does the prestige of p/np dental school matter if wanting to specialize?

[beepbooop]

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hello i was wondering if attending a school like roseman which is fairly new and uses p/np would place me at a disadvantage when applying to specialty programs? I am currently waitlisted at ucsf which is also p/np but will most likely be attending roseman.

 

[DocMon16]

I went to a P/NP and don't think it matters. To be fair, we still had a rank and all of that which I know is weird , we received grades and points on all assignments and clinical procedures but it was considered a P/NP DS.

 

[bergus95]

Wherever you go, make the most of it. The truth is maybe it does or maybe it doesn’t. Maybe it does help especially at a school that doesn’t have rank or the name carries a bit of weight. Maybe there is more comradely and people pushing each other to specialize.

But, what can you do? Will that turn you away from you goals? Going to any specific dental school is not a death sentence. You get a high rank, crush the CBSE, get good letters, are a normal well liked person, and show passion in this field... there is zero doubt you will have your fair share of interviews.

I saw a ton from state schools killing the interview game this year. I saw a ton from P/F schools. You want it, you go get it 🙂

 

[Sublimazing]

A good class rank helps if your CBSE isn’t stellar. A guy who only posts a 69 but was 1/43 in his class should still do well at 4yr programs. But if you post an 80 on cbse not having a class rank won’t hurt you.

Prestige of school can go a long way with a lot of PDs/attendings, but it isn’t mandatory to match...i mean even people from Nova find a way to match OMFS.

 

[beepbooop]

thank u everyone i really appreciate your insight & helping hand : )

 

[hopefullydentalstudent]

Only the truly unranked pass fail schools (Harvard and Columbia) will offer a significant advantage if you know you want to specialize. The other p/f have some sort of internal ranking system which the residencies will see. While many state/private schools post stats like “you have a 90 percent chance of getting into your first choice speciality” what they are really saying is “you have a 90 percent chance of your getting your first choice as long as that choice is general dentistry.” Additionally while a lot of the schools post stats like 4/4 students got into omfs what they aren’t disclosing is that only 4 people had sufficient cbse scores to even apply with a shot of getting in... there is significant self selection going on. People say that dds/dmd education is the same wherever you go, and this is surely true if you want to be a general dentist. But certain schools such as the ones I mentioned above have the most students who enter d1 with aspirations of becoming an os/other competitive specialities and actually fulfilling their goals.

 

[PerioDont]

I went to a P/NP and don't think it matters. To be fair, we still had a rank and all of that which I know is weird , we received grades and points on all assignments and clinical procedures but it was considered a P/NP DS.

Completely agree. I went to a similar place, matched no problem.

Wherever you go, make the most of it. The truth is maybe it does or maybe it doesn’t. Maybe it does help especially at a school that doesn’t have rank or the name carries a bit of weight. Maybe there is more comradely and people pushing each other to specialize.

But, what can you do? Will that turn you away from you goals? Going to any specific dental school is not a death sentence. You get a high rank, crush the CBSE, get good letters, are a normal well liked person, and show passion in this field... there is zero doubt you will have your fair share of interviews.

I saw a ton from state schools killing the interview game this year. I saw a ton from P/F schools. You want it, you go get it 🙂

This is the best advice. The school doesn't decide what quality of a clinician you will become or whether you will match or not, the student does.

 

[keep2camel]

Assuming all else is equal, I do believe that the schools name holds value when specializing.

 

[Sublimazing]

Assuming all else is equal, I do believe that the schools name holds value when specializing.

Yeah of course it does. Go on the parkland website and count how many of their residents DIDN’T go to a top 15 school.

here i’ll even give you the link to make counting easier:

www.utsouthwestern.edu/omfs/residents

 

[cmsmith85]

hello i was wondering if attending a school like roseman which is fairly new and uses p/np would place me at a disadvantage when applying to specialty programs? I am currently waitlisted at ucsf which is also p/np but will most likely be attending roseman.

I went to Roseman and we had a fair amount of people get in to the specialties they wanted to. There were a few that didn't get in to the specialty programs they wanted to, but I think the majority did get in. From my graduating class alone we've now had 4 get into OS, 4 for endo, 2 for ortho and a few for peds and perio.
I agree with what others have said that it all depends on how much and how well you apply yourself. Get to know faculty really well and form good relationships where you can easily ask for a letter of recommendation without it being awkward. Join and participate in the various clubs and organizations there and do your part to stand out.

