Computer Engineer very seriously considering medical school

[Bluesun]

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EDIT: This is now basically my update thread 🙂, so no need to answer any of the questions I posed 3+ years ago. The top post is older. But it still basically applies.

Greetings to all, and my thanks for reading my post. I will try to make it as clear and concise as possible.

The good: I graduated in 2009 with a degree in Computer Science and Engineering. ****redacted for varying reasons -- too much personal info >_<*****

The bad: I was never a good student in undergrad until my last year or so. I didn't take school very seriously, and I got very depressed for at least a year or two. I never studied and rarely did my homework. My graduating GPA was in the realm of 2.8, with my science GPA being possibly above a 3.0.

I have not yet taken the MCAT, but I am shooting for a very high score. Traditionally, I do very well on tests and I am extremely confident about the PS and VR sections.

The advice I'm looking for specifically is:

1) What is the best course of action to ensure I take all of the correct pre-reqs? Should I speak to a counselor at a medical school I'd be interested in going to? Should I speak with my old university, even though I would not be taking premed classes there? Should I speak to a counselor at a community college where I would likely take the prereqs I need?

2) Given my low undergrad GPA, is it unrealistic to think I could get into a school like Case with a high MCAT score? Does my 'impressive' job factor in at all?

3) How do you non-traditional students live off of student loans? Is it as bad as it sounds? How did you deal with a change in lifestyle? I find it very difficult to part with the life that I have worked so long to achieve.

Thank you so much for your time and for reading this -- suffice it to say I am highly stressed about the entire situation. Honestly, though, I can't think of anything more interesting than becoming a doctor.

Cheers

 

[Reggie V]

Just as some background, I am a non-trad who used to practice law. My thoughts:

1) speaking to someone at a medical school never hurts, but you really need to research which undergraduate programs offer post-bacc programs in your area and talk with them. There is always a debate about the pros/cons of doing the pre-med courses at a community college. I did not, but am not gonna bash it. I do believe, however, that a pre-med committee letter is probably the most important LOR you can get, and they may not provide them at a community college. Also, established post-bacc pre-med programs provide a lot of additional resources that may be helpful. With your gpa, you really want to have every other advantage possible, this includes not only a strong MCAT, but also solid LORs, personal statement and med school interview practice.

2) I can't really comment on your chances of getting into Case. However, your job will help you. It may not be that helpful pre-interview, but it will definitely let you distinguish yourself at the interview stage. Most of my interviews consisted of discussing my legal career and how it would relate to a career in medicine.

3) Part of the adjustment in lifestyle will be easy b/c once you begin med school, your free time will diminish substantially anyways. But, you will definitely have to tighten the purse strings.

 

[Dzerzhinsky]

1) What is the best course of action to ensure I take all of the correct pre-reqs? Should I speak to a counselor at a medical school I'd be interested in going to? Should I speak with my old university, even though I would not be taking premed classes there? Should I speak to a counselor at a community college where I would likely take the prereqs I need?

Basically, what you need is as follows:

• One year of physics (calc-based or algebra-based)
• One year of inorganic chemistry
• One year of organic chemistry
• One year of college-level math (exact reqs vary, but if you have Calc I and II plus stats, you're good everywhere)
• One year of biology

For specific requirements (Hopkins, for instance, wants biochemistry), check the MSAR. It requires a subscription, but it's well worth it. Or you can go to individual school websites.

As well, you'll need clinical experience (interacting with patients), volunteering (to show your altruism; can be clinical or non-clinical, but in the interests of time I chose to do clinical volunteering and get two birds with one stone) and shadowing (following around a doctor and seeing what they do.) These topics have been covered elsewhere on SDN, so a search should help you.

2) Given my low undergrad GPA, is it unrealistic to think I could get into a school like Case with a high MCAT score? Does my 'impressive' job factor in at all?

An interesting background can help you. Unfortunately, it won't help you if you never get seen by a human because you're auto-screened based on GPA. A piece of advice: Stop thinking "can I get into a school like Case" and start thinking "can I get into a medical school." The general consensus on SDN seems to be that the interesting stories of nontrads are an asset, but everything else has to be in place as well. Killing the MCAT will help you avoid being screened out, but if you can take enough extra credit hours to get your GPA above 3.0, that would help a lot too.

3) How do you non-traditional students live off of student loans? Is it as bad as it sounds? How did you deal with a change in lifestyle? I find it very difficult to part with the life that I have worked so long to achieve.

Can't speak to this yet, as I'll be working right up until the day I matriculate, and I'm hoping to be able to continue to pick up 20 hours a week or so on a contract basis nights and weekends--which, in my field (not so far from yours), can support me quite comfortably. To be honest, though, this is one of those tradeoffs you have to make. How badly do you want it?

 

[Bluesun]

Thanks so much for the careful responses.

