First Shift Hours for EM

[Brown429]

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I am interested in this field, however lifestyle is a MAJOR factor for me.
The places where I worked the ER physicians usually had a rotating schedule. Sometimes they would work first shift and then second/third at other times. Is it possible in EM to only work the day shift?

Also, how often do you get called in? It must depend on where you work, but on average? I would not like to be constantly called in.

 

[EctopicFetus]

I am interested in this field, however lifestyle is a MAJOR factor for me.
The places where I worked the ER physicians usually had a rotating schedule. Sometimes they would work first shift and then second/third at other times. Is it possible in EM to only work the day shift?

Also, how often do you get called in? It must depend on where you work, but on average? I would not like to be constantly called in.

huh.. yeah u usually work a rotating schedule. Called in? Never heard of this but perhaps if there is a mass casualty incident. But one of the beauties of EM is not being "on call"/

 

[Apollyon]

Called in? Never heard of this

Any and all groups will have a sick call schedule - either rotating among all providers (like my group) or administrators. It's not just sick call, either - it's for overflow, also.

Don't you have a sick call where you're at?

 

[docB]

Hang on. I don't think the OP is talking about sick call and so on. I think they just have some misperceptions about how the scheduling works. EPs don't get called in (except in unusual circumstances that occur rarely). EPs work their scheduled shifts. When we're off, we're off. That's one of the benefits of EM.

As for the question about working only day shifts. No. It is practically impossible for a new grad to get a job where you will work only day shifts. Some practices allow their senior members who have paid their dues to work days but you'll have years of nights to get there.

 

[Apollyon]

Hang on. I don't think the OP is talking about sick call and so on. I think they just have some misperceptions about how the scheduling works. EPs don't get called in (except in unusual circumstances that occur rarely). EPs work their scheduled shifts. When we're off, we're off. That's one of the benefits of EM.

But that's my point - although rare, it DOES happen (as the prior poster had never heard of it is why I mentioned it), and, if you're the backup guy, you might get called in. However, when you're off (and not on that one day a month you're the backup), you're off - of course. And the OP enquired as to how frequently (on average) do you get called in - which, I believe we all agree on, is "rarely".

Are you telling me you don't have a backup person? What happens if you have a car accident (God forbid) and can't make it in?

 

[ERMudPhud]

Actually, one group I know of staffs several smaller ER's that can get quite busy but aren't consistently busy enough to need double coverage. They have one doc per day on "volume call" and if any of their ER's get really backed up the volume call doc gets called in. Depending on the season you have anywhere from a 50-100% chance of being called to work on your call day. Call days only happen once or twice a month but you generally can't plan anything else for that day.

 

[Flopotomist]

I sorta hope that I eventually (after I finish med school and residency) can find the opposite - a job working only nights and 2nd shift. That way I can sleep all day, run errands while everything is open - go to the gym when there is nobody there, never have to wake up early (so not a morning person). Hmm.. maybe where I end up will have somebody like the OP and then we can just trade lots of shifts!

 

[Apollyon]

If you are willing to be the "nights guy" (all or majority of night shifts), you will be welcomed (unless the group is the rarest of them, where they already have a bunch of night hawks), and may also get a small financial bump for doing it.

 

[iatrosB]

If you are willing to be the "nights guy" (all or majority of night shifts), you will be welcomed (unless the group is the rarest of them, where they already have a bunch of night hawks), and may also get a small financial bump for doing it.

I would love to be the nights guy. I could take my kid to school, and pick him up, sleep while he is at school and work when he sleeps. Perfect! I'd rather do that than "swing" from shift to shift.

 

[trkd]

Holy cow! Any of you nights people need to contact me in about 3 years. We can be great friends!

 

[JkGrocerz]

Hang on. I don't think the OP is talking about sick call and so on. I think they just have some misperceptions about how the scheduling works. EPs don't get called in (except in unusual circumstances that occur rarely). EPs work their scheduled shifts. When we're off, we're off. That's one of the benefits of EM.

As for the question about working only day shifts. No. It is practically impossible for a new grad to get a job where you will work only day shifts. Some practices allow their senior members who have paid their dues to work days but you'll have years of nights to get there.

I dont know, mabey i'm weird but I actually like working the night shift...are there others out who feel the same?

 

[anonymousEM]

I feel like there is much less "pathology" amongst the staff at night...maybe it's because there's fewer administrators around but people seem like they get along better at night to me. Maybe it's just a different group of people who self select to work at night...

