Failing M4 after match

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Researchie

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hi,

I’m in a pretty bad situation right now. I just finished my last rotation—sports medicine in early April. One of the requirements was to attend three sports games with a team physician, and I attended one, didn’t do anything, and being a lazy M4 who matched, did attend the other two events. Stupid and unprofessional, I know. Now, my preceptor is threatening to fail me unless I observe one more game (I only could get into one game over the last month). I’ve called hundreds of places, but due to liability, some games observed by trainers rather than physicians, and other students, I haven’t been able to schedule anything yet (I’ve been guaranteed one game with another physician, but it’s not definite yet). And my preceptor is refusing to let me make up the requirement any other way—either attend a game with a physician or fail.

Essentially, I won’t be able to graduate, won’t start residency, and being in violation of NRMP for not starting residency, won’t be eligible for another match.

I’m not asking for sympathy here—I know I don’t deserve it—but am just asking what can I do. I feel like such a *****ic loser right now, really hopeless, saddled with $260,000 debt with no way to pay it off.
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Researchie said:
hi,

I’m in a pretty bad situation right now. I just finished my last rotation—sports medicine in early April. One of the requirements was to attend three sports games with a team physician, and I attended one, didn’t do anything, and being a lazy M4 who matched, did attend the other two events. Stupid and unprofessional, I know. Now, my preceptor is threatening to fail me unless I observe one more game (I only could get into one game over the last month). I’ve called hundreds of places, but due to liability, some games observed by trainers rather than physicians, and other students, I haven’t been able to schedule anything yet (I’ve been guaranteed one game with another physician, but it’s not definite yet). And my preceptor is refusing to let me make up the requirement any other way—either attend a game with a physician or fail.

Essentially, I won’t be able to graduate, won’t start residency, and being in violation of NRMP for not starting residency, won’t be eligible for another match.

I’m not asking for sympathy here—I know I don’t deserve it—but am just asking what can I do. I feel like such a *****ic loser right now, really hopeless, saddled with $260,000 debt with no way to pay it off.
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What you can do is call every sports med doc in America if you have to until you find someone that says you can go to the game with them.... pretty simple.
 
DNC127 said:
What you can do is call every sports med doc in America if you have to until you find someone that says you can go to the game with them.... pretty simple.
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Yep. Your full time job during business hours is to make phone calls to sports docs. Your full time evening job is to email them.

You were an idiot and this is the cost of learning to not be an idiot.

Do what you have to do
 
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Researchie said:
hi,

I’m in a pretty bad situation right now. I just finished my last rotation—sports medicine in early April. One of the requirements was to attend three sports games with a team physician, and I attended one, didn’t do anything, and being a lazy M4 who matched, did attend the other two events. Stupid and unprofessional, I know. Now, my preceptor is threatening to fail me unless I observe one more game (I only could get into one game over the last month). I’ve called hundreds of places, but due to liability, some games observed by trainers rather than physicians, and other students, I haven’t been able to schedule anything yet (I’ve been guaranteed one game with another physician, but it’s not definite yet). And my preceptor is refusing to let me make up the requirement any other way—either attend a game with a physician or fail.

Essentially, I won’t be able to graduate, won’t start residency, and being in violation of NRMP for not starting residency, won’t be eligible for another match.

I’m not asking for sympathy here—I know I don’t deserve it—but am just asking what can I do. I feel like such a *****ic loser right now, really hopeless, saddled with $260,000 debt with no way to pay it off.
Click to expand...

If your last rotation is April - you still have 2 months of May and June to make it up. Relax.

I doubt anyone in the history of medical education has been held back from starting residency by their med school due to poor performance on a M4 elective post-match.
 
NeurologyHopeful2018 said:
If your last rotation is April - you still have 2 months of May and June to make it up. Relax.

I doubt anyone in the history of medical education has been held back from starting residency by their med school due to poor performance on a M4 elective post-match.
Click to expand...
NeurologyHopeful2018 said:
If your last rotation is April - you still have 2 months of May and June to make it up. Relax.

I doubt anyone in the history of medical education has been held back from starting residency by their med school due to poor performance on a M4 elective post-match.
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No—this has to be compete by May 10th or I don’t qualify to graduate.
 
Talk to your preceptor and inform him of the difficulty you have been having.
If he still says no, you should go to your clincal dean and come clean and ask what you can do.

It seems very unlikely that they would take a hit to their numbers and fail you or prevent you from starting residency over this.
 
Yeah pretty much you've got to do what everyone is saying and get yourself a sports game anyway you can. I wouldn't elevate anything up to the dean unless you absolutely have exhausted yourself of possibilities - the school is concerned about residency placement. You done placed residency, so this may not be their problem anymore.
 
Researchie said:
No—this has to be compete by May 10th or I don’t qualify to graduate.
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You need to contact your student Dean and let him know about this - and how you are attempting to rectify it.

You need to make every effort to find a sports physcian - and let your preceptor know about your efforts until the point of annoying him.

If you had no brushes with administration prior to this - the dean should have a sympathetic ear to you.
 
