Depression as a shrink

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robot2216

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While I have no idea what it's like to work as an actual shrink, I can admire the ability to be able to hear about the meaningful parts of someone's life. Because of this, I've been thinking about switching my major over to psychology, however.. Does listening to the worst parts of someone's life day after day get to you?

I've been chatting with a lot of people recently over the internet, generally nothing more than a one day friend. I'm starting to manage to find the right words to get someone to open up almost instantly, however, I'm starting to not want them to. It's really starting to depress me.

I'll make sure to check back here, but I probably wont too many times. If you would like to, I would very much so enjoy it if you sent me an email ([email protected]).
 
So, I am currently working as a mental health therapist as I pursue my post-bac so I can apply to medical school. I have my masters degree in counseling, and I can say that there are ups and downs to this line of work. Yes, there are elements of it that can become draining, however you find that in any line of work. I know, where I work, it is so important that we all have an outlet to use to let go of our stress. We also have clinical supervision which is a good place to process what is going on with your clients.

With that being said, if you are looking into being a psychiatrist, at least from what I have seen, you really are not doing long, therapy type appointments. I currently work alongside a psychiatrist and sit in on up to ten appointments per week with the clients that I have therapy with, and she strictly (for the most part, of course) focuses on symptoms and medications whereas I may be focusing on the sources of their symptoms, etc...

So, just make sure you have somewhere to process any secondary trauma. I know that sometimes I definitely need someone to talk to at the end of a long day!!!

Hope that helps!!! 😀
 
During residency, the only issues that bugged me when listening to people's woes was when I had a Cluster B patient.

However with time, I learned how to manage their symptoms & draw the line & not be manipulated by them. After that, dealing with Cluster B stopped bugging me.

My tolerance for these patients is pretty high. I'm currently running a female forensic unit with a lot of Cluster B patients. The previous psychiatrists just ignored them and dealt with them minimally, and it shows. I don't think they were being medicated right.

However since I've taken over, I've instilled rules on the patients--no one is allowed to talk to me while I'm talking to another patient (several of them used to rudely demand I interview that person while I was still interviewing another patient), I'll medicate one of them if they become agitated--this was something the previous doctors weren't doing. They know it I'll do it, and the agitation has decreased big time. A lot of that agitation was pure Axis II.

However having about half my patients with borderline or histrionic DO is demanding.

The new thing that's causing me some emotional frustration is having to court order medications on psychotic patients whose concentration & memory are fully intact. When you court order meds on a psychotic patient who is disorganized, the meds will clear them up & they won't remember what happened. If they do happen to remember, they're usually thankful you did it because they'll notice the improvement in their thinking. When you do it to a patient whose concentration & memory are fully intact-well they remember you did this to them & they get upset at you & stay upset at you.

Some of the lesser experienced people here may argue-why force medicate someone whose concentration & memory are intact? Well Schizophrenia-Chronic Paranoid Type-this is often times the case. I got a patient right now and she thinks she's got computer chips in her head giving her messages, that an evil person from Washington DC is responsible for this, and she put a minor in danger because of her delusional belief in this computer chip conspiracy, yet she is fully cognizant & organized. I put her on court ordered meds because she is refusing antipsychotic medication. I can't discharge her because she's dangerous. She stated she's going to go to Washington DC to attack the monster that put the computer chips in her head. I have enough evidence to believe she'll attack some random innocent person, thinking that person is the evil-doer who surgically implanted the chips in her head.

She now hates me and compares me to a Nazi doctor for experimenting on her. Interviewing her is difficult and I really sympathize with her because she believes she is correct.

Most of my patients are thankful for the treatment I give them--or will be within a few days to weeks after they clear from their psychosis. In her case, I'm fearing that even with the right antipsychotic treatment, her delusions have been with her for years, and they may be fixed-in which case getting her discharged is going to be very difficult. She is a highly educated woman who had a productive life before she was committed. She frequently complains about being on a unit with low functioning psychotic people and I sympathize with her situation. She's been stuck on the unit for several weeks because I couldn't start medications until the court heard my case. They didn't schedule the hearing for weeks. IMHO, this is an injustice to patients. Its not the fault of the medical system but the legal system. If a patient fits the necessity for court ordered meds, and the court will not hear the case for weeks--even months-it forces an extension in the duration of inpatient involuntary commitment.

I just had a case today on a different patient where court ordered meds were requested months ago, but they only heard the case today. Making it worse, I had to drive over an hour to get to the court, then the judge ruled to have it delayed because the defense attorney didn't do his homework and wanted to read the chart more--so now the case is going to happen about 3 weeks later. Geez, ok screw the fact that they just wasted 4 hours of my time and I still have just as much clinical responsibilities I need to get done in 40 hours a week, this poor patient has to stay in her psychotic state, for a few more weeks with no improvement because someone didn't do their homework?