Basically, what you need is as follows:

• One year of physics (calc-based or algebra-based)
• One year of inorganic chemistry
• One year of organic chemistry
• One year of college-level math (exact reqs vary, but if you have Calc I and II plus stats, you're good everywhere)
• One year of biology

For specific requirements (Hopkins, for instance, wants biochemistry), check the MSAR. It requires a subscription, but it's well worth it. Or you can go to individual school websites.

I'm familiar with these criteria generally -- what I was really wondering about is whom I should speak with to get the best answer of what all I need. For example, biochemistry may be a better class to take as part of my bio requirement than biology 101. Like most engineers likely do, I have most all of the pre-reqs aside from biology and organic chemistry.

As well, you'll need clinical experience (interacting with patients), volunteering (to show your altruism; can be clinical or non-clinical, but in the interests of time I chose to do clinical volunteering and get two birds with one stone) and shadowing (following around a doctor and seeing what they do.) These topics have been covered elsewhere on SDN, so a search should help you.

I've read about these requirements, and plan to do them. I've also read that volunteering and shadowing can be a gigantic waste of time, which concerns me. I have a lot of things, but free time is not among them.

An interesting background can help you. Unfortunately, it won't help you if you never get seen by a human because you're auto-screened based on GPA. A piece of advice: Stop thinking "can I get into a school like Case" and start thinking "can I get into a medical school." The general consensus on SDN seems to be that the interesting stories of nontrads are an asset, but everything else has to be in place as well. Killing the MCAT will help you avoid being screened out, but if you can take enough extra credit hours to get your GPA above 3.0, that would help a lot too.

I guess I never realized just how dire my situation may be -- but that's one of the reasons I asked about my GPA. I am confident that I will be able to get into medical school, it's just a matter of how long and how difficult it will be. That, more than anything, is what I am trying to gauge currently.

Can't speak to this yet, as I'll be working right up until the day I matriculate, and I'm hoping to be able to continue to pick up 20 hours a week or so on a contract basis nights and weekends--which, in my field (not so far from yours), can support me quite comfortably. To be honest, though, this is one of those tradeoffs you have to make. How badly do you want it?

I do not plan on working at all while in medical school. I worked all through undergrad, and it is not an experience I would like to repeat -- especially when my grades are that important. My question was more aimed at judging just how difficult living off of student loans has been for those that have experienced it, and how much of an adjustment period there was to living on the super-cheap.

Again, thank you very much for your responses 🙂.

 

[Dzerzhinsky]

I'm familiar with these criteria generally -- what I was really wondering about is whom I should speak with to get the best answer of what all I need. For example, biochemistry may be a better class to take as part of my bio requirement than biology 101.

Since you're a computer engineer, I'm guessing that you're all set with your year of math and year of physics, but you might be a little light on bio and chem. I started out in that major in undergrad, and I know that my program required some inorganic, but I don't remember if it was a year, and I don't think we had to take organic at all.

You will almost certainly need a year of introductory-level bio with lab (everything is with lab, as I'm sure you know.) Upper level classes are nice to have, but mostly don't replace the intro stuff. There's a little wiggle room on this; my postbacc expressly recommends taking Bio I, then Microbio and Cell Bio (all three of which are four units w/ lab) instead of taking Bio I/Bio II. I'm hoping to get away with just Bio I and Cell Bio, but you will almost certainly need to take Bio I and another course such as Bio II, Microbio, or Cell Bio; biochem is generally an "in addition to nice to have" upper-level, like Genetics. It doesn't replace that year of relatively low-level bio.

Absolutely you can try calling medical schools, but their requirements are laid out fairly well on the individual websites or in the MSAR. I would steer clear of relying on your pre-health advising at either your undergrad or at the CC, since there is a wide spectrum of competence.

Tangentially, you want to be careful about prereqs at the CC, too; I originally had the same plan, but discovered from SDN that there is some bias against it due to perceived rigor and wound up doing the four-year instead.

I've read about these requirements, and plan to do them. I've also read that volunteering and shadowing can be a gigantic waste of time, which concerns me. I have a lot of things, but free time is not among them.

Same here. Last month, I was putting in sixty hours a week at work, twelve volunteering, and in class every weeknight. But it really comes down to "how badly do you want it, and what tradeoffs will you accept?"

I want it badly--I'm willing to do the above. But there are things I could do to make my application stronger that I'm not doing; research, for instance. I'm aware I'm weakening my application by not making time for research, but I'll accept that risk.

Not having volunteering or not having shadowing won't necessarily absolutely kill you, but it adds flaws. The way I look at it is you get one, maybe two flaws, and you've already used yours with the GPA. (Me too, by the way; I did some pooch-screwing in undergrad, so don't think I'm picking on you.) Make the total package as appealing as you can.

I guess I never realized just how dire my situation may be -- but that's one of the reasons I asked about my GPA. I am confident that I will be able to get into medical school, it's just a matter of how long and how difficult it will be. That, more than anything, is what I am trying to gauge currently.

You really very much want to get above a 3.0 at minimum, or you will go in a lot of auto-reject piles.

Have you/will you considered D.O. at all? They do grade replacement, which will help a lot in getting to that 3.0.

