does this sound like match violation?

[inkerman]

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Before ROLs were due I sent a brief message to my 2nd choice including a statement that "I will consider it a great honor to match at your program and I look forward to being a part of your department next year." I didn't mention the specific rank or anything.

In hindsight, I'm thinking that my message was too pushy, as if I somehow made a nefarious backroom deal guaranteeing my match. Do you think this message wouldve come across as a match violation and scared off the PD? I'm afraid the PD would have DNR'd me even if he had me ranked high before, just because my statement was too controversial.

 

[Dirt]

umm no.

 

[FlowLimited]

Not even close.

 

[Green Grass]

Presumptious? - maybe a little. Controversial? - no, no my friend.

 

[Conjuctiva]

I can't believe the stupid questions you loser gunner msiv's are asking. Grow some balls.

"There are no stupid questions, just stupid people"

 

[inkerman]

Presumptious? - maybe a little. Controversial? - no, no my friend.

In hindsight I also thought I sounded presumptuous/arrogant. What do y'all think are the chances that I'd be penalized (i.e. moved down the program's ROL or DNR'd outright) for sounding presumptuous?

 

[FlowLimited]

In hindsight I also thought I sounded presumptuous/arrogant. What do y'all think are the chances that I'd be penalized (i.e. moved down the program's ROL or DNR'd outright) for sounding presumptuous?

That all depends on how an individual program calculates their Applicant Presumptuousness Score (APS) and how it's weighted when determining your overall rating. I'm sure you can find the relevant data on the NRMP website.

 

[Chakrabs]

In hindsight I also thought I sounded presumptuous/arrogant. What do y'all think are the chances that I'd be penalized (i.e. moved down the program's ROL or DNR'd outright) for sounding presumptuous?

Dude, chill. Get out of your own head. Did it sound slightly presumptuous, yes. Will anyone with a working brain understand the actual meaning behind your words - pretty damn likely. Considering that most rankings are done well in advance of the ROL deadline, it shouldnt make much difference.

 

[DrAwsome]

Before ROLs were due I sent a brief message to my 2nd choice including a statement that "I will consider it a great honor to match at your program and I look forward to being a part of your department next year." I didn't mention the specific rank or anything.

In hindsight, I'm thinking that my message was too pushy, as if I somehow made a nefarious backroom deal guaranteeing my match. Do you think this message wouldve come across as a match violation and scared off the PD? I'm afraid the PD would have DNR'd me even if he had me ranked high before, just because my statement was too controversial.

I don't see how your statement is controversial. I sent similar messages to my non-#1 since I would be happy to match there and said things of a similar nature, that I would be very happy there and would like to be in the department next year, etc. A match violation would have being something like you entered the match and then accepted an outside the match position, or the other way around-you accepted an outside the match position and also submitted a rank list.

 

[HumbleMD]

I don't see how your statement is controversial. I sent similar messages to my non-#1 since I would be happy to match there and said things of a similar nature, that I would be very happy there and would like to be in the department next year, etc. A match violation would have being something like you entered the match and then accepted an outside the match position, or the other way around-you accepted an outside the match position and also submitted a rank list.

Agreed. Surprisingly, even all out lying is not a match violation. The act of soliciting where you are, and making deals on that information are match violations.

Don't sweat it OP.

 

[DrAwsome]

Agreed. Surprisingly, even all out lying is not a match violation. The act of soliciting where you are, and making deals on that information are match violations.

Don't sweat it OP.

I think that any and all post interview communication, including emails, letters, phone calls, etc. should be banned from both sides by the NRMP, etc. to the point where they can withdraw the applicant/program from the match if any such communication is had. I think it creates undue anxiety to have all this communication. If they banned it, then both sides would be on more equal playing ground. I don't see why they don't make some sort of rule on this.

 

[Phyozo]

I think that any and all post interview communication, including emails, letters, phone calls, etc. should be banned from both sides by the NRMP, etc. to the point where they can withdraw the applicant/program from the match if any such communication is had. I think it creates undue anxiety to have all this communication. If they banned it, then both sides would be on more equal playing ground. I don't see why they don't make some sort of rule on this.

How are you going to enforce a ban on post-interview communication?

