Every Healthcare career in the US will be saturated by 2025 with the exception of MD/DOs and Dentist

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Lnsean said:
Not true... physicians will face saturation with mid levels and improved tech...many specialties are already saturated as we speak
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Look at the government projections on the reddit post... I still think the physician job market is heaps better than the crap show pharmacy has turned into...
 
Saturationpoint said:
Look at the government projections on the reddit post... I still think the physician job market is heaps better than the crap show pharmacy has turned into...
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The government also predicted there would be a dramatic shortage of pharmacists 10 or even 8 years ago. They had to revise that.

The fact is...healthcare will be super saturated in the coming decade for all professions in the field. Tech is where it's at.
 
No way RN is a saturated field either. Almost every hospital in my city has been desperate to hire RNs in the past 2 years to the point that several of the hospitals are having to operate below capacity on multiple units because they do not have enough nurses to staff the units. Combine that with more nurses pursuing degrees like NP and we're not going to see a saturation of RNs anytime soon.
 
Stagg737 said:
No way RN is a saturated field either. Almost every hospital in my city has been desperate to hire RNs in the past 2 years to the point that several of the hospitals are having to operate below capacity on multiple units because they do not have enough nurses to staff the units. Combine that with more nurses pursuing degrees like NP and we're not going to see a saturation of RNs anytime soon.
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I think u r right... But NP is definitely saturated.. There are many RNs making more than NPs...
 
Yeah don't see Nursing field being saturated at least for a good decade..
 
I have previously read somewhere about the possibility of radiology reports being "outsourced".. And in hospitals they would have one anesthesiologist supervising bunch of nurse or PA anesthetists. So, I don't see that much of a job safety here.
 
Saturationpoint said:
I think u r right... But NP is definitely saturated.. There are many RNs making more than NPs...
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I don't think it's saturated yet, but it's definitely headed in that direction really fast. Wouldn't be surprised if RNs saw a large pay bump in the next decade to try and keep them in that field as opposed to going for an NP.
 
Saturationpoint said:
I just saw this post on reddit and thought it was very relevant to pharmacy...

The only 2 healthcare professions with demand exceeding supply are physicians and dentist
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Boy, people have short memories...RN's are actually oversaturated, the market is just good enough that most women nurses don't work. MLP's are currently understaffed, but that's being fixed fast. DDS/DMD's are oversaturated in the cities (they are increasingly having issues with startup), but country dentists still have a good, solidly profitable future ahead of them.

MD/DO - Heh, heh, heh, there's been oversaturation before, there will be again for specialists. Primary care though is still hurting, but the MLP's might be eating their lunch.
 
Stagg737 said:
Where are you working/living? In the 3 cities I've lived/worked in RNs were in dire need at most hospitals and in my current city it's easy to find an RN job that starts at $40/hr + benefits...
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And those hospitals are badly mismanaged would be my response if it's an urban area. It's not about getting the job that's the problem, it's keeping the job.
 
lord999 said:
And those hospitals are badly mismanaged would be my response if it's an urban area. It's not about getting the job that's the problem, it's keeping the job.
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Do you mean it's not about hiring the nurses but keeping them? Or are you saying nurses are having a problem holding their jobs? If it's the latter I've never heard of such a thing anywhere.
 
It's why I have been telling people to study computer science, engineering, finance, or accounting. Most of the health professions are completely saturated and require you to take out a significant amount of loans.

There is a huge shortage of tech workers right now. Many of them job hop every 3 months for massive raises (think 20% or more). Try that in pharmacy and you will just be without a job. They are also treated far better and showered with lavish perks, i.e. catered gourmet meals, employee shuttles, on-site gym, laundry, and massage, whereas a pharmacist you may be lucky to even get a bathroom break while on your feet all day.
 
