Community Based Residency Programs

[b&ierstiefel]

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I agree totally
It WAS a great thread, a topic not often touched upon
YOu should go ahead and post if it was related
I enjoy your opinions when they are related to the topic
The side tracking just gets out of hand, i know its fun but not all of the time
sometimes its weeks before anything substantial is put on this board
such a great resource should not be wasted

i agree...and it was a lot worse prior to these days...personally i think it's getting better. sidetracking occurs quite less these days...but i understand your frustrations. your point is well taken. cheers.

threads like this is similar to IMG vs. AMG or DO vs. MD threads. people have a variety of opinions. but one cannot take the extreme stance because they will get shat upon but those who take the other extreme stance. hence, what is offered instead are patronizing and moderated opinions which.

sure, i could be patronizing and say, oh this is great and that is great and everybody lives in a happy world...but c'mon, that gets us nowhere.

 

[DasN]

definately but you should express your opinion on the topic
I mean even if the posts get to right side vs left side some good info comes out in the responses
And community vs university isnt exactly MD vs DO
or IMG vs AMG garb
At this stage more info the better
so post your extreme view and ill defend it in only the rude and obscure way that I know how
Post andy and bring life back to this thread Doctor

 

[yaah]

sometimes its weeks before anything substantial is put on this board
such a great resource should not be wasted

I agree but at the same time there are only a few of us who ever post any substantial info. We get a lot of posts that ask the same questions repeatedly (or similar questions). I wish more people would post info about their programs (if asked) or their thoughts on things, etc, and it is encouraged.

 

[Pingu]

I agree but at the same time there are only a few of us who ever post any substantial info. We get a lot of posts that ask the same questions repeatedly (or similar questions). I wish more people would post info about their programs (if asked) or their thoughts on things, etc, and it is encouraged.

The problem with this is that all of our programs are relatively small and it is darn easy to figure out who is really who. I mean, if you walked into my program and said 'who likes shoes here?', about 30 fingers would point to me. Same thing with andy, if I walked in to BWH looking for a short asian PGY-1, I'm sure he wouldn't be hard to find. Heck, I'm sure there are university webpages with most of our pictures on it. There are a number of people on here whose anonymity is pretty much blown, which makes it harder to be brutally honest about things. I thought this thread was going pretty good though, as it is a topic I think people care about. Granted, I'm generally a frivolous person, so I also liked the fashion thread and the one we discussed fireplaces in. 🙄

 

[DasN]

im not saying that all the threads should be serious but just that they stick to their topic. If its about TV shows then talk about tv shows if its about programs then talk about programs. I do agree that our animinity is blown due to the small community that we make up, maybe thats why there are so many lurkers who feel that they cant honestly post. At the same time we should honestly post our opinions and try to regionalize them if possible. Instead of saying University of X totally sucks and all of the attendings are Diks we could say a university program in X state or X region sucks etc.
Because this site is so popular its hard to know who is reading what but the honest opinions and info provided in the past is what made this site so popular, we just have to adjust with the times.

 

[deschutes]

I think this board is (or can be) a huge equalizer for university and community programs in terms of making their presence felt amongst the medical student community. The thing is, people who visit and post on this site are generally self-oriented towards a university/tertiary referral setting in the first place. It is up to the community programs and those who are well-informed about them to level the playing field.

As for regionalization of comments, I think there is a real risk of sweeping generalizations!

Say I felt that that dermpath at the University of Minnesota (which is where I am) sucks ass (I don't know if this is true, but at any rate we don't have a fellowship). If I regionalized it, I would have to say that "dermpath sucks in the state of Minnesota".

And I'd bring the wrath of the Mayo Clinic down on my poor head, when I really don't know the slightest about dermpath at Mayo.

Even if I was anonymous, I would be hard-pressed to extrapolate it even further and state that "dermpath sucks throughout the Upper Midwest". Yikes.

Anonymity schnonymity. I've been trying to think of downsides of having my affiliation in my public profile and my picture on a university website. The picture is horrible, but that aside I doubt it would lead to a stalker being camped outside my apartment. At least people know I exist 😀 And I imagine people would be more sensible than to take my views to represent the views of the entire resident population at the U of MN, much less the department of pathology or the medical school.

 

[Brian Pavlovitz]

There are a number of people on here whose anonymity is pretty much blown, which makes it harder to be brutally honest about things.

