Discrimination?

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.
radoncmonkey

radoncmonkey

Full Member
10+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Joined
Aug 31, 2006
Messages
161
Reaction score
1
Members do not see this ad.
Let me preface this by saying that I have done a search on the DO in Radonc issue, but my questions remain unanswered.

As an older student, it would be beneficial for me to go to a DO school(both financially b/c of a scholarship, and would not have to be separated from my wife and kids b/c of location). However, I really would like to hear from stephew and others on the interview trail about discrimination from DOs. As a PA, I've worked in oncology for a long time, and have worked for PDs who outright reject DOs. Their application doesn't even get a look, simply because they are DOs. Even thought I have research experience and pubs, I wonder if I will even be looked at because I will not have an MD behind my name.

I hear all the time the stories about Ken Wallner, etc. But I think many of the MDs who are attendings and PDs now could very well not have gotten into Radonc programs in today's competitive environment -- so throw in the perceived "disadvantage" of the DO in the minds of the older PDs, and it provides some food for thought. I am wondering what to do about the decision, and would appreciate any and all input.
 
first take all this advice with a grain of salt - i'm currently applying right now so its not like i'm a successful match story (hopefully i will be, but its not looking to good)...


that being said...i think if u definitely want rad onc....u need to do everything in your power to position yourself to get it...and i think having the DO would unnecessarily put you at a disadvantage.

that does not mean you cannot match. ive done two aways were there were DO residents and/or attendings


but, i think each year the applicant pool is dramatically shifting...this year there are supposed to be around 200 applicants....and all those people who don't get it, i feel like the majority will apply again next year (myself included)


now if you are considering another field (ER, heme/onc, rads), i think if it financially and geographically makes sense, you could potentially go to a DO school. but even for those, you are putting yourself at an unnecessary disadvantage....


most of my friends who are in DO school, like it lot and don't have many complaints


good luck
 
Hey
On the interview trail right now, and have seen a DO student on a couple interviews. No idea how many interviews he has, or how he will match, but he has received a few interview offers. I think he was smart in choosing a few programs to rotate as an away student in which he may have a chance to match.

That being said, I would think if you were willing to leave a nice life as a PA to pursue RadOnc, why not try to go for an allopathic school? If you are so set on RadOnc, perhaps moving your family for a 4-year stint may be worth the extra security you will feel come your match? I would think that may be worth the extra move, if that's what you are set on for your career. If you're not willing to make that extra sacrifice, maybe thinking about MedOnc with more options for geography may be in your best interests? While it sounds like your background may be quite convincing to any program director, I would compare it to trying to get to the NFL from a DII school from a DI school. Maybe do-able, but MUCH more difficult. Give yourself the best shot. Best of luck!
 
radoncmonkey said:
As an older student, it would be beneficial for me to go to a DO school(both financially b/c of a scholarship, and would not have to be separated from my wife and kids b/c of location). However, I really would like to hear from stephew and others on the interview trail about discrimination from DOs. As a PA...
Click to expand...

From another thread you started titled "Wanting to switch programs"

I am currently an intern who has matched into radonc. I am thrilled to have matched, but not exactly thrilled where I matched...especially because there are currently some changes happening that kind of scare me about the programs future...


Are you sharing your account, or what's the deal? I think we're all about anonymity here, but not about misrepresenting ourselves...
 
Cancerdancer said:
From another thread you started titled "Wanting to switch programs"

I am currently an intern who has matched into radonc. I am thrilled to have matched, but not exactly thrilled where I matched...especially because there are currently some changes happening that kind of scare me about the programs future...


Are you sharing your account, or what's the deal? I think we're all about anonymity here, but not about misrepresenting ourselves...
Click to expand...


The radoncmonkey account has been used by dozens of people. It's an account set-up for anonymous inquiries/posts. Anyone on the board has access to it.
 
RadoncMonkey,

Why do you want to stop being a PA? Becoming a doctor is not as glamourous as it sounds: 4 years of anxiety and stress to make great grades and board scores, crummy year of internship, 4 more years of residency with hellish exams to finish off the last 2-3 years. Then finally you start making enough money pay off the $150,000 in loans you've accumulated.

