Do you want to read your LORs?

[xmsr3]

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So here is my situation:

I have 5 LORs, which I THINK are above avg. I have applied to 19 schools and each one I applied to I included all of my LORs.

Because I am applying to Army HPSP I have to include my LORs as well. So I went to my college file recommendation service and told them I was applying to Army and Navy HPSP and needed a copy of each letter put into a sealed envelope. They were nice enough to not charge me for this.

SO the question I pose to everyone here is:

Given that you have already sent your LORs to all your schools, would you open the spare envelope and read the letters? Would you want to know how bad or good they are?

 

[armybound]

Of course I'd be curious, I think that's human nature.

I managed to sneak a peek at my committee letter once (the secretary was essentially letting me read it) and saw some not-so-flattering comments. That may partially help explain my 2 years of rejections, and my multiple acceptances the year I quit using that committee letter.

 

[xmsr3]

i voted yes, because even though I can't change the fact that all my schools already have my letters I will go absolutely crazy unless I find out whether or this one unknown aspect of my application is good or not.

My LORs are all from professors who knew me and like me(at least I think they did) I also have one from a non science prof who was my mentor and is mentioned in my PS and my volunteer coordinator at my ER.

I am confident they didn't put anything bad in the letters, because that would just be evil, (only a sick and spiteful person would agree to write a LOR for someone they didn't like just so they could trash them).

Of course a friend of mine got rejected from all her schools because one of her LOR writers trashed her to high heaven, so I just have to know.

 

[nabeel76]

xmsr3 - I have a couple of questions regarding the timeline for the HPSP for the ARMY that you might be able to answer.

1. Do you need an acceptance to med school prior to initiating the app to the HPSP. I haven't taken the MCAT yet, scheduled for August 21st, and will complete my secondaries following that.

2. I am not 100% sure on the HPSP scholarship as of yet, I am leaning towards the ARMY National Guard ASR program at the moment, but I have bad credit and if I don't get approved for financial aid to med school prior to matriculation I will def want to do the HPSP. But I was hoping I could apply at that moment, if needed, without having to delay med school matriculation. So my question is would it be possible to delay the application for the HPSP until I am not only accepted, but know whether I will recieve financial aid or not?

 

[xmsr3]

xmsr3 - I have a couple of questions regarding the timeline for the HPSP for the ARMY that you might be able to answer.

1. Do you need an acceptance to med school prior to initiating the app to the HPSP. I haven't taken the MCAT yet, scheduled for August 21st, and will complete my secondaries following that.

2. I am not 100% sure on the HPSP scholarship as of yet, I am leaning towards the ARMY National Guard ASR program at the moment, but I have bad credit and if I don't get approved for financial aid to med school prior to matriculation I will def want to do the HPSP. But I was hoping I could apply at that moment, if needed, without having to delay med school matriculation. So my question is would it be possible to delay the application for the HPSP until I am not only accepted, but know whether I will recieve financial aid or not?

I would be happy to answer your questions.

1. No you don't need to be accepted to start the application process. You can fill out the initial form, send it in and they will draw up the background check and physical papers.

You then gather the miscellanious items they need, (Print out of AMCAS, MCAT, LORs, birth certificate, ect) and bring that to an appointment with your recruiter. There you fill out the paper work that allows them to start a background check and prep for the MEPS physical that you have to do.

You can get your entire HPSP application packet done minus the acceptance letter.

PLUS if your MCAT is 30 or over and your GPA 3.7+ you are automatically accepted.

2. Yes you can put off applying since they won't start handing out scholarships until Oct 1, 2009 so there is no rush for now, plus you may have automatic acceptance.

BUT I would recommend that you just go ahead, contact your Army recruiter and get started on the HPSP app and here's why.

The army recruiter will email you an information form to fill out. If you do you can then use that same form for any other military scholarships, even ASR.

Filling out the HPSP application IN NO WAY MEANS YOU HAVE TO DO IT, so by getting it started now, when you have more time, (prior to all those secondries and interviews) it will lessen your headaches later on.

Let me know if you need any other info.

 

[nabeel76]

I would be happy to answer your questions.

1. No you don't need to be accepted to start the application process. You can fill out the initial form, send it in and they will draw up the background check and physical papers.

You then gather the miscellanious items they need, (Print out of AMCAS, MCAT, LORs, birth certificate, ect) and bring that to an appointment with your recruiter. There you fill out the paper work that allows them to start a background check and prep for the MEPS physical that you have to do.

You can get your entire HPSP application packet done minus the acceptance letter.

PLUS if your MCAT is 30 or over and your GPA 3.7+ you are automatically accepted.

2. Yes you can put off applying since they won't start handing out scholarships until Oct 1, 2009 so there is no rush for now, plus you may have automatic acceptance.

BUT I would recommend that you just go ahead, contact your Army recruiter and get started on the HPSP app and here's why.

The army recruiter will email you an information form to fill out. If you do you can then use that same form for any other military scholarships, even ASR.

Filling out the HPSP application IN NO WAY MEANS YOU HAVE TO DO IT, so by getting it started now, when you have more time, (prior to all those secondries and interviews) it will lessen your headaches later on.

