Engineers.....

[klinzou]

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If you don't have that Bachelors degree that says ***** engineering, you're not an engineer.

Also, if it says industrial engineering, you are not and engineer.

 

[MacGyver]

Originally posted by klinzou
If you don't have that Bachelors degree that says ***** engineering, you're not an engineer.

Well I agree with you thats the way it should be...

the problem is that most companies have no problem taking job applicants with no such degree and giving them a job title with the word "engineer" in it

 

[nimbus001]

Originally posted by klinzou
If you don't have that Bachelors degree that says ***** engineering, you're not an engineer.

Hey, you told me that I wasn't an engineer because ABET wouldn't accredit my sub-major....I am still graduating from UCSD with a B.S in Bioengineering......So, am I an 'engineer' or not? Explain yourself 😀

 

[klinzou]

Hmmm. Must you make me be specific....

Lemme see.

OK. You can call yourself one yes. Professionally though, you aren't. I personally wouldn't be an engineerign major at a non-accredited institution. Is the reason they aren't accredited yet b/c it's a new program?? If so, and you expect accreditation, then fine. You're all engineer. If it's b/c the curriculum isn't up to standards, then no...sorry.

 

[SunnyS81]

Originally posted by klinzou

Also, if it says industrial engineering, you are not and engineer.

I resent that, but I'll let you live in ignorance.

 

[apass]

Panda Bear or any other PEs

Do you plan on keeping your Licence up to date? In my state we have to have so many educational credits to keep the PE and I don't think that medical school will qualify. What will you do or what have you done with your PE?

 

[nimbus001]

Originally posted by klinzou
Hmmm. Must you make me be specific....

Lemme see.

OK. You can call yourself one yes. Professionally though, you aren't. I personally wouldn't be an engineerign major at a non-accredited institution. Is the reason they aren't accredited yet b/c it's a new program?? If so, and you expect accreditation, then fine. You're all engineer. If it's b/c the curriculum isn't up to standards, then no...sorry.

Hehe...Ok, I go to UCSD, currently ranked 4th in the nation in Bioengineering according to USNews. The have 4 different majors given by the department, and 2 of them are not ABET accredited (2 of them are.) I am in the major without ABET accreditation because the accreditors felt that the major did not have enough engineering classes. They were short by like 4 engineering classes. The department don't want to make a big deal out of it, because in order to get accreditation, fufil the medschool requirements, and still only take 4 years would not be practical.

 

[klinzou]

It's true, at least at every school I have seen.
Industrial engineers have a curriculum based on manufacturing and business. They take engineering classes, but nothing really tough. They take core classes, but nothing advanced.

 

[Tamomo]

Originally posted by MacGyver
You should be very concerned about titles if you are an engineer, or any profession for that matter.

What if we opened up the term "physician" or "doctor" to anybody and everybody?

You would see a rapid loss in job value.

Medicine, unlike engineering, has actually made attempts to preserve barriers to the profession and therefore elevate it to one of the premier job titles.

Engineering, on the other hand, gave away its authority and as a result in 50 years engineering wont be a true profession anymore, but simply a vocational choice.

What about this....5 states allow clinical PSYCHOLOGISTS, with no true medical experience to prescribe medications. In these states there is no functional distinction b/w MDs and PhDs. They take no real science classes and have only a very basic understanding of pharmacology; it's too bad that a few people will have to die in order to demonstrate that only MDs are qualified enough to prescribe medicine. I talked with a pshychiatrist who is fuming over this; he got a BS in psychology and knows their graduate training. Go and talk about feelings and relationships with them but don't get meds from them. What's next....freakin' chiropractors licensed to prescribe meds.

Oh yeah, what's industrial, systems, or production engineering

 

[fonzy]

Originally posted by Panda Bear
You are exactly right. I used to work with a couple of design-draftsmen with associates degrees in Engineering Technology from a community college. (A very good community college, by the way.) Their big pet peeve was that they were not eligible for professional registration as "Engineers." In their world, a B.S. in engineering was "just a piece of paper" with no significance in the real world.

