How hard are German Med Schools compared to an US one?

Burrell College of Osteopathic Medicine
This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.
L

LuckedOut

New Member
7+ Year Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2015
Messages
9
Reaction score
4
Hello folks,

I've gathered that some people on here have studied in Germany.
I was wondering how hard they are compared to US schools. Who is the better "scientist", who is the better doctor after finishing training? Do the requirements compare (Biochem, Physiology, etc)?

Do you think they get a thorough and good education, or are US doctors just much better?
Members don't see this ad.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
Don't forget its a 6-year curriculum, meaning there are no premed requirements. From what I've heard from German folks, it's pretty hardcore (getting into as well as studies and board exams).
I've used both German and US textbooks and the depth and broadness of knowledge is the same.
 
I have a German friend that went to the med school in Berlin. Guy is one of the smartest people I know. From the few medical conversations we've had I don't think he has any gaps in his medical education compared to US med schools and if I had to guess knows more than a lot of US grads.m I know he and a few others from the school came to Harvard to do research for a little bit and seemed to fit in just fine. I'm not sure where the bar is to pass there vs here but I think it is whatever you make of it
 
Well, the thing is that they won't have to worry about debts. That seems like SUCH a huge plus. So maybe the depth of the material isn't the best, but you guys seem to think positively of the level of education, except #1. @qw098 , do you mind telling us how you came to that conclusion?
 
It would be a possibility to go to Germany to study there. Then, you can take your Steps and come back to the US to practice, or you just stay there. Anyway, no debts to worry about, and if the standard of education is comparable and good, then it's worth a thought, isn't it?
 
LuckedOut said:
It would be a possibility to go to Germany to study there. Then, you can take your Steps and come back to the US to practice, or you just stay there. Anyway, no debts to worry about, and if the standard of education is comparable and good, then it's worth a thought, isn't it?
Click to expand...

You have to remember that you are not guaranteed to get a residency in the US if you wanted to come back and then you won't be able to practice as a physician here. I think the general consensus is to go to medical school in the country you want to practice.
 
It is my understanding that German schools don't teach to the USMLE either.
 
One of the professors at my institute attended medical school in Germany. He came to the US to finish his clinical years. What I gathered from our discussion about the typical German vs. American medical student is-- German medical students are incredibly good at knowing medical minutia. You could pick the rarest enzyme mutation manifesting as some anatomical quirk and the German medical student would likely be able to pinpoint it quickly. The American medical student, however, is far more well-versed in practical matters. For example, if a patient comes into the ER basically coding, a young American medical student would be more adept, and likely feel more confident, in treating the patient.

This is, of course, just anecdotal evidence. I am sure that with the licensing exams required in both nations, the physicians they produce should all have some level of competence!
 
The system there is very different. It would be hard to objectively compare it to US system. I have a friend who's a medical student at Charité, which is one of the best medical institutions in Germany. Students do a lot more independent learning there than in the States. For example, instead of being tested on information presented during lectures, German medical students have to search for all the info themselves; they're simply given a list of objectives which they have to know, but it's up to them which source they want to use to cover those objectives. (I believe some American schools are starting to adopt this approach as well.) My friend often complains that it's hard know into how much depth she should go while studying for a particular objective.

Also, fun fact: if you fail an exam there, you don't just take an F and go home. You must retake it. And if you still fail it second, and then third time, you will not be permitted to study medicine anywhere in Germany for the rest of your life. They don't kid around! 🙂
 
Mr.Zero said:
You have to remember that you are not guaranteed to get a residency in the US if you wanted to come back and then you won't be able to practice as a physician here. I think the general consensus is to go to medical school in the country you want to practice.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure that you're "guaranteed" a residency anywhere. True, your odds may be better in the country in which you practice...but I wouldn't worry about this too much. With the upcoming physician shortage and the quality of many European schools, I don't think you'll have any problems getting a residency in the U.S.

Most schools post their residency match results from previous years. I'd check that out.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
LuckedOut said:
Hello folks,

I've gathered that some people on here have studied in Germany.
I was wondering how hard they are compared to US schools. Who is the better "scientist", who is the better doctor after finishing training? Do the requirements compare (Biochem, Physiology, etc)?

Do you think they get a thorough and good education, or are US doctors just much better?
Click to expand...
I had a friend who didn't get into any US MD or DO school for 2 years, so she went to Germany and got in quickly. Not sure what other factors played into that and I don't know her stats, but that's my only experience with it.
 