I do not plan on working at all while in medical school. I worked all through undergrad, and it is not an experience I would like to repeat -- especially when my grades are that important.

I worked through undergrad, too, and I definitely understand where you're coming from. However, just as a point of clarification, your grades in medical school are much less important than your performance on Step 1, as evidenced by the fact that many medical schools use a pass/fail system during the didactic years.

My question was more aimed at judging just how difficult living off of student loans has been for those that have experienced it, and how much of an adjustment period there was to living on the super-cheap.

Hopefully someone else will be able to speak to this!

 

[PTWOB02]

The good: I graduated in 2009 with a degree in Computer Science and Engineering.

The bad: My graduating GPA was in the realm of 2.8, with my science GPA being possibly above a 3.0.

1) What is the best course of action to ensure I take all of the correct pre-reqs?

2) Given my low undergrad GPA, is it unrealistic to think I could get into a school like Case with a high MCAT score?

3) How do you non-traditional students live off of student loans? Is it as bad as it sounds? How did you deal with a change in lifestyle? I find it very difficult to part with the life that I have worked so long to achieve.

I have similar GPA stats like you so I can relate. As far as taking correct pre-reqs, you can do it either through a formal Post Bacc program or informally by taking classes yourself at any undergrad university close to you. I chose the formal route because I needed structure and advice along the way as it's been 10 years since my undergrad, so weigh both options carefully. Since you are looking at Case, I'm assuming you want to stay in Ohio. Doesn't Case offer their own Post Bacc program? Look at Cleveland State University and John Carrol University programs, among others. Here is a link to find Post Bacc programs near you. Stay away from SMP program for now. Those are graduate level programs for students who completed Post Bacc and still need to boost their GPA.

http://services.aamc.org/postbac/

I don't know if you necessarily need to speak to a counselor at your medical school. I mean, unless you have very specific questions related to admission, they most likely will direct you back to read the admission guidelines posted on their website. Pre-reqs are identical to all medical schools, with the exception of some schools requiring Stats, others Calculus.

Also, I wouldn't recommend taking Community College courses. Some people have done it with no problems and got accepted, but the general consensus is they are not rigorous enough, especially for students like us with low undergrad GPA. I took one semester at a local college, then transferred to a 2-year Post Bacc at UT Dallas. Strong reputation of the Post Bacc program is important with local medical schools. Remember, you are trying to restart academics after a sub-par undergrad, so you need to have fantastic GPA this time around, one that pops in the admission's eyes.

As far as getting into Case Western School of Medicine with low GPA, I think it's important for you to have BOTH decent GPA and high MCAT. Most medical schools will not even look at your application if your GPA is below 3.0, so work really hard to get that 3.7 - 4.0 GPA in your Post Bacc, which will push you over 3.0 cum GPA, as well as rock the MCAT when it comes time for it (score of 33 or more).

Living off loans is pretty hard. I gave up my previous career as a manager, taking substantial hit on my savings, so it's something to figure out if it's worth it to you. Realize, you'll get around $12K in Stafford loans, plus any private loans if your credit is good, so it is not a lot of money to live off. In addition to your school tuition, you still have to budget living expenses, anywhere from $12-24K per year. Life WILL completely change for you and your family (if you have one), so be completely realistic about the journey you are about to embark on. It's a long road ahead: 2-years of Post Bacc + Gap year + 4 years of Med School + 4 years of Residency = 11 years total. Make sure you are comfortable with that.

Best of luck.

 

[EdLongshanks]

There's a lot of previous advice on your situation already posted.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=827879

 

[Helen Wheels]

Bluesun,

I have posted on SDN before my regrets about going to CC for my pre-reqs. In fact, since you mentioned Case, go look at the CWRU med school web site: http://casemed.case.edu/admissions/process/requirements.cfm They state on there that they don't want to see someone doing all the pre-reqs at a CC. I know you'd be only doing bio and organic and not all of them, but clearly this school looks down on CC courses so why handicap yourself from the start? You may not need a formal post-bac program (these can be expensive) but I would lean toward taking your classes at a four year school.

Yes, all the med schools have web sites and in the admissions section they will all list their specific admissions and application requirements. So, look up the ones you are interested in. I would be very, very surprised if any CC has a "pre-med advisor." You are pretty much on your own at the CC. Though, advising at four year schools can be pretty shaky, too.

Bluesun, I didn't hear you mention that you had any clinical experience. If you don't then some clinical shadowing or volunteering will be critical. Adcoms expect you to have had reasonable exposure to what physicians actually do and what it is like to deal with patients.

 

[nabeel76]

Greetings to all, and my thanks for reading my post. I will try to make it as clear and concise as possible.

The good: I graduated in 2009 with a degree in Computer Science and Engineering. I currently work as a NASA contractor in long term spaceflight related projects. Suffice it to say that on paper, my job is impressive.

