Dismissal for graduate program

[babyoneill]

Hello. I've been dismissed from a clinical psychology phd program because I failed the comprehensive exam. I am bilingual and bi-cultural and I have a degree of deficits in language and written expressions. I sometimes find it difficult when I type up papers or give a presentation in class because of my background. I recently failed the comprehensive exam because I did not allow enough time to complete one of the category and had missed some questions. I know about the appeal process through the university, but I'm at the very early stage and still trying to process my situation. I do plan to appeal when the time is right, and at the same time, I'm also considering applying to other clinical psychology phd programs to try to continue my graduate school. Please help advise me on what steps to take in terms of the appeal process and what to expect when applying to another similar graduate program. Thank you!

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[EmotRegulation]

Have you talked to your DCT about this? Do you have a DCT you can talk to honestly/openly? I find it odd that a program would dismiss someone from failing a comprehensive exam without the opportunity to redo or remediate, though I suppose it's up to each program to determine their own policies. Were you (and everyone else, for that matter) told that the consequence of failing comps would be dismissal from the program? There's a lot to unpack here. You certainly deserve due process, and I sincerely hope your program isn't discriminating against you for your language/background...

 

[babyoneill]

Hi thank you for responding!

The university has a policy that states you only have two chances of passing the exam. And if you fail the second time, a letter of dismissal would be draft and send to the dean to start the dismissal process. I don't believe the have a remedial program for this, at least it wasn't convey to me. All I can recall at this time is that once the dismissal letter is sent out to the dean and to me, I will have a chance to appeal. I think that that is usually the case. I do plan to appeal, but it's going to be a uphill battle. I'm sorry, but what is a DCT? What are other persons to speak to about this that is usually at a university? Is it appropriate to speak to the president of the university or the assistant dean? Thanks!

 

[psych.meout]

Hi thank you for responding!

The university has a policy that states you only have two chances of passing the exam. And if you fail the second time, a letter of dismissal would be draft and send to the dean to start the dismissal process. I don't believe the have a remedial program for this, at least it wasn't convey to me. All I can recall at this time is that once the dismissal letter is sent out to the dean and to me, I will have a chance to appeal. I think that that is usually the case. I do plan to appeal, but it's going to be a uphill battle. I'm sorry, but what is a DCT? What are other persons to speak to about this that is usually at a university? Is it appropriate to speak to the president of the university or the assistant dean? Thanks!

Does that mean this is the second time you've failed comps?

 

[temppsych123]

If your program is accredited, there should be a handbook or manual of some kind that lays out requirements to graduate, to attain doctoral candidacy, etc. That handbook should lay out requirements, what happens if you don't meet them, and the appeals process. Regardless of whether your program is accredited, your university (whatever branch oversees graduate studies, there is usually a separate office for this) should have policies and procedures that they follow.

The likely person you should contact is your university ombudsman/ombudsperson, which is someone whose job is to act impartially to resolve issues that affect students, staff, etc.

 

[babyoneill]

Does that mean this is the second time you've failed comps?

Hi. Yes. I failed it twice. The first time I wasn't sure of the essay format they wanted. The second time, I ran out of time and did not complete all of the questions on one of the exams. Students only have 2 and a half hours to complete each exams.

 

[babyoneill]

If your program is accredited, there should be a handbook or manual of some kind that lays out requirements to graduate, to attain doctoral candidacy, etc. That handbook should lay out requirements, what happens if you don't meet them, and the appeals process. Regardless of whether your program is accredited, your university (whatever branch oversees graduate studies, there is usually a separate office for this) should have policies and procedures that they follow.

The likely person you should contact is your university ombudsman/ombudsperson, which is someone whose job is to act impartially to resolve issues that affect students, staff, etc.

Okay. Thanks. I will check whether there is an ombudsman at my university. I also checked the handbook, but I wasn't able to locate the layout yet. I will try again, or ask someone who may direct me where to look.

 

[babyoneill]

DCT = Director of Clinical Training

The director of clinical training is one of the faculties who over sees the comprehensive exam, thus, the dismissal process as well. I don't know how much help he could provide given his title and responsibilities. Any suggestions on this part?

 

[psych.meout]

Hi. Yes. I failed it twice. The first time I wasn't sure of the essay format they wanted. The second time, I ran out of time and did not complete all of the questions on one of the exams. Students only have 2 and a half hours to complete each exams.

It's sounding more and more like the program does have their procedures explicitly outlined and you might be out of luck if you failed the exam twice. Does the program handbook say anything about the remediation process after you've failed comps for the first time? Are there certain things they expected you to do or services, mentoring, or other process involved after the first fail? What did your adviser do after you failed the first time? If they've followed their remediation procedures and have a policy about dismissal after two fails, you might not have much ground to stand on.

