Health Professions Major

[deleted1123640]

I'm considering switching to a health professions major to try and preserve my GPA, but I'm worried this may look bad. I know they say major doesn't matter, but I'm worried that not taking a lot of science classes will hurt me. I'll be taking Bio I and II, gen chem I and II, physics I and II, o chem I and II, biochem I and II, anatomy I and II, and precalculus and calculus I (I hate these classes, math is killing me which is why I'm changing my major). I'm just worried not being a science degree will hurt me and that not taking genetics, molecular biology, statistics, etc. could hurt me and that lack of research would hurt me since I am not a science major and won't be able to find research.
Can someone please just tell me that it'll be ok?

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[inwantstobeadoctor]

As long as you complete the pre reqs, you'll be fine. I know some schools (like Tulane off the top of my head) actually like when potential med students apply with degrees outside of science for the diversity aspect. A couple of my classmates have degrees in Literature and History and are flourishing. Make sure to keep up with volunteering and gaining manful/clinical experiences!

 

[deleted1123640]

As long as you complete the pre reqs, you'll be fine. I know some schools (like Tulane off the top of my head) actually like when potential med students apply with degrees outside of science for the diversity aspect. A couple of my classmates have degrees in Literature and History and are flourishing. Make sure to keep up with volunteering and gaining manful/clinical experiences!

Ok thank you. I'm just worried not taking a lot of stem classes will look bad or that it will set me up for failure in med school.

 

[inwantstobeadoctor]

I mean it might not help when it comes time to take the MCAT, but there are plenty of MCAT prep courses to take or self study materials to obtain when the time comes. The courses that you listed above are pretty much the classes that traditional premeds take (i.e. pre reqs)

 

[deleted1123640]

Ok, I thought that immunology, virology, microbiology, parasitology. mammalian physiology, endocrinology, and other classes that would've been in my other major would have really helped me.

 

[wysdoc]

Ok thank you. I'm just worried not taking a lot of stem classes will look bad or that it will set me up for failure in med school.

You might like to know that Calculus is not required for med school, but a good statistics class is required by most schools

 

[deleted1123640]

You might like to know that Calculus is not required for med school, but a good statistics class is required by most schools

Well, I have a biostatistics and public health class, so I think that could count.

 

[inwantstobeadoctor]

Immunology and endocrinology might have helped but honestly what you'll be taught in med school is what you need to know, regardless of if you've seen similar material in undergrad. You'll be fine with your new major!

 

[deleted1123640]

Immunology and endocrinology might have helped but honestly what you'll be taught in med school is what you need to know, regardless of if you've seen similar material in undergrad. You'll be fine with your new major!

I'm most of all scared of precalculus and calculus I because math is a huge weakness of mine and I have to withdraw from precalc.

 

[TragicalDrFaust]

Are pre calc and calculus the only classes you're worried about? There are a lot of options besides switching to health professions. While major mostly doesn't matter, that one may present a bit of a problem because it's perceived as less rigorous without adding any value the way a econ or philosophy major might. It's med school prereqs plus fluff. Why not take med school pre reqs plus major in something you're truly interested in?

 

[deleted1123640]

Are pre calc and calculus the only classes you're worried about? There are a lot of options besides switching to health professions. While major mostly doesn't matter, that one may present a bit of a problem because it's perceived as less rigorous without adding any value the way a econ or philosophy major might. It's med school prereqs plus fluff. Why not take med school pre reqs plus major in something you're truly interested in?

Because having to take calculus I and II, calc based physics I and II, physical chem, etc. would tank my GPA and because I've mostly heard that your major doesn't matter or add in any weight.

 

[TragicalDrFaust]

Because having to take calculus I and II, calc based physics I and II, physical chem, etc. would tank my GPA and because I've mostly heard that your major doesn't matter or add in any weight.

None of those classes is part of a biology major at my undergrad. What’s your current major? Even as a biochem major I didn’t have to take p chem.

Edit for clarity

 

[deleted1123640]

None of those classes is part of a biology major at my undergrad. What’s your current major? Even as a biochem major I didn’t have to take p chem.

Edit for clarity

Biochem

 

[eigen]

You might like to know that Calculus is not required for med school, but a good statistics class is required by most schools

The thing to keep in mind for students, is what math their school's physics courses require, if they want to take them as part of their undergrad coursework rather than over the summer / at a CC. There are definitely schools that require calculus, but it's a minority.

