Help with where to go...

[vesse77]

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I am technically a career changer though I'm only 26. I am volunteering at an animal hospital and taking the prerequisite courses however the debt aspect scares me to death. I am a US citizen with Canadian residency and there are some "cheap" schools in Canada but they'll still leave me with a lot of debt. I have looked at schools in Brazil as my husband is Brazilian and I speak Portuguese and the schools are 100% free. I know they are not accredited but they are recognized by the avma so what should I do? Is it better to take on the debt to go to an accredited school, or to do the ecfvg and have no debt (no debt from living expenses either since my in-laws live there). Thanks for your help!

 

[DVMDream]

Debt.

ECFVG is no guarantee, is expensive and many people fail to pass it and have to repeat it. It can easily cost you up to $10,000 or more.

If you can not or do not see yourself living and practicing vet med in Brazil, stick with an accredited university. That is my opinion.

 

[Lab Rat83]

I've worked with a guy who graduated from a vet school in Brazil (he was from there) and he met his wife and moved to Canada shortly after graduation. He's been trying to get licensed for the last 6 years and it will cost him at least $10K to do all the things he has to do to become licensed. He has been working as a vet tech since coming to Canada. So for him, it hasn't worked out.

 

[orca2011]

I've worked with a guy who graduated from a vet school in Brazil (he was from there) and he met his wife and moved to Canada shortly after graduation. He's been trying to get licensed for the last 6 years and it will cost him at least $10K to do all the things he has to do to become licensed. He has been working as a vet tech since coming to Canada. So for him, it hasn't worked out.

Just seconding that it can take a while. I work with a vet assistant who is actually a veterinarian from Egypt. He's currently going through the whole process himself and I think he's worked as a vet assistant for at least the past 5 years. I actually don't think he's started the actual testing yet.

 

[LetItSnow]

Huh. Seems like we all know some of these folks. I know an Iraqi vet who is working as a vet tech here in the U.S. because of how difficult it is for him to get licensed. If I understand him right (and I may not ... he's a great guy but his English is limited) they want him to do a clinical year at a U.S. vet school.

 

[vesse77]

LetItSnow makes a great point. I have read that the biggest issue tends to be the language issue. It's hard to get past the second step which is the toefl which is irrelevant for me. I found statistics from another thread here, 203/434 candidates passed within 3 years, 19% of those within 12 months of registering. That's at least more encouraging.

 

[Minnerbelle]

LetItSnow makes a great point. I have read that the biggest issue tends to be the language issue. It's hard to get past the second step which is the toefl which is irrelevant for me. I found statistics from another thread here, 203/434 candidates passed within 3 years, 19% of those within 12 months of registering. That's at least more encouraging.

Though I'm sure the toefl is a barrier for some, I don't think that's the biggest hurdle for everyone. The CPE is really brutal. Not only do you need to know your stuff medically, you need to be technically adept. i've heard a lot of disaster stories surrounding the anesthesia and surgery portion of the exam. I kinda doubt i would pass the large animal portion of it either... and I just graduated from a US school. In order to pass it, I know people who essentially paid OOS tuition to do a clinical year at a US school who offer a program for foreign grads. A lab animal resident I know said that of the entire group of people who took the CPE with her, she was the only one that passed...

 

[SMUVETMED2017]

Not sure if you have looked into any of the Caribbean schools yet. At St. Matthews we have lots of Canadian students. My understanding is they get financing aid and can do their clinical rotations in Canada or the US your choice. It is also VERY affordable, and starts three small (7-20 students)classes per year.

 

[Escalla]

My understanding is they get financing aid and can do their clinical rotations in Canada or the US your choice.

This is misleading. Canadians have very limited options for financial aid (particularly compared to American students) and it certainly wouldn't cover tuition for a clinical year in the U.S. I'm not sure what SMU tuition is, but it doesn't eliminate the problem of having to take foreign grad exams.

The approximately ~$10,000 per year at a Canadian school is going to be the cheapest option for veterinary school in North America.

