Current LPC - considering PhD. Question regarding focus and research match importance

[LaceyLPC]

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Hi all,

I've been a practicing MS-level LPC for four years, and am considering the idea of getting my doctorate. I have two questions in this post, please. 🙂

1) I understand that PhD programs are more research based than PsyD programs, in general. The only way I would ever consider getting a doctorate at this point is if it could be funded--it's not worth it to me to take on the debt of a PsyD. Thus, while many of the schools say they are "balanced" or some do say they are more researched based, are there more clinically based PhD programs? Where? Yes, I understand research will be a part of any of it, and I am okay with that...I just do see myself more in a clinical setting.

2) When schools want you to pick three (or so) professors you may be a good match with to do research, how much of that is really important? Going down the list of schools, many of the professors' research interests I have thought, "Well, I could live with working on that..." or, "that sounds kind of interesting, I guess?" But none of them (that I've found thus far) have just stood out to me like, "Yes! That is the path I want to go down!" Thoughts?

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I would suggest getting a copy of "Insider's Guide to Graduate Programs in Clinical and Counseling Psychology," or something similar, as this will provide you some information regarding different programs' clinical vs. research focus. In general, most folks who attend and complete Ph.D. programs will go on to clinically-oriented careers. Short answer: yes, there are more clinically-oriented programs, although research (as you've said) will still be significantly involved. You'll be in a research lab, will likely work on research projects throughout your time in grad school, and will complete a thesis and dissertation at the least.

The research match is very important. Most schools, particularly those with funding, have a mentorship model. That is, you're accepted by (and to work with) the individual professor more so than you are the grad program as a whole. Some are structured differently, of course, but that's the modal layout. You're going to want to steer more toward the, "yes!" than "eh, that sounds tolerable" reaction and level of interest. Ideally, you're also going to want to have some sort of research experience already; preferably, although not necessarily, in this area of interest. If the goal is a funded program, research experience will be a necessity for your application to be competitive.

 

[WisNeuro]

Hi all,

I've been a practicing MS-level LPC for four years, and am considering the idea of getting my doctorate. I have two questions in this post, please. 🙂

1) I understand that PhD programs are more research based than PsyD programs, in general. The only way I would ever consider getting a doctorate at this point is if it could be funded--it's not worth it to me to take on the debt of a PsyD. Thus, while many of the schools say they are "balanced" or some do say they are more researched based, are there more clinically based PhD programs? Where? Yes, I understand research will be a part of any of it, and I am okay with that...I just do see myself more in a clinical setting.

2) When schools want you to pick three (or so) professors you may be a good match with to do research, how much of that is really important? Going down the list of schools, many of the professors' research interests I have thought, "Well, I could live with working on that..." or, "that sounds kind of interesting, I guess?" But none of them (that I've found thus far) have just stood out to me like, "Yes! That is the path I want to go down!" Thoughts?

1) There are a ton, if you do a search through old threads of this nature, you'll find at least a couple dozen mentioned by name. And, the majority of PhD students go on to clinical careers, and in general, have more clinical hours than PsyD applicants on internship apps. So, the research/clinical dichotomy is a falsehood that has persisted despite our best efforts.

2) As AA said, extremely important. If you're deeply interested in something, it's much easier to write a 100+page dissertation on it than if you have only a passing interest.

 

[MCParent]

Hi all,

I've been a practicing MS-level LPC for four years, and am considering the idea of getting my doctorate. I have two questions in this post, please. 🙂

1) I understand that PhD programs are more research based than PsyD programs, in general. The only way I would ever consider getting a doctorate at this point is if it could be funded--it's not worth it to me to take on the debt of a PsyD. Thus, while many of the schools say they are "balanced" or some do say they are more researched based, are there more clinically based PhD programs? Where? Yes, I understand research will be a part of any of it, and I am okay with that...I just do see myself more in a clinical setting.

2) When schools want you to pick three (or so) professors you may be a good match with to do research, how much of that is really important? Going down the list of schools, many of the professors' research interests I have thought, "Well, I could live with working on that..." or, "that sounds kind of interesting, I guess?" But none of them (that I've found thus far) have just stood out to me like, "Yes! That is the path I want to go down!" Thoughts?

1. Aside from a couple ultra-research-powerhouses, most programs graduate lots of/mostly clinical people. There are not enough academic jobs for all of us to just train academics. It's hard to gauge this before an interview, but you could get proxies for it in materials. For example, does the program web site brag about all the great, varied clinical placements they have? Building prac sites takes investment from a program in clinical training, and having lots of solid, varied training sites suggests that the faculty value clinical training enough to build and maintain those relationships.

2. If you pick multiple faculty, just make sure there is a common thread. Saying you'd be fine with working with anyone is not a good strategy. But, if you want to look at, say, PTSD, and one person does that with adolescents and one does it with young adults, that's fine. Saying "I'm super passionate about research on schizophrenia in older homeless people with Dr. Jones, and also about adolescent risky driving behavior with Dr. Smith" makes no sense.

 

[SaraLance]

1) There are a ton, if you do a search through old threads of this nature, you'll find at least a couple dozen mentioned by name. And, the majority of PhD students go on to clinical careers, and in general, have more clinical hours than PsyD applicants on internship apps. So, the research/clinical dichotomy is a falsehood that has persisted despite our best efforts.

2) As AA said, extremely important. If you're deeply interested in something, it's much easier to write a 100+page dissertation on it than if you have only a passing interest.

#2 cannot be stressed enough. Anecdotally, I'd say that this is one of the biggest reasons for people dragging their feet on completing dissertations.

 

[MCParent]

1)
2) As AA said, extremely important. If you're deeply interested in something, it's much easier to write a 100+page dissertation on it than if you have only a passing interest.

That's hopeful 😛. I don't know anyone who wasn't SICK of their dissertation by the end of it. I sure was, and I was super into the topic. I think finishing the damn thing is more a matter of realistic approaches to writing (e.g., just sit down and write for three hours, it doesn't matter if it's written well, publication of this will require so many revisions you might as well just start from scratch, only three people will ever read this thing anyway) than interest in the topic, myself.

 

[LaceyLPC]

1) There are a ton, if you do a search through old threads of this nature, you'll find at least a couple dozen mentioned by name. And, the majority of PhD students go on to clinical careers, and in general, have more clinical hours than PsyD applicants on internship apps. So, the research/clinical dichotomy is a falsehood that has persisted despite our best efforts.

Hi, I've tried doing the search, but I'm having trouble choosing good keywords, hence why I asked here. I've tried "clinical focus," "research vs. clinical," etc. I've found a few things, yes, but not many. Thanks!

#2 cannot be stressed enough. Anecdotally, I'd say that this is one of the biggest reasons for people dragging their feet on completing dissertations.

So this may be an ignorant question, as I know you likely need experts in the field to guide you on your dissertation, but I didn't know you HAVE to do something along those same lines as your mentor?

 

[MCParent]

So this may be an ignorant question, as I know you likely need experts in the field to guide you on your dissertation, but I didn't know you HAVE to do something along those same lines as your mentor?

The expectation is that you will do something your faculty mentor has an interest in so they can judge the quality and contribution of your work. If you ask to do something no one else does, no faculty has time to become an expert in that topic just for your diss.