Domek said:
I'm not sure that you're "guaranteed" a residency anywhere. True, your odds may be better in the country in which you practice...but I wouldn't worry about this too much. With the upcoming physician shortage and the quality of many European schools, I don't think you'll have any problems getting a residency in the U.S.

Most schools post their residency match results from previous years. I'd check that out.
Click to expand...

Not sure this is sound advice. The quality of the international school matters far less than the fact that it is an international school. Even some of the top ranked international schools still have abysmal match rates for US residencies compared to even lower tier US schools.
 
Domek said:
I'm not sure that you're "guaranteed" a residency anywhere. True, your odds may be better in the country in which you practice...but I wouldn't worry about this too much. With the upcoming physician shortage and the quality of many European schools, I don't think you'll have any problems getting a residency in the U.S.

Most schools post their residency match results from previous years. I'd check that out.
Click to expand...
No.
 
I did an internship at an orthopedic hospital in Germany with other German med students. I'd say German med schools are as tough as American ones. They are very difficult to get in, although they don't require an interview. The students get a great medical education, but I remember them telling me they wished administration and the professors would "take care" of them better, much like at many American schools (probably because we pay $$$$$, haha). Some of them also told me that after 2 years, they tried to take Step 1 for fun and thought it was insanely difficult. The first 2 years, they mostly learn basic sciences (chem, physics, mol bio, etc) from what I gathered. Another interesting thing about German med schools is that many students end up getting a PhD as well. Apparently, it's super easy to get a PhD as a med student. You just have to submit a thesis on any research project. I've seen a couple and they were very simple projects.
 
^ That is, as far as I know, no real PhD. In the US, there's the MD title, which they don't have there. So they have to write a thesis to get their MD. A Dr. med is in most cases not seen as anything close to a PhD.
 
"Hard to get in", really? AFAIK, their admission test is a joke compared to the ridiculous MCAT we have here. Also, no interviews, no EC's. Just your grades, people!
 
I'd imagine it's just as difficult, medical school is hard. Just, they get through it in less years than we might in the U.S.
 
PhoenixFire said:
"Hard to get in", really? AFAIK, their admission test is a joke compared to the ridiculous MCAT we have here. Also, no interviews, no EC's. Just your grades, people!
Click to expand...

at 16 years old. Remember that mega-nerd Asian in high school who studied 12 hours a day and was top of his class? That's your competition. If you don't make it on the first cut, your chances go down by like 90%.
 
PhoenixFire said:
at 17-18.

Hah, I'd still prefer no EC's, no LORs, no interview 🙂

"Each year 10,000 new students start medical education" in Germany. While Germany is just the size of a U.S. state, it produces half of the # of med students compared to the U.S. every year: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2716556/
Click to expand...

sure, until you don't get in because you weren't in the top 5% in high school.

Also, Germany would be more than twice as big as California, in terms of population. Depending on the attrition rates, Germany could easily wind up training as many doctors per capita as we do.
 
PhoenixFire said:
"Each year 10,000 new students start medical education" in Germany. While Germany is just the size of a U.S. state, it produces half of the # of med students compared to the U.S. every year: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2716556/
Click to expand...

Finishing the sentence you quoted, "Each year 10,000 new students start medical education and about 6000 students graduate every year." A 40% attrition rate (I'm just assuming its due to attrition, but I really don't know) seems pretty terrible to me, but at least they aren't paying much for tuition compared to the US model
 
notbobtrustme said:
sure, until you don't get in because you weren't in the top 5% in high school.

Also, Germany would be more than twice as big as California, in terms of population. Depending on the attrition rates, Germany could easily wind up training as many doctors per capita as we do.
Click to expand...
C'mon, it's ridiculously easy to be in top 5% in high school - even though their HS is higher caliber than ours.

Being top 5% in HS vs. 4 years of undergrad + MCAT + a bunch of EC's + bothering people for LORs + graduating with tons of loans,
I'd gladly take the former.

Mr.Zero said:
but at least they aren't paying much for tuition compared to the US model
Click to expand...
Tuition is actually 100% free over there.
 
Yea you are right about the tuition, I did a quick search and just saw that they started charging about 500 euros in tuition about ten years ago. I guess that law has been basically repealed by the individual states since then, making it free again.
 
PhoenixFire said:
"Each year 10,000 new students start medical education" in Germany. While Germany is just the size of a U.S. state, it produces half of the # of med students compared to the U.S. every year: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2716556/
Click to expand...

