For schools that "strongly recommend LORs from two science faculty who taught you" will my app be stronger with just one science LOR? (context inside)

[misosoop]

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Would really appreciate any help.

My second science LOR just canceled on me today, super super frustrating as two weeks ago I had even asked plainly to tell me if he was no longer able to write a letter so that I could find another letter writer asap. He said he'd have no problem at that time and now today he cancels. My first secondaries are "due" (based on the two week recommendation) in 10 days.

I've been frantically emailing professors and an absolute angel is willing to write me a very generic academic evaluation letter given the time constraints... the catch is I withdrew from her course midway through the semester due to a family death and retook it with a different professor (ironically the one I was supposed to have gotten a letter from). She says that she will just be speaking on my performance during the class, not the final grade.

For a school like Hopkins, who has a hard requirement of 2 science LORs, I'll obviously use the letter and am immensely grateful to have the ability to do so.

But for schools that "strongly recommend 2 science LORs" (Harvard, Chicago, Emory), would it benefit me to leave this letter out?

For context, my other letters are from another science prof, a non-science prof, my PI, and a physician/director of our hospital's scribe program. I believe these are very strong letters. Also, for concerns of science proficiency maybe my MCAT score will cover that?

Thank you very much for any insight.

 

[polymerization]

willing to write me a very generic academic evaluation letter

Ouch. In other words, your professor said no—and rightfully so, you didn't finish out the semester with them and they only know of you because there were special circumstances surrounding your enrollment in their class.

I can understand you're pulling at straws to meet the basic requirements for the application, which is valid. I just wonder what the professionals will think about a lukewarm and impersonal letter that is rushed to meet a deadline, given great stats.

On your end, I don't know how much arm-twisting you needed to do to have them write this letter, but given the overwhelming anxiety you're likely to feel as you near your deadline, I would probably refrain from obsessively following up.

Expect the letter to be late, if it arrives at all—and if it does, thank them profusely. Remember this is your emergency, not theirs...and they hold a lot of power over you right now. Not only do you need their letter to be specific and positive, but you're likely to be perceived in a pretty demanding, aggressive way (by essentially telling them, "drop everything and work on this unpaid essay out of the goodness of your heart and undying affection for me, one student of hundreds you teach every 3 months, right now, immediately").

Explore other options. If there was anyone else on your list to reach out to that could and would write you a letter, now is the time. You're already experiencing what happens when you put all your eggs in one basket. Don't make the same mistake twice. Good luck!

 

[misosoop]

Ouch. In other words, your professor said no—and rightfully so, you didn't finish out the semester with them and they only know of you because there were special circumstances surrounding your enrollment in their class.

I can understand you're pulling at straws to meet the basic requirements for the application, which is valid. I just wonder what the professionals will think about a lukewarm and impersonal letter that is rushed to meet a deadline, given great stats.

On your end, I don't know how much arm-twisting you needed to do to have them write this letter, but given the overwhelming anxiety you're likely to feel as you near your deadline, I would probably refrain from obsessively following up.

Expect the letter to be late, if it arrives at all—and if it does, thank them profusely. Remember this is your emergency, not theirs...and they hold a lot of power over you right now. Not only do you need their letter to be specific and positive, but you're asking in a pretty demanding, aggressive way (by essentially telling them, "drop everything and work on this unpaid essay out of the goodness of your heart and undying affection for me, one student of hundreds you teach every 3 months, right now, immediately").

Explore other options. If there was anyone else on your list to reach out to that could and would write you a letter, now is the time. You're already experiencing what happens when you put all your eggs in one basket. Don't make the same mistake twice. Good luck!

Hi! No, the professor that canceled on me was not the one whose class I withdrew from.

The prof that canceled on me was Dr. B. I initially took the class with Dr. A, withdrew due to family circumstances, and took the class again the following semester with Dr. B. Dr. B agreed to write me the letter a year ago when I finished his class. I followed up accordingly, had the conversation two weeks ago, and he canceled on me today.

