Duke University Internal Medicine

[causalinference]

I'm a soon-to-be first year medical student at Ohio State. I was in North Carolina this week and had the opportunity to shadow Dr. Joseph Moore on the hematology/oncology service at Duke University. I also met various internal medicine residents and hematology/oncology fellows. I was blown away by the experience and wanted to share it.

The housestaff were extremely friendly and helpful. The interns seemed to love being there and had lots of advice for me. The attending who I shadowed was an enthusiastic teacher and, in some cases, even let me touch the patients, all of who had leukemia. It was such a positive experience that it made me want to come back as a resident.

Perhaps this question is premature since I don't start medical school until this fall, but does anyone have any advice for matching at this particular institution? Other thoughts about Duke University would be appreciated as well. Thanks in advance.

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[obiwan]

why don't you post on this thread 3 years from now after you're still interested in doing internal medicine and then we'll talk.... until then

 

[causalinference]

Well, even if I eventually change my mind, perhaps this thread can prove helpful to someone down the line who does a search on Duke IM. I didn't intend for this thread to be specific to my case.

 

[jbz24]

There's not much you can do at this point because matching into internal medicine is largely based upon your clerkship grades, board scores, and LORs. The only thing you can really do at this point is if you're certain what field you want to go into, start some research in that area.

 

[causalinference]

I heard that it's possible to do an "away" rotation at another institution (depending on what medical school one attends)? How common is this and could it be useful in matching somewhere?

 

[jbz24]

You can do an away rotation as a 4th year. It sometimes helps getting an interview at the program you do an away rotation at. For Duke, I doubt it would help much getting an interview or matching unless you were a very strong applicant to begin with.

 

[IM2010]

Do as well as you can on Step 1 (try for > 230 for the most competitive programs), honor as many rotations as possible in 3rd year, definitely honor any medicine rotations, do some research (preferably something that you are interested in so that you are genuinely into it), a little community service in 1st and 2nd year, and stay enthusiastic!

You can absolutely do an away rotation at Duke - there is a little extra paperwork that your medical school needs to do, so plan early (sometime in 3rd year).

Its great that you have goals in mind already, work hard and you can make it happen!

 

[Speculatrix]

I did not apply to Duke based on the fact that it had to scramble for positions last year. This set off a number of red flags, and the last thing I wanted was to be at a malignant program. Can someone who interviewed there talk about how they explained this? What did they say during the interview process? Judging from interview feedback reports, it seems like their feedback to applicants this year was saccharine, to say the least.

 

[BlazerMed]

I did not apply to Duke based on the fact that it had to scramble for positions last year. This set off a number of red flags, and the last thing I wanted was to be at a malignant program. Can someone who interviewed there talk about how they explained this? What did they say during the interview process? Judging from interview feedback reports, it seems like their feedback to applicants this year was saccharine, to say the least.

They scrambled 2 years ago, not last year. They drastically changed the schedule for last year, fewer call months as an intern, Q5 on Duke Gen Med Q4 at VA, fewer clinics during inpatient months, etc. I've been told they were very open about it during last year's interview cycle as that was the group that immediately followed. It wasn't really addressed this year.

I thoroughly enjoyed the people and the program. Both residents and faculty were very outgoing and forthcoming with what it's like there.

 

[Speculatrix]

They scrambled 2 years ago, not last year. They drastically changed the schedule for last year, fewer call months as an intern, Q5 on Duke Gen Med Q4 at VA, fewer clinics during inpatient months, etc. I've been told they were very open about it during last year's interview cycle as that was the group that immediately followed. It wasn't really addressed this year.

I thoroughly enjoyed the people and the program. Both residents and faculty were very outgoing and forthcoming with what it's like there.

Are people really making their decisions based on call schedules?!?! Who can really decipher the difference between q6 medium call, q5 double-tall call, q3 extra-short call, etc. etc. at all the various programs. If it were about call schedules, no one would rank Vanderbilt and it would go unfilled in the match despite it being a great program. I figure it all evens out in the end in terms of hours at the hospital, so there has to be something else that explains the difference? Hubris from the resident selection committee? I mean I don't doubt that the residents are nice, but there has to have been something else besides the call schedule.

 

[IM2010]

I interviewed there and absolutely loved it. The residents were welcoming, intelligent, warm, etc. I only found the residents at BWH to be as intelligent, warm, and outgoing as the residents at Duke. I have kept in touch with the residents as well and they couldn't be more helpful.

The issues of not matching all their spots 2 years ago were briefly brought up on my day (I think someone asked a question) - the program's response was that the issues involving not making hours (because of call, clinic while on the wards etc.) have been eliminated and the residents echoed that the feel of the program changed substantially. It did not seem as if changing "just the call schedule" was all that happened but it appeared to have department-wide changes in attitude etc. The residents said they were incredibly happy with the new schedule and loved the faculty and fellow residents.