Umm, I think I'm the only dolt who joined SDN using his REAL name! Now there's anonymity for you! 😀

 

[mcfaddens]

Umm, I think I'm the only dolt who joined SDN using his REAL name! Now there's anonymity for you! 😀

Yes but thats the genius of Pavlovitz!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[deschutes]

I think Mindy did too, and she certainly made no secret of being at MGH 😉

 

[1Path]

Anonymity schnonymity. I've been trying to think of downsides of having my affiliation in my public profile and my picture on a university website. The picture is horrible, but that aside I doubt it would lead to a stalker being camped outside my apartment. At least people know I exist 😀 And I imagine people would be more sensible than to take my views to represent the views of the entire resident population at the U of MN, much less the department of pathology or the medical school.

Great post! And speaking of that, I think the absolute BEST section on SDN is the pathology forum. Many times I can't decide if you guys are REALLY training to be pathologists or are all secretly moonlighting on SNL. Many times I crack my side laughing at what's posted here but can also appreciate the candor and realism here too. In all pathologists seem to be like so many of the ones I've met in person, a pleasure to know and work with.

Ok, back to secondaries! 😡

 

[quant]

Umm, I think I'm the only dolt who joined SDN using his REAL name! Now there's anonymity for you! 😀

Brian Mon
How s life holding up? How are things working for you?
Regards
Quant

 

[Brian Pavlovitz]

Yes but thats the genius of Pavlovitz!!!!!!!!!!!!

I never thought I would see my name eqated with "genius", but thanks for the vote of confidence! 😉

 

[Brian Pavlovitz]

Brian Mon
How s life holding up? How are things working for you?
Regards
Quant

I'm hangin' in there! Hoping for some news this week, as I begin a one month dermatopathology elective 😀

 

[Tidal]

The biggest problem with your thinking is assuming everyone has a clear idea of what they want and those traits are somehow appropriately conveyed in a half day visit to a program after flying the flipping red eye in from the opposite coast. You get there after having sat next to an uncomfortably obese woman who keeps putting her arm on your frickin arm rest, you fight through airport security, show up at some ass AM conference where you dont know crap and god forbid some assmonkey junior attending calls on you because you are there looking like a tool in a business suit (read: easy mark). Then a series of interviews where like 1/2 will be with dunghole research types because anyone doing surg path has better things to do than meet with 100+ scut biotch-to-be's that are paraded through each fall. You get a crappy cafeteria lunch, stale chips and an outdated cookie, if you are lucky then meet with the chairman who says "rah rah we own." Then back on the plane sitting next to another overweight American....

And somehow you are supposed to find a "marriage" in all that??

Be honest! 99% of us are status ******, pure and simple, we will go to the best most prestigous program that has the overall greatest chance of impressing that blonde at the local bar into dropping her panties...

Hey I think you CAN have your cake and eat it to. There are academic programs out there that are VERY diagnositcally driven. Look at MGH, UPMC, Cleveland Clinic, or Mt. Sinai! These are very prestigous and are mostly geared toward training awesome morphologists. But I agree that many big research programs might not be so hot when training you for patient care pathology.

 

[pathdawg]

The biggest problem with your thinking is assuming everyone has a clear idea of what they want and those traits are somehow appropriately conveyed in a half day visit to a program after flying the flipping red eye in from the opposite coast. You get there after having sat next to an uncomfortably obese woman who keeps putting her arm on your frickin arm rest, you fight through airport security, show up at some ass AM conference where you dont know crap and god forbid some assmonkey junior attending calls on you because you are there looking like a tool in a business suit (read: easy mark). Then a series of interviews where like 1/2 will be with dunghole research types because anyone doing surg path has better things to do than meet with 100+ scut biotch-to-be's that are paraded through each fall. You get a crappy cafeteria lunch, stale chips and an outdated cookie, if you are lucky then meet with the chairman who says "rah rah we own." Then back on the plane sitting next to another overweight American....

And somehow you are supposed to find a "marriage" in all that??

Be honest! 99% of us are status ******, pure and simple, we will go to the best most prestigous program that has the overall greatest chance of impressing that blonde at the local bar into dropping her panties...

And this is why I loooove reading LA's posts. Great stuff. Keep doing your thing, man.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

And this is why I loooove reading LA's posts. Great stuff. Keep doing your thing, man.

Agreed 100%.

I live vicariously through LADoc00. All this rah rah political correctness bullsh*t really irks me. LA tells it like it is and I agree with him on many issues.

 

[deschutes]

Oh well, some of us prefer to take our pleasures sadly... 😉

 

[yaah]

I don't really give a crap about status, I am discovering this more as I get older and I realize it doesn't make any difference to me whether I am famous or not. I just want to be happy, successful, and enjoy life, with as minimal bull**** as possible. Getting more status and "prestige" just leads to more bull****. This is my new philosophy. I will strive to be the best I can at what I do, and help others out, and not give a **** about prestige.

