair! I am very interested in examining different interventions aimed at improving students with ADHD academic performance. I've come across different labs that look into educational interventions or coaching interventions, both seem interesting BUT it seems that most labs I come across were working on that a few years ago and have shifted away to other interests.

Purdue might be a choice if you really want to go this direction, but honestly I think your goals would be best met with a school psych doctorate.

 

[psych.meout]

Purdue might be a choice if you really want to go this direction, but honestly I think your goals would be best met with a school psych doctorate.

Agreed. There's a School psych doctoral program near me and some of their students were doing practicum with the peds neuropsych psychologists in the same AMC clinic where I did my adult neuropsych prac.

 

[summerbabe]

I am very interested in examining different interventions aimed at improving students with ADHD academic performance.

Is this something intriguing that you’d like to spend some time researching and practicing or what you may want to dedicate a good chunk of your career to?

If the latter, neuropsychology is overkill and I agree with others that school psych would be a better fit.

Neuropsychologists absolutely get trained for ADHD and may do some of these evals, especially if they work for a hospital system.

But your average clinical, counseling and school psychologist should also be competent to do ADHD evals while neuropsychologists will be much more qualified to focus on things like dementia, TBI, and cog rehab (and will be paid to do this kind of work).

And in general, clinical and counseling psychologists will do very little with academic performance while that’s the bread and butter of school psychologists.

 

[bcliff]

Mark D. Rapport - Psychology

Website: Children’s Learning Clinic Editorial Board, Journal of Psychopathology and Behavioral Assessment Editorial Board, Behavior Modification Editorial Advisory Board, Journal of Child Psychology and Psychiatry Editorial Board, Journal of Clinical Child Psychology Editorial Board, Clinical...

sciences.ucf.edu

Ph.D. Program in Clinical Psychology - Psychology

sciences.ucf.edu

A name and program that comes to mind.

 

[borne_before]

As a homie with a PhD in school psych, I basically do what you do. Never worked in a school (other than my internship), two in my cohort have boards in a neuropsych (I didn't). Just find a strong program that emphasizes pediatric psychology and PhD training.

 

[psyched-applicant]

Is this something intriguing that you’d like to spend some time researching and practicing or what you may want to dedicate a good chunk of your career to?

If the latter, neuropsychology is overkill and I agree with others that school psych would be a better fit.

Neuropsychologists absolutely get trained for ADHD and may do some of these evals, especially if they work for a hospital system.

But your average clinical, counseling and school psychologist should also be competent to do ADHD evals while neuropsychologists will be much more qualified to focus on things like dementia, TBI, and cog rehab (and will be paid to do this kind of work).

And in general, clinical and counseling psychologists will do very little with academic performance while that’s the bread and butter of school psychologists.

These are definitely good points! I love working in a hospital setting and I am getting more familiar with TBI and cog rehab. The idea of working in a school as a school psychologist sounds so limiting to me. The intense burnout, the politics of a school system, and unimpressive pay are big reasons for me why I don't want a long career in a school. It seems daunting and I don't even have my degree yet. I'm also much more interested in topics about health, brains, ADHD research than I am about educational strategies.

 

[psyched-applicant]

Agreed. There's a School psych doctoral program near me and some of their students were doing practicum with the peds neuropsych psychologists in the same AMC clinic where I did my adult neuropsych prac.

That's awesome! What city is this in? Or what school if you are comfortable sharing! School Psych training definitely has its perks but I can't imagine myself working in a traditional school psych role without always wanting more.

 

[psyched-applicant]

As a homie with a PhD in school psych, I basically do what you do. Never worked in a school (other than my internship), two in my cohort have boards in a neuropsych (I didn't). Just find a strong program that emphasizes pediatric psychology and PhD training.

Thanks! Are you recommending a school psych program with a pediatric psychology emphasis or any PhD program with a peds emphasis?

 

[psyched-applicant]

Purdue might be a choice if you really want to go this direction, but honestly I think your goals would be best met with a school psych doctorate.

Thanks for your input! Just curious, why school psych and not clinical neuropsych? Is it because neuropsych also encompasses TBI, dementia, etc?

 

[psyched-applicant]

Yeah, that'll be pretty slim pickings in clinical psych. I can't think of any labs off the top of my head in that niche.

I guess I should have been born a few years earlier so I could have applied for for these programs while this was the focus. It seems the 2000s-2010s would have had a lot more options for me lol

Some of these labs have current students or very recent graduates who completed their dissertations on topics that really interest me but again it seems like the PI shifted their focus and is now interested on something in a completely different direction

 

[R. Matey]

Thanks for your input! Just curious, why school psych and not clinical neuropsych? Is it because neuropsych also encompasses TBI, dementia, etc?

That, your stated interested in neurodevelopmental disorder assessment, and a shorter overall timeline to beginning your career was behind my thinking. An MA in clinical psych may buy you some transfer credits, but I agree with others that it probably won't decrease your overall time to completion by that much.