 

[iatrosB]

Holy cow! Any of you nights people need to contact me in about 3 years. We can be great friends!

Sorry, more like 5 years for me! 👎 😡

 

[docB]

But that's my point - although rare, it DOES happen (as the prior poster had never heard of it is why I mentioned it), and, if you're the backup guy, you might get called in. However, when you're off (and not on that one day a month you're the backup), you're off - of course. And the OP enquired as to how frequently (on average) do you get called in - which, I believe we all agree on, is "rarely".

Are you telling me you don't have a backup person? What happens if you have a car accident (God forbid) and can't make it in?

Nope. No backup. If there's a problem the directors take up the slack. The guy on may have to stay late and the next guy may have to come in early.

 

[docB]

I dont know, mabey i'm weird but I actually like working the night shift...are there others out who feel the same?

Hey, I'm not bagging on the night shift. I'm just saying that it's a rare group that will let a new guy come in and work days only.

 

[Apollyon]

Nope. No backup. If there's a problem the directors take up the slack. The guy on may have to stay late and the next guy may have to come in early.

That's what I meant when I referred to administrators in my original post. Where I was a resident, there was always an administrator on call, and, if, for some reason, an attending couldn't make it, the administrator had to work the shift. I don't think it ever happened while I was there, though (and there could have been a problem, since one of the administrators is peds EM only).

My group has 36 docs, so it's ~1 day/month on backup.

 

[Rockhouse]

In my community ED there is a young guy that only works day shifts, but it comes at a price. He gets stuck with tons of holidays, weekends, and the like. I have know way to know about the big places, but out in the sticks where I grew up, the other docs that worked there were happy to take advantage of the young guy that couldn't stay up at night.

 

[allylz]

I dont know, mabey i'm weird but I actually like working the night shift...are there others out who feel the same?

Count me in, I love the night shift. My mind works better between the hours of 7pm and 2am. I am at my worst from 2pm to 6pm. And I love driving to work with no traffic and getting the best parking space! It really helps to start off the workday with so little stress. Not to mention the fact that when you leave, you can see a beautiful sunrise, laugh at all the poor sods who are on the way in, and go enjoy a lazy breakfast, the best meal of the day.

🙂

 

[NinerNiner999]

Finding a job that has full time night coverage is worth the hunt - and if you are willing to work nights, as mentioned before, you will be welcomed with open arms...

 

[SLPI]

EM is definitely on my list - gotta love that late morning breakfast.

 

[GeneralVeers]

EM is definitely on my list - gotta love that late morning breakfast.

My free county breakfast of bacon and eggs feels awesome after a 12-hour shift!

 

[Brown429]

It kind of stinks how you have to work 2nd shift. I mean especially if you really into family. I mean I want to be there for my wife and kids and have dinner everyday with them. And I do not want to work the graveyard shift.

Yes I will do it during residency, but this is a huge consideration. EM is really cool...but not getting the day shift and being forced to work 3-5 night (3-12PM) shifts until I am in my mid 40's or older is not what I am looking for. Really want to push for the 9-5 or 7-5 type job.

How can anyone say that they would not take that into consideration lifestyle?

 

[Sweet Tea]

Honestly, most people think that the EM shift schedule is easier and more appealing than other rotations. If working second and third shifts for residency and for a major part of your "adult" (or attending) life is really, really discouraging for you, then maybe EM isn't your field. Lifestyle is important, and if it's not a life you're willing to leave then it's not the field for you.

 

[deleted87716]

Honestly, most people think that the EM shift schedule is easier and more appealing than other rotations. If working second and third shifts for residency and for a major part of your "adult" (or attending) life is really, really discouraging for you, then maybe EM isn't your field. Lifestyle is important, and if it's not a life you're willing to leave then it's not the field for you.

Ditto...that's what always surprises me when people say they chose EM because of "the lifestyle." Working holidays, nights and weekends...? 😉

 

[ERMudPhud]

Really want to push for the 9-5 or 7-5 type job.

Looks like you need to look at something like psych or derm or maybe even something nonmedical. There aren't that many medical fields that are exclusively 9-5 with no call. On the other hand I work 9-12 8 hours shifts per month of which about 2-3 are 7AM-3PM, 2-3 are 11pm-7AM, and the rest start late morning to late afternoon and run 8 hours. That means I can take my kids to school all but 2-3 days per month and pick them up after school all but 5-6 days a month and have about 20 days a month off to do whatever I want. Plus have a great time at work. Not many of my non-EM colleagues can say that.