The bad: I was never a good student in undergrad until my last year or so. I didn't take school very seriously, and I got very depressed for at least a year or two. I never studied and rarely did my homework. My graduating GPA was in the realm of 2.8, with my science GPA being possibly above a 3.0.

I have not yet taken the MCAT, but I am shooting for a very high score. Traditionally, I do very well on tests and I am extremely confident about the PS and VR sections.

The advice I'm looking for specifically is:

1) What is the best course of action to ensure I take all of the correct pre-reqs? Should I speak to a counselor at a medical school I'd be interested in going to? Should I speak with my old university, even though I would not be taking premed classes there? Should I speak to a counselor at a community college where I would likely take the prereqs I need?

Unfortunately with a 2.8 GPA your going to have to do a very substantial post bacc - not just the bare minimium med school prereqs here. Your going to be competing with students that have 3.6+ GPA's at even the lowest tiered medical schools. Therefore your going to have to take at least a full year of post bacc courses (at 3.7+ GPA) and then follow that with a strong showing at an SMP. A high MCAT will not alleviate that low of a GPA - your application will not even make it past most screens with a GPA below a 3.0.


2) Given my low undergrad GPA, is it unrealistic to think I could get into a school like Case with a high MCAT score? Does my 'impressive' job factor in at all?

Like I said above, your going to need a year of postbacc minimum, a SMP, a high MCAT, and the usual EC's to have a chance at any US med school. Getting into a school like Case is difficult for students that already have high (3.7+) GPA's and good MCAT's (33+). So first get your app to a state where you are competitive for any med school and then give it a shot - keeping in mind that it's going to be a long shot.

And oh, as a 2009 college grad, your not as non-traditional as you may think you are. Although your work sounds interesting, which may help the convo at the interview stage, it's going to do little to nothing to get you that interview. There are many applicants that have post-college work experience in the sciences, engineering disciplines, etc. The only jobs that seem to really have an impact on the application process are those that are in the lines of clinical health care - EMT's, Paramedics, etc.

3) How do you non-traditional students live off of student loans? Is it as bad as it sounds? How did you deal with a change in lifestyle? I find it very difficult to part with the life that I have worked so long to achieve.

Well, in a nutshell, depending on how old you are, most non-trads are married. And hopefully, your significant other is willing to help you financially through this process. Their income in addition to your student loans should keep you a float financially. So the big adjustment in lifestyle mostly comes from your loss of free time.

Thank you so much for your time and for reading this -- suffice it to say I am highly stressed about the entire situation. Honestly, though, I can't think of anything more interesting than becoming a doctor.

Cheers

Hope this helps.

 

[vc7777]

Whooa...dropped the ball on this one! My B!

Hi OP.

I'm Vc777. I'm usually hanging around these parts 😏

I'm a former Electrical Engineer, current Casemed student, and I had a crappy UG GPA (I brought my overall GPA up to a 2.87), and I had an excellent post-bacc, and a decent MCAT. I might be able to contribute a bit to this thread... 😀

Lemme read this in more detail...

EDIT: Ok...soooo...I have to say, the usual suspects on this forum have got you covered. Strong work nontrads! 🙂

I mostly agree with everything posted. I take issue with the idea that Case has a simple overall-GPA screen. We don't. Otherwise I would not have been accepted here. Twice.

Yes indeed it is a long shot. I am not saying I am proof you can get it in here (or anywhere). But I am saying, there is enough in common between you and I at this stage in the game to perhaps make some comparisons. If, however, you tell me you are fat and balding, then I will be creeped out and say you are stalking me! 😛

 

[liveoak]

blueson, where did you motivation for medicine come from?

another electrical engineer here. you really do need to brush up on chemistry because i know for a fact you computer engineers don't touch that stuff (outside of band gaps..:?)

🙂

 

[Bluesun]

Wow, thank you for so many useful responses! I appreciate all of you taking the time to read my story and type up a response.

Whooa...dropped the ball on this one! My B!

Hi OP.

I'm Vc777. I'm usually hanging around these parts 😏

I'm a former Electrical Engineer, current Casemed student, and I had a crappy UG GPA (I brought my overall GPA up to a 2.87), and I had an excellent post-bacc, and a decent MCAT. I might be able to contribute a bit to this thread... 😀

Lemme read this in more detail...

EDIT: Ok...soooo...I have to say, the usual suspects on this forum have got you covered. Strong work nontrads! 🙂

I mostly agree with everything posted. I take issue with the idea that Case has a simple overall-GPA screen. We don't. Otherwise I would not have been accepted here. Twice.

Yes indeed it is a long shot. I am not saying I am proof you can get it in here (or anywhere). But I am saying, there is enough in common between you and I at this stage in the game to perhaps make some comparisons. If, however, you tell me you are fat and balding, then I will be creeped out and say you are stalking me! 😛

You just gave me so much hope 🙂. What do you think set you apart, and allowed them to look past your poor undergrad GPA? Was it your performance in your post-bacc? Did the interviewers seem at all intrigued with your previous career as an engineer? I'm so glad you posted!


