How important is it for a school to have a university hospital?

[CavsFan2016]

Is having an established university hospital over 5-6 university-affiliated hospitals a big advantage?


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[Redpancreas]

Is having an established university hospital over 5-6 university-affiliated hospitals a big advantage?


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Sorry be to be that guy, but in what context? Fellowship match? Job prestige? My advisors in academic medicine have told me it does, but don't know why. I'd imagine for job prestige, anything that sounds good to a layperson would be an advantage because anytime a person hears their doctor trained at <insert Ivy> it sounds good.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

One benefit is that most rotation are localized to the university hospital

 

[Seth Joo]

Is having an established university hospital over 5-6 university-affiliated hospitals a big advantage?


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A large research based medical school with its own research hospitals will be an advantage when you are in the clinical phase of your education. It definitely won't hurt.

 

[CavsFan2016]

Sorry be to be that guy, but in what context? Fellowship match? Job prestige? My advisors in academic medicine have told me it does, but don't know why. I'd imagine for job prestige, anything that sounds good to a layperson would be an advantage because anytime a person hears their doctor trained at <insert Ivy> it sounds good.

I was thinking in the context of 4 years down the line when applying for residencies


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[IlDestriero]

A large research based medical school with its own research hospitals will be an advantage when you are in the clinical phase of your education. It definitely won't hurt.

This is why it helps. Centralized hub for most of your rotations, easy and regular access to the same faculty, research opportunities, potential for better LORs, networking with leaders in the field, etc. Not everyone can go to Harvard and work at MGH, but it can benefit your career.


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Il Destriero

 

[Stagg737]

This is why it helps. Centralized hub for most of your rotations, easy and regular access to the same faculty, research opportunities, potential for better LORs, networking with leaders in the field, etc. Not everyone can go to Harvard and work at MGH, but it can benefit your career.


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Il Destriero

Is it also advantageous because it creates more standardization for clinical grades for PDs to interpret? I'd imagine that one university hospital would mean less variation in attendings and more consistency in terms of evaluations. Is that even a consideration or just an extrapolation I'm making?

 

[----x----]

Sometimes students who aren't looking to go into academic medicine dislike their rotations at their large university hospital. It's possible that in seeing a very different patient population, you miss out on what would be the "bread and butter" cases regularly found in the specialty you're rotating in, and are potentially less prepared for PGY-1 because you know how to manage zebras better than the top 5 workups on the unit.

 

[IlDestriero]

If you can handle septic syndromic kids and people with 30+ line problem lists, you can manage Johnnie's infected paper cut. Aim high, you can always settle for an easier lifestyle job.


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Il Destriero

 

[Seth Joo]

This is why it helps. Centralized hub for most of your rotations, easy and regular access to the same faculty, research opportunities, potential for better LORs, networking with leaders in the field, etc. Not everyone can go to Harvard and work at MGH, but it can benefit your career.


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Il Destriero

Of course it can.

 

[Doctor-S]

In addition to the reasons articulated by other posters above, here are my general thoughts about an AMC residency (academic/clinical/research focus) versus a university-affiliated hospital (clinical/community focus):

1. If you're interested in research and clinical training, an AMC combines research, education and clinical care at one established site that may (or may not) be readily available at university-affiliated hospitals. You'll probably become familiar with more than a few people at an AMC since everyone works at the same AMC. Think good training opportunities, professional recommendations, as well as professional networking.

2. If you're interested in research, an AMC offers clinical trials to compare the best existing treatments to "emerging" treatments. It provides residents with greater access to cutting-edge technologies, breakthroughs, research and therapies that might not be available at other hospitals. This also provides residents and students with opportunities to perform research/analyze data to establish new standards of patient care.

3. An AMC often has sufficient resources to sponsor different professional events that may attract leading professionals in your field. This can be useful for completing CMEs, practice, networking, recommendations, etc.

Just my thoughts.

 

[Goro]

In looking at Hofstra/Northwell, Gersinger [sp?]/TCMC and the upcoming Southern Cal Kaiser plus Arrowhead med schools, I wonder if in a few years people will be asking "How important is it for a hospital to have a medical school?"

Not too long ago a hospital in our town was on the verge of bankruptcy. I asked our University's Provost if it would be feasible for us to by it, so my med school would have an actual teaching hosptial. His reply was that "that model of medical education is not viable anymore". Please tell me if he was full of horse excrement or not!

 

[neoevolution]

In looking at Hofstra/Northwell, Gersinger [sp?]/TCMC and the upcoming Southern Cal Kaiser plus Arrowhead med schools, I wonder if in a few years people will be asking "How important is it for a hospital to have a medical school?"