Dr. A, angel as she is, agreed to write me a generic academic eval letter when I reached out to her (among other profs) today. However, given that I withdrew from her class, it is obviously not ideal and I wanted to know if it would be better not to send this letter to schools even if they "strongly recommend" a second science LOR.

 

[misosoop]

@polymerization Respectfully, I also don't think your read of the situation is accurate. I did not "twist her arm" in an aggressive, demanding way or ask under the assumption that I had any grounds to demand anything of anyone. I certainly do not feel in any way that she should have any affection for me or is obligated to write a letter in such short time. I am immensely grateful for her that she is willing to. I have no plans to obsessively follow up with her, as she's already confirmed the reciept of my interfolio link.

 

[Goro]

Find another science faculty member.
It's only July 1. You still have time.

 

[misosoop]

Find another science faculty member.
It's only July 1. You still have time.

Thanks. I sent out some emails today and am lucky to have Dr. A's response in such a short time.

However, under the likely scenario where no one else agrees to write me this letter, would it be better not to send Dr. A's letter to schools even if they "strongly recommend" a second science LOR, given that I had withdrawn from the class?

I expect any letter written in such a timeframe to be generic but this one has the added caveat that I withdrew.

 

[polymerization]

I can understand your view as an applicant completely. This process can feel unfair for us. Sometimes it genuinely is.

It's clear you're having feelings and I don't blame you for them. That said, you do have to make an adult decision now.

To be successful, you need to play the game. Denying that there is a game or resisting its rules is not advisable.

To be clear, the transaction between you and your professor should be genuine academic interest and curiosity in their field of study in exchange for their strong recommendation in moving forward with those academic interests. In this case, you were not able to show genuine interest because you physically were not there, and so they are unable to provide their strong recommendation in return.

It is not just words, it's an assignment. It is the only tangible academic product where there typical roles are reversed—the student requests, the professor fulfills. The same way you expect courtesy from your professor in allowing adequate time to complete your class assignments, it can come across as discourteous not to provide ample time to write a recommendation.

That's what I mean by demanding and aggressive... they have to push everything aside to meet your needs—and let's be real... the likelihood you ever speak to a professor that you only knew for half a semester again is slim, and they know that. Similarly, students having this kind of emergency are extremely insistent by necessity, and so you can understand why a professor would be hesitant to decline outright. The typical advice not to ask someone you don't know well is precisely to minimize the probability of getting an "I don't really know this person" letter, despite what that individual may tell you to your face.

Not everyone is the angel we hope they can be for us. Feeling entitled to it comes across naïve.

 

[Goro]

Thanks. I sent out some emails today and am lucky to have Dr. A's response in such a short time.

However, under the likely scenario where no one else agrees to write me this letter, would it be better not to send Dr. A's letter to schools even if they "strongly recommend" a second science LOR, given that I had withdrawn from the class?

I expect any letter written in such a timeframe to be generic but this one has the added caveat that I withdrew.

Simple solution, don't apply to that school.

"Strongly recommend" means "required". It raises eyebrows when people don't take the time to get to know their Faculty.

 

[misosoop]

I can understand your view as an applicant completely. This process can feel unfair for us. Sometimes it genuinely is.

It's clear you're having feelings and I don't blame you for them. That said, you do have to make an adult decision now.

To be successful, you need to play the game. Denying that there is a game or resisting its rules is not advisable.

To be clear, the transaction between you and your professor should be genuine academic interest and curiosity in their field of study in exchange for their strong recommendation in moving forward with those academic interests. In this case, you were not able to show genuine interest because you physically were not there, and so they are unable to provide their strong recommendation in return.

It is not just words, it's an assignment. It is the only tangible academic product where there typical roles are reversed—the student requests, the professor fulfills. The same way you expect courtesy from your professor in allowing adequate time to complete your class assignments, it can come across as discourteous not to provide ample time to write a recommendation.