Hey, I'm all for you fullfilling your dreams. Just be aware that over the period of 9 years your kids will be nearly grown up, you won't be the young guy you are now, and all the while your friends and family will be enjoying the time off and financial stability that a regular job provides.

I don't regret my decision to be a doctor, and certainly don't regret becoming a Radiation Oncologist. But starting young, I believe, is a different story than going through everything after you already have a family and career.

As for DO vs. MD, it's an extreme uphill battle for DOs. Don't sell yourself short. If you're going to go for it, lay it all on the line and go MD, sacrifice your time to make the grades, complete research, do multiple externships, etc. In the end I hope it's all you dreamed it would be.
 
actually as some well versed in the "alternate pathway" scheme of medicine let me chime in. It is not in general an uphill battle for DOs. HOWEVER in radonc, yes it wont be as attractive. Is it right? No. Is it real? Yes. Unless you really had an outstanding cv (something increasingly difficult in this day and age of crazy bright people) the DO thing will in and of itself be viewed as a less desireable pedigree, like IMGs. Again, not fair, but true. If you do have that great cv people will ask you "why" are you a DO? read: What happened? Will it definitely stop you from being a radonc? No. BUt again, in this climate, every little leverage helps and you don't want anything that takes away from you. Indeed, even which allopathic school you go to is weighed in - far more than it should. But again when the competition is so fierce, they look for the most minute things to differentiate between candidates. Please spare me anti DO accusations. This is not a judgment on DOs in any way shape or form. This is a statement of the climate. There are DOs in the field and a DO CAN get a spot. BUT if you know you want radonc and have a choice, the best allopathic school you can get into is going to help. If you cant do allopathic? Kick butt in DO school and do all that research and those electives.
 
Bruce Banner said:
RadoncMonkey,

Why do you want to stop being a PA? Becoming a doctor is not as glamourous as it sounds: 4 years of anxiety and stress to make great grades and board scores, crummy year of internship, 4 more years of residency with hellish exams to finish off the last 2-3 years. Then finally you start making enough money pay off the $150,000 in loans you've accumulated.

Hey, I'm all for you fullfilling your dreams. Just be aware that over the period of 9 years your kids will be nearly grown up, you won't be the young guy you are now, and all the while your friends and family will be enjoying the time off and financial stability that a regular job provides.

I don't regret my decision to be a doctor, and certainly don't regret becoming a Radiation Oncologist. But starting young, I believe, is a different story than going through everything after you already have a family and career.

As for DO vs. MD, it's an extreme uphill battle for DOs. Don't sell yourself short. If you're going to go for it, lay it all on the line and go MD, sacrifice your time to make the grades, complete research, do multiple externships, etc. In the end I hope it's all you dreamed it would be.
Click to expand...

I'll just second this and caution you that med school is not everything and you will be surprised how easily you forget "how bad you want to be a doctor and get in med school!"

If you really do want to be a rad onc I would say go for MD. I'm in an allopathic school, 3rd year, got little above average boards and am sweating it like crazy to get this career! And even if you do get into an allopathic school every test, every class, and especially step I you'll have to kick some major butt (not to mention try to publish, do away rotations, balance your family life, etc.)

I'm not trying to be harsh, but I think everyone who is going through the grind here can say that if this is a fair warning and my hope that you will go all out right now and get into MD, don't go half way and end up doing bad on step I, finishing DO school, doing X more years in research and applications, and not getting in. Just go all out! (But if I were you, staying out of Med school and enjoying your kids as they grow up aint nothing to scoff at).

Good Luck to you 🙂

PS Bottom line you gotta kick butt all the way through... why not start now so you can get your MD?
 
I can see it beeing a tough decision since you have a family and a DO school right nearby. But in the long-term, if you get a residency you'll be more able "choose" a location for where you want to residency. If you go to a DO school, i think you'll have to work really really hard and will probably have to be willing to move any where where you can get a spot. Granted there are exceptions. Penn for example has a DO in their class right now who is a current second year.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top