I have to run, but I'll try to come back and read all of the posts more carefully, and respond where necessary. Thank you again, everyone!

 

[vc7777]

You just gave me so much hope 🙂. What do you think set you apart, and allowed them to look past your poor undergrad GPA? Was is your performance in your post-bacc? Did the interviewers seem at all intrigued with your previous career as an engineer? I'm so glad you posted!


I have to run, but I'll try to come back and read all of the posts more carefully, and respond where necessary. Thank you again, everyone!

Well, the caveat I always have to put forth is that I am half-Hispanic, and premeds (mainly in the PA forum) enjoy implying my story is less impressive because if this. So, there, putting that out there first and foremost. 😛

Definitely my post-bacc and MCAT are what probably got me my interviews. It also doesn't hurt that I had 12 years between my undergrad and med school. So the argument that "I am not the same person I was when I graduated" went unchallenged.

Hmmm...It is very hard to say what overall it was. I was just talking in another thread about the ecological fallacy about applying stats about a population to individuals within that population. It is is dangerous to say it was all MCAT or post-bacc GPA that helped me get in.

I like to talk (look at the Case threads, if you don't believe me 😛 ). And I had great success in my interviews - and this cannot be predicted by GPA or MCAT. I wouldn't say they were "intrigued" by my work. Retrospectively, engineers (and engineering undergraduate students) are not "rare" applicants to medical schools.

Also, I don't think I mentioned this, but do NOT take any of the MCAT for granted because you are an engineer. In some ways being one is a handicap. There is no time for derivations. You need to have all your formulas memorize, and you need to have test skills like approximating enough to converge on the right answer and be disciplined enough to not bother with solving. Being lean-and-mean on the PS and BS sections is the name of the game.

Good luck.

 

[Bluesun]

Well, the caveat I always have to put forth is that I am half-Hispanic, and premeds (mainly in the PA forum) enjoy implying my story is less impressive because if this. So, there, putting that out there first and foremost. 😛

Definitely my post-bacc and MCAT are what probably got me my interviews. It also doesn't hurt that I had 12 years between my undergrad and med school. So the argument that "I am not the same person I was when I graduated" went unchallenged.

Hmmm...It is very hard to say what overall it was. I was just talking in another thread about the ecological fallacy about applying stats about a population to individuals within that population. It is is dangerous to say it was all MCAT or post-bacc GPA that helped me get in.

I like to talk (look at the Case threads, if you don't believe me 😛 ). And I had great success in my interviews - and this cannot be predicted by GPA or MCAT. I wouldn't say they were "intrigued" by my work. Retrospectively, engineers (and engineering undergraduate students) are not "rare" applicants to medical schools.

Also, I don't think I mentioned this, but do NOT take any of the MCAT for granted because you are an engineer. In some ways being one is a handicap. There is no time for derivations. You need to have all your formulas memorize, and you need to have test skills like approximating enough to converge on the right answer and be disciplined enough to not bother with solving. Being lean-and-mean on the PS and BS sections is the name of the game.

Good luck.

Have you ever typed out your full story -- your plan for success, how you came up with it, where you went to school, etc?

I'd really like to hear all about it. Our situations are so analogous, and you are where I want to be -- teach me the way!

 

[NuttyEngDude]

Have you ever typed out your full story -- your plan for success, how you came up with it, where you went to school, etc?

I'd really like to hear all about it. Our situations are so analogous, and you are where I want to be -- teach me the way!

try this one:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=8880998&postcount=13

also phtlz (i think his name is another inspiring engineer story):
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=10401794&postcount=37

and i hope you and I can write our own one day 🙂

 

[vc7777]

Have you ever typed out your full story -- your plan for success, how you came up with it, where you went to school, etc?

I'd really like to hear all about it. Our situations are so analogous, and you are where I want to be -- teach me the way!

Well...there's always my MDapps page, where I tell you all about my undergrad, my family, my post-bacc, my applications to every medical school, where I was accepted, where I am now. Or my signature where I talk about my med school. Or the Case thread where I am always to be found...Oh, and my twitter account to see what I am doing currently. Or the links posted above...Other than that I am Terribly Mysterious. 😏
(Just teasing you!)

Plan for success:

33% Luck
33% Stupidity
33% Effort
33% Failure to understand statistics 50% of the time (esp. my "chances" as declared by others on SDN).

 

[Bluesun]

I have some updates, so I may as well post them in my thread.

1) I've started taking (auditing) an online chemistry course through MIT's OpenCourseware to prepare myself for my first semester back -- I need to get As, and I will ensure I am prepared to do so.

2) I've applied to a local state university for an a la carte post-bacc with intentions on starting in Spring.

3) Thanks to my wonderful friends and family, I've been put in contact with two doctors for shadowing purposes -- a cardiologist and a GP. Both seem very friendly and excited to have me tag along 🙂.

I cannot tell you how excited I am about this entire endeavor. Ironically, I met 6 Case med students a few weeks ago while out and about as well. The general consensus between them regarding med school was "it's really not that bad". Did I mention I've started to fall in love with biology?

