Cosmetic Dentistry Certification/Programs?!

[tx oms]

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at least they're not wasting 6 years of the best part of their life to go take out teeth and place implants - things you can do without a residency. - go be our second point of reference when a periodontist isnt available.

How about I be the final point of reference for all dentists. Doesn't matter who you are, if you aren't sure you're calling me in a hurry. People who take out teeth without a residency are the ones that keep me in business, taking out the roots they left behind. BTW, I'm pretty certain a pros residency doesn't teach me anything I didn't learn in dental school or couldn't read about in a book and do on my own. Try a neck dissection with your Netter's open beside you.

Pedo has been discussed ad nauseum. Bottom line, they learn to sedate and get hospital privelages.

Toofache, maybe the pros guy can start making my gunning splints. Omsres doesn't polish them right. Also, I am definantly a man. Ask Ms. Omsres.

 

[JavadiCavity]

I love to read tx_oms' posts.

 

[toofache32]

Also, I am definantly a man. Ask Ms. Omsres.

I heard his new youngster looks a bit like you. OF course, the first one looks like me.

 

[omfsres]

.

 

[toofache32]

Ya'll are going to make Darth Vader have to choke a bitch.

Why is it you're the one that's always made to be the b!tch around here? Such is life...

 

[tx oms]

Omsres, Hulk angry. You don't want to make the Hulk angry.

 

[ip]

BTW, I'm pretty certain a pros residency doesn't teach me anything I didn't learn in dental school or couldn't read about in a book and do on my own.

Oh for crying out loud, please tell me that you're joking.

 

[toofache32]

...I'm pretty certain a pros residency doesn't teach me anything I didn't learn in dental school or couldn't read about in a book and do on my own.

I'm not sure I agree with this. Waxing should really be done only under experienced supervision. Heaven forbid if you should over-contour your buccal cusps.

 

[ip]

I'm not sure I agree with this. Waxing should really be done only under experienced supervision. Heaven forbid if you should over-contour your buccal cusps.

True. After all, there are no procedures oral surgeons [prosthodontists] perform that are more invasive than extractions [waxups].

Seriously, is it keyboard courage at play or do you guys truly believe this? I'm not sure. Prosth is BS, Pedo is BS, Perio is BS, we all know endo is BS, is ortho BS too? Bottom line, is OMS the only worthwhile training?

You folks will do swell once you get out of that hospital and beg for implants/extractions!

 

[GQ1]

How about I be the final point of reference for all dentists. Doesn't matter who you are, if you aren't sure you're calling me in a hurry. People who take out teeth without a residency are the ones that keep me in business, taking out the roots they left behind. BTW, I'm pretty certain a pros residency doesn't teach me anything I didn't learn in dental school or couldn't read about in a book and do on my own. Try a neck dissection with your Netter's open beside you.

Pedo has been discussed ad nauseum. Bottom line, they learn to sedate and get hospital privelages.

Toofache, maybe the pros guy can start making my gunning splints. Omsres doesn't polish them right. Also, I am definantly a man. Ask Ms. Omsres.

Been out of town - now for the response. By the same token for the procedures many oral surgeons end up doing like 3rd molar extractions and implants i dont feel the need to go to residency for them. I learnt a great base in dental school and wont need to refer for that. Il be referring more endo, perio soft issue control but not dento alveolar which is bread and butter for a practice.

and its dentists screwing up that keep us in business - with their great ideas for a 'smile make over' or in depth and insightful tx planning for full mouth reconstuctions. ask a pros the last time he prepped a tooth a generalist hadnt screwed up first.

Dont you have a general surgeons posterior to go and kiss or take a beating from an orthopod - the real surgeons in your facility.