For the past week the situation was bugging me, but I can't do more to accelerate her improvement to get her out.
 
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Thanks for the story, whopper, I really enjoyed reading that.
 
I had an unusually rough day, mainly b/c of a brain injured guy admitted to my unit on what he thought were false pretenses. I spent literally half of my morning (like 4 patients' time on this one guy) trying to figure out why he'd been admitted, why his BP was so high, what meds he was realy supposed to be on, was he taking them, was he really the sole caretaker of 2 kids, where were those kids now... In the middle of this got called from the vice-president of the hospital b/c the patient had called his office demanding to be released. Got to clinic late, had three people in simultaneous crisis lots of histrionics and drama, AND my department chair calling because brain-injured guy had gotten ahold of him now!😱 (And of course I still had the other more "normal" patients to get through...)

The cure for this is pizza, beer, and "Don't Mess with the Zohan". And more beer. 😀
 
I had an unusually rough day, mainly b/c of a brain injured guy admitted to my unit on what he thought were false pretenses. I spent literally half of my morning (like 4 patients' time on this one guy) trying to figure out why he'd been admitted, why his BP was so high, what meds he was realy supposed to be on, was he taking them, was he really the sole caretaker of 2 kids, where were those kids now... In the middle of this got called from the vice-president of the hospital b/c the patient had called his office demanding to be released. Got to clinic late, had three people in simultaneous crisis lots of histrionics and drama, AND my department chair calling because brain-injured guy had gotten ahold of him now!😱 (And of course I still had the other more "normal" patients to get through...)

The cure for this is pizza, beer, and "Don't Mess with the Zohan". And more beer. 😀

I'd rather chocolate and amaretto, though....😉
 
I've picked up the attitude of... release them.. they will just bounce back.

I know I can't save the world... I know people don't want to be saved.. so I will wait until they realize they need to be saved... After they bounce back a few times... refer to a long term state hospital if they are dangerous or continue the cycle.

There is no point in forcing meds... yes they are ill.. they dont realize it, sooner or later if they really have schizophrenia or the differentials, they will just deteriorate. Of course in the case of bipolars... well what can i say, they need to hit rock bottom first after alienating family.
 
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I might suggest attending a few NAMI meetings before settling into the pattern you describe.
 
There is no point on forcing meds... yes they are ill.. they dont realize it, sooner or later if they really have schizophrenia or the differentials, they will just deteriorate. Of course in the case of bipolars... well what can i say, they need to hit rock bottom first after alienating family.

In the place you're working, very much so. Patients shouldn't be forced meds in an area where they are only there for a few days, unless they're acutely agitated.
 
During residency, the only issues that bugged me when listening to people's woes was when I had a Cluster B patient.

However with time, I learned how to manage their symptoms & draw the line & not be manipulated by them. After that, dealing with Cluster B stopped bugging me.

My tolerance for these patients is pretty high. I'm currently running a female forensic unit with a lot of Cluster B patients. The previous psychiatrists just ignored them and dealt with them minimally, and it shows. I don't think they were being medicated right.

However since I've taken over, I've instilled rules on the patients--no one is allowed to talk to me while I'm talking to another patient (several of them used to rudely demand I interview that person while I was still interviewing another patient), I'll medicate one of them if they become agitated--this was something the previous doctors weren't doing. They know it I'll do it, and the agitation has decreased big time. A lot of that agitation was pure Axis II.

However having about half my patients with borderline or histrionic DO is demanding.

The new thing that's causing me some emotional frustration is having to court order medications on psychotic patients whose concentration & memory are fully intact. When you court order meds on a psychotic patient who is disorganized, the meds will clear them up & they won't remember what happened. If they do happen to remember, they're usually thankful you did it because they'll notice the improvement in their thinking. When you do it to a patient whose concentration & memory are fully intact-well they remember you did this to them & they get upset at you & stay upset at you.

Some of the lesser experienced people here may argue-why force medicate someone whose concentration & memory are intact? Well Schizophrenia-Chronic Paranoid Type-this is often times the case. I got a patient right now and she thinks she's got computer chips in her head giving her messages, that an evil person from Washington DC is responsible for this, and she put a minor in danger because of her delusional belief in this computer chip conspiracy, yet she is fully cognizant & organized. I put her on court ordered meds because she is refusing antipsychotic medication. I can't discharge her because she's dangerous. She stated she's going to go to Washington DC to attack the monster that put the computer chips in her head. I have enough evidence to believe she'll attack some random innocent person, thinking that person is the evil-doer who surgically implanted the chips in her head.

She now hates me and compares me to a Nazi doctor for experimenting on her. Interviewing her is difficult and I really sympathize with her because she believes she is correct.