 

[DrAwsome]

How are you going to enforce a ban on post-interview communication?

I don't know, but I'm just saying it would be beneficial.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

So, if you had a question about the program after your visit, you couldn't ask it? Or if I wanted some new information from you (let's say an updated transcript, or a new step score), I'm not allowed to ask afterwards?

To the OP: You are seriously over thinking this. Your email was fine. It won't change your position on their ranklist either way. I got 10+ of these emails every day before the ROL deadline.

 

[DrAwsome]

So, if you had a question about the program after your visit, you couldn't ask it? Or if I wanted some new information from you (let's say an updated transcript, or a new step score), I'm not allowed to ask afterwards?

To the OP: You are seriously over thinking this. Your email was fine. It won't change your position on their ranklist either way. I got 10+ of these emails every day before the ROL deadline.

Well no, that's not what I meant actually. I was actually not referring to objective questions, but rather the subjective - Oh, I'm ranking you this, or you as the PD, calling people post interview to tell them that they are being ranked, etc. etc. Sort of how like now it's a match violation to ask an applicant how the program is being ranked, etc. I don't know if that makes sense.

Of course if the applicant has a real question, or if the PD/faculty member has an actual objective question they could ask. But I have found that most of the time, it's mostly subjective type communication that goes on, and it causes a great deal of stress - sort of like how the OP is totally stressing out here. 🙂

Btw-can I ask what specialty you are a PD in? I am curious. And since you mentioned that you got a bunch of those emails prior to the ROL deadline, I figured I'd ask-do they have any effect on your ranking of applicants? If someone truly wants to be in your program and they send you such an email, will it move them up the list or not at all?

 

[NotAProgDirector]

That's the problem. You can say "No communication after the interview" which is straightforward to enforce. But if you say you're not allowed to say "I'm ranking you highly", can you say:

"I enjoyed my visit"
"I could see myself happy lving in the area"
"I would enjoy working with your residents, as they seem like a fun group"

etc.

In any case, these statements don't make much, if any, difference. I see them as meaningless platitudes.

I'm in Internal Medicine.

 

[SDEM2012]

That's the problem. You can say "No communication after the interview" which is straightforward to enforce. But if you say you're not allowed to say "I'm ranking you highly", can you say:

"I enjoyed my visit"
"I could see myself happy living in the area"
"I would enjoy working with your residents, as they seem like a fun group"

etc.

In any case, these statements don't make much, if any, difference. I see them as meaningless platitudes.

I'm in Internal Medicine.

Out of curiosity, do the 'I'm ranking you #1' e-mails affect you in any way?

 

[SDEM2012]

I can't believe the stupid questions you loser gunner msiv's are asking. Grow some balls.

"There are no stupid questions, just stupid people"

Wow, you're so cool Conjunctiva.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

For me, no.

I rank people in the order that I want them. Telling me that I'm your #1 doesn't really change that.

Plus, I've had enough experiences where someone who told me that they are ranking me #1 and then doesn't match with us, that I frankly don't believe it.

 

[Conjuctiva]

I can't believe the stupid questions you loser gunner msiv's are asking. Grow some balls.

"There are no stupid questions, just stupid people"

couldnt have said it better myself



oh wait

 

[deleted103644]

So, if you had a question about the program after your visit, you couldn't ask it? Or if I wanted some new information from you (let's say an updated transcript, or a new step score), I'm not allowed to ask afterwards?

To the OP: You are seriously over thinking this. Your email was fine. It won't change your position on their ranklist either way. I got 10+ of these emails every day before the ROL deadline.

If the ERAS system were better, I would say you could enforce having all communications between applicant and program happen through ERAS (including a better interview management solution) with direct contact cut off post-interview. This would also eliminate the whole thank you note dilemma.

For questions about a program, most applicants would be interested in the responses so this could be handled with a message board for anonymous questions accessible only to individuals who interviewed at a program.

All of these things would be fairly straightforward to do, but would involve some serious improvements in ERAS that probably would never happen. Personally I just hope they allow people to use Chrome or Safari next year, and they could really use an iPhone app.

 

[turkeyjerky]

. Personally I just hope they allow people to use Chrome or Safari next year, and they could really use an iPhone app.

Amen to that