That's what I mean by demanding and aggressive... they have to push everything aside to meet your needs—and let's be real... the likelihood you ever speak to a professor that you only knew for half a semester again is slim, and they know that. Similarly, students having this kind of emergency are extremely insistent by necessity, and so you can understand why a professor would be hesitant to decline outright. The typical advice not to ask someone you don't know well is precisely to minimize the probability of getting an "I don't really know this person" letter, despite what that individual may tell you to your face.

Not everyone is the angel we hope they can be for us. Feeling entitled to it comes across naïve.

Again, respectfully, I think you're misconstruing things. Where in the world do I come across as entitled in this post? And in the emails which I have not shared with you, I mention multiple multiple times that I realize it is an unrealistic request. I would not have been mad at any of these professors if they had refused at all, even less so with the timeframe. I am frustrated with the professor who canceled because I believe it is common professional courtesy to have canceled when I first asked him for confirmation, but have kept my response to him professional. But towards the professors willing to do me such a huge favor? I am just grateful. I don't care that it's a "I don't really know this person" letter because to expect any more in this situation is entitled.

I see a lot of moral posturing upon others in your posts on this forum.

 

[polymerization]

I offer my perspective as an applicant and never claimed to be an authority on anything.

I appreciate that you have been following my posts and will take your comments under advisement.

FYI, this is also part of the game. Insulting people who are trying to help you (like the professor that canceled on you) is not going to change your situation. It only guarantees you find yourself progressively more alone.

That said, have a great cycle. Hopefully things work out.

 

[misosoop]

I offer my perspective as an applicant and never claimed to be an authority on anything.

I appreciate that you have been following my posts and will take your comments under advisement.

FYI, this is also part of the game. Insulting people who are trying to help you (like the professor that canceled on you) is not going to change your situation. It only guarantees you find yourself progressively more alone.

That said, have a great cycle. Hopefully things work out.

Commenting on someone's professionalism is not the insult you claim it is, otherwise all professional evaluations would be offensive. Thank you.

 

[ridebiker]

Ouch. In other words, your professor said no—and rightfully so, you didn't finish out the semester with them and they only know of you because there were special circumstances surrounding your enrollment in their class.

I can understand you're pulling at straws to meet the basic requirements for the application, which is valid. I just wonder what the professionals will think about a lukewarm and impersonal letter that is rushed to meet a deadline, given great stats.

On your end, I don't know how much arm-twisting you needed to do to have them write this letter, but given the overwhelming anxiety you're likely to feel as you near your deadline, I would probably refrain from obsessively following up.

Expect the letter to be late, if it arrives at all—and if it does, thank them profusely. Remember this is your emergency, not theirs...and they hold a lot of power over you right now. Not only do you need their letter to be specific and positive, but you're asking in a pretty demanding, aggressive way (by essentially telling them, "drop everything and work on this unpaid essay out of the goodness of your heart and undying affection for me, one student of hundreds you teach every 3 months, right now, immediately").

Explore other options. If there was anyone else on your list to reach out to that could and would write you a letter, now is the time. You're already experiencing what happens when you put all your eggs in one basket. Don't make the same mistake twice. Good luck!

Wow that's a lot of inference you made without knowing what OP e-mailed their professor. How do you know they were demanding and aggressive? Your response is completely unecessary and so condescending

 

[ridebiker]

OP sorry you are getting the responses you are getting. I don't read anywhere where you are insulting towards either of your professors, or aggressive and demanding. There's a lot being read between the lines from a very specific viewpoint.

It sucks, this is part of the game and it's really hard to count on people when you have no other options. I'm being ghosted by one of my letter writers right now, it sucks! I've built plenty of strong relationships, but because I'm non-trad, just don't have tight connections with a lot of science professors. I hope you figure it out....you might e-mail the admissions department at one of the schools and ask if you can sub XYZ letter in for the second science letter. The worst they can say is no, and then you can save the Secondary app fee

 

[misosoop]

OP sorry you are getting the responses you are getting. I don't read anywhere where you are insulting towards either of your professors, or aggressive and demanding. There's a lot being read between the lines from a very specific viewpoint.