Would your recommendation change if I said that my program does not have a PhD in School Psych (only Clinical PhD) and that I'm really not impressed with the program?

Do you think you have a really good shot at getting into this program without finishing your M.A.? If not, attending a funded program may mean moving away.

Thanks! Everything keeps pointing to the doctorate. I've been thinking clinical psychology and then clinical neuropsychology fellowship, but everyone keeps mentioning a school psych PhD so maybe I'll start looking into that. My program is a MA in Clinical Psych (whatever that means since I don't think I would be eligible for my state's LPC exam) with a school psych certification, meaning that the courses and training set me up for a career as a school psychologist.

I think it might be a good call. Use APA's search feature to look for doctoral programs. You can filter by school psychology. I know of one combined counseling and school program with pretty good history of funding if you wanted to keep your options open, but the reviews I've heard from students are honestly pretty mixed.

 

[R. Matey]

Mods, can we merge these two threads? It's confusing to toggle back and forth for what is essentially the same question.

 

[borne_before]

Thanks! Are you recommending a school psych program with a pediatric psychology emphasis or any PhD program with a peds emphasis?

School psych program. Plus, you get to focus on ALL the neurodevelopmental disorders. The school psych doctorate is really a specialization in neurodevelopmental disorders with emphasis on school laws and academic-behavioral learning.

Regarding the neurodevelopmental disorders, I can opine about how freaking interesting and common they are. Here are some cool thoughts, some half formed, I've been having lately:

• People don't find the specific learning disabilities(SLD) very sexy. But, c'mon, like 20% of kids have real issues learning how to read and 6-10% of people actually have dyslexia and like 40% of america can't read proficiently at the fourth grade level. You spend the first three grades learnin' to read (decode), then the rest of your life readin' to learn. What could be more important/holy/spiritual than helping someone read, because to read, you're able to learn from others thoughts/experiences without directly experiencing that.
• Dyslexia is interesting socially because if it doesn't destroy you (like only 10% of kids with a SLD go onto college), it might be able to confirm some benefits out of necessity. Not sure if dyslexic thinking is a real thing (Richard Branson the billionaire has an org dedicated to it). But, I do think academically successful people with dyslexia are special. Out of necessity, they, and this isn't empirical, tend to have some other robust strengths that allow them to outsource their weaknesses either through being strong socially (e.g., get others to do your work) or really dig into their strengths.
• I think that might be true for any disability - develop compensatory strategies and utilize strengths. When I was untreated ADHD as an undergrad, I was always organizing study groups and networking because the social stuff made boring stuff more enjoyable somehow.
• The whole SLD landscape is a messy quagmire. Literally the only well validated SLD are reading related. What do your mean by that? Dyslexia seems to have the clearest interventional pathway. But it sorta depends on what flavor you have (e.g., do you have trouble quickly recognizing words, connecting letters to their speech sounds, or both?). But the other ones are interesting. I have dysgraphia - I had an IEP. But, i've come to view it as a side effect of ADHD. In fact, I don't think i've ever seen it outside of a kiddo with ADHD. My handwriting and stuff gets better when I take stimulant medication. That being said, I have mixed feelings about my parents being antimedication. One, I would have taken about three years less time graduate and made many fewer errors (from wrecking cars to other impulsive decisions, etc.). But, no meds had forced me to develop other strengths and weird work ethic.
• Autism is cool right now. It's a weird developmental disability. Again, it's not the best validated and there seems to be some diagnostic drift. Historically, it's dope as hell because it differentiated so many people from intellectual disability. But, I see so many people people that half of good psychs would dx and half wouldn't. I joke with a colleague that "a person has autism because I diagnosed them with autism." This underlies a recent change about diagnosis and testing after I did a lil deep dive in to bayes, but basically no test we give has a filter rate of 100%, when we test for a condition, we filter through clinical interview, to tests, to rating scales, and deal with contradicting information, and still you might end up with a professional judgment, based on experience and "vibe" and what a diagnosis might do a family, while taking resource availability, insurance, and governmental systems into account. For instance, you might be more willing to diagnose autism in a kiddo if their IQ is higher, they're younger and would benefit from early interventions, and ABA. The cool/funny thing about ABA is that is really transdiagnostic.
• Poor intellectual disability, the ignored one right now. Personally, I love it. It's one of diagnosis I am always seeing in my clinic. Especially the mild ID homies. They often skate by, never identified, maybe because they have low average working memory or processing speed and get a SLD classification in all domains, even though that seems to overlook the specific part of a specific learning disability, only to burn out/become depressed in high school. Because they have mild ID, their problem solving skills usually suck and they're rejected by classmates for being odd, and often wind up suicidal. When really they don't need to be held back for the third time, they're not lazy, but they sure as hell don't need to learn prealgebra (because they can't). They do need to focus on life skills/adult survival/not being taken advantage of socially.
• my feedback pt showed up.