 

[GQ1]

I totally agree. Compared to spending a meager 3 years of full-time post-doctorate training learning to trim dies, earning an MD and completing a surgery residency look like a complete waste of time.

hey short stump - wait till youve been in the clinic for more than 0.75 years or however you re measuring it - like a 5 year old telling you their age. you seem like one of those guys who ll end up as a generalist and inadvertantly keep prosthos in business via screw ups a couple of years after you finish each "smile makeover" or whatevers new in dental economics that month.

you ll think the case is a success as the pt never came back to complain about it - cos they went to another guy, or you just plain wont be able to see whats happening to the case.

 

[aphistis]

hey short stump - wait till youve been in the clinic for more than 0.75 years or however you re measuring it - like a 5 year old telling you their age. you seem like one of those guys who ll end up as a generalist and inadvertantly keep prosthos in business via screw ups a couple of years after you finish each "smile makeover" or whatevers new in dental economics that month.

you ll think the case is a success as the pt never came back to complain about it - cos they went to another guy, or you just plain wont be able to see whats happening to the case.

Whatever makes you feel better about yourself, sport.

 

[ip]

Whatever makes you feel better about yourself, sport.

Yet another in the long line of dental students believing that prosth is learning how to make a 3 unit bridge. Wait till 5 years out into private practice, young pup. That's the point where all GP's begin a 15 year quest for CE that will turn their drill & fill practice into a real live prosth practice.

 

[ItsGavinC]

Dont you have a general surgeons posterior to go and kiss or take a beating from an orthopod - the real surgeons in your facility.

Wow, extremely weak response.

You're right about the real surgeons, the MD these guys have means little if anything.

 

[ItsGavinC]

Yet another in the long line of dental students believing that prosth is learning how to make a 3 unit bridge.

You're right, because prosth isn't about learning that. Although I'm sure prosthodontists list that on their CV, we all know that 3-unit bridges are made by the lab.

 

[GQ1]

Wow, extremely weak response.

You're right about the real surgeons, the MD these guys have means little if anything.

and this was a real stellar one from some poster


"When a fractured maxilla is sitting in the ER and has also broken the patient's dentures, it's comforting to know that someone is standing by to do the chairside re-mount. Don't forget the pumice."

its like telling the generalist - go polish some teeth.

what can i say, it seems oral surgeons also have a big ego in addition to prosthodontists.

 

[omfresident]

Wow, extremely weak response.

You're right about the real surgeons, the MD these guys have means little if anything.

unfortunate and irresponsible post from someone who calls themselves a modedrator. I gues I should appreciate the min. clinical experience you have. I guess this makes it easier to disregard edu., or fully appreciate what application this can have for those of choose to persue it.

 

[simpledoc]

gavin, in your attempts to generate some humor these days, am tired of your newly acquired sarcastic style of comments which actually sound so dumb and hardly make any sense! i know that you are smarter than these comments

 

[tx oms]

First, Gavin, I enjoy your posts. Thanks for the humor.

Next, it sounds like a few little pros wannabe's got their little feelings hurts. Here little boy, do you want a sucker? Aww, that's so cute. I hope you feel all better now. Now, shut-up and burnish that crown margin you pansy.

 

[GQ1]

First, Gavin, I enjoy your posts. Thanks for the humor.

Next, it sounds like a few little pros wannabe's got their little feelings hurts. Here little boy, do you want a sucker? Aww, that's so cute. I hope you feel all better now. Now, shut-up and burnish that crown margin you pansy.

now you ve finished kissing gavin's butt maybe you can go service one of the real respected surgeons at your school - you know those that THE PUBLIC think of as true doctors - neuro, ortho hell even OBGYNs are more respected. dont bring your inferiority issues to SDN

 

[aphistis]

now you ve finished kissing gavin's butt maybe you can go service one of the real respected surgeons at your school - you know those that THE PUBLIC think of as true doctors - neuro, ortho hell even OBGYNs are more respected. dont bring your inferiority issues to SDN

That's an excellent point. Personally, I think all this garbage about "being the best doctor you can be" is a bunch of hooey. We don't spend nearly enough time obsessing over what the ignorant lay public think, and I think it's high time we all got back to priority #1.