Also, have other people been recently dismissed in this manner as well or is your case particularly unique or rare?

The director of clinical training is one of the faculties who over sees the comprehensive exam, thus, the dismissal process as well. I don't know how much help he could provide given his title and responsibilities. Any suggestions on this part?

Well, you need to find someone who knows how to navigate the program handbook and knows what the program's policies are about these issues. Maybe your adviser could help. Alternatively, the ombudsman could help.

Also, you mention being bilingual, but is English your first or second language? DId you have to take the TOEFL to get admitted to your program?

 

[babyoneill]

It's sounding more and more like the program does have their procedures explicitly outlined and you might be out of luck if you failed the exam twice. Does the program handbook say anything about the remediation process after you've failed comps for the first time? Are there certain things they expected you to do or services, mentoring, or other process involved after the first fail? What did your adviser do after you failed the first time? If they've followed their remediation procedures and have a policy about dismissal after two fails, you might not have much ground to stand on.

Also, have other people been recently dismissed in this manner as well or is your case particularly unique or rare?


Well, you need to find someone who knows how to navigate the program handbook and knows what the program's policies are about these issues. Maybe your adviser could help. Alternatively, the ombudsman could help.

Also, you mention being bilingual, but is English your first or second language? DId you have to take the TOEFL to get admitted to your program?

They do have their procedures explicitly outlined. After the first failed, they gave me some options that I could do before taking the 2nd exam. Such as, I could drop out of the program and not take the 2nd exam so that it doesn't hurt my chances of getting into another graduate program of a different discipline, see if I could get tested for a learning disorder; thus, if qualify I could have time and a half to complete the exam, or study really hard and go for it. I did not go and get tested for a learning disorder, because I don't feel like I have a learning disorder. I am slower at written expression because of my bilingual mindset. English is a second language so sometimes language gets in the way with articulation issue. The TOEFL was not a requirement, but I have taken it before and scored high.

Because they have their policies clearly layout, it seems that it will be difficult to convince them that the knowledge is there, except I ran out of time in completing some of the questions. Again, English as a second language does put me in a disadvantage, but I've improved after the second failed. What are some ways I could reframe this for a more compelling argument? Thanks.

 

[eeor1006]

I am sorry you are going through this. I can resonate with what you wrote about writing in English as a second language. I am also bilingual and I failed my comps the first time I took it. While there were other reasons that I did not pass, awkward grammar was definitely one of them.
Are you international? I would reach out to your international student programs re your situation.


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[temppsych123]

Unfortunately, because we are not at your specific school, we aren't going to have a lot of specific information to help you. In general, you should consider seeking out advice from people at your school who are supposed to assist students in these cases - that would be the ombudsperson/ombudsman, the student affairs office (or something similar), the international student office (if you are an international student), the dean or head of the graduate school, etc. I imagine that, once you receive the dismissal letter, you will get some more details about the specific options available to you.

Unfortunately, I am not sure there's a great way to "reframe" this to compel your program to give you another chance. It sounds like the program gives each student two attempts to pass the comprehensive exam, and if you fail it the first time, you can get tested to see if you have a disability that would qualify you for extra time to complete the exam. You chose not to complete that testing, so the argument that you ran out of time on the second test is probably not going to be very compelling. Of course, it is possible you could have done the testing and they would have determined you did not qualify for extra time anyway, but there is no way to know that now. It will be hard to argue that you needed more time, since you did not seek out the one option that could have given you more time, unless there is something we are missing about the testing (for example, if they were going to make you pay some huge sum of money to be tested, you could argue that is unfair).

 

[babyoneill]

Unfortunately, because we are not at your specific school, we aren't going to have a lot of specific information to help you. In general, you should consider seeking out advice from people at your school who are supposed to assist students in these cases - that would be the ombudsperson/ombudsman, the student affairs office (or something similar), the international student office (if you are an international student), the dean or head of the graduate school, etc. I imagine that, once you receive the dismissal letter, you will get some more details about the specific options available to you.

Unfortunately, I am not sure there's a great way to "reframe" this to compel your program to give you another chance. It sounds like the program gives each student two attempts to pass the comprehensive exam, and if you fail it the first time, you can get tested to see if you have a disability that would qualify you for extra time to complete the exam. You chose not to complete that testing, so the argument that you ran out of time on the second test is probably not going to be very compelling. Of course, it is possible you could have done the testing and they would have determined you did not qualify for extra time anyway, but there is no way to know that now. It will be hard to argue that you needed more time, since you did not seek out the one option that could have given you more time, unless there is something we are missing about the testing (for example, if they were going to make you pay some huge sum of money to be tested, you could argue that is unfair).

