Do med schools prefer to accept students from their affiliated ugrad?

[wondergirl3]

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I was looking at my school's previous year's matriculant list and it seems like for all of the big name schools (top 30) only had 1 student each from my undergrad.

Looking at the trend, I wonder how important it is that students who go to the undergrad have heavier weight on their app than out of school applicants. This adds to the IS, OOS bias, and makes it much harder.

Is there any way that people who are not from the affiliated undergrad can improve their chances (other than the obvious GPA, MCAT, ECs), or is this something that is beyond our control?

Sincerely,
wondergirl3

 

[closetgunner19]

no

 

[jeghaber]

I know Brown/Alpert explicitly has a bias against their undergrads not coming from their PLME 8-year program. I had a friend interview there who spent most of the time trying to convince the interviewers he would indeed matriculate if accepted (he was, and he didn't). This is because Alpert already has so many people coming from Brown brought their PLME program that they hardly need any more students with the "same" background. Plus, after 4 years in Providence, most people, even accepted, don't decide to matriculate anyways.

I don't know how other 7 or 8 year programs treat their other undergrads, but I can imagine they'd have a similar goal of diversifying their class with people from different colleges.

 

[Goro]

Only Brown does, and U MO-KC, I believe.

I was looking at my school's previous year's matriculant list and it seems like for all of the big name schools (top 30) only had 1 student each from my undergrad.

Looking at the trend, I wonder how important it is that students who go to the undergrad have heavier weight on their app than out of school applicants. This adds to the IS, OOS bias, and makes it much harder.

Is there any way that people who are not from the affiliated undergrad can improve their chances (other than the obvious GPA, MCAT, ECs), or is this something that is beyond our control?

Sincerely,
wondergirl3

 

[mvenus929]

Schools tend to "favor" their affiliated undergrads because students are more likely to apply to schools nearby. UVA takes a lot of UVA students, but is it because they really favor those students, or is it just that a lot more UVA students apply than from any other single school, and the education that UVA undergrad provides is good and therefore acceptable to VMed's standards?

There's not really anything specific you can do, other than making your application a good as it can be so that you stand out of the crowd.

 

[Shinobiz11]

Michigan loves California students. They're usually 50/50 in attendance, but they get a good amount from the undergrad.

 

[moop]

Schools tend to "favor" their affiliated undergrads because students are more likely to apply to schools nearby. UVA takes a lot of UVA students, but is it because they really favor those students, or is it just that a lot more UVA students apply than from any other single school, and the education that UVA undergrad provides is good and therefore acceptable to VMed's standards?

There's not really anything specific you can do, other than making your application a good as it can be so that you stand out of the crowd.

Yale accepts 30 Yalies out of ~220. That's a ton. There's a selection bias, though, so the conclusion is not as clear-cut as the data might imply.

 

[Ace Khalifa]

WUSM loves Wash U students, but only if they were highly competitive for top schools and mostly research focused to begin with. There may be an advantage for Wash U students having access to WUSM faculty research and subsequent LOR's during undergrad, but you still have to be an absolutely stellar rockstar candidate to have a chance when applying to WUSM.

 

[meander]

Hopkins only takes 2 Hopkins undergrads per year, as far as I know. There's a lot of grumbling among the undergrads that had they known they wouldn't have gone to Hopkins for UG (and thus 'tanked' their chances at the SOM).

 

[RedPhys]

From my experience at Weill Cornell, the students say there is a noticeable presence of med students that did their undergrad at Cornell, so I guess for Weill Cornell, they do have some favoring toward Cornell undergrads?

As for another school, I heard from an MS3 at University of Miami that their class is very heavily students from their undergraduate program.

 

[JPA178]

UMich certainly does not. A "good amount" are taken but it's nowhere near what you see at other state schools, e.g. Iowa, Wisconsin, etc.

 

[Mad Jack]

Self-selection results in more students from a given undergrad going to that same school's medical school. They already picked the place for undergrad for a reason, so they're more likely to choose that place as a top candidate for med school.

 

[Albino Dino]

My school (Canadian) vocally admits to favouring students from their own undergrad.

 

[Tliu91]

Approximately 20-25% of Duke Med's class each year comprises of its own undergrad students.

 

[theknappkin]

Schools tend to "favor" their affiliated undergrads because students are more likely to apply to schools nearby. UVA takes a lot of UVA students, but is it because they really favor those students, or is it just that a lot more UVA students apply than from any other single school, and the education that UVA undergrad provides is good and therefore acceptable to VMed's standards?

There's not really anything specific you can do, other than making your application a good as it can be so that you stand out of the crowd.

