Dropping PhD to take masters and run -- how to assure ADCOM's of your commitment?

[philosonista]

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Hello, SDN --

I'm pursuing a PhD before a MD. Let's consider the possibility that I end up disliking the PhD and decide to end it at a masters. How do I assure ADCOMs I am taking the masters and running if I'm one year out from getting my masters? (The application cycle would overlap with my final year for the masters).

 

[Goro]

Your EC'S will convict us that you're pursuing your dream, or chasing a wild goose

 

[URHere]

1) Make sure your PhD program will actually allow you to complete a terminal masters degree. My university used to have this option until too many people used it to get a free MS - it is essentially unheard of now. Not even worth considering this if it can't happen at your university.

2) If you decide to take a terminal masters, decide BEFORE you apply to medical school. Most schools will accept you with the caveat that you complete your current training program prior to matriculation. If you drop down to a masters and are forthcoming about the fact that research just isn't right for you in your PS/medical school application I don't think that would reflect badly on you (assuming that you can explain why medicine IS right for you). If a medical school expects you to finish a PhD and you graduate with a masters, that's another story.

 

[Lucca]

Why not apply md phd? I'm absolutely sure it's frowned upon to drop the phd in the middle of the program but it seems like a more straightforward path if you think you need (and desire) the training. Do you have a compelling reason to believe you will bail on the phd?

 

[hoihaie]

Why not apply md phd? I'm absolutely sure it's frowned upon to drop the phd in the middle of the program but it seems like a more straightforward path if you think you need (and desire) the training. Do you have a compelling reason to believe you will bail on the phd?

lol drop phd to apply md/phd???

 

[philosonista]

I was pre-MD/PhD. Now I'm not so sure. So I'm going for the one that won't leave me in financial ruin if I leave it -- the PhD. You just don't apply MD/PhD half-heartedly.

 

[philosonista]

lol drop phd to apply md/phd???

It happens.

 

[Lucca]

I was pre-MD/PhD. Now I'm not so sure. So I'm going for the one that won't leave me in financial ruin if I leave it -- the PhD. You just don't apply MD/PhD half-heartedly.

Is it really financial ruin if you are considering going PhD ----> MD anyways? Or are you unsure on the MD bit more than the PhD bit? It sounded to me like you were considering investing in the MD in any case. By going MD/PhD you at least have the opportunity to not pay for half of the MD if you don't want the PhD. It's probably a better call to sort out your values/desires/career aspirations and take the most direct, integrated route rather than doing something so circuitous if you can avoid it. The PhD to MD folks on SDN at least certainly don't recommend it as the go to path to the dual degree.

 

[philosonista]

I'm a mixed bag of sentiments.

I'm not competitive for MD/PhD right now. Very competitive for MD (but pre-MCAT). I need something that will show me whether I like research, pay me, preferably not require me to move given my uncertainty of how long I'd be there, my spouse has his life well settled here (I don't want to just move him around at my unsure whim) and because we have a once-in-lifetime deal on a subsidized apartment that I don't want to give up without good reason. There's a program in my town I'm pretty sure I could get into. There is also an unpaid research position I could have, but, alas unpaid. Not cool with my large loans. I'd like to tell my parents they don't have to help me out anymore. And I also want to experience grad school -- not just the lab. There is also an underlying hesitation about the MD.

I'm not sure about any of the three: MD/PhD, PhD or MD. But I am damn sure it is going to be one of the three. It's not easy to sort out my desires without getting my feet wet. It's going to be one of the three, and going for the PhD will help me potentially eliminate two of them, or keep me content with the PhD, and fit my preferences.

I'm not just going to sit here and introspect until I happen upon an answer. I've been at it all summer. It's gotten me nowhere.

 

[Lucca]

I'm a mixed bag of sentiments.

I'm not competitive for MD/PhD right now. Very competitive for MD (but pre-MCAT). I need something that will show me whether I like research, pay me, preferably not require me to move given my uncertainty of how long I'd be there, my spouse has his life well settled here (I don't want to just move him around at my unsure whim) and because we have a once-in-lifetime deal on a subsidized apartment that I don't want to give up without good reason. There's a program in my town I'm pretty sure I could get into. There is also an unpaid research position I could have, but, alas unpaid. Not cool with my large loans. I'd like to tell my parents they don't have to help me out anymore. And I also want to experience grad school -- not just the lab. There is also an underlying hesitation about the MD.

I'm not sure about any of the three: MD/PhD, PhD or MD. But it's not easy to sort out my desires without getting my feet wet. It's going to be one of the three, and going for the PhD will help me potentially eliminate two of them, or keep me content with the PhD, and fit my preferences.

I'm not just going to sit here and introspect until I happen upon an answer. I've been at it all summer. It's gotten me nowhere.

I see. It's definitely a very particular and difficult position to be in. I can certainly relate to flip-flopping between those three degree options. I'm afraid I'm not experienced enough to confidently provide advice in this situation. Others from the Physician Scientist forum may be able to do a better job than me. One has already commented above. I don't suppose you live near the NIH lol so you could do the NIH IRTA? I imagine that is not the case.

