Go with the MD, or try really hard for the MD/PhD?

[mashinator]

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Edit: (Simplified)
I was tired from all the stress of applying but failed to realize how ridiculous it was for me to be whining.
Two Q's:
(i) how likely is it to get off the waitlists at UTHSCSA and CWRU MD/PhD programs?
(ii) what can I do to help me get off theses waitlists if I haven't done basic research since interviewing?

 

[eteshoe]

There's always hope until there isn't. If your end goal is to be a physician scientist, then a MD/PhD is just one of the paths towards that goal. There's plenty of MD-only physician scientists. If that happens to be the only available route for you then all hope is not lost. Get involved in research in med school, perform well in med school and match into a research intensive residency (and/or fellowship).

 

[downthedrain]

I didn't get my acceptances until after the April deadline for people to drop their multiple acceptances. You just have to be patient. Be thankful that you have a place to go. That takes a lot of pressure off you. Also, if I'm not mistaken, NYMC has an MD/PhD program that you can apply into during your M2 yrs, so it's not like you have no options if you go there.

 

[darkamgine]

I think letters describing why you really want to attend the school more so than academic achievements could help in your situation. I would contact the schools and ask them how many people in previous years got off the waitlist for their programs. I would say don't hold your breath for Case (not 100% sure, but pm me if you want more information). Not sure about UTHSCSA.

 

[Shifty B]

There is no dilemma here. You wait. Hang on to the NYMC acceptance until you hear from the other places, then decide.

Otherwise why did you bother to apply in the first place?

 

[mashinator]

There's always hope until there isn't. If your end goal is to be a physician scientist, then a MD/PhD is just one of the paths towards that goal. There's plenty of MD-only physician scientists. If that happens to be the only available route for you then all hope is not lost. Get involved in research in med school, perform well in med school and match into a research intensive residency (and/or fellowship).

Point taken. Still, I was looking forward to the PhD training and I'll never be able to replicate that if I just pursue the MD.

I didn't get my acceptances until after the April deadline for people to drop their multiple acceptances. You just have to be patient. Be thankful that you have a place to go. That takes a lot of pressure off you. Also, if I'm not mistaken, NYMC has an MD/PhD program that you can apply into during your M2 yrs, so it's not like you have no options if you go there.

I think I was just feeling a little down with several more months of uncertainty ahead. No worries though, self-pity time is over 🙂. NYMC does have a MD/PhD program that can only be applied to internally. However, they do not support their students during the MD years and there doesn't seem to be any sort of integration with the MD and PhD. It would probably make more sense to follow @eteshoe 's advice and pursue research as an MD in this case instead.

I think letters describing why you really want to attend the school more so than academic achievements could help in your situation. I would contact the schools and ask them how many people in previous years got off the waitlist for their programs. I would say don't hold your breath for Case (not 100% sure, but pm me if you want more information). Not sure about UTHSCSA.

I am currently in a gap year so I wouldn't have any academic achievements and thus will write the kind of letters you're talking about. One school mentions that they do reach into the waitlist and the other said that there was no guarantee that they would (although they had in the past). Pm'd.

There is no dilemma here. You wait. Hang on to the NYMC acceptance until you hear from the other places, then decide.

Otherwise why did you bother to apply in the first place?

I'll hang on without a doubt. A lot of factors led to me feeling a weee bit sad the other day but that has quickly changed as I got rid of my arrogance. There are some truly amazing candidates out there - many of whom were accepted and many of whom may be worse off than I am. I am honored to have had the chance to be on the waitlist at such amazing mdphd programs and to be accepted to an MD school.

 

[eteshoe]

Point taken. Still, I was looking forward to the PhD training and I'll never be able to replicate that if I just pursue the MD.



I think I was just feeling a little down with several more months of uncertainty ahead. No worries though, self-pity time is over 🙂. NYMC does have a MD/PhD program that can only be applied to internally. However, they do not support their students during the MD years and there doesn't seem to be any sort of integration with the MD and PhD. It would probably make more sense to follow @eteshoe 's advice and pursue research as an MD in this case instead.



