Do I even have a shot? Non traditional, way off track, what do you think I could do?

[Tstarke0816]

TLDR: poor student, nontraditional, how would you plan to recover from a 2.69 nonstem (pre-law) degree and plan your prereqs to position success?

Not going to be sappy but for context started college in 2012 straight out of high school, no clue, didn’t have any family ever make it to college, construction and service industry parents. Default went into engineering because I wanted to fly in high school with a 4.2 and math is easy for me. Came out with 30+ AP credits. Was not prepared for college. Terrible student. Averaged a 3.2 for two years, needed to work, took a leave of absence, became a cop, did that for two years and on year three went back to school for pre-law, for two years, parents got divorced, drug addiction started for parents, still working full time, had to drop out of class trying to manage 60 hours of work a week and maintain my parent's wellness 3 hours away. Well, I have two 3 F’s from a semester where I couldn’t handle it all and was passed the withdrawal time. 21-year-old me thought I would be a cop forever and didn’t need a degree. Took a year off. Dad OD’d. Sad, but realized I wanted to tighten up and pursue my dreams. 2018 went back to school, dean list 3 semesters in a row. I graduated in 2019 but my GPA is 2.69. My core GPA is better but my last two years before graduation is 3.75.

I worked hard for two years, pursued my dream to fly, studied, worked hard, and landed a military flight contract. 2020 commissioned, got through the process, have an eye condition they found during training that DQd me from flying… been doing a desk dog in intel (think cyber related) and I can't stand the material or really working for the government, so here I am 29 and re-evaluating my life. My closest friends and family are PA’s or Doctors. Medicine is an area of study that I didn’t really find interesting (just no academic exposure) until I started really helping my wife study for her school, she got into med school but chose PA school for QOL and mobility as a military spouse. I actually enjoy the questions and understanding the subject matter. I have genuinely thought about pursuing EM, especially since that was my favorite part of being a cop for 5 years. Thousands of ER rides, visits, gsw’s, cardiac arrest, worked hours of off duty in the ER and I really really seemed to click with the few ER doctors I worked with, one of the few personalities in life I actually envied, just great people. I loved the shift work. However, the cost of med school always deterred even the thought.

Well, I now have the opportunity to go get all my undergrad classes for free with the GI bill and have the ability to have med school 100% paid for through veterans benefits. Money isn’t a factor anymore. My wife supports me as well. Here I am 3 months after having the initial thought and I can’t help but think about it every day. I really try to think about other paths, get my MBA and go into finance or project management, go into cyber security… I just don’t help people with anything there. You don’t deal with people and I genuinely enjoy that aspect.

As a nontraditional student, I am seriously considering going back to school next spring/fall to get my requirements down (Chem, Orgo chem 1/2, biochem 1/2, physics 1/2) and praying my science GPA catches someone’s attention. I have more life experience than your average human and way more than your average applicant but I am not nearly as book smart, just determined and I think medicine really is an option. Do you think I have a shot? How would you organize your attack? I am a wheels-down reverse guy, which means I like to look at everything from a safe mission executed and plan my attack In reverse to get there.

I would have to do it online due to my duty station (location) for the first two semesters. Did that hinder you? I have read schools want your post-grads/bacc studies in person, all at the same location.

Tell me I have no shot in the world so I can move on with my life. My biggest fear is wasting my resources and my family's time. I can recover from anything but with kids and an opportunity for free tuition, I need to make it count.

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[Angler]

Looks like you just joined; you're in the right place. Start here:

Goro's Guide for reinvention

You have a very interesting story that easily can be spun into narratives in applications. However, you need some credential repair. That link will get you started. There are others here who know the ins and outs of post-bac's and SMP's, who'll chime in. If you can get a good MCAT and good grades from here out, you have a good chance. Great MCAT and great grades gets you a great chance.

 

[Tstarke0816]

Thank you so much for the input. I am trying to get genuine objective opinions because my wife and friends are supportive. They are realistic but not mean enough sometimes. I was just reading about another thread about the AFS from Texas and trying to understand how it works, I think I am too recent to use it since I am within 10 years.

 

[Angler]

I don't know much about the Texas AFS; you're obviously a Texas resident. It might be too rigid a program.

 

[Tstarke0816]

I don't know much about the Texas AFS; you're obviously a Texas resident. It might be too rigid a program.

I am not, I’m a FL resident, but I’d consider moving there if it meant I would have an upper hand.

 

[Angler]

The program is really only useful for those applying to Texas Med Schools using the separate special Texas application process called TMDSAS. Are you really wanting to move your whole family to Texas just to go to Med School?

 

[Tstarke0816]

The program is really only useful for those applying to Texas Med Schools using the separate special Texas application process called TMDSAS. Are you really wanting to move your whole family to Texas just to go to Med School?

