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Do MD/PhDs practice medicine?

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wolverine2015

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I'm at a big research university, so maybe that's why I'm asking this question, but I haven't seen many MD/PhDs practice medicine while also doing research.
I've seen MDs do research on the side while practicing medicine at my University, should I neglect the PhD route if research isn't something I want to do 100% of the time?
 
MD/PhD's have to practice medicine, they can't get research grants anymore :meanie:


Seriously, I think the number thrown around a lot is 80/20 which is percent research/percent clinical but it depends on the institution you're at and a number of other things. There are a lot of great discussions by people far more knowledgable than me in the physician scientist forum on here about the pros and cons of the MD/PhD route and I'd strongly encourage you to check that out.

If you don't want the vast majority of your time to be research and still want a decent amount of patient care, there are options to do MD/MS programs to give you more formal research training in basic, translational, clinical, or epidemiology research without the time commitment of an MD/PhD program. Also quite a few residency programs, at least in my part of the country, are offering options to do clinical research certification or a master's during residency if you have that as an interest.

It is possible to do research with just an MD, but I'd recommend some formal training. There are quite a few practicing MD's in my epidemiology program right now. It's just helpful to have some structured training instead of learning as you go.
But again the physician scientist forum here is a great resource for different perspectives.
 
wolverine2015 said:
I'm at a big research university, so maybe that's why I'm asking this question, but I haven't seen many MD/PhDs practice medicine while also doing research.
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You're definitely getting a skewed perspective. A study from the Howard Hughes Medical Institute several years ago showed that the majority (>50%) of MD/PhDs do not do any research whatsoever after their residency.
 
Here is one paper on what MSTP students do after graduation and the vast majority are not doing 100% research:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20186033

Also many people that I have talked to do different things at different times in their careers. There is a physician scientist forum here at sdn where there have been multiple discussions on who would do MD/PhD again and who wouldn't and why. Reading through those threads will probably give you a better answer to your second question.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/forumdisplay.php?f=32
 
Def read the threads above. Most MD/PhDs I know do both clinical time and research. They would also be the first to ask you to think hard before following in their footsteps; they love what they do, but would not do it over again if they weren't really planning to make use of both qualifications. The training is long, and the financial benefits aren't stellar when weighed against the loss of income and benefits earning years.
 
Our program is pretty split between those leaning more towards research and those who learn more towards clinical practice. Many wind up choosing between the two career paths eventually. Some are pretty successful at both, though (50/50 split)...

Send me a PM if you want to talk more about these sort of programs 🙂
 
Is the 50/50 split more of an MD thing? A lot of people have told me that if I want a 50/50 split then I might as well do MD but I don't know how credible they are.

Also, for the 80/20 split, is that 20% clinical time actually doing genuine treatment or just collecting samples from patients?
 
TheShaker said:
Is the 50/50 split more of an MD thing? A lot of people have told me that if I want a 50/50 split then I might as well do MD but I don't know how credible they are.

Also, for the 80/20 split, is that 20% clinical time actually doing genuine treatment or just collecting samples from patients?
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The 20% is treating patients. It is usually a half day of clinic a week if you are in an outpatient specialty or~8 weeks on service divided up in 2-4 week blocks throughout the year if you are in an inpatient specialty.

A 50/50 split is more common among clinical researchers which is more common among MDs. I would bet that people splitting basic science research 50/50 with clinical are more often MD/PhD but it is a less common path than skewing one way or the other.

Not all MD/PhDs do residency. If you have no interest in ever seeing a patient in your life and just want to do research with the background of knowledge provided by an MD there is no need to do residency. My program has had 1 person do this in the last 5 years, so it isn't a common choice but it is available.
 
Permavirgin said:
Do MD/PhDs do residency?
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If they want to practice medicine at any level yes, but it isn't unheard of for someone to go straight into a research position if research is the only thing they want to do.
 
mdpdgirl said:
The 20% is treating patients. It is usually a half day of clinic a week if you are in an outpatient specialty or~8 weeks on service divided up in 2-4 week blocks throughout the year if you are in an inpatient specialty.

A 50/50 split is more common among clinical researchers which is more common among MDs. I would bet that people splitting basic science research 50/50 with clinical are more often MD/PhD but it is a less common path than skewing one way or the other.

Not all MD/PhDs do residency. If you have no interest in ever seeing a patient in your life and just want to do research with the background of knowledge provided by an MD there is no need to do residency. My program has had 1 person do this in the last 5 years, so it isn't a common choice but it is available.
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So would wanting to go into MD/PhD be valid if the 50/50 split would be in basic science? Also, doesn't the physician skills get a bit rusty due to lack of use on the 80/20? It seems like practicing once a week or in a block after months of inactivity can weaken anybody's skill. Or is it kind of like riding a bike?
 
TheShaker said:
So would wanting to go into MD/PhD be valid if the 50/50 split would be in basic science? Also, doesn't the physician skills get a bit rusty due to lack of use on the 80/20? It seems like practicing once a week or in a block after months of inactivity can weaken anybody's skill. Or is it kind of like riding a bike?
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Totally depends.

No, I don' think you can do a 50/50 split and really try to preserve that balance without a significant amount of your own funding. That is to say, you won't be able to run your own lab only spending half the time most of your colleagues/competitors do. In general, institutional and department pressure combined with the funding you already have yourself will really dictate what kind of balance you can mantain.

Most MD/PhD's doing basic science research at that nice little cliche '80/20' usually super specialize. However, more procedural specialties like surgery even after major specialization might never really put you in a place where you can practice and run your own lab. I'm not terribly well-informed, but I'm not sure it's really possible to just practice like 1 month out of five. That'd be quite odd. Most 80/20'rs practice once a week and are in the lab the rest of the week (often including weekends).

That said, physicians can also be educators and administrators and still practice depending on the specialty.
 
If I do a MD/PhD in statistics or biostats, would it be realistic to be able to run my own statistical support service, use statistics in designing my own clinical research trials, and also see patients?
 
wolverine2015 said:
If I do a MD/PhD in statistics or biostats, would it be realistic to be able to run my own statistical support service, use statistics in designing my own clinical research trials, and also see patients?
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Yes. As we've pointed out already many people to basic science research and see patients. It is also easier to get departmental support and funding for a 60/40 or 50/50 split doing clinical research.
 
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