Let me know if you need any other info.

Cool thanks for the reply. That sounds good I will get started on those forms since I am sure I will do either ASR or HPSP. Still deciding which one is going to work out better for me since I am an older applicant and speak fluent farsi (will most likely be deployed to Afghanistan) and am not sure if I want to do the 18 month deployments of the ARMY. The National Guard seems to limit deployments to 3 month stints which is much more manageable for me.

 

[Magnetek Blue]

Why would anyone not want to know? If you were rejected everywhere, wouldn't you immediately wonder if your letters had something to do with it?

I made sure to always ask for a positive letter of recommendation, and then said if it wouldn't be positive to please not send it... except I forgot to say that to one person, and now it is driving me insane! It's my only letter from a doc, and I think we got along well, but I suppose I'll never know.

 

[TopSecret]

I'm not exactly sure of the rules regarding LOR's but some writers would give you the privilege of reading the letters even though you had waived your right to read them. Some would even draft the letter while you're sitting in their office and allow you to edit the letter for content and accuracy before it's printed and signed.

 

[red10]

I know at least one of my letters was good because the professor seemed really happy to write it for me.
For the second I did a full on interview with the prof going over every part of my resume and every medical experience I've ever had. I assume its a good one because who would really take the time to do that and then write crap?
The third one is the only one that could be my wild card but I have to assume that if the prof wasn't going to write good things about me that she wouldn't have taken the time to write it and read my PS in the first place.

Unless you're a huge jack***** (or your prof is) I can't imagine why a prof would waste their time with a bad letter.

I'd like to read them if I could though

 

[dbrokut]

Hell yeaaaahhhhhhh!!

 

[xmsr3]

So I read each letter twice and I am walking on sunshine.

Here is the synopsis in increasing order of awsomeness.

Volunteer Coordinator, clinical letter: A standard form letter, she basically explains what ER volunteers do, why they are important and mentions that I have over 150 hours of experience there and am liked by all the staff and committed to my patients and very dedicated and compassionate.

Strength shown: proves I have lots of clinical experience

Econ Prof, Mentor mentioned in PS: He mentions that I was top two of his senior year econ classes and the most mature, compassionate and dedicated senior he has ever known and am in it for all the right reasons. On the downside he shows he's a novice at medical LORs when he says he didn't know me as long as he would have wished and that I was the only senior who he knew who volunteered at an ER.

Strength shown: I am a mature person who is dedicated to medicine for all the right reasons.

O-Chem Lab professor: She says she that I was one of the top of her class, top 2 of my lab section and that my sucess in med school would be assured. On the down side she does say that my lab technique was below average but that I worked hard all semester to improve it. She labels me a strong theorist.

Strength Shown: I can thrive in a lab course that included 1 hour of lecture and 2 4 hour lab sessions each week.

Human Physiology professor: says I got 235/240 points for the semester, came in 1st out of 242 students in her class, asked her questions in class that were weeks ahead of schedule and that she considers me the finest student she has had in 13 years of teaching. Though she says I have yet to fully mature she gives me the highest possible recommendation.

Strength shown: A true love of physiology, biology and medical science and an ability to excel in the subjects that I will be seeing a lot of in med school.

Physics 2: I was shocked at this letter as I was expecting it to be weak, (my prof took forever writing it and I was kind of scared that I pissed him off with my frequent reminders about it).

Not a bad thing in it. He says that I have an intuitive grasp of physics including the most difficult subjects in it, a natural and sincere love of science, a dedication to excellence and helping others in my lab and discussions sections and that of the 2 semesters he taught, 350 students total he considers me the best student he had.

strengths shown: a love of science and an ability to excel in the most loathed subject of most pre-meds.

Overall I am over the moon with these LORs. Looking back on them, the strength of my PS and secondary essays, my ECs, (which are at least average) and my stellar stats, I have no doubts that I will get in somewhere and most likely to my dream school😀

 

[TopSecret]

So I read each letter twice and I am walking on sunshine.

Here is the synopsis in increasing order of awsomeness.

Volunteer Coordinator, clinical letter: A standard form letter, she basically explains what ER volunteers do, why they are important and mentions that I have over 150 hours of experience there and am liked by all the staff and committed to my patients and very dedicated and compassionate.

Strength shown: proves I have lots of clinical experience

Econ Prof, Mentor mentioned in PS: He mentions that I was top two of his senior year econ classes and the most mature, compassionate and dedicated senior he has ever known and am in it for all the right reasons. On the downside he shows he's a novice at medical LORs when he says he didn't know me as long as he would have wished and that I was the only senior who he knew who volunteered at an ER.

Strength shown: I am a mature person who is dedicated to medicine for all the right reasons.

O-Chem Lab professor: She says she that I was one of the top of her class, top 2 of my lab section and that my sucess in med school would be assured. On the down side she does say that my lab technique was below average but that I worked hard all semester to improve it. She labels me a strong theorist.

Strength Shown: I can thrive in a lab course that included 1 hour of lecture and 2 4 hour lab sessions each week.