 

[that redhead]

Though I'm sure the toefl is a barrier for some, I don't think that's the biggest hurdle for everyone. The CPE is really brutal. Not only do you need to know your stuff medically, you need to be technically adept. i've heard a lot of disaster stories surrounding the anesthesia and surgery portion of the exam. I kinda doubt i would pass the large animal portion of it either... and I just graduated from a US school. In order to pass it, I know people who essentially paid OOS tuition to do a clinical year at a US school who offer a program for foreign grads. A lab animal resident I know said that of the entire group of people who took the CPE with her, she was the only one that passed...

CPE exams have been happening at my school the past couple of weeks and I've been working with clinicians who've "proctored" the exams...it is extremely brutal. I don't think it necessarily reflects poorly on the candidates (some of the errors sound like simple nerves) but the quality or level of education is just not the same at a non-accredited school many times. I agree with DVMD - the debt is worth it in this scenario.

 

[Minnerbelle]

CPE exams have been happening at my school the past couple of weeks and I've been working with clinicians who've "proctored" the exams...it is extremely brutal. I don't think it necessarily reflects poorly on the candidates (some of the errors sound like simple nerves) but the quality or level of education is just not the same at a non-accredited school many times. I agree with DVMD - the debt is worth it in this scenario.

I seen it with my own two eyes as well (large animal portion), and I remember thinking, holy hell I wouldn't pass that...

 

[that redhead]

I seen it with my own two eyes as well (large animal portion), and I remember thinking, holy hell I wouldn't pass that...

I tend to think that myself, especially since surgery is my weak point. But plenty of details I've heard make me believe there are some truly unqualified people and it's pretty scary what might happen if the CPE didn't exist :/

 

[TXvet]

One of the techs I worked with was a veterinarian from Ethiopia. He came here in 2000 and started working on his citizenship and towards licensing to practice in the U.S. It took him 5 years to become a US citizen. He then had to take an English proficiency test (which you probably would not take). Then he started taking the required testing to get his US veterinary license. He was required to take 1 clinical year at a US vet school( he went to Oklahoma State). After all of the testing and the cost of the clinical year at OSU, he spent about $30,000. He complained about the amount until I told him most US students graduate from vet school with 150,000 to 250,000$ worth of debt, so I think he got a good deal. It did take several years but he is now practicing in Georgia. You should be worried about the debt.

 

[TXvet]

BTW, I work with a vet from SMU and she owes about 300,000$. She says she will never be debt free-I would not do this.

 

[DVMDream]

One of the techs I worked with was a veterinarian from Ethiopia. He came here in 2000 and started working on his citizenship and towards licensing to practice in the U.S. It took him 5 years to become a US citizen. He then had to take an English profeniency test (which you probably would not take). Then he started taking the required testing to get his US veterinary license. He was required to take 1 clinical year at a US vet school( he went to Oklahoma State). After all of the testing and the cost of the clinical year at OSU, he spent about $30,000. He complained about the amount until I told him most US students graduate from vet school with 150,000 to 250,000$ worth of debt, so I think he got a good deal. It did take several years but he is now practicing in Georgia. You should be worried about the debt.

So he was one of the few that got through everything and made it work out. That does not happen for everyone. And it is very difficult to pass those exams. Many people have to repeat the exams a few times before they pass. It isn't something that you just sign up for, go through the motions, and then finish and have your license. It takes years, hard work, lots of study and you may still never pass the exam in order to get your license.

So basically the OP needs to decide between taking on scary amounts of debt or going a cheaper route and possibly never getting his/her license to practice vet med in the US.

 

[TXvet]

That is true, though going overseas does not guarantee a degree either. I have worked with techs that did not make it through Ross, one from SMU that did not pass the tests- they are paying their loans on a tech salary.

 

[DVMDream]

That is true, though going overseas does not guarantee a degree either. I have worked with techs that did not make it through Ross, one from SMU that did not pass the tests- they are paying their loans on a tech salary.

Going to any school does not guarantee a degree. Ross and St. George are now accredited vet schools so those students only have to take the NAVLE. There is a chance that anyone can fail the NAVLE regardless of which school they attend. It is not limited to overseas schools. The chance of not passing the NAVLE though at an accredited school is much less than the chance of not passing the ECFVG. Most of the accredited vet schools have NAVLE pass rates around 98-100%.