Lastly, thank you to this community (especially those select few, you know who you are) for your continued support and time invested in helping out your fellow humans.

À la prochaine!

 

[NuttyEngDude]

I cannot tell you how excited I am about this entire endeavor. Ironically, I met 6 Case med students a few weeks ago while out and about as well. The general consensus between them regarding med school was "it's really not that bad". Did I mention I've started to fall in love with biology?

hey good for you 👍

regarding your love for biology, I had the same feeling then i experienced some pretty bad bio professors. just remember how fun it is learning it as you are now, and this goes for any class you are enjoying. being older helps.

 

[Morsetlis]

The good: It's easier than engineering.

The bad: You have terrible grades, so you're not that smart in the first place 🙄

Consider a pre-med post-bacc or SMP. Tons of schools realize that there are career-field changers and have accommodated you by creating expensive programs designed just for you! Consult the stickied post-bacc / SMP threads.

 

[Bluesun]

Another somewhat notable update:

A friend of mine works for a local cardiologist, and he has agreed to let me shadow him two weeks from now. Suffice it to say that I'm ridiculously excited. He also has lots of other contacts (obviously), and if things go well, I was told to expect him to be able to refer me to lots of other specialties to shadow. THIS IS SO EXCITING!!!!!!

I know there are shadowing threads around here (which I've read), but I haven't seen much in the way of what exactly I should be expected to do. I'm naturally a very curious person, and I think I can tend to ask too many questions to the point of being a pest. At the same time, though, I don't want to end up just lingering. This man is doing me a favor, so I don't want to seem too intrusive or bothersome.

As a quick aside, I'm a huge fast car fan (my car = twin turbo 6 cyl), and he drives a Maserati 😍.

Again, thank you to all of you wonderful folks who donate your time to help those of us trying to get a handle on all of this -- some of us truly are grateful. <3

EDIT: I also got "accepted" officially to the university I applied to as a non-degree grad student. Woot!

 

[dmf2682]

The good: It's easier than engineering.

The bad: You have terrible grades, so you're not that smart in the first place 🙄

*like*

 

[jdnontrad]

Make sure you aren't jumping in with your eyes close, buddy. With the healthcare reforms and all, things (pay, etc) aren't going to be easier for doctors in the future.

 

[Bluesun]

Make sure you aren't jumping in with your eyes close, buddy. With the healthcare reforms and all, things (pay, etc) aren't going to be easier for doctors in the future.

What gives you the impression I'm jumping in with my eyes closed?

If it was about money, I would not be leaving the engineering field. Having said that, I still don't see doctors going below 6 figures, regardless of the reform.

 

[Bluesun]

Oh how the time flies... I haven't been around the forums much, but I've been busy!

I recently shadowed my second doctor, a hospitalist at a local hospital. It was a wonderful experience, and the doctor was a very straightforward guy. He was optimistic about my getting into med school (he also agreed that I may need to do an SMP), but he warned me about what specialties would be harder to get into. Most notably, he mentioned that anesthesiologists are starting to be picked from the top third of their classes now.

Interestingly enough, he also agreed with what some others have said (Q, I'm looking at you), that where you go isn't so important in most cases. His claim was that the education, by and large, is the same regardless of where you go. It may be presented differently, however, and some teaching styles may fit me better (which I kinda already knew, but was nice to hear from another person who has done the whole mess).

What surprised me most was his candidness about money -- how much I should expect to make, how much debt he had, etc. He also told me that, given my engineering background, if I made it through med school, I would have lots of options open to me -- another reassuring thing to hear.

Given his specialty, I was able to observe many different kinds of patients -- from old folks that have been smoking for 50 years (in one case, the gentleman had smoked 3 packs a day for almost 50 years...), to people addicted to opiate pain meds...it's just crazy to see what people do to their bodies.

I'm not sure that this post is particularly useful, but I'd like to keep writing my thoughts and experiences here as I progress.

I am also officially enrolled in a local university (got accepted...not that that's a big deal), and start my post-bacc this summer. I audited an online class through MIT, and I think that reawakened the student in me a little. I have also built a decent support network of people who I can use to help me study at the first sign of struggle.

Lastly, THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU again to all of the wonderful helpful people on this forum that have given me so much insight into what I need to do, and what I can realistically expect. I can't tell you how grateful I am.

Back to the grind!

 

[NuttyEngDude]

I'm not sure that this post is particularly useful, but I'd like to keep writing my thoughts and experiences here as I progress

It was extremely useful. Thank you!

 

[artsciencelove]

B.S. Computer Science, 3.3 undergrad GPA, 12 years as a software engineer, got accepted to medical school last month. You can do it. I had a 4.00 post-bacc GPA and a 35 MCAT, and I'm sure those were important factors.

I interviewed at Case this month. I will hear if I have been accepted this week. Case loves the students who will bring real diversity to their team-based learning, but you really have to demonstrate that you sincerely want to be there (and prove it with the MCAT and GPA).