 

[wysdoc]

The thing to keep in mind for students, is what math their school's physics courses require, if they want to take them as part of their undergrad coursework rather than over the summer / at a CC. There are definitely schools that require calculus, but it's a minority.

True, it could be required for the Biochem major at the OP’s school, hence the decision to change majors

 

[deleted1123640]

The thing to keep in mind for students, is what math their school's physics courses require, if they want to take them as part of their undergrad coursework rather than over the summer / at a CC. There are definitely schools that require calculus, but it's a minority.

I have 3 physics courses to choose from. Algebra based, calculus based for engineers, and calculus based for science majors. The reason I’m taking calculus is because it’s required for the biochemistry classes

 

[eigen]

Yeah, it's pretty common for biochem majors, since you really need a pretty decent grasp of it for PChem. There are some biochemistry majors in biology departments (usually Biochemistry & Molecular Biology) that are less chem / more molecular biology based that don't require PChem, but I'd say they're less common than those that do.

A surprisingly large number of schools only offer calculus based physics, I've learned.

 

[eigen]

True, it could be required for the Biochem major at the OP’s school, hence the decision to change majors

Yeah. I actually meant med schools that require calculus, but also school specific for the OP.

 

[deleted1123640]

Yeah. I actually meant med schools that require calculus, but also school specific for the OP.

So if I want to take biochemistry I and II at my school, I have to take calculus because it's a prerequisite. If I want to major in biochemistry, I have to take physical chemistry, calculus II, calc based physics, and a few other really hard classes that'll ruin my gpa.

My concern is that
A, the lack ot a STEM major could hurt me because I have less science classes and
B, this will mean I probably couldn't get research

 

[LizzyM]

My concern would be that the majors that are vocational and intended to prepare people for allied health professions sometimes raise questions regarding why you are switching to medicine after preparing through your major for a career as a .....

As long as you have the pre-reqs, you are covered in that respect. If you have the bench skills, you can get research experience, even as a paid researcher after college. I had a grad student who majored in philosophy, worked in a lab after graduation, did a masters degree and went on to med school.

 

[eigen]

So if I want to take biochemistry I and II at my school, I have to take calculus because it's a prerequisite. If I want to major in biochemistry, I have to take physical chemistry, calculus II, calc based physics, and a few other really hard classes that'll ruin my gpa.

My concern is that
A, the lack ot a STEM major could hurt me because I have less science classes and
B, this will mean I probably couldn't get research

For what it's worth, I watch my advisees successfully get into medical school from a wide variety of majors across the arts, humanities, social sciences and sciences.

That said, I'm not sure a "health professions" major is a good idea, depending on what it involves. By the name, it sounds like it's either a typical "pre-med" major or more vocational, rather than being a stand-alone discipline, and I don't find those are often as successful for students.

Similarly, depending on what rank / specialty you're aiming for, I have students with no research experience get into fine programs, but not those that are research focused.

I would also be careful, depending on how far into the major you are, that it's not obvious you're changing major just to protect your GPA. In my experience, changes that look specifically like they're only GPA protection aren't usually well considered.

 

[deleted1123640]

For what it's worth, I watch my advisees successfully get into medical school from a wide variety of majors across the arts, humanities, social sciences and sciences.

That said, I'm not sure a "health professions" major is a good idea, depending on what it involves. By the name, it sounds like it's either a typical "pre-med" major or more vocational, rather than being a stand-alone discipline, and I don't find those are often as successful for students.

Similarly, depending on what rank / specialty you're aiming for, I have students with no research experience get into fine programs, but not those that are research focused.

I would also be careful, depending on how far into the major you are, that it's not obvious you're changing major just to protect your GPA. In my experience, changes that look specifically like they're only GPA protection aren't usually well considered.

I'm in my first semester, so I don't know if it'll look like that. As far as what it is as far as a degree, it's a lot of things related to public health, biostatistics, anatomy, psychology, US healthcare, disease prevention and control, intro to narrative patient health care, exercise and nutrition, as well as the standard prerequisites. As a degree alone, it isn't very useful. My fear is just getting bad grades and ending up with a 3.2 GPA and not being able to get into medical school.

 

[deleted1123640]

My concern would be that the majors that are vocational and intended to prepare people for allied health professions sometimes raise questions regarding why you are switching to medicine after preparing through your major for a career as a .....