Most of my patients are thankful for the treatment I give them--or will be within a few days to weeks after they clear from their psychosis. In her case, I'm fearing that even with the right antipsychotic treatment, her delusions have been with her for years, and they may be fixed-in which case getting her discharged is going to be very difficult. She is a highly educated woman who had a productive life before she was committed. She frequently complains about being on a unit with low functioning psychotic people and I sympathize with her situation. She's been stuck on the unit for several weeks because I couldn't start medications until the court heard my case. They didn't schedule the hearing for weeks. IMHO, this is an injustice to patients. Its not the fault of the medical system but the legal system. If a patient fits the necessity for court ordered meds, and the court will not hear the case for weeks--even months-it forces an extension in the duration of inpatient involuntary commitment.

I just had a case today on a different patient where court ordered meds were requested months ago, but they only heard the case today. Making it worse, I had to drive over an hour to get to the court, then the judge ruled to have it delayed because the defense attorney didn't do his homework and wanted to read the chart more--so now the case is going to happen about 3 weeks later. Geez, ok screw the fact that they just wasted 4 hours of my time and I still have just as much clinical responsibilities I need to get done in 40 hours a week, this poor patient has to stay in her psychotic state, for a few more weeks with no improvement because someone didn't do their homework?

For the past week the situation was bugging me, but I can't do more to accelerate her improvement to get her out.

WOW, as a newcomer, preparing for med school, this is a HUGE eye opener as to how the system really works. Intense situation and I empathize with the patient. Sucks.
 
Debbie, don't let my mention of this prejudice you against Psychiatry.

I'm working on an inpatient forensic unit--the most dangerous of the mentally ill. People here have murdered, raped, burned houses down among other things and have been found not guilty by reason of insanity.

The vast overwhelming majority of patients are not medicated against their will. Those that are only done so if a doctor finds them an immediate danger to themself or others or unable to care for themselves due to their mental illness, and this then had to be further backed by 3rd party evaluators such as other doctors & a judge reviewing the case (though the specifics vary between states).

Trust me, there are bad things in every field of medicine. Court ordered meds, though rarely needed are a necessity. In this particular case, I just wish the legal system worked faster.

Most psychiatrists I've seen aren't in my situation.
 
I might suggest attending a few NAMI meetings before settling into the pattern you describe.

I'm not sure if you were replying to me or not, but I think I will. This is my first time hearing of NAMI, what are the meetings like? The next one for my area is on Monday, "general meeting."

If I can't enjoy meetings like this, I don't think switching my major will be a very good idea, haha.
 
While I have no idea what it's like to work as an actual shrink, I can admire the ability to be able to hear about the meaningful parts of someone's life. Because of this, I've been thinking about switching my major over to psychology, however.. Does listening to the worst parts of someone's life day after day get to you?

I've been chatting with a lot of people recently over the internet, generally nothing more than a one day friend. I'm starting to manage to find the right words to get someone to open up almost instantly, however, I'm starting to not want them to. It's really starting to depress me.

I'll make sure to check back here, but I probably wont too many times. If you would like to, I would very much so enjoy it if you sent me an email ([email protected]).

You sound pretty young. The defense mechanisms to keep from letting your work eat you alive take time to develop.

I never have a problem with getting involved emotionally, but I do WRT duty. Back in high school, it wasn't uncommon for me to spend upwards of 20 hours a week talkign to people about their problems. Same in college. I would often get involved to the detriment of my sleep and my schoolwork. Since it was informal stuff (even tho I got a lot of 'referrals' lol), there was no clear work/personal distinction. It wasn't till later in college that I developed the ability to set limits for MYSELF in terms of how much time and energy I would expend on these pursuits.

*shrug*
 
You sound pretty young. The defense mechanisms to keep from letting your work eat you alive take time to develop.

I never have a problem with getting involved emotionally, but I do WRT duty.
Pardon my ignorance, but what is WRT? And I had the impression that you were still in school. Maybe I have my wires crossed...
 
WRT=with regard to.

I am still in school. I was speaking only in the context of someone who has done a ton of informal and formal peer counselling.
 
WRT=with regard to.

I am still in school. I was speaking only in the context of someone who has done a ton of informal and formal peer counselling.
Ah, sorry. Thought WRT was some psych term I'd never heard of. I didn't get that it was an Internet reference at all. Your post makes a lot more sense now. My bad...
 
Ah, sorry. Thought WRT was some psych term I'd never heard of. I didn't get that it was an Internet reference at all. Your post makes a lot more sense now. My bad...

It's all good. I'm an internet junkie.
 
I'm not sure if you were replying to me or not, but I think I will. This is my first time hearing of NAMI, what are the meetings like? The next one for my area is on Monday, "general meeting."