Human Physiology professor: says I got 235/240 points for the semester, came in 1st out of 242 students in her class, asked her questions in class that were weeks ahead of schedule and that she considers me the finest student she has had in 13 years of teaching. Though she says I have yet to fully mature she gives me the highest possible recommendation.

Strength shown: A true love of physiology, biology and medical science and an ability to excel in the subjects that I will be seeing a lot of in med school.

Physics 2: I was shocked at this letter as I was expecting it to be weak, (my prof took forever writing it and I was kind of scared that I pissed him off with my frequent reminders about it).

Not a bad thing in it. He says that I have an intuitive grasp of physics including the most difficult subjects in it, a natural and sincere love of science, a dedication to excellence and helping others in my lab and discussions sections and that of the 2 semesters he taught, 350 students total he considers me the best student he had.

strengths shown: a love of science and an ability to excel in the most loathed subject of most pre-meds.

Overall I am over the moon with these LORs. Looking back on them, the strength of my PS and secondary essays, my ECs, (which are at least average) and my stellar stats, I have no doubts that I will get in somewhere and most likely to my dream school😀

Nothing is guaranteed but it sounds like you'll be getting interview invitations soon.

 

[DrBeks]

I would want to know after the whole process is over. If I get accepted, I would want to thank the letter writers again. If I get rejected, I would know not to request a letter from the negative ones. 🙂

 

[movax]

If you use(d) Interfolio, could you not have them "sent"/"delivered" to a friend/other address for "interview purposes", if you really wanted to read them?

Honestly, I'm only worried about my LORs from engineering profs, because, well, they're used to writing about how good of an engineer student would make, whether we could be trusted to design something safety-critical, etc.

 

[Poliscidoc]

In the past, haven't got any LOR for medical school yet. But most professors give me a copy of the letter to read and review before they sent them. But I go to a small private school and they understand the need for strong LOR.


Also has anybody ever hand a professor that is an Alumni of the school you are sending the LOR to? Those letters really help a lot, you probably knew that but I thought I would just put it out there..

 

[Abdullaah]

So here is my situation:

I have 5 LORs, which I THINK are above avg. I have applied to 19 schools and each one I applied to I included all of my LORs.

Because I am applying to Army HPSP I have to include my LORs as well. So I went to my college file recommendation service and told them I was applying to Army and Navy HPSP and needed a copy of each letter put into a sealed envelope. They were nice enough to not charge me for this.

SO the question I pose to everyone here is:

Given that you have already sent your LORs to all your schools, would you open the spare envelope and read the letters? Would you want to know how bad or good they are?

Didn't read the other posts so sorry if I repeat. But basically:

Of course I wanna know what the letter writers wrote!!

But no, I'd never "open the spare envelope and read the letters" cuz we're not supposed to, and I think one of the documents we signed waived our right to see the letter content.🙁

 

[Poliscidoc]

Didn't read the other posts so sorry if I repeat. But basically:

Of course I wanna know what the letter writers wrote!!

But no, I'd never "open the spare envelope and read the letters" cuz we're not supposed to, and I think one of the documents we signed waived our right to see the letter content.🙁

Have a friend open the spare then. Yes you are not supposed to, but he has no legal obligation.

 

[xmsr3]

Didn't read the other posts so sorry if I repeat. But basically:

Of course I wanna know what the letter writers wrote!!

But no, I'd never "open the spare envelope and read the letters" cuz we're not supposed to, and I think one of the documents we signed waived our right to see the letter content.🙁

Yeah but who's gonna know? As far as my college is concerned those envelopes are going to the Army and Navy. Besides all my colleges already recieved all those letters so its not as if I am cherry picking, I just couldn't go on living without knowing what my profs wrote.

 

[Zona Pellucida]

Not really. I honestly don't even care. They are all from professors that told me if I ever needed letters to tell them as they would be happy to write.

 

[mmcnamara]

Didn't read the other posts so sorry if I repeat. But basically:

Of course I wanna know what the letter writers wrote!!

But no, I'd never "open the spare envelope and read the letters" cuz we're not supposed to, and I think one of the documents we signed waived our right to see the letter content.🙁

Have a friend open the spare then. Yes you are not supposed to, but he has no legal obligation.

You are NOT supposed to see the letters if you signed the waiver. I agree with poliscidoc. You should not read them. While I understand the anxiety of not really knowing what they say, it is unethical to read them. I think that it is scary how many of these responses show a complete lack of ethical standards.

 

[LuciusVorenus]

If you use(d) Interfolio, could you not have them "sent"/"delivered" to a friend/other address for "interview purposes", if you really wanted to read them?

Honestly, I'm only worried about my LORs from engineering profs, because, well, they're used to writing about how good of an engineer student would make, whether we could be trusted to design something safety-critical, etc.

I'm not sure how interfolio works
but I'm guessing they were smart enough to think of that ahead of time
if not...

 

[Beren]

No, it's like pandora's box - insecurity and failure sealed in an envelope, I'd bet. 😛

Especially for the one's with a check boxes that say, "the student is the best (communicator) you've met in _____ years." My PI half-jokingly said to me that he would leave it blank if he couldn't quantify it in whole numbers.