In the military we have lived apart, moved stations, remote pregnancy, I ideally wouldn’t but I have very small little ones for now and the ROI is worth it IMO. We are used to sacrificing, my wife’s career is my only concern. Our final destination (Pensacola) is about 45 minutes from the closest med school (USA) and the next closest one is 3 hours (FSU/VCOM Auburn) away, so I figured moving was in our future regardless. I absolutely would love to go home for 2 years to finish my pre reqs to atleast get my wife a refresh and let the grandparents spend some quality time. I just know my GPA is in dire need of restart. It’s the only thing I regret in my life.

 

[Angler]

I believe that @Goro @Mr.Smile12 and @Faha would have more specifics to offer you about your future journey.

 

[karaya]

You probably won't get your cGPA up to 3.0, but you have the opportunity to hit 4.0 science GPA, assuming you haven't taken any BCPM classes. I've heard sGPA has more weight. SMP wouldn't necessarily be required. You also have a massive upward trend which is great. Being a veteran is great. All things considered, you have an interesting story and medicine isn't out of the question. If I were in your shoes I would include DO schools.

 

[Dral]

You would likely be shooting for DO schools. I think you do need some type of grade improvement. I believe in person classes are preferred.

I would see about shadowing some physicians to try to be sure it is really want you want to do. I believe the angle of the ED from a cop's perspective is quite a bit different from what being an ED physician is actually like. At the risk of sounding jaded (I'm not an ED physician, but rotated through one intern year), but cops probably aren't seeing the myriad of drug seekers, vague abdominal pain, and patients using the ED as their urgent care/primary care source. In what capacity did you work in the ED? You may have possibly seen all of that and do have a good understanding of it.

 

[Tstarke0816]

You would likely be shooting for DO schools. I think you do need some type of grade improvement. I believe in person classes are preferred.

I would see about shadowing some physicians to try to be sure it is really want you want to do. I believe the angle of the ED from a cop's perspective is quite a bit different from what being an ED physician is actually like. At the risk of sounding jaded (I'm not an ED physician, but rotated through one intern year), but cops probably aren't seeing the myriad of drug seekers, vague abdominal pain, and patients using the ED as their urgent care/primary care source. In what capacity did you work in the ED? You may have possibly seen all of that and do have a good understanding of it.

I read through Gorros guide. I’d be very happy with a DO school. No shame in my game, at the end of the day I don’t think it would stop my end goal. I think shooting for my sGPA to be a standout is the end all be all for me, as it’s the only logical approach. In person initially is tough for me as that means I have to wait to start until I separate from the service. I do intend full time in person as soon as I am out.

So I think you you are absolutely right. I hope I didn’t come off like I know or I have any real medical experience. I did work in a drug riddled city for a while, did the narcan thing, was the crisis intervention officer on my shift (“mental health expert” which really translated to suicidal patients on edge, bipolar patients in their manic episodes, college students on APVP butt naked in the street wrestling them down for paramedics to stick them with some haldol) and actually worked off duty in the ER a lot (basically means the ER employed me to enforce laws but most sit in there cars or play on their phone, I made friends with the EDs and learned a lot. This encompassed 6-10 hour shifts tending to the intake personality issues, restraining unruly patients, discussing post treatment options for arrestees/detainees, securing the triage and trauma bays while actively working a patient. I didn’t nearly do the tedious “tummy pains” or fever of 98 but “that’s high for me because I know my body.” There are all types of stuff I was never exposed to. Looking back it’s one of the only environment I think I found in my careers that I enjoyed. The multi tasking, the versatility, the on the spot problem solving. I am absolutely not stuck on ED, I just think that’s what attracted me to begin with. After studying with my wife for the passed ~2 years, everything but nephrology interest me lol

 

[Tstarke0816]

You probably won't get your cGPA up to 3.0, but you have the opportunity to hit 4.0 science GPA, assuming you haven't taken any BCPM classes. I've heard sGPA has more weight. SMP wouldn't necessarily be required. You also have a massive upward trend which is great. Being a veteran is great. All things considered, you have an interesting story and medicine isn't out of the question. If I were in your shoes I would include DO schools.

Correct I have not taken any BCPM classes so that’s the idea to crush that. DO schools are plenty fine in my opinion. Thanks for the encouragement.

 

[Dral]

So I think you you are absolutely right. I hope I didn’t come off like I know or I have any real medical experience.

You didn't. I just brought it up because due to the high input that it takes to get through applying, med school, applying for residency, residency, possible fellowship; I feel people really have to understand to the best of their abilities what they are getting into.

I believe you do really want to go through the process and honestly, you'll get a decent idea of different areas of medicine as you get to them in med school. While there are people who are like "I've wanted to be a surgeon since I was 15 years old", in general it's best to decide to be a physician first and decide specifics later. However, during the interview process, your ED experience certainly will make a nice narrative linking your desire to by a physician to wanting to help people.