It sucks, this is part of the game and it's really hard to count on people when you have no other options. I'm being ghosted by one of my letter writers right now, it sucks! I've built plenty of strong relationships, but because I'm non-trad, just don't have tight connections with a lot of science professors. I hope you figure it out....you might e-mail the admissions department at one of the schools and ask if you can sub XYZ letter in for the second science letter. The worst they can say is no, and then you can save the Secondary app fee

Thank you very much, I appreciate it! I will definitely be checking in with admissions departments. I hope your letter writer gets back to you; good luck on the cycle!

 

[LizzyM]

Please relax if you can. As long as letters are in by Sept 1, you will be fine. The 10 day turn around for secondaries is to show your enthusiasm for a school. No one is expecting letter writers to show anything like that. Many schools pump out 100 committee letters over the summer and med schools plan their admissions cycle around the expectation that those letters arrive before Labor Day.

Dr. A may be just fine, if she can cover the material in the AMCAS handout for letter writers.

 

[misosoop]

Please relax if you can. As long as letters are in by Sept 1, you will be fine. The 10 day turn around for secondaries is to show your enthusiasm for a school. No one is expecting letter writers to show anything like that. Many schools pump out 100 committee letters over the summer and med schools plan their admissions cycle around the expectation that those letters arrive before Labor Day.

Dr. A may be just fine, if she can cover the material in the AMCAS handout for letter writers.

Alright, thank you!

 

[Mr.Smile12]

Would really appreciate any help.

My second science LOR just canceled on me today, super super frustrating as two weeks ago I had even asked plainly to tell me if he was no longer able to write a letter so that I could find another letter writer asap. He said he'd have no problem at that time and now today he cancels. My first secondaries are "due" (based on the two week recommendation) in 10 days.

I've been frantically emailing professors and an absolute angel is willing to write me a very generic academic evaluation letter given the time constraints... the catch is I withdrew from her course midway through the semester due to a family death and retook it with a different professor (ironically the one I was supposed to have gotten a letter from). She says that she will just be speaking on my performance during the class, not the final grade.

For a school like Hopkins, who has a hard requirement of 2 science LORs, I'll obviously use the letter and am immensely grateful to have the ability to do so.

But for schools that "strongly recommend 2 science LORs" (Harvard, Chicago, Emory), would it benefit me to leave this letter out?

For context, my other letters are from another science prof, a non-science prof, my PI, and a physician/director of our hospital's scribe program. I believe these are very strong letters. Also, for concerns of science proficiency maybe my MCAT score will cover that?

Thank you very much for any insight.

I agree, you have a bit more time.

Could you clarify, is your PI a science professor too?

Research Experience and Faculty References: Profile of the Accepted Applicant 2025 | SDN

Prehealth applicants worry about the importance of a research experience in the application process. Research experience offers a rewarding opportunity to

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[misosoop]

I agree, you have a bit more time.

Could you clarify, is your PI a science professor too?

Research Experience and Faculty References: Profile of the Accepted Applicant 2025 | SDN

Prehealth applicants worry about the importance of a research experience in the application process. Research experience offers a rewarding opportunity to

www.studentdoctor.net

Thanks, I'll let prospective letter writers know. Yes, my PI is a science professor and he said that he had written me "a very strong letter" so I think it can speak to my science proficiency. Unfortunately, I did not take his class (ironically enough he also teaches the class that I took with Dr. A and Dr. B lol).

 

[Mr.Smile12]

Thanks, I'll let prospective letter writers know. Yes, my PI is a science professor and he said that he had written me "a very strong letter" so I think it can speak to my science proficiency. Unfortunately, I did not take his class (ironically enough he also teaches the class that I took with Dr. A and Dr. B lol).

This is a pet peeve of mine: professors have to fulfill their jobs with teaching, research, and service. It's dumb if admissions committees only want "teaching" faculty letters when they have other responsibilities (but if you have to play their game, so be it). Research science professor LOR's are science professor LOR's (to me); they tend to know the students better than lecture professors do.

Move forward and get your secondaries done. If you get the other science lecture prof letter, great. If not, trust the process.