 

[endodonia]

Get to know faculty really well and form good relationships where you can easily ask for a letter of recommendation without it being awkward. Join and participate in the various clubs and organizations there and do your part to stand out.

After thinking critically on the topic of specializing over the past few years I believe this to be one of the most important factors. I saw a similar class rank kid to me (lets call it 25/80 for those wondering) get into ortho right out of school and leapfrog 3 kids with better class ranks (2 were in the top 10) because the faculty liked them more. simple as that. the other 3 got into ortho too just not at my school, which was their first choice

 

[beepbooop]

thank u everyone once again i genuinely appreciate ur insight & time!

 

[schmoob]

Yeah of course it does. Go on the parkland website and count how many of their residents DIDN’T go to a top 15 school.

here i’ll even give you the link to make counting easier:

www.utsouthwestern.edu/omfs/residents

You got me...

 

[Peon.]

Roseman still applies ranking to their students. Them being pass/fail doesn't help you at all because once you apply to residency they will include a letter on your application that will indicate where you are on the class ranking - Don't believe me? Go ahead and give them a call/ email and ask for yourself. Not all pass/fail schools offer the actual benefits of being unranked; it's really misleading. Being unranked is the important factor in the equation, pass/fail offers no benefits if your rank is still disclosed.

 

[bergus95]

I am pretty sure the only true P/F schools with no rank are Harvard, UCSF, UCLA, and UConn. Columbia has ranking by thirds but still some PD’s think it’s name carries weight. Penn doesn’t rank past number 10. Stony Brook idk about.

Plenty of state schools mentioned above. Looking back I would choose them hands down over Harvard, Penn, and Columbia solely because of the price tag.

Getting into OMFS will he very tough regardless of where you go. No guarantees you can make it in the aforementioned schools.

I know plenty of Harvard, Columbia, Penn, UCSF and UCLA people that did not make it into omfs either due to the task it took to match or CBSE. Choose carefully and cautiously as the only guarantee is the pricetag you are paying once you start dental school.

 

[cmsmith85]

Roseman still applies ranking to their students. Them being pass/fail doesn't help you at all because once you apply to residency they will include a letter on your application that will indicate where you are on the class ranking - Don't believe me? Go ahead and give them a call/ email and ask for yourself. Not all pass/fail schools offer the actual benefits of being unranked; it's really misleading. Being unranked is the important factor in the equation, pass/fail offers no benefits if your rank is still disclosed.

When I was applying for residency I asked them and they said they didn't have one. So I'm not sure you're right. I guess I can ask the program director for the residency I got into if they had one and included it in their letter when I start up this summer.

 

[Peon.]

When I was applying for residency I asked them and they said they didn't have one. So I'm not sure you're right. I guess I can ask the program director for the residency I got into if they had one and included it in their letter when I start up this summer.

They rank in quartiles or something like that. So you may not have an exact number rank but they have an idea of where abouts you stand.

 

[Bereno]

UConn is strict P/F. No honors, no distinction, no rank... nothing. At least this was the case when I attended from 2012-2016.

 

[beepbooop]

thanks everyone for such great info! also thanks for including info bout ucsf, they were the only school that decreased their class size from 90-60 this cycle so realistically looks like i will make the best out of roseman!

 

[cmsmith85]

thanks for including info bout ucsf, they were the only school that decreased their class size from 90-60 this cycle so realistically looks like i will make the best out of roseman!

I loved it at Roseman. I was part of the 2nd graduating class, so being a newer school was nice where I was able to get a lot of exposure to different procedures since there wasn't any post doc programs set up there yet. I'm sure things have changed a bit there, but it should still be a great program.

 

[OMSDoc]

Everything boils down to timing, and who the teachers are at the dental school when you are there. It is amazing how much one or two individuals can effect such a large influence on you.

I think the most important thing for a strong undergraduate dental experience are (1) the strength of the oral biology departments (at the Medical College of Georgia, all of our professors had PhDs in their area, PLUS a dental degree), and (2) the rigorousness of the clinical requirements.

Back in the day, the Medical College of Georgia School of Dentistry was listed in the top 3 of dental schools in the USA, in terms of the clinical requirements and, say, research submissions to the NADR/IADR. We had a significant number in my class who were excellent clinicians, but who had to remain after the graduation day to complete their clinical requirements.

I matched at the Mayo Clinic, and my foundation from MCG served me well there.