US population 320 mio, German population 80 mio.
US graduates 18k, German graduates 6k.

But yeah let's just look at the size of the countries, because Alaska is so crowded.

abi1 said:
Apparently, it's super easy to get a PhD as a med student. You just have to submit a thesis on any research project. I've seen a couple and they were very simple projects.
Click to expand...

It's the MD thesis (Dr. med). A PhD takes at least 2-3 full years.
 
PhoenixFire said:
C'mon, it's ridiculously easy to be in top 5% in high school - even though their HS is higher caliber than ours.

Being top 5% in HS vs. 4 years of undergrad + MCAT + a bunch of EC's + bothering people for LORs + graduating with tons of loans,
I'd gladly take the former.


Tuition is actually 100% free over there.
Click to expand...
As someone who was an average student in high school, but in med school now. I'll take the latter lol.
I didn't know what I wanted to do going into high school, I think I only started getting serious about school later on.
 
zeppelinpage4 said:
As someone who was an average student in high school, but in med school now. I'll take the latter lol.
I didn't know what I wanted to do going into high school, I think I only started getting serious about school later on.
Click to expand...

Seriously, I think you miss a lot of fine students if the selection process is during high school. A lot of people don't have the maturity to take high school seriously and then actually do well in college. I was more interested in gaming and sports back then.
 
TheShaker said:
Seriously, I think you miss a lot of fine students if the selection process is during high school. A lot of people don't have the maturity to take high school seriously and then actually do well in college. I was more interested in gaming and sports back then.
Click to expand...
people can enter med school in Germany at a later age, too. My aunt entered when she was 24 or so...
 
PatNanym said:
Are you a fan of Asin Thottumkal? 😀
Click to expand...
Ahhh, in the 6 years I've had this account, you're the first person on these forums to recognize her! 😀 Haha, yes, quite the fan...longest lasting celebrity crush I've had I think. Always pleased to meet another Asin fan. ^_^
 
zeppelinpage4 said:
Ahhh, in the 6 years I've had this account, you're the first person on these forums to recognize her! 😀 Haha, yes, quite the fan...longest lasting celebrity crush I've had I think. Always pleased to meet another Asin fan. ^_^
Click to expand...
Cheers! 👍 Seeing Asin's pic on SDN, I just HAD to comment! 😀 I guess then it's safe enough to presume you're originally from the southern parts of India, or at least from the subcontinent! 🙂
 
PatNanym said:
Cheers! 👍 Seeing Asin's pic on SDN, I just HAD to comment! 😀 I guess then it's safe enough to presume you're originally from the southern parts of India, or at least from the subcontinent! 🙂
Click to expand...
Haha yup! I grew up in the U.S., but my family is Indian so I've been raised with an appreciation for Bollywood films. 🙂

Simplyaroy said:
I've been her fan since Ghajini and I'm not even Indian nor Asian
Click to expand...

Same! I saw her for the first time in Ghajini sometime in early 2009.

PatNanym said:
Wow, really?! Never thought Asin or Indian movies would be this famous!
Click to expand...
Yeah, it's surprisingly popular here. I had several friends in college without any south Asian background, who were really into bollywood dancing and music. They were some of the biggest fans I knew! 😀
 
Last edited:
zeppelinpage4 said:
Haha yup! I grew up in the U.S., but my family is Indian so I've been raised with an appreciation for Bollywood films. 🙂

Same! I saw her for the first time in Ghajini sometime in early 2009.


Yeah, it's surprisingly popular here. I had several friends in college without any south Asian background, who were really into bollywood dancing and music. They were some of the biggest fans I knew! 😀
Click to expand...

That's great! 🙂
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Baller27
How hard is it to match into competitive specialties in competitive areas with no ties> (NYC, Cali, Chicago)
Replies
20
Views
2K
RN-2-Medicine
RN-2-Medicine
V
Are med students at most schools allowed to put in orders?
Replies
25
Views
2K
DarkBluMage
D
Tibial.Tuberosity
  • Question Question
How often can I visit family during med school?
Replies
19
Views
1K
AJS59
AJS59
AJS59
Any resources on how to deal with breakups as a med student?
Replies
8
Views
1K
Rachapkis
Rachapkis
X0001234
How can I set myself up for success in med school and beyond?
Replies
5
Views
716
Mr.Smile12
Mr.Smile12
Top