 

[deleted109597]

I mean I want to be there for my wife and kids and have dinner everyday with them. And I do not want to work the graveyard shift. Yes I will do it during residency, but this is a huge consideration. EM is really cool...but not getting the day shift and being forced to work 3-5 night (3-12PM) shifts until I am in my mid 40's or older is not what I am looking for. Really want to push for the 9-5 or 7-5 type job.

Be sure and mention this a lot during residency interviews. They dig that sort of thing. Promise.

In all seriousness, most of medicine sucks when it comes to scheduling. It is either every day, with many nights thrown in there, or alternating shift schedules. Unless you go into derm, or maybe rad onc, you can't choose when you work all the time. Even radiologists and plastic surgeons work some evenings.

 

[AmoryBlaine]

Be sure and mention this a lot during residency interviews. They dig that sort of thing. Promise.

In all seriousness, most of medicine sucks when it comes to scheduling. It is either every day, with many nights thrown in there, or alternating shift schedules. Unless you go into derm, or maybe rad onc, you can't choose when you work all the time. Even radiologists and plastic surgeons work some evenings.

Yeah, I feel like I am increasingly coming to realize that alot of people in even the really cush specialties (derm etc) are going to be working harder than your average white-collar stiff.

 

[corpsmanUP]

Side bar about scheduling:

I think applicants place the emphasis on the wrong things when inquiring about scheduling at their interviews. Quite frankly, I feel you should ask for a schedule from each program and file it away to review later. That way when you are stuck in the middle between two programs at the end, you can break it out and see how they schedule.

Check for things like:
-Do they routinely schedule someone to be sandwiched with two shifts around conference (meaning you sleep very little those two days)
-Do they work 3-4 more shifts per month than another program you like equally as well?

I dropped some rather great programs down to the bottom of my list last year because they worked as many as 22-12's a month, or 21-22 10's a month. I'll admit that I like my days off.

Here where I am we work 18 10's a month and that is absolutely perfect. It gets you a couple of full weekends normally and almost always allows for a 4 day break in the middle somewhere rather unexpectedly.

The main point...scheduling really does matter. But don't rank a program based on the fact that they work every other weekend or something because that small stuff can change in a heartbeat. The number of shifts though is likely not going to change.

FYI, our 1st shift (day shift) is actually 8A-6P.

 

[MDstudent79]

If you are willing to be the "nights guy" (all or majority of night shifts), you will be welcomed (unless the group is the rarest of them, where they already have a bunch of night hawks), and may also get a small financial bump for doing it.

Hmm...interesting. I'm only an MS1 right now, so still not making any major decisions on specialties, but ER has always been something on the back burner for me.

I had heard about "night guys" previously and was recently wondering if there was any truth to that. I'm a complete night owl no matter how much I try to fight it. I worked night shift (9:30pm-6:00am) an entire summer in college doing tech support at a commercial ISP, and I loved it! Definitely prefer gradually waking up into the day and enjoying the day as opposed to busting my butt to get up at 5:00 in the morning so I can maybe get off work to see some daylight.

Not sure if I'd be as much into night shift as I get older and am post-residency, but it's nice to know the option's out there for at least some specialties in medicine.

Such early days has been something that's making me think twice about even considering surgery!!

 

[MDstudent79]

Yeah, I feel like I am increasingly coming to realize that alot of people in even the really cush specialties (derm etc) are going to be working harder than your average white-collar stiff.

Yep, one of the reasons society is willing to pay docs more than the average white collar stiff, too. Because in the corporate world, once you get too far above the six-figure mark, your schedule can equally suck in terms of having to travel all the time. Been to an airport lately? That sucks. So that's at least one benefit of medicine--no travel for most folks.

Of course there are always those slick guys in the sales departments who can somehow have all local clients and bring in the huge bucks. 🙄

 

[a_ditchdoc]

It sounds like Radiology might be your calling, or perhaps pathology. Personally, I like the variation in my scheduling. A predictable daily routine kills me. 2nd shift is my all-time favorite (11-11 or so). Third shift is nice until about 4am...when even traumatic amputations fail to peak my interest. I wouldn't do 7-5 for anything... just not my thing.

Of course, in about ten years...I might just become a morning person...