You have a shot at this, don't give up!

 

[Bluesun]

B.S. Computer Science, 3.3 undergrad GPA, 12 years as a software engineer, got accepted to medical school last month. You can do it. I had a 4.00 post-bacc GPA and a 35 MCAT, and I'm sure those were important factors.

I interviewed at Case this month. I will hear if I have been accepted this week. Case loves the students who will bring real diversity to their team-based learning, but you really have to demonstrate that you sincerely want to be there (and prove it with the MCAT and GPA).

You have a shot at this, don't give up!

I can't tell you how much this meant to me. Thank you so much for the encouragement. I'm certainly dedicated to it, and I've been thinking about how to best convey that in my personal statement (even though I'm like 2.5 years from applying).

It is very reassuring to hear this. Consider yourself hugged, stranger. You'll have to let me know how you think med school compares to engineering school, and please do let me know what Case says!

Also, a huge congrats to you on getting accepted!

 

[Bluesun]

Continuing to add to my thread 🙂

First semester down! Only took one class, for varying reasons. One of them was adjusting to being a student again, which I was never very good at in the first place. I needed to learn how to study and how to get A's. I also apparently have test anxiety -- amazing how different things can be when you actually care about school! I came very close with an A- in the lecture and a high A in the lab. I was smiling for a solid day and a half. I know what I screwed up and why (as evidenced by my A on the final), and I feel much more confident about my ability to do well next semester. Chem II and Bio II, both with labs. Class M-Th instead of just M,W. 9 credit hours instead of 4.

For anyone interested, the method I decided upon for studying/learning the material is recording the lectures and making Anki cards from those lectures. It doesn't take a terribly long time to do (maybe an hour or two at a semi-leisurely pace), and having the key points in Anki cards that I reviewed daily was just the magic medicine for me. Especially with a subject like Bio where there are so many things to remember (Kreb's cycle, anyone?) (note: I say this because it is in stark contrast with all of the science/math courses I have taken in the past for my undergrad, where once you understand the concepts, you can apply them broadly -- I'm good at that, not so good at remembering misc., possibly unrelated names of things).

In October, I had to fly to TX for work for a week...missing an exam and a couple lectures, all of which I had to make up somehow. The exam I was scheduled to take as soon as I came back, the following Monday. I was hoping to have lots of time to study, but it didn't pan out that way at all. I would get back to my hotel around 9:00 or later, and just be roasted. Having to get up at 6:30am every day (absolutely cannot be late, no excuses) did not help.

I read blogs by medical students and medical school applicants from time to time. Every time I come across a blog post about studying for the MCAT and flying around to apply to schools, I start to feel angst building. There is just so much more to do, and there's that constant "you're not getting any younger, dude" pressure. I think it's hard to appreciate why this is really so difficult without going through it yourself. You can take classes while working a demanding job full time, but you're going to have to sacrifice. You're going to miss out on things you enjoy doing with people you enjoy. You're going to not have as much time to just let loose and relax. You need to schedule nearly everything around school.

Having said that, I still ask myself every single day "is this REALLY what you want to do?", the answer is still always the same. I really can't imagine working towards anything else.

Thank you all again for all of your constant help and encouragement. And thank you for reading my outbursts .

 

[Bluesun]

My, how the time flies...

Since posting in here last, I've completed two semesters of prereqs. Last spring I took Bio 2 and gen-chem 2 together while working full time. Combined with some difficult times in my personal life, that has to be the most mentally taxing 6 months of my life so far. It didn't help that the biology course I took, the faculty saw it necessary to skip over relevant material (like immunology and the endocrine system) and instead required us to learn an incredible amount of taxonomy. My brain was so fried by the end of it. My grades suffered and I ended up with a B in biology lecture and lab (although a high A in gen-chem 2, which I was happy about having not taken gen chem 1 for over 7 years).

Last semester I took ochem I and actually somewhat enjoyed myself. O-chem is interesting and I got a solid A in the class and lab. Last week I started the Kaplan MCAT prep course and today I start ochem-2. I'm scheduled to take the MCAT end of May. This is definitely going to be a full semester, but I think with patience and careful planning it will be manageable. Things are really starting to pick up at work, though, so there's some concern about going in too many different directions with too much intensity. Never enough time in a day...

I know of a couple of people that are currently in the process of doing interviews. In one case, the person is a better candidate than me on paper and has only received one interview -- definitely not very encouraging. I have to admit that as I approach the beginning of my application process, I'm starting to freak out a little. I've come across a couple of discussions about how we are quickly approaching a time when we will have more doctors graduating from med school than there are residencies to fill. That would be a pretty crappy situation to be in. Definitely a worse position than I'm in now, with very little debt and a good paying job. Or there's the possibility that I would end up really hating being a doctor, in comparison to what I do now, which I do get enjoyment from. Jumping into the unknown is difficult when you're warm and comfy.