How much time have you spent doing research in undergrad? I can't really speak to your motivations and I don't think anyone is really entirely sure when they make this sort of decision. You might just have to go with your gut and see what works best for you. The MD is the easiest to sort out in my opinion: Do you want to see patients? As far as research is concerned I can only tell you what I have figured out in my limited experience and that is that I want to contribute to human discovery, I enjoy the day to day of lab work and I'm fascinated by nature in general. I would consider my career lacking in some way if I did not spend a significant amount of my time doing a more intense version of what I am currently doing.

 

[philosonista]

Neuroscience IRTA's are in Maryland, unfortunately.

I've done two years of research. What enthusiasm I had for it at the start has been crushed by what I think is not typical of research. One semester was spent just learning the ropes. Fine. Another semester was spent working with a terrible, terrible research partner with what was soon diagnosed to be a mental illness. Two semesters has been spent failing to lift the project off the ground due to a company that is terribly slow to respond and a malfunctioning, but essential piece of equipment made by said company.

I don't think this is how research usually goes. But I can't just assume I would like research if it weren't like this.

I love the idea of having patients. But I also have a desire to further medicine, not only practice it. And I'd love to have research as an excuse to program! And I have deep reservations that I would not like the job based on things I hear: less time spent per patient, increasing paperwork, many physicians would not recommend the practice, etc. At the same time, I could truly just dislike research.

I sound like a bottle of contradictions, I know. It seems like all my sentences start with either "And" or "But." I can't much help it at this point.

 

[deleted393595]

I'm a mixed bag of sentiments.

I'm not competitive for MD/PhD right now. Very competitive for MD (but pre-MCAT). I need something that will show me whether I like research, pay me, preferably not require me to move given my uncertainty of how long I'd be there, my spouse has his life well settled here (I don't want to just move him around at my unsure whim) and because we have a once-in-lifetime deal on a subsidized apartment that I don't want to give up without good reason. There's a program in my town I'm pretty sure I could get into. There is also an unpaid research position I could have, but, alas unpaid. Not cool with my large loans. I'd like to tell my parents they don't have to help me out anymore. And I also want to experience grad school -- not just the lab. There is also an underlying hesitation about the MD.

I'm not sure about any of the three: MD/PhD, PhD or MD. But I am damn sure it is going to be one of the three. It's not easy to sort out my desires without getting my feet wet. It's going to be one of the three, and going for the PhD will help me potentially eliminate two of them, or keep me content with the PhD, and fit my preferences.

I'm not just going to sit here and introspect until I happen upon an answer. I've been at it all summer. It's gotten me nowhere.

Right now you need to focus on the MCAT. You can have the greatest ECs and a 4.0, but it means nothing without a good MCAT.

Neuroscience IRTA's are in Maryland, unfortunately.

I've done two years of research. What enthusiasm I had for it at the start has been crushed by what I think is not typical of research. One semester was spent just learning the ropes. Fine. Another semester was spent working with a terrible, terrible research partner with what was soon diagnosed to be a mental illness. Two semesters has been spent failing to lift the project off the ground due to a company that is terribly slow to respond and a malfunctioning, but essential piece of equipment made by said company.

I don't think this is how research usually goes. But I can't just assume I would like research if it weren't like this.

I love the idea of having patients. But I also have a desire to further medicine, not only practice it. And I'd love to have research as an excuse to program! And I have deep reservations that I would not like the job based on things I hear: less time spent per patient, increasing paperwork, many physicians would not recommend the practice, etc. At the same time, I could truly just dislike research.

I sound like a bottle of contradictions, I know. It seems like all my sentences start with either "And" or "But." I can't much help it at this point.

Sounds like a fairly typical experience imho.

 

[Lucca]

Neuroscience IRTA's are in Maryland, unfortunately.

I've done two years of research. What enthusiasm I had for it at the start has been crushed by what I think is not typical of research. One semester was spent just learning the ropes. Fine. Another semester was spent working with a terrible, terrible research partner with what was soon diagnosed to be a mental illness. Two semesters has been spent failing to lift the project off the ground due to a company that is terribly slow to respond and a malfunctioning, but essential piece of equipment made by said company.

I don't think this is how research usually goes. But I can't just assume I would like research if it weren't like this.

I love the idea of having patients. But I also have a desire to further medicine, not only practice it. And I'd love to have research as an excuse to program! And I have deep reservations that I would not like the job based on things I hear: less time spent per patient, increasing paperwork, many physicians would not recommend the practice, etc. At the same time, I could truly just dislike research.

I sound like a bottle of contradictions, I know. It seems like all my sentences start with either "And" or "But." I can't much help it at this point.

That's definitely a rough path I would say. My research experience has not been similar but it has had its frustrating and sometimes seemingly pointless road bumps. It's a messy business and unlike actual business things aren't very quick to turnaround, change, or be fixed. Again, I don't know, have to defer to more experienced people on this one.

 

[philosonista]

That's definitely a rough path I would say. My research experience has not been similar but it has had its frustrating and sometimes seemingly pointless road bumps. It's a messy business and unlike actual business things aren't very quick to turnaround, change, or be fixed. Again, I don't know, have to defer to more experienced people on this one.

You're help is appreciated anyways if only to be able to talk to someone besides my spouse about it. ^_^

Have a nice night.