As long as you have the pre-reqs, you are covered in that respect. If you have the bench skills, you can get research experience, even as a paid researcher after college. I had a grad student who majored in philosophy, worked in a lab after graduation, did a masters degree and went on to med school.

I see that, I didn't think they would look into that too much. I'm just afraid I would have too low of a GPA and have to do a post bacc to get into medical school to recover from a low GPA.

 

[LizzyM]

You are a first semester freshman who took community college courses in HS, correct?
You have identified math as a particular weakness. (I can relate.)

My recommendation to you would be to take a break from pre-med coursework, knock out some general education requirements, and focus a major amount of attention on strengthening your math skills. Khan Academy, workbooks, your school's tutoring center, whatever works best for your learning style. Getting a firm foundation in math now will serve you well later whether you stay the course as a pre-med or take a different path. But don't let your weakness in math be what holds you back! You are still young and you can master this!

Not to be a Debbie Downer but do consider that more than half of the people who get to the point of applying to medical school end up going pro in something else. Many more pre-meds never get to the point of actually applying. If you are going down this road, you have to keep in mind that an alternate career might be what you'll end up doing and you should have some ideas as to why you want to do this and what other careers would satisfy the itch. Overall, you are smart to be concerned now about GPA and not letting yourself get into a hole that will be hard to get out of. Do keep in mind that schools look at GPA by academic year, not by semester or quarter, so a poor term will not sink things as they appear to us when we look at your application.

 

[deleted1123640]

You are a first semester freshman who took community college courses in HS, correct?
You have identified math as a particular weakness. (I can relate.)

My recommendation to you would be to take a break from pre-med coursework, knock out some general education requirements, and focus a major amount of attention on strengthening your math skills. Khan Academy, workbooks, your school's tutoring center, whatever works best for your learning style. Getting a firm foundation in math now will serve you well later whether you stay the course as a pre-med or take a different path. But don't let your weakness in math be what holds you back! You are still young and you can master this!

Not to be a Debbie Downer but do consider that more than half of the people who get to the point of applying to medical school end up going pro in something else. Many more pre-meds never get to the point of actually applying. If you are going down this road, you have to keep in mind that an alternate career might be what you'll end up doing and you should have some ideas as to why you want to do this and what other careers would satisfy the itch. Overall, you are smart to be concerned now about GPA and not letting yourself get into a hole that will be hard to get out of. Do keep in mind that schools look at GPA by academic year, not by semester or quarter, so a poor term will not sink things as they appear to us when we look at your application.

That is correct, I took 4 semesters of dual enrollment while in high school and then 2 part time semesters after high school (I graduated 1 semester early, so I took 1 semester in the spring and 1 semester in the summer prior to transferring to a 4 year university). I've been really REALLY trying to work more on my math skills, at community college I breezed through the math classes. I think the big struggle for me is that my current university doesn't allow the use of calculators and goes into very complex problems as opposed to the basic stuff we did at community college. I go to my schools math center (it's a bunch of engineering and mathematic major students who offer to help students) a few times a week and spend well over 8 hours a week on my math work. I feel like I understand the content, but then come test time the content is just different from what we covered in class. I have compared my tests side by side with the homework and practice problems we are told to do and they don't match up. I've watched Khan Academy, Brian McLogan, The Organic Chemistry Tutor, Professor Leonard, and other videos on the subject, it's just a really big struggle for me and I'm worried having to take calculus I and II, calculus based physics, physical chemistry, chemical measurement, chemical research, and all these other classes will just hurt my GPA to the point medical school isn't a feasible option, especially since stats are increasing more and more every year.

 

[eigen]

I'm in my first semester, so I don't know if it'll look like that. As far as what it is as far as a degree, it's a lot of things related to public health, biostatistics, anatomy, psychology, US healthcare, disease prevention and control, intro to narrative patient health care, exercise and nutrition, as well as the standard prerequisites. As a degree alone, it isn't very useful. My fear is just getting bad grades and ending up with a 3.2 GPA and not being able to get into medical school.

I strongly recommend students avoid degrees that have no use outside of prep for a professional program. Too many of my students get to the point of applying and realize they don't want to go to medical school.

Having years of undergrad coursework and debt that have no utility directly in a degree is not a good place to be.

