EM in Canada

[hurricanemd]

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My hubby's boss wants us to relocate to Toronto after I finish residency here in the US. I'll be done in July and haven't really started my job search here yet. Aside from the weather, what are the negatives to living in Canada? Also, does anyone know how hard it is to get a Canadian medical license? And how different is EM practice there versus here?

Sorry for all the specifics, but I want to make a good decision for both our careers. I'd appreciate any input.

 

[po' boy]

i am also curious about this. from what i can tell, getting a medical license in canada requires residency training that is equal in length to canadian em residency training, which is five years. this seems ridiculous, especially for abem board certified graduates of us em residency programs. anyone heard different?

 

[deleted109597]

this seems ridiculous

While I don't know whether this is true or not, it is their country, their rules.

 

[leviathan]

The ridiculous part is that Canadians can practice emergency medicine in almost any emergency department after a shorter (2 year) family med residency if they add on a 1 year EM fellowship. Even family physicians can work in smaller rural ERs without any extra training, although I think that is the same in the US and it is out of necessity. Anyways, an inarguably superiorly trained US emerg physician with 3-4 solid years isn't deemed equivalent?

However, I think there is a regular poster on these boards who was able to challenge that and was/is practicing in Canada.

 

[po' boy]

While I don't know whether this is true or not, it is their country, their rules.

very true. it is also their prerogative to close emergency departments due to inability to find doctors to staff them, as has happened several times over the last few months, especially in more remote areas like manitoba. again, no different than in the US.

 

[canuck MD]

My hubby's boss wants us to relocate to Toronto after I finish residency here in the US. I'll be done in July and haven't really started my job search here yet. Aside from the weather, what are the negatives to living in Canada? Also, does anyone know how hard it is to get a Canadian medical license? And how different is EM practice there versus here?

Sorry for all the specifics, but I want to make a good decision for both our careers. I'd appreciate any input.

Let me start by saying that I have never worked in the US so I can't make a fair comparison.

First off, Toronto is unique in that it is similar to any large US city. You'll see alot of blunt trauma and less penetrating trauma than most large US cities. Residency training programs are smaller in Canada than in the US so less Emergency Specialists. Most non tertiary hospitals are staffed with family physicians with enhance EM training. Volume of patients is anywhere from 150 - 200 pts/day (depending on which hospital - there are several in Toronto). There is a dedidicated Pediatric Hospital in Toronto - not many kids seen in the Adult EDs. The EMS system is top notch with Advanced and Critical Care Paramedics. There is a provincial critical care service for transfers etc.

You'll get the same hassles with consultants as you would in any other city. Probably the biggest advantage is that our healthcare system allows everyone to benefit from the same services (regardless of insurance policies) - I find this very helpfull when ordering investigation etc. That being said, a patient with a borderline chest pain story won't get the million dollar workup that a US patient with insurance would get. You also don't need to worry much about litigation - almost non existent.

Depending what city you're from, you probably won't see much of a difference living in Toronto. It's very multicultural and has everything one would need to enjoy a great life (No NFL team though..). The Canadian education system is excellent.

In regards to weather - it actually doesn't get that cold in Toronto - city usually shuts down if they get more than 5 inches of snow!

Not sure exactly what you need for liscensing but this is where you would need to look.

www.cpso.on.ca (Provincial governing body responsable for liscencing)
www.mcc.ca/en/mcc_docs/licentiate.shtml (medical certification agency)
www.cmpa.org (National legal coverage)

Good luck!

 

[canuck MD]

The ridiculous part is that Canadians can practice emergency medicine in almost any emergency department after a shorter (2 year) family med residency if they add on a 1 year EM fellowship. Even family physicians can work in smaller rural ERs without any extra training, although I think that is the same in the US and it is out of necessity. Anyways, an inarguably superiorly trained US emerg physician with 3-4 solid years isn't deemed equivalent?

I wouldn't say superiorly trained..differently trained for sure. A US resident might need the training in chest tube insertions or thoracotomies if their environment requires it - doesn't make them a better physician; especially if they plan on working in Canada..

 

[Apollyon]

(No NFL team though..)

But the NFL is playing games there for the next several years (yes!), with the down side being it's the Bills (bummer) (and I grew up in Buffalo).

And they're trying to move the Bills there (after Ralph Wilson dies, his family doesn't want to have/run the team).

 

[canuck MD]

But the NFL is playing games there for the next several years (yes!), with the down side being it's the Bills (bummer) (and I grew up in Buffalo).

And they're trying to move the Bills there (after Ralph Wilson dies, his family doesn't want to have/run the team).

I don't think that Toronto can afford to have another losing franchise! Sport fans will have a fit.

 

[McGillGrad]

In order to get licensed, you will need to take the MCCEE and have equivalent training for the speciality you plan on practicing. The MCCEE is a quasi- Step1/2 exam.

You may qualify for an exemption if you are board certified, but I am not 100% sure about that.

 

[leviathan]

I wouldn't say superiorly trained..differently trained for sure. A US resident might need the training in chest tube insertions or thoracotomies if their environment requires it - doesn't make them a better physician; especially if they plan on working in Canada..

Have to disagree with you there...a US physician with 3 dedicated years of EM training is superior in competency to a Canadian physician who does only 1 year of training in EM.

 

[bravotwozero]

Or at the very least, more experienced in EM.

 

[canuck MD]

Have to disagree with you there...a US physician with 3 dedicated years of EM training is superior in competency to a Canadian physician who does only 1 year of training in EM.

Pretty generalized comment. I still disagree; but this could easily be debaed either way. Again, it depends what the resident is exposed to. During my FM training, I did more EM and ICU than my FRCP conterparts in their 1st and 2nd years of training. US trained physicians may have more exposure. Exposure is not equivelent to competency.