Stagg737 said:
I don't think it's saturated yet, but it's definitely headed in that direction really fast. Wouldn't be surprised if RNs saw a large pay bump in the next decade to try and keep them in that field as opposed to going for an NP.
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In my area a lot of NPs take a paycut... after going to NP school.. All the experienced RNs make more than pharmacists though..
 
lord999 said:
Boy, people have short memories...RN's are actually oversaturated, the market is just good enough that most women nurses don't work. MLP's are currently understaffed, but that's being fixed fast. DDS/DMD's are oversaturated in the cities (they are increasingly having issues with startup), but country dentists still have a good, solidly profitable future ahead of them.

MD/DO - Heh, heh, heh, there's been oversaturation before, there will be again for specialists. Primary care though is still hurting, but the MLP's might be eating their lunch.
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MEH as long as the barrier to entry into Dental and MD schools stay high... The saturation will be nowhere near as bad as pharmacist... Pharmacy schools will accept anyone with a pulse nowadays... Even rural areas are already saturated..
 
Chrish said:
I have previously read somewhere about the possibility of radiology reports being "outsourced".. And in hospitals they would have one anesthesiologist supervising bunch of nurse or PA anesthetists. So, I don't see that much of a job safety here.
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sorry but outsourcing for radiologists will never happen...
 
Saturationpoint said:
I just saw this post on reddit and thought it was very relevant to pharmacy...

The only 2 healthcare professions with demand exceeding supply are physicians and dentist
Click to expand...
Wow. Welcome to SDN. Love the new screenname. I think you will fit in VERY well here.
 
Stagg737 said:
No way RN is a saturated field either. Almost every hospital in my city has been desperate to hire RNs in the past 2 years to the point that several of the hospitals are having to operate below capacity on multiple units because they do not have enough nurses to staff the units. Combine that with more nurses pursuing degrees like NP and we're not going to see a saturation of RNs anytime soon.
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You realize this isn't from a shortage of RNs but a failure of the hospitals to pay the wage the market demands right? If the hospital was willing to pay market rate + an allowance for living in whatever crappy/bad/undesirable town it is they would be getting job applicants tomorrow.
 
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stoichiometrist said:
It's why I have been telling people to study computer science, engineering, finance, or accounting. Most of the health professions are completely saturated and require you to take out a significant amount of loans.

There is a huge shortage of tech workers right now. Many of them job hop every 3 months for massive raises (think 20% or more). Try that in pharmacy and you will just be without a job. They are also treated far better and showered with lavish perks, i.e. catered gourmet meals, employee shuttles, on-site gym, laundry, and massage, whereas a pharmacist you may be lucky to even get a bathroom break while on your feet all day.
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the thing is programming actually takes a high IQ and ability to learn. Where any bonehead can take out a 100,000 USD + loan and go to pharmacy school and blindly memorize drugs. Every programmer could be a pharmacist but maybe like 20% of pharmDs could even write one FOR loop.
 
Saturationpoint said:
sorry but outsourcing for radiologists will never happen...
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Search on radiology forum.. There are half a dozen threads on that. Theoretically it's also possible for one radiologist working from basement analyzing reports. Kinda like 2 remote verification rphs replacing 3 retail rphs. Possibilities are definitely there.
 
stoichiometrist said:
It's why I have been telling people to study computer science, engineering, finance, or accounting. Most of the health professions are completely saturated and require you to take out a significant amount of loans.

There is a huge shortage of tech workers right now. Many of them job hop every 3 months for massive raises (think 20% or more). Try that in pharmacy and you will just be without a job. They are also treated far better and showered with lavish perks, i.e. catered gourmet meals, employee shuttles, on-site gym, laundry, and massage, whereas a pharmacist you may be lucky to even get a bathroom break while on your feet all day.
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Idk I think that people who are good at sciences, are generally good either at math/physics or bio and chem subjects.

I just don’t think that many people contemplate between engineering and healthcare.
 
Chrish said:
Search on radiology forum.. There are half a dozen threads on that. Theoretically it's also possible for one radiologist working from basement analyzing reports. Kinda like 2 remote verification rphs replacing 3 retail rphs. Possibilities are definitely there.
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Lol but they have been discussing outsourcing since early 2000s... Guess what...It never happened.... Also mid level creep is only a threat to few specialties, IE. Anesthesia, Family Med, General IM, pediatrics, OB gyn.... Even then an anesthesiologist with a 1 year fellowship (Pain med, pediatrics anesthesia) will be very safe from mid levels. Mid levels don't have the breadth of knowledge required for difficult specialties, IE. Rad Onc, Neurosurg, cardiology, Cardio surg......
 