NAMI is the National Alliance on Mental Illness (www.nami.org), an advocacy/education group primarily made up of family members of those with a serious mental illness, but also includes a lot of patients. They have LOTS of activities of interest to families, patients, and sometimes professionals. Their "Family-to-Family" classes run for 12 weeks and give a vast amt of info to families about illnesses, treatments, how the public/private Mental Health systems work, how/where/when to advocate for care for patients, and many other topics. The monthly "general meetings" are most often a combination of information (often a speaker) and business (upcoming events, new educational materials available, voting for officers, etc.). Some local affiliates are very welcoming of involvement by local MH professionals, some others less open to it.

IMHO, almost every patient/family involved in the public MH system should be encouraged to check out NAMI.
 
Yeah, I speak it as a late-learned second language. Folks writing in AIM chatspeak may as well be speaking Urdu for all I pick up.

ah WRT is actually internet forum hotheaded political debate shorthand.
 
Getting a little more to the original post's question, I never had a period where a patient who was depressed got me down. If anything, it inspired me more to get that patient better.

I mentioned the court ordered med case above because that was the most recent case to memory where I got bummed out. The previous one before that happened about a year earlier. I had a depressed patient, I did his admission, got him going on the right track, the right meds, he was getting better, then he got transferred to another psychiatrist who just completely botched up the job (out of laziness) on him and that got me real upset.
 
Getting a little more to the original post's question, I never had a period where a patient who was depressed got me down. If anything, it inspired me more to get that patient better.

I mentioned the court ordered med case above because that was the most recent case to memory where I got bummed out. The previous one before that happened about a year earlier. I had a depressed patient, I did his admission, got him going on the right track, the right meds, he was getting better, then he got transferred to another psychiatrist who just completely botched up the job (out of laziness) on him and that got me real upset.

We seem to be looking at the same thing from completely different angles, whopper. You see the patient as he leaves you-- happy and enthusiastic. I see them when they've stopped taking medication because they can't afford the cost, or for some other reason. When they've returned to the exact same behavior as they always have had. As a friend once told me, "Shrinks will tell you what's wrong, and how to fix it, but it means nothing if I can't find the motivation to do it myself."

If you begin to think that some people can never be happy, and you can't see how to be happy yourself in their position, becoming enthusiastic about helping the person is a little difficult.
 
We seem to be looking at the same thing from completely different angles, whopper. You see the patient as he leaves you-- happy and enthusiastic. I see them when they've stopped taking medication because they can't afford the cost, or for some other reason. When they've returned to the exact same behavior as they always have had. As a friend once told me, "Shrinks will tell you what's wrong, and how to fix it, but it means nothing if I can't find the motivation to do it myself."

If you begin to think that some people can never be happy, and you can't see how to be happy yourself in their position, becoming enthusiastic about helping the person is a little difficult.

I do think helping people with mental illness is challenging and can be sad. I like to look at it as I am doing my best to help someone else achieve mental health. Sometimes you will be able to help and sometimes you won't. You have to accept that you won't be able to help everybody and be okay with that. I find fulfillment in whatever help I can offer.
 
Well, sometimes it's difficult to help patients when the system is just totally against you in all ways.

Drugies want to go to state hospitals where they dont belong....

Psychotics/Manics dont want to go to state hospitals where they do belong....

To top that... many feel your job is not "real" or is not as important as someone's heart or stroke.

This is a difficult job. I am still early in the career but I do see some signs of compassion fatigue in some people.
 
You see the patient as he leaves you-- happy and enthusiastic. I see them when they've stopped taking medication because they can't afford the cost, or for some other reason.

I don't know if I'm misunderstanding you or you're misunderstanding me.

In the case I mentioned, the guy I was treating had Major Depressive Disorder with psychotic features.

I had him doing well on a low dose of Abilify & maxed out dose of Citalopram.

The guy was doing well on those meds. I discharged him on them.

Then the next psychiatrist he got (and mind you I was a resident at the time and he went to an attending) stopped his Abilify, put him on Zyprexa & lowered his antidepressant.

The patient's depression worsened, and even though his psychosis was gone (and mind you this wasn't Bipolar or Schizophrena, again it was MDD w/ psychotic features), the attending kept increasing the guy's Zyprexa...to the point where the patient could barely stand & was zonked all the time.

The patient's family called me up & told me they wanted me to get back on the case, but I could not. Remember, at the time I was a resident. I don't have a private practice. I called up the attending, told him that my regimen I prescribed worked. I asked the attending why he would put him on mega doses of Zyprexa when the guy didn't have a psychotic disorder, only MDD w/ psychotic features. The attending pretty much just blew me off.

Turned out the attending wasn't even really seeing the patient either. He just kept upping the guy's Zyprexa.

Case really ticked me off, then a few days later bummed me out.

It had nothing to do with the patient not being compliant or not wanting to get better. The patient wanted to get better, in fact took this attending's mega doses of Zyprexa, trusting this guy's medical opinion.

I don't fault the patient at all on this specific case. I blame that attending. Certainly substandard care.
 
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