But their business cards still said "Design Engineer." (Which is a viloation of Louisiana law, by the way.) The ironic thing is that until I worked for five years and passed the PE exam, my business cards said, "EIT". (Engineer in Training.)

Since there's nobody here but us engineering types and there is little chance of starting a flame-war, people with a votech diploma who call themselves "engineers" are like chiropracters calling themselves "physicians." (Or "doctors," for that matter.)

People in software business working as programmers are called software engineers or network engineers, etc. Not only that they do not need a degree in engineering, they do not need a degree at all.

 

[MacGyver]

Originally posted by fonzy
People in software business working as programmers are called software engineers or network engineers, etc. Not only that they do not need a degree in engineering, they do not need a degree at all.

100% correct

 

[MacGyver]

Originally posted by apass
Panda Bear or any other PEs

Do you plan on keeping your Licence up to date? In my state we have to have so many educational credits to keep the PE and I don't think that medical school will qualify. What will you do or what have you done with your PE?

I looked into this so I can answer.

In general, its impossible to get a PE during med school. You have to work under a PE, and there are no PEs in med school.

The only reason Panda got a PE was because he worked in industry for a number of years which are required before sitting for the Principles and Practice of Engineering Exam. If he had gone straight from college to med school, he would have been unable to get the PE.

The only way for a med student to get a PE would be to graduate from med school, NOT do a residency, and instead get a job as an engineer for at least 4 or 5 years. After that, you can sit for the PE exam.

Med school credits (even if you do work in bioengineering) dont count. Most engineering boards dont recognize biomedical engineering as a professional engineering discipline and therefore dont let BMEs get the professional PE license.

 

[8744]

And the key provision is that you have to work under the supervision of a licensed engineer while you are an EIT. If you "free-lance" doing some engineering work here or there while you are in medical school this time will not count towards your acreddited experience.

I let my professional registration expire, by the way. I got a nice letter from the State Board saying that medical school courses don't count towards the CE requirement.

 

[SunnyS81]

Originally posted by klinzou
It's true, at least at every school I have seen.
Industrial engineers have a curriculum based on manufacturing and business. They take engineering classes, but nothing really tough. They take core classes, but nothing advanced.

I've taken upper level engineering classes in Civil, Mechanical, and Electrical Engineering. Honestly, the only one I found even slightly difficult was Electrical.

True though in regards to my curriculum. We had a quality control classes (but every engineering department at my school does) and we have logistics classes. Despite this, the goal of our classes is to mathamatically optimize operative systems. Lot of people go into software optimization, manufacturing/logistics optimization, and optimization of other systems (heathcare, devices,etc.)

As for the definition of Industrial Engineering from the Institute of Industrial Engineering website:

Industrial engineering is concerned with the design, improvement and installation of integrated systems of people, material, information, equipment and energy. It draws upon specialized knowledge and skills in the mathematical, physical and social sciences, together with the principles and methods of engineering analysis and design to specify, predict and evaluate the results to be obtained from such systems

 

[apass]

Originally posted by MacGyver
I looked into this so I can answer.

In general, its impossible to get a PE during med school. You have to work under a PE, and there are no PEs in med school.

The only reason Panda got a PE was because he worked in industry for a number of years which are required before sitting for the Principles and Practice of Engineering Exam. If he had gone straight from college to med school, he would have been unable to get the PE.

The only way for a med student to get a PE would be to graduate from med school, NOT do a residency, and instead get a job as an engineer for at least 4 or 5 years. After that, you can sit for the PE exam.

Med school credits (even if you do work in bioengineering) dont count. Most engineering boards dont recognize biomedical engineering as a professional engineering discipline and therefore dont let BMEs get the professional PE license.

No - I already have my PE, already played that game - tired of it though - I am just wondering what Panda Bear is doing in med school. I start school this fall - I am nontraditional. I got my undergrad at university of missouri - rolla and masters at washington university while working. I just don't know if it is possible to get your licence after leaving the engineering field????