I would ideally love to be working in the engineering field as an MD -- developing medical technology. I would be happy (in my imagination obviously, refer to previous paragraph) practicing in a few different specialties, but engineering is still something I'd like to be involved in. Whether as part of my primary job or something on the side. If anyone has any commentary on how feasible any of this is, feel free to chime in. I always welcome reality checks.

One last semester of prereqs and an MCAT are the only things in my way at this point. This all is going by freakishly fast... Thanks for reading, and any/all feedback is welcome.

Keep on keepin' on.

 

[NuttyEngDude]

work hard and kill the mcat. there will be plenty of time to freak out later during the application cycle. good luck! 😀

 

[Captain Sisko]

work hard and kill the mcat. there will be plenty of time to freak out later during the application cycle. good luck! 😀

By during, ned means throughout 🙂

 

[Goro]

First, know what the pre-reqs are. Generally, a year of Bio, two years of Chem, a year of physics (for example, that's what Alaby requires. Baylor has the same, but requires College English as well, and has a big list of "recommmended" classes.) DO programs may require a year a math (possibly through calculus).


1) What is the best course of action to ensure I take all of the correct pre-reqs?

Med schools don't provide counseling like UG schools do. You can ask an Admissions dean if you're competitive. However, as of right now, your GPA is not competitive for any MD or DO program, even with a 45 MCAT score.

Should I speak to a counselor at a medical school I'd be interested in going to?

No

Should I speak with my old university, even though I would not be taking premed classes there?

Yes.
Should I speak to a counselor at a community college where I would likely take the prereqs I need?

Not untill you ace your pre-reqs.

2) Given my low undergrad GPA, is it unrealistic to think I could get into a school like Case with a high MCAT score?

No
Does my 'impressive' job factor in at all?

Don't forget shadowing, and ECs, both clinical and non-clinical. And always have a backup plan.

Thank you so much for your time and for reading this -- suffice it to say I am highly stressed about the entire situation. Honestly, though, I can't think of anything more interesting than becoming a doctor.

 

[Captain Sisko]

Goro's advice isn't universal- i actually received counseling from my local medical school regarding plans for getting ready to apply, and I also consulted my old undergrad's premed office even though I was several years removed. Even had them go over my application before I submitted.

Give it a try- the worst you'll get is a polite "no, sorry"

 

[Bluesun]

Chiming in with another update... but first, I gotta say that the first post isn't terribly relevant anymore. While I appreciate the commentary...I don't think looking for answers to the OP questions is the purpose of this thread any longer. Moving on...

I finished up my last semester of pre-reqs a few weeks ago. It is absolutely insane how fast time flies. I know that's cliche to say, but it seems like I just decided to actually go through with all of this not long ago. Reflecting back on the last 4 semesters of classes, I have to say it was a lot more difficult than I anticipated. Not the material so much as managing all of those things at one time -- full time demanding work, school (this semester also adding in the Kaplan MCAT prep course) and just real life as an adult. I turned 30 this year, which was weird enough in and of itself.

Thankfully, in spite of being the sickest I have ever been in my life and having a bad reaction to the antibiotics I was given (ciprofloxacin), including an ER visit, ultimately resulting in a missed exam -- in spite of all of this, I still managed to eek out an A in my last prereq, ochem 2. I'm scheduled to take the MCAT tomorrow. I'll be sitting for the exam, but I'm planning on not scoring it. It's too late to reschedule or cancel to get any sort of refund, so I may as well attend it to see what the real thing is like. Unfortunately, the fact of the matter is that I'm just not ready. My best score was my last practice test which I got a 30 on. That's nowhere near where I need to be, which is the high 30's to make up for my abysmal GPA. My hope is that with another month or two of prep, I'll be ready. Once I get several more practice exams under my belt. Getting as sick as I did really put me behind. Bio is definitely my weakest subject, but thankfully I'm up to 12-13 in verbal.

Semi rambling post before my first official MCAT -- but just wanted to update my progress thread. Maybe one day I'll be posting about interviews and acceptance letters... Thanks for reading thus far.

 

[NuttyEngDude]

I'm scheduled to take the MCAT tomorrow. I'll be sitting for the exam, but I'm planning on not scoring it. It's too late to reschedule or cancel to get any sort of refund, so I may as well attend it to see what the real thing is like. Unfortunately, the fact of the matter is that I'm just not ready.

Take it and cancel, then make sure you are where you need to be. Good luck anyways, it will be an expensive drill 🙂

 

[kash650]

@Blueson

I just finished reading this whole thread and am really interested in your story. I'm a computer engineering major as well, just graduated, and looking into getting into med school too.

Anything you could update us with how things are going? Did you end up retaking the MCAT?



I fortunately took the premed classes (minus biochem and psych) during undergrad so won't have to take a post bacc course, but since I took them years ago I'm relearning it from the kaplan course before I take the mcat.

 

[EngineerToMed]

Have you got any updates?

 

[namllus13]

Any updates. I am in the exact same situation as you?