 

[Tstarke0816]

I believe that @Goro @Mr.Smile12 and @Faha would have more specifics to offer you about your future journey.

I would love to hear from them! Thank you for your input.

 

[Tstarke0816]

You didn't. I just brought it up because due to the high input that it takes to get through applying, med school, applying for residency, residency, possible fellowship; I feel people really have to understand to the best of their abilities what they are getting into.

I believe you do really want to go through the process and honestly, you'll get a decent idea of different areas of medicine as you get to them in med school. While there are people who are like "I've wanted to be a surgeon since I was 15 years old", in general it's best to decide to be a physician first and decide specifics later. However, during the interview process, your ED experience certainly will make a nice narrative linking your desire to by a physician to wanting to help people.

Thanks for the well thought out response, I definitely plan on shadowing a few different specialties. My mind is open and while beggars can’t be choosers efficiency is important to me for my families sake at this point. If you had someone reaching out like this to career switch at 30 with no experience and not that “I wanted to do this since I was 5 playing doctor on my brothers” like my wife, what would look for?

 

[lanzhou_lamian]

Your plan seems reasonable. If you take your science prereqs and do well, you can have a 4.0 sGPA and 4.0 postbacc GOA. Couple that with your upward trend and the fact that you’re several years out from undergrad graduation, I don’t think you’re undergrad gpa should prevent you from achieving this goal.

For classes, I’d just do a DIY postbacc at a state university that’s convenient for you. Your grades and MCAT would need to be really good. Beyond that, you just need the standard things (clinical volunteering, non-clinical volunteering, shadowing, etc) and I think you’d have as good as shot as anyone, maybe even better with the military experience and interesting life story.

 

[Tstarke0816]

Your plan seems reasonable. If you take your science prereqs and do well, you can have a 4.0 sGPA and 4.0 postbacc GOA. Couple that with your upward trend and the fact that you’re several years out from undergrad graduation, I don’t think you’re undergrad gpa should prevent you from achieving this goal.

For classes, I’d just do a DIY postbacc at a state university that’s convenient for you. Your grades and MCAT would need to be really good. Beyond that, you just need the standard things (clinical volunteering, non-clinical volunteering, shadowing, etc) and I think you’d have as good as shot as anyone, maybe even better with the military experience and interesting life story.

I am sorry, can you d plain what you mean by the 4.0 GOA? I am assuming that’s just. A typo for GPA. I only planned on taking the prerequisites which are all science so my sGPA and post bacc GPA are going to be identical. As far as the the university my undergrad was all done at a state uni and it is affiliated with FSU, so I planned on going back when I separate from service. I would love to get started where I am at now but then my post bacc would be at two separate locations.

 

[lanzhou_lamian]

I am sorry, can you d plain what you mean by the 4.0 GOA? I am assuming that’s just. A typo for GPA. I only planned on taking the prerequisites which are all science so my sGPA and post bacc GPA are going to be identical. As far as the the university my undergrad was all done at a state uni and it is affiliated with FSU, so I planned on going back when I separate from service. I would love to get started where I am at now but then my post bacc would be at two separate locations.

Yep, typo for GPA.

 

[Angler]

SDN postbacc resources

read these articles to assess DIY vs formal post baccalaureate

 

[Dral]

Thanks for the well thought out response, I definitely plan on shadowing a few different specialties. My mind is open and while beggars can’t be choosers efficiency is important to me for my families sake at this point. If you had someone reaching out like this to career switch at 30 with no experience and not that “I wanted to do this since I was 5 playing doctor on my brothers” like my wife, what would look for?

Just have a compelling story about why you are making this change. We are living in odd times with odd economic pressures. As you may be aware, there have been trends of med school apps going up when the economy turns south. You will have to convince adcoms that you truly have the desire to be a physician opposed to a career jumper due to 'greener' pastures.

 

[LunaOri]

There would be no downside to doing some of your courses online, or taking courses in more than one location due to moving for your military career. If you do well in your science courses and MCAT, and get enough clinical exposure, I think you have a good chance at MD school. Your time in the military makes you a good fit for service-oriented schools. You also write very well, and show insight, which are desirable traits.
The only question I have is: why not PA school?

 

[Mr.Smile12]

I agree with @LunaOri : I'd check out physician assistant programs (including variations like anesthesiology, surgery, or pathology assistant). They all require the same prereqs as medical school, and a handful will require the MCAT (the rest GRE). Many may take your online courses, and your overall training will be shorter and less expensive.

 

[PandaBaer]

It's possible to get in with a low GPA, mine was lower and majority STEM, you also don't have any sGPA debt. I think your plan for crushing online pre-reqs and the MCAT is fine for most schools, including all DO and mid-low tier MD. Do the things in Goro's guide and keep us updated. You don't have to consider PA or other paths at this time.

 

[Cornfed101]

Just FYI engineering classes are included in your science GPA for DO schools (not for MD schools)