 

[misosoop]

This is a pet peeve of mine: professors have to fulfill their jobs with teaching, research, and service. It's dumb if admissions committees only want "teaching" faculty letters when they have other responsibilities (but if you have to play their game, so be it). Research science professor LOR's are science professor LOR's (to me); they tend to know the students better than lecture professors do.

Move forward and get your secondaries done. If you get the other science lecture prof letter, great. If not, trust the process.

If only all adcoms thought like this! 🥲 Alas, I emailed some schools whose "2 science faculty" requirement seemed to allow this wiggle room, just to double check, and so far FIU has responded outlining in three different ways how they wanted a teaching letter to know "how I'd be as a student".

But regardless, thank you for the encouragement. I'm incredibly grateful to have Dr. A's letter to send to schools who absolutely require it, but I think I will refrain from sending it to schools who only "strongly recommend it" (Harvard, Chicago) for fear that it will do more harm than good. I will just have to manage/suppress that neurotic itch that comes from not having the absolute perfect app for these schools......

 

[maybefuturedoctor7]

Hey! Wondering if you had any big lecture courses where you had a TA and not a professor? At my undergrad, we were able to (with the professor's permission) ask the TA to draft a letter and then have the professor co-sign it. I personally didn't do this though, so if that might help you, definitely double-check if this is allowed. The TA also might have to be a grad student or higher (i.e. not an undergraduate student). A TA probably has more information about your class performance, work ethic and personality than Dr. A. Some people are also willing to Zoom with you or let you send an email containing everything you remember about your experience in the course to jog their memory. In many cases they'll straight up write down whatever you told them. Sorry you're going through this OP, it's no fun.

Side note: You're doing great, keep asking for that second rec letter. Don't ever be afraid to ask for help because you're afraid to offend the other person - they are adults and should know how to politely say no. A professor's job description involves writing letters, they are literally PAID to do it. If you're worried you can always add something like "I completely understand if you can't do this" etc.

Edit: several typos lol sorry

 

[misosoop]

Hey! Wondering if you had any big lecture courses where you had a TA and not a professor? At my undergrad, we were able to (with the professor's permission) ask the TA to draft a letter and then have the professor co-sign it. I personally didn't do this though, so if that might help you, definitely double-check if this is allowed. The TA also might have to be a grad student or higher (i.e. not an undergraduate student). A TA probably has more information about your class performance, work ethic and personality than Dr. A. Some people are also willing to Zoom with you or let you send an email containing everything you remember about your experience in the course to jog their memory. In many cases they'll straight up write down whatever you told them. Sorry you're going through this OP, it's no fun.

Side note: You're doing great, keep asking for that second rec letter. Don't ever be afraid to ask for help because you're afraid to offend the other person - they are adults and should know how to politely say no. A professor's job description involves writing letters, they are literally PAID to do it. If you're worried you can always add something like "I completely understand if you can't do this" etc.

Edit: several typos lol sorry

Thank you very much! Unfortunately all our TA's were only available in office hours and I didn't go to any specific TA's hours consistently. Thanks for the recommendation anyway, and your encouragement is greatly appreciated!

 

[stew_md]

I was able to scavenge 2 science LORs that I'm almost certain were mediocre. I hadn't talked to these instructors in multiple years. They remembered me from class, but I was not confident about the quality of their letters. I got better letters from my clinical and volunteer experiences, though. If the 2 science LORs are a hard requirement, you should try your best to meet that requirement. However, some schools may be more flexible than others when it comes to LOR requirements, you could reach out to a few schools via email and see if your current LORs will suffice.

 

[misosoop]

I was able to scavenge 2 science LORs that I'm almost certain were mediocre. I hadn't talked to these instructors in multiple years. They remembered me from class, but I was not confident about the quality of their letters. I got better letters from my clinical and volunteer experiences, though. If the 2 science LORs are a hard requirement, you should try your best to meet that requirement. However, some schools may be more flexible than others when it comes to LOR requirements, you could reach out to a few schools via email and see if your current LORs will suffice.

thank you, this makes me feel a lot better! I believe that my other four letters are strong.