Lnsean said:
The government also predicted there would be a dramatic shortage of pharmacists 10 or even 8 years ago. They had to revise that.

The fact is...healthcare will be super saturated in the coming decade for all professions in the field. Tech is where it's at.
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The reason why physician wages are protected is because residency is funded by public money.. The number of residency positions have not increased significantly in the last decade.... Unlike pharmacy schools which nearly doubled... Dentistry is safe because dental schools are very expensive to run...
 
Modest_anteater said:
the thing is programming actually takes a high IQ and ability to learn. Where any bonehead can take out a 100,000 USD + loan and go to pharmacy school and blindly memorize drugs. Every programmer could be a pharmacist but maybe like 20% of pharmDs could even write one FOR loop.
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That is true. You need the skills to become an engineer/developer or even to go through a coding boot camp. Anyone can become a pharmD and that's why the profession went downhill in less than a decade.
 
mentos said:
That is true. You need the skills to become an engineer/developer or even to go through a coding boot camp. Anyone can become a pharmD and that's why the profession went downhill in less than a decade.
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You can tell a field is saturated when the barrier to entry is low.... Pharmacy and NP school will accept anyone with a 2.5 gpa... That is why the field is so saturated... Med and dental, you need at least a 3.5/3.6 science gpa to be competitive. PA school is still competitive but the problem is PAs compete for the same jobs as NPs....
 
mentos said:
That is true. You need the skills to become an engineer/developer or even to go through a coding boot camp. Anyone can become a pharmD and that's why the profession went downhill in less than a decade.
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exactly. Just a bunch of greedy lower IQ individuals trying to make money fast. Pharmacy school is basically a get-rich-quick scheme. Anyone willing to put hard work into their education is going to program or do intellectually demanding work.
 
Modest_anteater said:
You realize this isn't from a shortage of RNs but a failure of the hospitals to pay the wage the market demands right? If the hospital was willing to pay market rate + an allowance for living in whatever crappy/bad/undesirable town it is they would be getting job applicants tomorrow.
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Eh, based on my experiences I disagree. This is certainly false in the city I'm currently in as there's a legitimate massive shortage to the point that some hospitals cannot legally fill their units because of staff shortages.

I talked to a nurse yesterday who told the hospital she just started at she wanted $65/hr starting and required a minimum $50/hr or she'd look elsewhere. They hired her for $55/hr. Supposedly market demand in my city according to indeed/glassdoor/all those garbage sites is around $37/hr. If that's the case how am I hearing about all these RNs in my city starting at $45+ and successfully demanding much more? I'm also in a mid-sized city (~500k), so it's not like this is an undesirable location.
 
Saturationpoint said:
I just saw this post on reddit and thought it was very relevant to pharmacy...

The only 2 healthcare professions with demand exceeding supply are physicians and dentist
Click to expand...

Source??

Dentistry have been saturated in my town for a long time... good thing is there are only 3 dental schools in my state. But still my friends have been complaining about saturation for years. My doctor friends, especially the specialists have been complaining also. One GI doc friend had to open his office an hour away from civilization.
 
VictorOfHungerGames said:
Source??

Dentistry have been saturated in my town for a long time... good thing is there are only 3 dental schools in my state. But still my friends have been complaining about saturation for years. My doctor friends, especially the specialists have been complaining also. One GI doc friend had to open his office an hour away from civilization.
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At least he gets to open private practice... 99% of pharmacist have no chance to open their own independent even in rural areas... Even rural pharmacy is already saturated... And your lucky to even have a 30 hour a week floater gig... The saturation of dentists and doctors is nowhere near as bad pharmD... 15000 pharmcist graduate every year vs 19000 physicians and 6000 dentists... Each Dental and Med school has 3-10% acceptance rate.... Pharmacy schools nowadays have an 80%+ acceptance rate
 
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Stagg737 said:
Eh, based on my experiences I disagree. This is certainly false in the city I'm currently in as there's a legitimate massive shortage to the point that some hospitals cannot legally fill their units because of staff shortages.