 

[toofache32]

now you ve finished kissing gavin's butt maybe you can go service one of the real respected surgeons at your school - you know those that THE PUBLIC think of as true doctors - neuro, ortho hell even OBGYNs are more respected. dont bring your inferiority issues to SDN

What on earth are you blathering about!?

 

[omfresident]

it souns like aphistis and gq1 need a time out. Come on itsgavinc, lets do our job and moderate.

 

[ip]

Is there a reason why everytime a specialty like Prosth, Perio, Pedo comes up in discussion the board needs to be infested by these infantile OMS residents with their inferiority complexes? Now their dental student cronies following them too?

Seriously, I have no idea who the owner of this website is but I'm pretty sure their intent wasn't for these people to monopolize the conversation and try and insult anyone who chose a career path other than theirs.

Take a look at the med forums, even when they have a thread on prestige there is no insulting eachother. I'd like to think that it's a single OMS intern wreaking havoc but this is getting to be ridiculous. These people are detracting from the website.

 

[aphistis]

it souns like aphistis and gq1 need a time out. Come on itsgavinc, lets do our job and moderate.

Gee, omfsapplicant and omfs_expert both get banned for trolling, and now omfsresident appears from nowhere and picks up the same posting patterns. Gavin, can we get an IP block on this guy?

 

[tx oms]

Is there a reason why everytime a specialty like Prosth, Perio, Pedo comes up in discussion the board needs to be infested by these infantile OMS residents with their inferiority complexes? Now their dental student cronies following them too?

Seriously, I have no idea who the owner of this website is but I'm pretty sure their intent wasn't for these people to monopolize the conversation and try and insult anyone who chose a career path other than theirs.

Take a look at the med forums, even when they have a thread on prestige there is no insulting eachother. I'd like to think that it's a single OMS intern wreaking havoc but this is getting to be ridiculous. These people are detracting from the website.

You know why I get pissed? I get pissed when I see dentists and other dental specialists, people in my choosen profession, that don't seem to care about being a doctor. People who just want money.

 

[ItsGavinC]

Take a look at the med forums, even when they have a thread on prestige there is no insulting eachother.

You must be reading the wrong forums. There is nothing but slandering and chest-pounding happening over there.

If you don't like what somebody says, then use the "Ignore" feature to block all of their future posts. Problem easily solved that.

Everybody is entitled to an opinion, and as long as there aren't personal insults being thrown around, the discussion may continue.

 

[lnn2]

You know why I get pissed? I get pissed when I see dentists and other dental specialists, people in my choosen profession, that don't seem to care about being a doctor. People who just want money.

I second that! exactly my sentiments!

 

[UTDental]

So you rip on all other specialties because they just want money and don't care about being a doctor? How did you make this connection?

You know why I get pissed? I get pissed when I see dentists and other dental specialists, people in my choosen profession, that don't seem to care about being a doctor. People who just want money.

 

[omfresident]

You know why I get pissed? I get pissed when I see dentists and other dental specialists, people in my choosen profession, that don't seem to care about being a doctor. People who just want money.

well said, there is more to this then money. Hopefully some of you are recognizing the benefit of helping people. If you wanted to make real money you chose the wrong proffesion.

 

[tx oms]

So you rip on all other specialties because they just want money and don't care about being a doctor? How did you make this connection?

I hear so many dentists and specialists pushing elective procedures like used car salesmen. Look, dentists and dental specialists are like vets. We really aren't all that necessary. When the economy is bad and things are tight, you can shoot your dog and solve all their health problems. Same with teeth. You can ignore oral health and treat all problems with extractions. Dentures aren't even necessary. Perhaps this dose of reality would help many dentists.

It seems to me that many dentists push patients hard to do things that really aren't necessary. My wife fired our vet the other day for the same reason--he kept insisting that my three year old dog have a $100 pre-op lab panel before a dental cleaning. Dentist do have to market b/c they are selling largely elective procedures. Hell, oral surgeons sell many elective procedures, too. If we stop here all dentists would be dirty used car salesmen. The redeeming quality is talking honestly with patients. I see people all the time who have spoken to dentists, specialists, and even other oral surgeons who don't seem to tell the patient the whole truth about treatment options.