I've spoken with a UVA adcom and while he didn't outright say it, he said something along the lines of, "We understand how difficult general chemistry and other undergrad science classes are and the quality of education you receive. We factor that into our consideration."

 

[WingedOx]

UMich certainly does not. A "good amount" are taken but it's nowhere near what you see at other state schools, e.g. Iowa, Wisconsin, etc.

Totally different admissions objectives between Michigan and the others. Michigan is more or less trying to grab as many top tier applicants as possible from wherever. Despite being right in the median of their stats, Wisconsin rejected me pre-secondary with a nice letter stating that I didn't have enough connections to the state of Wisconsin to be considered. (Midwesterners are so polite)

I do wonder if you'd be better off being at a mid-tier UG school with a med school like Loyola, Michigan State, UToledo than a high tier place like Hopkins or Michigan for the institutional bias alone. (assuming your goal is admission to ANY LCME school... as it should be).

 

[JPA178]

Totally different admissions objectives between Michigan and the others. Michigan is more or less trying to grab as many top tier applicants as possible from wherever. Despite being right in the median of their stats, Wisconsin rejected me pre-secondary with a nice letter stating that I didn't have enough connections to the state of Wisconsin to be considered. (Midwesterners are so polite)

I do wonder if you'd be better off being at a mid-tier UG school with a med school like Loyola, Michigan State, UToledo than a high tier place like Hopkins or Michigan for the institutional bias alone. (assuming your goal is admission to ANY LCME school... as it should be).

Yeah, you know, it makes me jealous of people who are residents of states like Wisconsin, Iowa, Alabama... they have great in-state schools who will give serious consideration to their residents as long as they are around their medians or even a little bit lower. As a Michigan resident, it kind of sucks that our flagship institution rules out in-state students who aren't the best of the best. We have a lot of other great med schools in Michigan, of course, but UM is always the dream.

 

[ithd]

Hopkins only takes 2 Hopkins undergrads per year, as far as I know. There's a lot of grumbling among the undergrads that had they known they wouldn't have gone to Hopkins for UG (and thus 'tanked' their chances at the SOM).

Not that it makes a difference, but I know 3 jhu undergrads (2014) who are now MS1s at the med school. There's probably a few more too from previous classes.

 

[justadream]

Hopkins only takes 2 Hopkins undergrads per year, as far as I know. There's a lot of grumbling among the undergrads that had they known they wouldn't have gone to Hopkins for UG (and thus 'tanked' their chances at the SOM).

Are you saying there's a hard limit? I find 2 to be quite low...

 

[moop]

Totally different admissions objectives between Michigan and the others. Michigan is more or less trying to grab as many top tier applicants as possible from wherever. Despite being right in the median of their stats, Wisconsin rejected me pre-secondary with a nice letter stating that I didn't have enough connections to the state of Wisconsin to be considered. (Midwesterners are so polite)

I do wonder if you'd be better off being at a mid-tier UG school with a med school like Loyola, Michigan State, UToledo than a high tier place like Hopkins or Michigan for the institutional bias alone. (assuming your goal is admission to ANY LCME school... as it should be).

So premeds shouldn't have any goals beyond only getting into ANY school? Those who have their eyes set on a certain subset of schools are misinformed/wrong/silly?

 

[moop]

Are you saying there's a hard limit? I find 2 to be quite low...

Yah stats needed yo. Yale's data of 30 accepted out of 220 is attached. 2010 was the last year they publicly released school-specific figures. Now, all we have is vague BS: http://ocs.yale.edu/sites/default/files/2013 STATISTICS_YALE COLLEGE MEDICAL SCHOOL APPLICANTS.pdf

 

[Plue00]

Schools tend to "favor" their affiliated undergrads because students are more likely to apply to schools nearby. UVA takes a lot of UVA students, but is it because they really favor those students, or is it just that a lot more UVA students apply than from any other single school, and the education that UVA undergrad provides is good and therefore acceptable to VMed's standards?

There's not really anything specific you can do, other than making your application a good as it can be so that you stand out of the crowd.

Over 50% of VCU and EVMS instaters are from UVA too.

I think one year UVA had ~45 of its ~75 IS students come from UVA.

It's a premed powerhouse.

 

[WingedOx]

So premeds shouldn't have any goals beyond only getting into ANY school? Those who have their eyes set on a certain subset of schools are misinformed/wrong/silly?

Two issues here... since I think you're twisting what I'm saying

1. You can have whatever goals you want, but to assume that choosing a particular undergrad will make an appreciable difference in getting into said school is probably a stretch (the significance that does exist probably is more than offset by things like cost of said school).