Not too long ago a hospital in our town was on the verge of bankruptcy. I asked our University's Provost if it would be feasible for us to by it, so my med school would have an actual teaching hosptial. His reply was that "that model of medical education is not viable anymore". Please tell me if he was full of horse excrement or not!

An advantage of having an affiliate hospital is also the stability it brings to clinical rotations. I've met many NY medical students who are incredibly frustrated that Caribbean schools are outbidding their med schools for rotation sites that they have historically been able to send students too (which I'm assuming are in the area but not official affiliates).

 

[Goro]

An advantage of having an affiliate hospital is also the stability it brings to clinical rotations. I've met many NY medical students who are incredibly frustrated that Caribbean schools are outbidding their med schools for rotation sites that they have historically been able to send students too (which I'm assuming are in the area but not official affiliates).

Which is why I suggested to our Provost that we buy that hospital!

 

[qwerty89]

Sometimes students who aren't looking to go into academic medicine dislike their rotations at their large university hospital. It's possible that in seeing a very different patient population, you miss out on what would be the "bread and butter" cases regularly found in the specialty you're rotating in, and are potentially less prepared for PGY-1 because you know how to manage zebras better than the top 5 workups on the unit.

Exactly. Don't listen to the naysayers. You really don't need to see a ton of zebras since you will be managing typical bread and butter on a daily basis.

Best of luck. My preceptors in different clinics were super helpful and taught me all I need to know in NP school!


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[Levo]

This is very anecdotal, but I've felt like I had much better teaching at "main university hospital" rotation than on rotations at affiliated hospitals. Attendings hired at a hospital with "university" in the name know that med students are part of their job, and see enough med students to know how to work with them. Outside the university hospital, the attendings I worked with viewed having a medical student as a much less important part of their day and hardly if ever did any formal teaching.

 

[mcloaf]

Sometimes students who aren't looking to go into academic medicine dislike their rotations at their large university hospital. It's possible that in seeing a very different patient population, you miss out on what would be the "bread and butter" cases regularly found in the specialty you're rotating in, and are potentially less prepared for PGY-1 because you know how to manage zebras better than the top 5 workups on the unit.

Are you just repeating things you've heard on the internet? Don't worry, you'll see plenty of CHF and pneumonia on university hospital wards.

 

[OnePunchBiopsy]

No matter where you do your clinical rotations, try and do at least one away rotation at the opposite.

If you end up at amed school without a university hospital, you could always do an away rotation at one later.

 

[----x----]

Are you just repeating things you've heard on the internet? Don't worry, you'll see plenty of CHF and pneumonia on university hospital wards.

No, I'm repeating what I've heard when speaking with 3rd and 4th year students at my state school. There are 6 to 7 hospitals students can rotate at, and some students mentioned they dislike the university hospital the most for this reason.

Again, what I stated above was their opinions. One said the majority of their class felt that way. Perhaps that's not as common of an opinion elsewhere.

 

[Ismet]

Sometimes students who aren't looking to go into academic medicine dislike their rotations at their large university hospital. It's possible that in seeing a very different patient population, you miss out on what would be the "bread and butter" cases regularly found in the specialty you're rotating in, and are potentially less prepared for PGY-1 because you know how to manage zebras better than the top 5 workups on the unit.

No, I'm repeating what I've heard when speaking with 3rd and 4th year students at my state school. There are 6 to 7 hospitals students can rotate at, and some students mentioned they dislike the university hospital the most for this reason.

Again, what I stated above was their opinions. One said the majority of their class felt that way. Perhaps that's not as common of an opinion elsewhere.

I went to med school at a major academic institution and at another major academic institution for residency and I did not/do not miss out on bread and butter (or zebras) in the slightest. We tend to give our 3rd years the interesting patients to follow, usually both "bread and butter" and "zebras," but at the very least they'll have cases they can learn good things from. Good students not only learn about their patients, but pay attention to the other patients on the team and learn from them too. I guarantee that your friends' services were not lacking in common diagnoses.

Don't worry, after your first inpatient month of PGY-1 you'll have those "top 5 workups" down.

 

[MSTP18]

Is it also advantageous because it creates more standardization for clinical grades for PDs to interpret? I'd imagine that one university hospital would mean less variation in attendings and more consistency in terms of evaluations. Is that even a consideration or just an extrapolation I'm making?

Probably in the general sense yes, but I've had attendings at the same hospital in the same specialty give me wildly different evaluations obviously because of their own personal expectations of what I should be doing.