Tell your patients about the benefits of your services and the quality of life issues involved in loosing teeth, but also tell them that those veneers you just installed will condemn the underlying teeth to a lifetime of expensive restorations. Oral surgeons should tell patients the truth about the necessity of wisdom tooth extractions. Attention pedodontists: every kid doesn't need braces, and if they do perhaps an orthodontist should place them instead of you.

I get sick of the money and profit drive that is so pervasive in dentistry. Every dental rag I get in the mail is about making money, pushing patients to do things they don't need, and working your hygienist harder. Every CE meeting is 50% on practice management and making money. Hell, most media stories about dentists these days have to do with money and how much money we're making.

Damnit, we're doctors, aren't we? What happened to being honest with patients and caring about the patient as a human rather than a carrying agent for a check book?

 

[lnn2]

Well said!!!

Doctors have to make a living too! but the important thing is that we have to adhere to our compasion, integrity and dignity. Otherwise, "all dentists would be dirty used car salesmen"!

 

[aphistis]

I hear so many dentists and specialists pushing elective procedures like used car salesmen. Look, dentists and dental specialists are like vets. We really aren't all that necessary. When the economy is bad and things are tight, you can shoot your dog and solve all their health problems. Same with teeth. You can ignore oral health and treat all problems with extractions. Dentures aren't even necessary. Perhaps this dose of reality would help many dentists.

It seems to me that many dentists push patients hard to do things that really aren't necessary. My wife fired our vet the other day for the same reason--he kept insisting that my three year old dog have a $100 pre-op lab panel before a dental cleaning. Dentist do have to market b/c they are selling largely elective procedures. Hell, oral surgeons sell many elective procedures, too. If we stop here all dentists would be dirty used car salesmen. The redeeming quality is talking honestly with patients. I see people all the time who have spoken to dentists, specialists, and even other oral surgeons who don't seem to tell the patient the whole truth about treatment options.

Tell your patients about the benefits of your services and the quality of life issues involved in loosing teeth, but also tell them that those veneers you just installed will condemn the underlying teeth to a lifetime of expensive restorations. Oral surgeons should tell patients the truth about the necessity of wisdom tooth extractions. Attention pedodontists: every kid doesn't need braces, and if they do perhaps an orthodontist should place them instead of you.

I get sick of the money and profit drive that is so pervasive in dentistry. Every dental rag I get in the mail is about making money, pushing patients to do things they don't need, and working your hygienist harder. Every CE meeting is 50% on practice management and making money. Hell, most media stories about dentists these days have to do with money and how much money we're making.

Damnit, we're doctors, aren't we? What happened to being honest with patients and caring about the patient as a human rather than a carrying agent for a check book?

Amen. 👍

 

[UTDental]

Well said. On the other hand this is the US and if there is a demand for something, that demand is going to be met. Everyone wants bright, beautiful teeth here. I'm sure the majority of these CE courses sprouted up because dentists were being approached by their patients for these cosmetic procedures- not the other way around. Now dentists are trying to meet the demand. But yes, I'm sure there is some sleaze out there making us look like car salesmen.
Another problem I see is overtreatment and poor treatment planning. It's alright to offer elective procedures, but be conservative and honest. I wonder how many veneer cases are told they are now married to those things and to expect to replace them every so many years.

I hear so many dentists and specialists pushing elective procedures like used car salesmen. Look, dentists and dental specialists are like vets. We really aren't all that necessary. When the economy is bad and things are tight, you can shoot your dog and solve all their health problems. Same with teeth. You can ignore oral health and treat all problems with extractions. Dentures aren't even necessary. Perhaps this dose of reality would help many dentists.