2. Assuming you have an LCME MD, no one really cares where you went to medical school once you get into residency. It's not like I have an inferiority complex about not getting my MD from Penn or a superiority complex about going to a "better school" than Drexel. Residency is how you'll be judged, and even then most specialties are small enough that you develop a reputation good or bad regardless of where you trained.

 

[WingedOx]

Yeah, you know, it makes me jealous of people who are residents of states like Wisconsin, Iowa, Alabama... they have great in-state schools who will give serious consideration to their residents as long as they are around their medians or even a little bit lower. As a Michigan resident, it kind of sucks that our flagship institution rules out in-state students who aren't the best of the best. We have a lot of other great med schools in Michigan, of course, but UM is always the dream.

Many a Spartan fan has been forged in the broken dreams of rejection letters from Ann Arbor.

/and lately they've come out ahead, Harbaugh or no Harbaugh.

 

[moop]

Many a Spartan fan has been forged in the broken dreams of rejection letters from Ann Arbor.

/and lately they've come out ahead, Harbaugh or no Harbaugh.

 

[gyngyn]

Many a Spartan fan has been forged in the broken dreams of rejection letters from Ann Arbor.

/and lately they've come out ahead, Harbaugh or no Harbaugh.

Bruins might give them a run for their money!
UCLA undergrad had 919 medical school applicants last year (that's more than the total number of CA matriculants in the whole state, 870)! U of MI: 825.

 

[Shinobiz11]

Many a Spartan fan has been forged in the broken dreams of rejection letters from Ann Arbor.

/and lately they've come out ahead, Harbaugh or no Harbaugh.

Sure on the football field. I have friends at MSUCHM who are "gunning" to get into UMich for residency. It's a top 10 institution in am amazing town, why wouldn't you want to be there.

 

[JPA178]

Many a Spartan fan has been forged in the broken dreams of rejection letters from Ann Arbor.

/and lately they've come out ahead, Harbaugh or no Harbaugh.

Truth. I'll never change my allegiance though. Even if my own alma mater won't let me become a doctor there, I'm a wolverine for life.

 

[justadream]

Yah stats needed yo. Yale's data of 30 accepted out of 220 is attached. 2010 was the last year they publicly released school-specific figures. Now, all we have is vague BS: http://ocs.yale.edu/sites/default/files/2013 STATISTICS_YALE COLLEGE MEDICAL SCHOOL APPLICANTS.pdf

Great data. I wish more schools would release this information.

 

[moop]

Great data. I wish more schools would release this information.

It's not in their interest to do so unless they have HYP numbers. What I don't get is why the top schools don't do it more often lolol

 

[justadream]

It's not in their interest to do so unless they have HYP numbers. What I don't get is why the top schools don't do it more often lolol

Lol maybe H/P saw the numbers Yale put out, realized theirs were slightly worse, and therefore declined to provide the info.

 

[WingedOx]

Sure on the football field. I have friends at MSUCHM who are "gunning" to get into UMich for residency. It's a top 10 institution in am amazing town, why wouldn't you want to be there.

Great hospitals and programs across the board. The only complaint I hear is that Ann Arbor gets a little too "undergrad-y" by the time people have spent 8 years in college towns.

/also have you SEEN the weather reports out of the Midwest right now?

 

[neurotroph]

Besides self-selection, it may also have to do with undergrads building relationships with people close to folks on the admissions committee, or with the adcoms themselves. A good recommendation might hold more weight if the recommender knows someone on the adcom personally because they're faculty in the same department or something. It's also possible to have someone affiliated with the med school/committee as your PI, adviser, etc. I'm guessing these examples are easier at some schools than at others though. Could account for some of Yale's numbers since it's a relatively small school and undergrads are very involved w/ the med school.

 

[ireoyellet]

There may be an advantage for Wash U students having access to WUSM faculty research and subsequent LOR's during undergrad

 

[Ace Khalifa]

There may be an advantage for Wash U students having access to WUSM faculty research and subsequent LOR's during undergrad

I said this already......I can understand not reading thru an entire thread of 8+ pages, but this one hasn't even broken the 2nd page yet.

 

[moop]

I said this already......I can understand not reading thru an entire thread of 8+ pages, but this one hasn't even broken the 2nd page yet.

It's a spambot bro
All they do is sign up for an account, post 3 posts that copy and paste someone's previous post, and link some weird picture which I'm sure does something no bueno to Windows computers.

 

[Ace Khalifa]

It's a spambot bro
All they do is sign up for an account, post 3 posts that copy and paste someone's previous post, and link some weird picture which I'm sure does something no bueno to Windows computers.

Good thing I didn't use my computer to reply...