 

[Pingu]

I don't really give a crap about status

Amen to that, I just want enough money that I can shop my way around the world while doing pathology! And a room in my house solely for shoes and purses! I have such altruistic goals! 😍

 

[deschutes]

I think part of this status obsession is that it's always easier to blame someone for your own unhappiness than it is to blame yourself. 🙂

 

[hzma]

How about community based programs that are university affiliated? Like for example, there's a program in Mineola, NY, called Winthrop- and its affiliated with SUNY. But they only have 20K specimens a year. but they have lots of hours of lectures and stuff, and like I said they are univ- affiliated. So what do you think? Good/bad, not worth the trip?
Thanks!

 

[deschutes]

Hard to say. What do those 20K specimens comprise? How many residents are those specimens divided amongst? And what sort of learner are you? What are your career goals? I tend to like to see lots and be taught while signing out rather than listening to lectures, but that's me.

 

[hzma]

Hmmm. I see what you mean. I guess it'll be clearer if i actually go visit. Ithink its imp. to ask the right questions, if u know what i mean.
tc.

 

[Pingu]

For specimens, you have to divide out the number of specimens by the number of residents to even do any sort of comparison. And even then, the numbers can be skewed. Where I went to medical school, they did mostly uncomplicated surgeries, lots of hernias and lap choles, but not a ton of colons or breasts or gastrectomys. My medical school also did not do neurosurgery. I am at a community program now and some days I will see 2 gastrectomys and some crazy colons and numerous other specimens. So you are looking for diversity as well as volume.

 

[yaah]

For specimens, you have to divide out the number of specimens by the number of residents to even do any sort of comparison. And even then, the numbers can be skewed. Where I went to medical school, they did mostly uncomplicated surgeries, lots of hernias and lap choles, but not a ton of colons or breasts or gastrectomys. My medical school also did not do neurosurgery. I am at a community program now and some days I will see 2 gastrectomys and some crazy colons and numerous other specimens. So you are looking for diversity as well as volume.

Yeah, crazy **** here. Double mastectomies and hemi oral cavity-ectomies and retroperitoneal sarcomas. Got a nose last week. Resident a few days ago had three total proctocolectomies for UC with dysplasia in one day. At many small programs you will never see specimens like sarcoma resections, whipples, pneumonectomies. Whether it is incredibly important to know how to do them since you may not see them at all in practice anyway I guess is debatable though.

But yes, specimen # can be misleading - a lot of places will have the majority of their specimens as certain types of biopsies (cervical biopsies, GI polyps) and it can be rare to see others. So diversity is very important.

 

[deschutes]

(Text of original post follows mine)

We had a faculty candidate here today, which made me think.

The part no one spelled out - either in the original post or the responses (thereby including myself) - is that this knowing-what-you-want business will continue to stalk you the rest of your career, especially if you go into academics.

Fast forward 4 to 6 years down the line. You're looking for a job.
You think your job interviews for a partnership position or assistant professorship are going to last longer than the usual half-a-day? You think you're going to have any better idea what you're in for when you sign your contract?

You'd better darn well have a clear idea of what you are willing to put up with (or not). You'd better devise some way of reading people and environments quickly and accurately, because no one is going to do it for you.
And you can wail about it all you want - but when that's done, what are you going to do about it?

Residency interviews are just a trial run for the real thing. The Match is not perfect (at the worst of times it sucks) but it is at least, organized.

Since it seems important to some people that **** gets shot, I'm shooting it.

The biggest problem with your thinking is assuming everyone has a clear idea of what they want and those traits are somehow appropriately conveyed in a half day visit to a program after flying the flipping red eye in from the opposite coast. You get there after having sat next to an uncomfortably obese woman who keeps putting her arm on your frickin arm rest, you fight through airport security, show up at some ass AM conference where you dont know crap and god forbid some assmonkey junior attending calls on you because you are there looking like a tool in a business suit (read: easy mark). Then a series of interviews where like 1/2 will be with dunghole research types because anyone doing surg path has better things to do than meet with 100+ scut biotch-to-be's that are paraded through each fall. You get a crappy cafeteria lunch, stale chips and an outdated cookie, if you are lucky then meet with the chairman who says "rah rah we own." Then back on the plane sitting next to another overweight American....

And somehow you are supposed to find a "marriage" in all that??

Be honest! 99% of us are status ******, pure and simple, we will go to the best most prestigous program that has the overall greatest chance of impressing that blonde at the local bar into dropping her panties...