How far down rank lists do programs typically get?

[superfly24]

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Title is pretty self explanatory.

Wondering how far down a program's rank list they typically go to fill their last spot. Specifically for average Family Med programs.

 

[Cathyran]

This was discussed in great detail a few weeks ago.

 

[b-real]

This was discussed in great detail a few weeks ago.

link?

 

[Phur]

http://www.nrmp.org/data/resultsanddata2011.pdf

Table 17... 5.1 per number of positions for FM last year

 

[superfly24]

Yeah, I've read the Match data but that's an average across all the FM programs. I'm assuming a top 10 program wouldn't have to go down as far as a bottom tier so I'm guessing the middle to lower programs tend to go farther down than the average number.

Looking for what a mid-low tier program would go through to fill a spot. Thought some who have been in their programs previous rank meetings may have some insight.

 

[FlowLimited]

Do you know your position on their list? If not, how is this information going to help you?

 

[Law2Doc]

Yeah, I've read the Match data but that's an average across all the FM programs. I'm assuming a top 10 program wouldn't have to go down as far as a bottom tier so I'm guessing the middle to lower programs tend to go farther down than the average number.

Looking for what a mid-low tier program would go through to fill a spot. Thought some who have been in their programs previous rank meetings may have some insight.

Programs know historically how deep they have gone, and try to create a buffer below that. The general goal is not to have to resort to the scramble. Every year some program is going to miscalculate and end up with spots in the scramble. I'm not sure there's an on average rank list depth. If a school filled their ten spots in 20 ranks three years in a row, they probably don't rank too many more than 40 people. The better programs have closer to a 1:1 rank acceptance ratio. The worse ones fill with folks who cone up short with their longshots. There isn't going to be a magic number here. Basically, if you are qualified and had a good interview, you have a good shot. But there will always be someone more qualified and better in the interview. So it comes down to whether they want the program or someplace else. It's less about the programs driving this train and more about what other applicants want, which is probably harder to predict.

 

[deleted103644]

http://www.nrmp.org/data/resultsanddata2011.pdf

Table 17... 5.1 per number of positions for FM last year

Also that table does not say that the average program went down that far on their list, just that the average completely filled program ranked that many applicants.

I would imagine the average number of ranks needed to be fully matched would actually be significantly smaller since many programs that matched fully probably ranked far more than they needed to...

 

[FutrPharm]

Also that table does not say that the average program went down that far on their list, just that the average completely filled program ranked that many applicants.

I would imagine the average number of ranks needed to be fully matched would actually be significantly smaller since many programs that matched fully probably ranked far more than they needed to...

Actually I think it is saying how far the average program went down their list to fill each spot:

"Average Number of Ranked Applicants Per Position Needed to Fill All Positions within Programs"

So to put it another way, these are the number of ranks needed to fill each spot. The total number of ranks is obviously going to be a larger number, since this is only a subset of that population. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Also, I find it hard to believe that the average ortho program with 4 spots is only ranking 18 people. There are a lot of good programs that go into the 30's I've heard.

 

[Phenytoin]

Actually I think it is saying how far the average program went down their list to fill each spot:

"Average Number of Ranked Applicants Per Position Needed to Fill All Positions within Programs"

So to put it another way, these are the number of ranks needed to fill each spot. The total number of ranks is obviously going to be a larger number, since this is only a subset of that population. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Also, I find it hard to believe that the average ortho program with 4 spots is only ranking 18 people. There are a lot of good programs that go into the 30's I've heard.

I agree with your interpretaion of the nrmp table. I doubt good programs in a competitive field like ortho go into the 30s. I know in a similarly
competitive field a good program will go to 9-12 for 6...

 

[deleted103644]

Actually I think it is saying how far the average program went down their list to fill each spot:

"Average Number of Ranked Applicants Per Position Needed to Fill All Positions within Programs"

So to put it another way, these are the number of ranks needed to fill each spot. The total number of ranks is obviously going to be a larger number, since this is only a subset of that population. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Also, I find it hard to believe that the average ortho program with 4 spots is only ranking 18 people. There are a lot of good programs that go into the 30's I've heard.

May have been confusing it with another table they have (which definitely is the total rank list length), but the wording for this is also a bit vague (although I think on second look I agree with you).

If they separated this out by size of program, I'm sure smaller programs go down further per position than large programs, both due to random noise and that large programs tend to be more competitive.