 

[apass]

Originally posted by apass
No - I already have my PE, already played that game - tired of it though - I am just wondering what Panda Bear is doing in med school. I start school this fall - I am nontraditional. I got my undergrad at university of missouri - rolla and masters at washington university while working. I just don't know if it is possible to get your licence after leaving the engineering field????

I meant keep your licence NOT get it - damn sorry about that

 

[8744]

Originally posted by apass
No - I already have my PE, already played that game - tired of it though - I am just wondering what Panda Bear is doing in med school. I start school this fall - I am nontraditional. I got my undergrad at university of missouri - rolla and masters at washington university while working. I just don't know if it is possible to get your licence after leaving the engineering field????

Since there is nobody here but us engineers and I don't have to worry about some self-righteous gunner wagging their finger at me and mouthing platitudes, the primary reason that I am in medical school is because engineering is not financially stable or lucrative enough to provide any kind of long-term financial stability for my family. I know I won't get rich as a doctor, but the work is steady and the average salaries in most specialties are at least twice what I was making as an engineer.

Even counting the four years of lost salary and added debt burden I will still come out far ahead. The lost salary isn't that big of an issue, either. If I had stayed in the engineering business I would have taken a bath in the last two years.

I like medicine, I do want to "hep" people, and I am really enjoying medical school. So please, no disparaging comments. We all have our reasons. The best career is something you enjoy AND make money doing.

 

[smoothflyin]

Well, I havent been around long on this board but it is good to see that there are other engineers out there with the same aspirations about Med School. My question is should I worry about taking the FE exam. I graduate next december with a ME degree. I will have to finish up a few Pre-reqs and take the MCAT and then the applying process begins.

 

[apass]

Originally posted by Panda Bear
Since there is nobody here but us engineers and I don't have to worry about some self-righteous gunner wagging their finger at me and mouthing platitudes, the primary reason that I am in medical school is because engineering is not financially stable or lucrative enough to provide any kind of long-term financial stability for my family. I know I won't get rich as a doctor, but the work is steady and the average salaries in most specialties are at least twice what I was making as an engineer.

Even counting the four years of lost salary and added debt burden I will still come out far ahead. The lost salary isn't that big of an issue, either. If I had stayed in the engineering business I would have taken a bath in the last two years.

I like medicine, I do want to "hep" people, and I am really enjoying medical school. So please, no disparaging comments. We all have our reasons. The best career is something you enjoy AND make money doing.

For the love of GOD - I am asking you for your help - I am not a gunner!!! I am too an engineer and i am heading to med school in the fall. I thought you had your PE licence? I am 31 years old and I have mine and I was just curious as to what you were doing with yours? Are you still going to keep it up - you know pay the fee every year the new credit thing you have to have to get your licence renewed etc etc...? I like engineering but I feel like you do. I have been in this field for over 8 years and I am losing four years of engineering salary too. I think I have been misread - damn it sure can be hard to ask an honest question.

Sorry Panda Bear

 

[mellotron]

Originally posted by SunnyS81
I've taken upper level engineering classes in Civil, Mechanical, and Electrical Engineering. Honestly, the only one I found even slightly difficult was Electrical.

Ahh, no ChE? Well, if you were really looking for a challenge... Just kidding, just representin' (and maybe sparking a OSU/UofM rivalry)

 

[SunnyS81]

Originally posted by mellotron
Ahh, no ChE? Well, if you were really looking for a challenge... Just kidding, just representin' (and maybe sparking a OSU/UofM rivalry)

No, but I worked in a ChE lab for 2 years. I started out ChE but switched out before I took a ChE class because I didn't find it that interesting (no offense). If I had to do it all over, I would be an ME though.

As for a rivalry, UM has a good engineering department, but Georgia Tech is better. In fact, most of my peers would say that you're not a real engineer until you go to Tech. (We do have a 40% fail out rate)

My cousin is a CompE grad from OSU though, although she isn't the brightest cookie........

 

[klinzou]

Oh yeah, well at TN Tech we ahev a 50% fail out rate!!! so there