It seems to me that many dentists push patients hard to do things that really aren't necessary. My wife fired our vet the other day for the same reason--he kept insisting that my three year old dog have a $100 pre-op lab panel before a dental cleaning. Dentist do have to market b/c they are selling largely elective procedures. Hell, oral surgeons sell many elective procedures, too. If we stop here all dentists would be dirty used car salesmen. The redeeming quality is talking honestly with patients. I see people all the time who have spoken to dentists, specialists, and even other oral surgeons who don't seem to tell the patient the whole truth about treatment options.

Tell your patients about the benefits of your services and the quality of life issues involved in loosing teeth, but also tell them that those veneers you just installed will condemn the underlying teeth to a lifetime of expensive restorations. Oral surgeons should tell patients the truth about the necessity of wisdom tooth extractions. Attention pedodontists: every kid doesn't need braces, and if they do perhaps an orthodontist should place them instead of you.

I get sick of the money and profit drive that is so pervasive in dentistry. Every dental rag I get in the mail is about making money, pushing patients to do things they don't need, and working your hygienist harder. Every CE meeting is 50% on practice management and making money. Hell, most media stories about dentists these days have to do with money and how much money we're making.

Damnit, we're doctors, aren't we? What happened to being honest with patients and caring about the patient as a human rather than a carrying agent for a check book?

 

[DDSSlave]

I wonder how many veneer cases are told they are now married to those things and to expect to replace them every so many years.

Few. I wonder how many patients with otherwise beautiful but malaligned teeth were offered ortho? Probably just as few.

 

[ip]

Another problem I see is overtreatment and poor treatment planning. It's alright to offer elective procedures, but be conservative and honest.

This is exactly why people going through post-doc residencies should respect others doing the same. The #1 thing you learn in a residency is treatment planning. You learn to be conservative where others would jump in head first.

This is why I'm amazed and stupefied that some OMS resident here wrote that prosth residents learn nothing he didn't learn in dental school or could read up on in a textbook. Should be smart enough not to make a comment like that. Should be.

 

[aphistis]

This is exactly why people going through post-doc residencies should respect others doing the same. The #1 thing you learn in a residency is treatment planning. You learn to be conservative where others would jump in head first.

This is why I'm amazed and stupefied that some OMS resident here wrote that prosth residents learn nothing he didn't learn in dental school or could read up on in a textbook. Should be smart enough not to make a comment like that. Should be.

And one of the pros advocates wrote the exact same thing about oral surgery.

Look, each side's partisans seriously misrepresented the other side. There aren't any clean hands left in the context of this discussion.

 

[tx oms]

I have to make light of pros weenies. I mean, c'mon...they're prosthodontists, really.

In relation to an earlier post, the reason I rip on other specialties (though not all of them if you pay attention) is b/c it seems to me that certain specialties and many GP's care only about money, not being a doctor. Like the post in the HIV thread said, many times anyone that is complex or underfunded is sent to a specialist b/c they aren't an "ideal" patient.

If we, as a profession, want to continue to think oral care is necessay, we should act like it. Passing ourselves off as cosmetic dentists and getting rid of anyone who isn't rich implies dentistry really isn't a true necessity in healthcare but more of a luxury. BTW, that implication is dead-on accurate.

I think the advertising bugs me them most. There's nothing wrong with offering elective procedures that patient's want if there is adequate informed consent. In reality many doctors offer less than necessary treatment. I think the real problem is the gimmicky advertisements and stuff. I wish the term "smile analysis" would disappear and anyone who says that phrase would have their teeth rot out. I also wish I never see a picture of a smiling tooth again. Unless heart surgeons start putting smiling hearts on their big neon signs. Wait, heart surgeons don't have neon signs.

I am proud to say, though, that I saw an autistic, CP, MR kid this morning that receives regular care from a local, private practice pedontist.

 

[toofache32]

I am proud to say, though, that I saw an autistic, CP, MR kid this morning that receives regular care from a local, private practice pedontist.

...until you pulled all his teeth.