I don't think SMU is accredited yet, so they would still have to take ECFVG in order to get their license.

 

[DVMDream]

That is true, though going overseas does not guarantee a degree either. I have worked with techs that did not make it through Ross, one from SMU that did not pass the tests- they are paying their loans on a tech salary.

Also, the original poster was considering going to a Canadian school not Ross or SMU or St. George. Though none of those schools I just mentioned are bad schools to attend for a vet degree, they are just as good as any US school.

 

[SMUVETMED2017]

Going to any school does not guarantee a degree. Ross and St. George are now accredited vet schools so those students only have to take the NAVLE. There is a chance that anyone can fail the NAVLE regardless of which school they attend. It is not limited to overseas schools. The chance of not passing the NAVLE though at an accredited school is much less than the chance of not passing the ECFVG. Most of the accredited vet schools have NAVLE pass rates around 98-100%.

I don't think SMU is accredited yet, so they would still have to take ECFVG in order to get their license.

You are right about this SMU is AVMA listed but not quite yet approved. Depending on what state you intend to practice in you can take the PAVE (MUCH cheaper) or the ECFVG.

 

[WillowLeaf]

Most of the accredited vet schools have NAVLE pass rates around 98-100%.

I've been wondering for a while - do those pass rates mean 98-100% of graduates pass the first time they take the test, or that 0-2% of graduates never pass at all? Even 2% never passing seems like a scary statistic, because that 2% would have so much debt but be unable to use their degree.

 

[dyachei]

I've been wondering for a while - do those pass rates mean 98-100% of graduates pass the first time they take the test, or that 0-2% of graduates never pass at all? Even 2% never passing seems like a scary statistic, because that 2% would have so much debt but be unable to use their degree.

Ask the school but I think it's usually pass rate while the student is in school (2 tries)

 

[SMUVETMED2017]

BTW, I work with a vet from SMU and she owes about 300,000$. She says she will never be debt free-I would not do this.

As of right now, tuition at SMU is $13k USD/semester and ~$20k USD for your clinical year semesters (this depends on the school you go to). With seven semesters on Island and your Clinical year back in the States, it comes out to be a little less that $160k USD (~($91K for tuition, ~$60k Clinics, and $2-8k for PAVE/NAVLE/ECFVG). Granted there is Cost of living/travel associated with this as well, but that is true of any school you go to.

 

[Fly Racing]

The OP is not considering any of the Caribbean schools. The OP is deciding between Brazil and Canada.

Realizing the ECFVG is not actually a good option, a further part of the problem with Brazil is you won't be eligible for the PAVE option unless you do a US clinical year in addition to the Brazil school's requirements. The PAVE is much easier to pass (no skills test). By the time you have expenses (traveling, daily needs, ect) in Brazil, a US clinical year with those living expenses and the PAVE exam, you would actually save money and time by staying in Canada. And being in Brazil won't really be free. Your rent might be free, but I doubt they will be buying your school supplies, shampoo, and clothes too.

 

[Sam T.]

I am technically a career changer though I'm only 26. I am volunteering at an animal hospital and taking the prerequisite courses however the debt aspect scares me to death. I am a US citizen with Canadian residency and there are some "cheap" schools in Canada but they'll still leave me with a lot of debt. I have looked at schools in Brazil as my husband is Brazilian and I speak Portuguese and the schools are 100% free. I know they are not accredited but they are recognized by the avma so what should I do? Is it better to take on the debt to go to an accredited school, or to do the ecfvg and have no debt (no debt from living expenses either since my in-laws live there). Thanks for your help!

Hello! I'm curious which path you decided to take. I am in the same predicament now and would like to know what decision you made? Any insight would be greatly appreciated!

 

[LyraGardenia]

Hello! I'm curious which path you decided to take. I am in the same predicament now and would like to know what decision you made? Any insight would be greatly appreciated!

It doesn't look like that poster has been back on the forums since 2014, unfortunately.