I am currently in a gap year so I wouldn't have any academic achievements and thus will write the kind of letters you're talking about. One school mentions that they do reach into the waitlist and the other said that there was no guarantee that they would (although they had in the past). Pm'd.



I'll hang on without a doubt. A lot of factors led to me feeling a weee bit sad the other day but that has quickly changed as I got rid of my arrogance. There are some truly amazing candidates out there - many of whom were accepted and many of whom may be worse off than I am. I am honored to have had the chance to be on the waitlist at such amazing mdphd programs and to be accepted to an MD school.

There are some fellowship programs that will grant you a PhD upon completion if that is one of your end goals.

 

[mashinator]

There are some fellowship programs that will grant you a PhD upon completion if that is one of your end goals.

Hmm, I didn't know that. How would that work? After a residency, would I pursue studies/research like a graduate student? I couldn't find such a fellowship from some Google searches - if you could provide a few examples, I'd appreciate it!

 

[eteshoe]

Hmm, I didn't know that. How would that work? After a residency, would I pursue studies/research like a graduate student? I couldn't find such a fellowship from some Google searches - if you could provide a few examples, I'd appreciate it!

I know there are more out there but here are the few I heard of before:
https://medicine.yale.edu/investigativemedicine/
http://star.med.ucla.edu
http://med.stanford.edu/arts/overview.html
CSU Link
Mt Sinai Link

 

[mashinator]

I know there are more out there but here are the few I heard of before:
https://medicine.yale.edu/investigativemedicine/
http://star.med.ucla.edu
http://med.stanford.edu/arts/overview.html
CSU Link
Mt Sinai Link

That's pretty cool! I had no idea such programs existed. Are there any major advantages/disadvantages in terms of timeline, career, medical training, funding, costs, etc. for taking this route over the MDPhD route?

 

[eteshoe]

That's pretty cool! I had no idea such programs existed. Are there any major advantages/disadvantages in terms of timeline, career, medical training, funding, costs, etc. for taking this route over the MDPhD route?

No major difference in the timeline. Both routes are funded and one ends up with both degrees at the end. So I would say this route is comparable to the formal MD/PhD program route

 

[mashinator]

No major difference in the timeline. Both routes are funded and one ends up with both degrees at the end. So I would say this route is comparable to the formal MD/PhD program route

They probably don't cover the med school tuition though (although would the stipend you receive be closer to a MD/PhD student's, grad students', resident's or fellow's?). Would the role be closer to a grad student or post doc? And, correct me if I'm wrong, but, there seems to be some benefit to completing the clinical training before starting the research intensive fellowship (as opposed to what happens for MD/PhDs). For example, if I know I want to work on prion disease research, having had the clinical training could greatly improve the type of research I do, or at least I think I should. Anyways, this has been super informative @eteshoe and I hope other potential MD/PhD students know that such an option exists. Thanks a bunch!

 

[eteshoe]

They probably don't cover the med school tuition though (although would the stipend you receive be closer to a MD/PhD student's, grad students', resident's or fellow's?). Would the role be closer to a grad student or post doc? And, correct me if I'm wrong, but, there seems to be some benefit to completing the clinical training before starting the research intensive fellowship (as opposed to what happens for MD/PhDs). For example, if I know I want to work on prion disease research, having had the clinical training could greatly improve the type of research I do, or at least I think I should. Anyways, this has been super informative @eteshoe and I hope other potential MD/PhD students know that such an option exists. Thanks a bunch!

My bad. Just noticed what I said - you're correct the medical school portion won't be funded (I mean unless you win a scholarship from your institution). The stipend would be closer to that of a grad student or Postdoc in many cases. There is an advantage to doing the PhD at that point in your medical training since you will have an exact idea of what interests you (though in my case my interests have kind of converged so I'm not too worried). And no problem - SDN has been quite helpful to me so I try to do the same.