Thank you for the responses. I'm afraid it sounds like I'm out of luck. Once I get the dismissal letter, I'll ask about what steps to take to repeal the decision. It doesn't sound like I have a good chance, but I'll try my best. Aside from this matter and looking forward, what are the chances of getting into another clinical psychology Phd program? It may not sound promising, but are there options for students who have been dismissed from a Phd program such as myself?

 

[babyoneill]

I am sorry you are going through this. I can resonate with what you wrote about writing in English as a second language. I am also bilingual and I failed my comps the first time I took it. While there were other reasons that I did not pass, awkward grammar was definitely one of them.
Are you international? I would reach out to your international student programs re your situation.


No, I'm not an international student. I came to the US as a refugee and got my citizenship back in the mid 90's.

 

[MTLDR]

Hello. I've been dismissed from a clinical psychology phd program because I failed the comprehensive exam. I am bilingual and bi-cultural and I have a degree of deficits in language and written expressions. I sometimes find it difficult when I type up papers or give a presentation in class because of my background. I recently failed the comprehensive exam because I did not allow enough time to complete one of the category and had missed some questions. I know about the appeal process through the university, but I'm at the very early stage and still trying to process my situation. I do plan to appeal when the time is right, and at the same time, I'm also considering applying to other clinical psychology phd programs to try to continue my graduate school. Please help advise me on what steps to take in terms of the appeal process and what to expect when applying to another similar graduate program. Thank you!

While this is no doubt a very upsetting experience, it doesn't necessarily mean you still can't have a career in this field. I wouldn't put much faith in the appeal process, departments tend to close ranks around the staff, students are easily replaceable. I would encourage you to get research experience in another nearby school, if possible, gets some letters of reference through that process and then try applying widely next year. Don't give up hope.

 

[psych.meout]

While this is no doubt a very upsetting experience, it doesn't necessarily mean you still can't have a career in this field. I wouldn't put much faith in the appeal process, departments tend to close ranks around the staff, students are easily replaceable. I would encourage you to get research experience in another nearby school, if possible, gets some letters of reference through that process and then try applying widely next year. Don't give up hope.

Look, I don't want to discourage OP, but the chances of getting admitted to another doctoral program (or at least one that is funded and/or not a diploma mill) are going to be slim, at best, after getting dismissed from their program. There are very few spots at any given program as it is and each program is investing quite a bit of time, money, and effort into training you. Why should they risk all of these resources on an applicant who has already demonstrated that they can't couldn't pass comps vs. an applicant who doesn't have this history?

I guess OP could apply to programs that have moved away from actual comprehensive exams to milestones that are more germane to research or clinical practice, but I don't know that the faculty at these programs wouldn't still have reservations about them.

 

[WisNeuro]

The door will be shut at many programs. I'd be looking into alternative ways to get what you want out of a career (e.g., masters licensure, SW degree, etc).

 

[Justanothergrad]

Agreed. This will shut many (most) doors. With how competitive admissions are, there is little reason for committees to take a red flag.

 

[temppsych123]

I agree that, barring some exceptional circumstances (e.g. the rest of your application is PHENOMENAL, you are ultimately diagnosed with a disability that would have qualified you for extra time so you can provide a clear explanation for the failure of comps, etc) the odds will be pretty slim. I'm not saying this to hurt your feelings or make you feel any worse than you might already (and I imagine the other folks commenting feel similarly), but because you could end up spending a lot of time and money trying to get accepted to another program when that same time and money would be better spent looking at other ways to get to the goals you want. Do you want to do clinical work? In that case, there are lots of ways to do that without necessarily getting a PhD.

 

[Dahresto]

Be optimistic and start looking into other fields. Things happen but don't let those things bring you down.

 

[LadyHalcyon]

I may have overlooked this part but is there any way you could reconsider their option for a psychoeducational evaluation?

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[CA_PsyD_FL_LMHC]

Something similar happened to a student at a practicum site, and the rationale that was provided when they denied the appeal was that the program would have to offer similar accomodations to every student endorsing English as their second language in this instance, and that the program outlined the ability to complete coursework in English without accomodations as a requirement, etc.

I also know a student that did the suggested testing after their first failure, and was given accomodations because of the results. While they did not meet diagnostic criteria for any learning disorders, they were able to indicate that their processing speed was an obstacle to optimal performance. Not sure if you'd be given another chance to take them up on the testing offer, at this point, however.