Biochemistry as a major may not be for you, but I would suggest choosing a major that has usefulness on it's own (or particular interest to you). Choosing a degree purely based on getting into medical school isn't a path I see working out well for most students.

Also, again, unless you're aiming for *top* schools, a 3.2 is not dead in the water if the rest of your application is strong, despite what you see from averages.

 

[deleted1123640]

I strongly recommend students avoid degrees that have no use outside of prep for a professional program. Too many of my students get to the point of applying and realize they don't want to go to medical school.

Having years of undergrad coursework and debt that have no utility directly in a degree is not a good place to be.

Biochemistry as a major may not be for you, but I would suggest choosing a major that has usefulness on it's own (or particular interest to you). Choosing a degree purely based on getting into medical school isn't a path I see working out well for most students.

Also, again, unless you're aiming for *top* schools, a 3.2 is not dead in the water if the rest of your application is strong, despite what you see from averages.

Really? I thought 3.5 was like, the bottom of the barrel, even for DO schools.

 

[eigen]

Not in my experience, no. Do your chances reduce with lower GPA? Sure, *assuming* the rest of your package is the same. But a slightly lower GPA coupled with a strong MCAT, or an average MCAT coupled with strong community involvement and clinical experience.

I also wanted to tag onto something you said above: you mention spending 8 hours a week on math as an indication that it's a lot / too much. For a typical 3 credit college class, you should be spending 6-9 hours per week out of class at the bare minimum, which is usually what an average student needs for an average grade in the class. Some students in some classes might not need to spend that much time, but 8 hours a week is right about on part with what I'd expect most students to need to spend.

::edit:: Consider this table (https://www.aamc.org/media/6091/download), and note that for a given MCAT score, going down by 0.2 GPA units has a relatively small decrease in admissions %. If you look at "average" (505-509 MCAT range), you'll see ~25% acceptance rates even in the <3.0 range.

 

[deleted1123640]

Not in my experience, no. Do your chances reduce with lower GPA? Sure, *assuming* the rest of your package is the same. But a slightly lower GPA coupled with a strong MCAT, or an average MCAT coupled with strong community involvement and clinical experience.

I also wanted to tag onto something you said above: you mention spending 8 hours a week on math as an indication that it's a lot / too much. For a typical 3 credit college class, you should be spending 6-9 hours per week out of class at the bare minimum, which is usually what an average student needs for an average grade in the class. Some students in some classes might not need to spend that much time, but 8 hours a week is right about on part with what I'd expect most students to need to spend.

I don't know what more I could really do because I do all the practice problems over and over again and go to tutoring. I spend more time on this class than I do all my other classes combined. Biology and chemistry I spend maybe 2 or 3 hours a week on (each) and my English class I spend maybe an hour or two on (depending on if I have a big paper due or not).

I know I'm just repeating myself, but I'm just worried getting a low GPA will leave me DOA considering the average GPA and MCAT is going up, as is clinical experience, research, volunteer experience, shadowing, leadership, even publications.

 

[eigen]

My point is that those are very low amounts to spend on a class: your math class is about average.

As part of assessment and to receive federal financial aid funds, schools have to show during accreditation that their classes provide a minimum of 2 hours of out of class work / 1 hour of in class work per credit hour over the course of a typical semester.

As an average, students should expect to spend 2-3 hours out of class per credit hour. Sometimes you may need to spend less, especially in your first year when you're taking courses that largely re-tread high school material.

As for looking at "average stats", remember that they're average. That means half of the people have lower stats, half have above that. For a lot of things, you have wide variation in a class. You might have someone that worked full time for 3 years post-graduation as a researcher and has 6000+ hours. That brings the average up a lot. Same with clinical experience and other things.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

Read What Are the Most Common Premed/Pre-Health Majors? - SDN .

 

[LizzyM]

Your math skills are weak when faced with university level math coursework. That either needs to be rectified or you won't thrive in the pre-med courses expected of all pre-meds.

While it is too soon to throw in the towel, you should think about a major that can get you into a profession other than medicine if it comes to that.

What is it that interests you about medicine and if medical schools all closed tomorrow, what would your alternative be? Would you like to be a teacher/instructor? a therapist? a counselor? an advocate? a person who examines (and, perhaps, treats) just a portion of patients' bodies? to be a first responder for persons in acute distress? a data analyst? an administrator? There may be a role for you in or outside of health care which you could consider now as you choose your major or in the future, knowing that you are well prepared for other options.