DocWinter said:
Yeah pretty much you've got to do what everyone is saying and get yourself a sports game anyway you can. I wouldn't elevate anything up to the dean unless you absolutely have exhausted yourself of possibilities - the school is concerned about residency placement. You done placed residency, so this may not be their problem anymore.
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That is a very good point - the deans at my school literally stated their one and only goal is to make sure their match rate is high and residency placement looks good. In fact the one and only measure of success for everyone is to see if you matched X specialty at University of Y.

If you matched, the dean may not care anymore.
 
NeurologyHopeful2018 said:
If your last rotation is April - you still have 2 months of May and June to make it up. Relax.

I doubt anyone in the history of medical education has been held back from starting residency by their med school due to poor performance on a M4 elective post-match.
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I know of one student who isn't moving on to residency because of an even more trivial reason, something that basically amounts to a clerical error. It's more common than you might think.
 
libertyyne said:
What happened?
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Basically switched a fourth year rotation from one institution to another in the same time slot and specialty well in advance but forgot to fill out the paperwork on the school end for his away. Despite having a solid evaluation, he had to give up his match and everything.
 
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Mad Jack said:
Basically switched a fourth year rotation from one institution to another in the same time slot and specialty well in advance but forgot to fill out the paperwork on the school end for his away. Despite having a solid evaluation, he had to give up his match and everything.
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Seriously? I feel like the school handled that pretty badly.

That also reflects poorly on the school at the institution the student matched at.
 
Comply now with the petty tyrants, and get whatever it is that needs getting done to graduate. Some joker along the way will always pop up and rain on your plans. Why? Because they can, and take some mirthless pleasure out of giving you a hard time. Folks like that--ones impeding your way--stepping on your toes, will some day be kissing your backside. It may sound dopey, but just do it, grovel a little too.
 
Trying to finish up my EM rotation and feeling sick. Continuing to call. Supposedly I’ll hear back from that one orthopedic with a game coming up, but we’ll see. This is the worst I’ve felt in my life.
 
@Researchie - I see on your previous posts about all the top programs you interviewed at - Yale, Mayo, UAB...etc.

You must be a rockstar student. With such reputation, I believe administration will step behind you and help you succeed.
 
NeurologyHopeful2018 said:
@Researchie - I see on your previous posts about all the top programs you interviewed at - Yale, Mayo, UAB...etc.

You must be a rockstar student. With such reputation, I believe administration will step behind you and help you succeed.
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are you familiar with the derm matched ms4 who forged a some sign in sheets and ditched dates on his last rotation......expelled

OP needs to go to a game even if they have to buy a plane ticket to get there
 
Call literally every sports physician and sports team within a 3 hour radius. Professional, college, and high school.

Also call your clin ed people, mea culpa x a gazillion, and rather than asking to get out of it and risking all he** breaking loose for perceived (and kinda real let’s be honest) unprofessionalism, ask for their help in finding a sports physician so you can complete the requirement. Assuming you’re a good student who has flown under the radar otherwise, it’s in their best interest to help you fix this in one way or another to preserve their graduation and Match numbers— but I think they’re more likely to be benevolent if you show initiative and ask for help than if you ask to get out of it.
 
The only "easy" way to get out of this bind is to beg your preceptor. You suck up to him like you never suck before, cry if you must and hope that he's in a merciful mood to let it slide this one time.
Print out your match letter, your loan statement, your notarized promise that you'll sacrifice your firstborn in his honor etc. and bring them with you when you see him and hope for the best.
 
sb247 said:
are you familiar with the derm matched ms4 who forged a some sign in sheets and ditched dates on his last rotation......expelled

OP needs to go to a game even if they have to buy a plane ticket to get there
Click to expand...

I heard of that Case Western grad who got his degree revoked retroactively due to far more egregious offence (criminal conviction...etc).

Please do share about this guy...
 
sb247 said:
are you familiar with the derm matched ms4 who forged a some sign in sheets and ditched dates on his last rotation......expelled
Click to expand...

Ugh that sucks. It's one thing to just not show up .. but to forge a sign in sheet? Come on.

I feel conflicted about the expulsion though ...
 
croak2 said:
Comply now with the petty tyrants, and get whatever it is that needs getting done to graduate. Some joker along the way will always pop up and rain on your plans. Why? Because they can, and take some mirthless pleasure out of giving you a hard time. Folks like that--ones impeding your way--stepping on your toes, will some day be kissing your backside. It may sound dopey, but just do it, grovel a little too.
Click to expand...
Yes, because when you're given a job to do and people have expectations of you, it's always best to blame power issues.
 
C’mon dude - you had so much to lose. Why stop running at the final stretch?

I hope for your sake you break out of this situation scott-free and learn from this mistake. Yes it is stupid you are in this spot, but I hope you don’t get penalized, and end up just feeling some fire under your ***. C’mon dude, you are better than a mistake like this. Work your tail off to do nothing but fix this problem with all living hours of your day until it is taken care of.
 
Mad Jack said:
Basically switched a fourth year rotation from one institution to another in the same time slot and specialty well in advance but forgot to fill out the paperwork on the school end for his away. Despite having a solid evaluation, he had to give up his match and everything.
Click to expand...