I obviously loved Duke enough that I am ranking it first above BWH, MGH and Hopkins so feel free to ask questions. I felt the environment at MGH and Hopkins was much more intense than the feel at Duke (BWH had a similar warm feeling and I also loved it there).

 

[Frugal Traveler]

I interviewed there and absolutely loved it. The residents were welcoming, intelligent, warm, etc. I only found the residents at BWH to be as intelligent, warm, and outgoing as the residents at Duke. I have kept in touch with the residents as well and they couldn't be more helpful.

BWH, Duke, and UCSF had the most delightful residents.


Duke is a great program. The issue with the scramble a few years ago was apparently from not ranking enough applicants (their fault) from what I heard on the grapevine. I think the program is striving to become the best it can be at this point. Every dog has its fleas - Duke is no exception.

 

[Frugal Traveler]

Are people really making their decisions based on call schedules?!?! Who can really decipher the difference between q6 medium call, q5 double-tall call, q3 extra-short call, etc. etc. at all the various programs. If it were about call schedules, no one would rank Vanderbilt and it would go unfilled in the match despite it being a great program. I figure it all evens out in the end in terms of hours at the hospital, so there has to be something else that explains the difference? Hubris from the resident selection committee? I mean I don't doubt that the residents are nice, but there has to have been something else besides the call schedule.

It's called the "lamest generation." Some (rather unpleasant) applicants I encountered on the circuit were literally trying to make a time line of the average resident day (the questioning stopped short of asking about bathroom breaks). Internists are known to be involved in excessive details, so I would not put it past some people to get lost and not see the big picture.

The whole thing about basing your decision on current variables is a little ridiculous given that programs can change all the time!

 

[Scaredshizzles]

It's called the "lamest generation." Some (rather unpleasant) applicants I encountered on the circuit were literally trying to make a time line of the average resident day (the questioning stopped short of asking about bathroom breaks). Internists are known to be involved in excessive details, so I would not put it past some people to get lost and not see the big picture.

The whole thing about basing your decision on current variables is a little ridiculous given that programs can change all the time!

Well almost as ridiculous as basing your decision on how friendly the residents appear, considering they change every year, and you only get to see a small sample of them at most places anyway.

 

[Frugal Traveler]

Well almost as ridiculous as basing your decision on how friendly the residents appear, considering they change every year, and you only get to see a small sample of them at most places anyway.

There is a document that the NRMP publishes that indicates what factors people considered important (http://www.nrmp.org/data/ApplicantResultsBySpecialty2009.pdf).

The data is limited because only around 50 % responded for most specialties.

I honestly didn't have a rational way of ranking... I just ranked the programs by what my gut reaction was to the place.

 

[BlazerMed]

Are people really making their decisions based on call schedules?!?! Who can really decipher the difference between q6 medium call, q5 double-tall call, q3 extra-short call, etc. etc. at all the various programs. If it were about call schedules, no one would rank Vanderbilt and it would go unfilled in the match despite it being a great program. I figure it all evens out in the end in terms of hours at the hospital, so there has to be something else that explains the difference? Hubris from the resident selection committee? I mean I don't doubt that the residents are nice, but there has to have been something else besides the call schedule.

Some people do, and seeing as how workhours are what most people are referring to when referencing malignancy, I figured I'd include call months. I could care less, and to use the school you referenced, I ranked Vanderbilt 3rd.

 

[vinci1283]

Well almost as ridiculous as basing your decision on how friendly the residents appear, considering they change every year, and you only get to see a small sample of them at most places anyway.

I think residents may change, but admins are more static. PDs, aPDs etc often set the tempo/culture of the place and it's a more accurate assessment of "niceness," I think, when it's from a top down approach. I think a lot of ppl place premiums on "friendly" environments bc obviously, having to deal with negative vibes make 3 years seem much longer.... Seen places where places have a stuffy atmosphere and it's no surprise that ppl up top reinforce that.

 

[ResidentMD]

I think residents may change, but admins are more static. PDs, aPDs etc often set the tempo/culture of the place and it's a more accurate assessment of "niceness," I think, when it's from a top down approach. I think a lot of ppl place premiums on "friendly" environments bc obviously, having to deal with negative vibes make 3 years seem much longer.... Seen places where places have a stuffy atmosphere and it's no surprise that ppl up top reinforce that.

Also the quality and temperament of the residents at times is an indicator of the type of residents that the admin likes to hire (or will interview, and subsequently rank high enough to match).