I talked to a nurse yesterday who told the hospital she just started at she wanted $65/hr starting and required a minimum $50/hr or she'd look elsewhere. They hired her for $55/hr. Supposedly market demand in my city according to indeed/glassdoor/all those garbage sites is around $37/hr. If that's the case how am I hearing about all these RNs in my city starting at $45+ and successfully demanding much more? I'm also in a mid-sized city (~500k), so it's not like this is an undesirable location.
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RNs make $70 an hour in my city.. Pharmacists make $50 an hour and if your lucky, you get a full time job....
 
Saturationpoint said:


At least he gets to open private practice... 99% of pharmacist have no chance to open their own independent even in rural areas... Even rural pharmacy is already saturated... And your lucky to even have a 30 hour a week floater gig... The saturation of dentists and doctors is nowhere near as bad pharmD... 15000 pharmcist graduate every year vs 19000 physicians and 6000 dentists... Each Dental and Med school has 3-10% acceptance rate.... Pharmacy schools nowadays have an 80%+ acceptance rate
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hmmm interesting... so basically, if I'm reading this right, the problem is that... there are too many pharmacy schools opening up? lol and to resolve this issue, we need to regulate or limit number of schools and graduates.... i assume this will happen naturally once enough people can't find jobs. haha.

Rural area in my state is not saturated. There are plenty of job openings.
 
VictorOfHungerGames said:
hmmm interesting... so basically, if I'm reading this right, the problem is that... there are too many pharmacy schools opening up? lol and to resolve this issue, we need to regulate or limit number of schools and graduates.... i assume this will happen naturally once enough people can't find jobs. haha.

Rural area in my state is not saturated. There are plenty of job openings.
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The only way to save pharmacy is if we limit the number of graduates to 8000 a year instead of 15000.. This can be done by closing half the schools or reducing class size by half. Barrier to entry will be much higher and only the top students in undergrad will be able to get into pharmacy school...
 
Saturationpoint said:
The only way to save pharmacy is if we limit the number of graduates to 8000 a year instead of 15000.. This can be done by closing half the schools or reducing class size by half. Barrier to entry will be much higher and only the top students in undergrad will be able to get into pharmacy school...
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Right. How do we do that? haha
 
Stagg737 said:
No way RN is a saturated field either. Almost every hospital in my city has been desperate to hire RNs in the past 2 years to the point that several of the hospitals are having to operate below capacity on multiple units because they do not have enough nurses to staff the units. Combine that with more nurses pursuing degrees like NP and we're not going to see a saturation of RNs anytime soon.
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Nursing is both saturated and not saturated. If you look at licensed nurses, and even more RN's who have let their license's lapse, there are way, way , way more nurses than there are jobs. The only reason we aren't seeing it is, so many women (probably some men to, but mostly women) go into nursing intending to work part-time, and there are many nurses who have quit the field (either to stay home with their children, or because they are got sick of the job.) Now if all these people suddenly decided they wanted to work full-time, well many of them would be unemployed from lack of jobs. But as that isn't likely to happen in the near future, nursing is a safer healthcare bet than, say pharmacy.

Saturationpoint said:
Mid levels don't have the breadth of knowledge required for difficult specialties, IE. Rad Onc, Neurosurg, cardiology, Cardio surg......
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No, but that doesn't mean they won't get the jobs. There are already cardiology NP's, in IL NP's can't practice independently (at least on paper, in reality some have minimal oversight and essentially do.) I agree, I can't imagine an NP doing neurosurgery, cardio surgery, or rad onc.....but when I first started practicing I had never even heard of NP's, and now they are everywhere in every field. So while it seems ludicrous that they would be doing complicated surgeries...I think anything is possible. Remember, people care more about bedside manner than outcomes (and most people not having any medical knowledge have no idea what a reasonable outcome is.)
 
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