There’s got to be more to the story.
 
I have people like you in my class, and all of you are absolutely infuriating.

Let me guess, straight from college to medical school, zero full time work experience?

Grow up. Frankly I hope this doesn't work out an they expell you or make you repeat 4th year. SOMEONE needs to teach you something about accountability.
 
Treebeard said:
I have people like you in my class, and all of you are absolutely infuriating.

Let me guess, straight from college to medical school, zero full time work experience?

Grow up. Frankly I hope this doesn't work out an they expell you or make you repeat 4th year. SOMEONE needs to teach you something about accountability.
Click to expand...

Jesus. Cut him some slack, everyone makes mistakes and I'm sure he learned a little about accountability.
 
Treebeard said:
I have people like you in my class, and all of you are absolutely infuriating.

Let me guess, straight from college to medical school, zero full time work experience?

Grow up. Frankly I hope this doesn't work out an they expell you or make you repeat 4th year. SOMEONE needs to teach you something about accountability.
Click to expand...

I have people like you in my class, and all of you are absolutely infuriating.

Let me guess, you never ever stepped out of line and always followed the rules? And blame others when they don't do things the way you do it?

Grow up. Frankly, I hope you learn to have some empathy at some point. SOMEONE needs to knock you off your high horse.
 
bigindian4891 said:
I have people like you in my class, and all of you are absolutely infuriating.

Let me guess, you never ever stepped out of line and always followed the rules? And blame others when they don't do things the way you do it?

Grow up. Frankly, I hope you learn to have some empathy at some point. SOMEONE needs to knock you off your high horse.
Click to expand...

It was clearly stated that the students must do something to pass the clerkship. OP decided not to do it because they already had a residency. This is called "entitled".
 
Oso said:
Ugh that sucks. It's one thing to just not show up .. but to forge a sign in sheet? Come on.

I feel conflicted about the expulsion though ...
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Unless this is a different story, I thought that he forged the attending's signature to make it look like he showed up on days he didn't.

Edit: I realize now I was reading posts in this thread too quickly and my response is a bit off. Sorry.
 
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One advice, I haven't seen anyone say is maybe you can see if you can meet some of these sport physicians/directors in person Just show up to the offices and explain your situation. Many people have a harder time turning down people in person then over a phone call or email

Edit: saw that you found something lined up... Congrats
 
ditching sports games? do you even like sports?
 
sb247 said:
are you familiar with the derm matched ms4 who forged a some sign in sheets and ditched dates on his last rotation....expelled
Click to expand...

Woooooow. What a waste. Especially given how hard he must’ve had to work to match derm. You would think he would be smart enough not to do that kind of stuff




Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
 
Treebeard said:
I have people like you in my class, and all of you are absolutely infuriating.

Let me guess, straight from college to medical school, zero full time work experience?

Grow up. Frankly I hope this doesn't work out an they expell you or make you repeat 4th year. SOMEONE needs to teach you something about accountability.
Click to expand...
my heart goes out to the poor med students at whichever uptight med school makes you assistant vice dean of education
 
Oso said:
Ugh that sucks. It's one thing to just not show up .. but to forge a sign in sheet? Come on.

I feel conflicted about the expulsion though ...
Click to expand...

Lol are you serious?
This is pretty much a pastime at my school.
 
Treebeard said:
I have people like you in my class, and all of you are absolutely infuriating.

Let me guess, straight from college to medical school, zero full time work experience?

Grow up. Frankly I hope this doesn't work out an they expell you or make you repeat 4th year. SOMEONE needs to teach you something about accountability.
Click to expand...
Really? OP didn't go to a sports game and you hope they get expelled, don't become a physician which they've worked 8 years for and have 300k of useless debt?........I hope SOMEONE above you someday has a chip on their shoulder and zero sympathy for you and blows something tiny you do out of proportion and destroys your career. SOMEONE needs to teach you a little humility, sympathy, and what an inappropriate reaction to a small issue is.
 
Treebeard said:
I have people like you in my class, and all of you are absolutely infuriating.

Let me guess, straight from college to medical school, zero full time work experience?

Grow up. Frankly I hope this doesn't work out an they expell you or make you repeat 4th year. SOMEONE needs to teach you something about accountability.
Click to expand...
Ehh it’s not a real job. This portion of Med school is just part of the tuition racket.
 
Donald Juan said:
Really? OP didn't go to a sports game and you hope they get expelled, don't become a physician which they've worked 8 years for and have 300k of useless debt?........I hope SOMEONE above you someday has a chip on their shoulder and zero sympathy for you and blows something tiny you do out of proportion and destroys your career. SOMEONE needs to teach you a little humility, sympathy, and what an inappropriate reaction to a small issue is.
Click to expand...

OP was told they needed to do something to pass the rotation. They decided to screw around instead. Is this the level of responsibility you want in the doctor that's taking care of your parent, spouse, or child?

This is the same person who goes to CME conferences and spends the entire day drinking coffee in the hotel lobby.
 
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