I can't handle the lazy.

[SSnows123]

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I can handle stupid people. I can handle weird super intelligent people. I can handle rude people, happy people, shy people, obnoxious people, etc. It's all fine as long as they put the work in.

My problem is with the moderately intelligent but extremely lazy people. I mean, seriously, don't ask me for help if you won't put in the minimum. Don't cheat off me because you didn't study. Don't ask to be in my group because you know I read the chapter and you didn't. For the love of god, stop asking after each slide, "Will this be on the test?" just so you don't have to study!

Was I this annoying when I was 20-22? If so, I apologize to humanity!

Part of being a nontrad is having life experience, emotional maturity and patience but I'm sorry, I just cannot take the lazies. And yes, I know I better get over it because a lot of my patients will probably someday be these exact lazies... *shudders*

/Rant over.

 

[futuremdforme]

Breathe! Once you're in med school, you'll be amongst "your people."

 

[SSnows123]

I should have probably toned this down before posting. Color me abashed.

Going back to lower level pre-reqs as a nontrad can be a little annoying, though. It seems to me that the majority of students that I encounter are just there to fulfill a requirement for their degree and aren't at all interested in actually learning. It's kind of a sad state of affairs when our young are going into huge amounts of debt and viewing college as a necessary evil instead of an amazing privilege that their job is to just LEARN!

 

[DrMikeP]

I can handle stupid people. I can handle weird super intelligent people. I can handle rude people, happy people, shy people, obnoxious people, etc. It's all fine as long as they put the work in.

My problem is with the moderately intelligent but extremely lazy people. I mean, seriously, don't ask me for help if you won't put in the minimum. Don't cheat off me because you didn't study. Don't ask to be in my group because you know I read the chapter and you didn't. For the love of god, stop asking after each slide, "Will this be on the test?" just so you don't have to study!

Was I this annoying when I was 20-22? If so, I apologize to humanity!

Part of being a nontrad is having life experience, emotional maturity and patience but I'm sorry, I just cannot take the lazies. And yes, I know I better get over it because a lot of my patients will probably someday be these exact lazies... *shudders*

/Rant over.

LOL.. It gets worse every year.

Hang around SDN long enough and you'll see people who post things so ridiculous that they are just plain too lazy to Google and read or to dumb to practice, but either way you hope to God will never get into med school.

Patients are even worse, my favorite complaint recently was a severely obese 20 yo who asked "can't they just somehow implant my medication because taking pills daily is hard work." Thus why the psych consult.

 

[Mad Jack]

Hang around SDN long enough and you'll see people who post things so ridiculous that they are just plain too lazy to Google and read or to dumb to practice

That's the reason I tend to avoid pre-allo these days.

 

[Plastic156600sub3]

Remember when you were in school and you had to learn handwriting/cursive? They don't do that anymore because apparently no one has time to write anything.

When I was teaching, students were appalled to hear me ask them actually do something. Discipline is lacking, because parents will not make their precious little darlings lift a pinky. In fact, even as early as my student teaching year I was thrown the race card because little Johnny didn't like that I told him to quiet down. No, it's not all the parents' fault for coddling once they get to be college kids, but it sure wouldn't hurt to have these brats handed some responsibility and accountability once in a while.

 

[futuremdforme]

Patients are even worse, my favorite complaint recently was a severely obese 20 yo who asked "can't they just somehow implant my medication because taking pills daily is hard work." Thus why the psych consult.

OMG! I get forgetting to take pills, but actually declaring your laziness and saying it's hard work to take pills? Wow.

 

[chibaddie]

Part of being a nontrad is having life experience, emotional maturity and patience but I'm sorry, I just cannot take the lazies.

You are in for a treat once you're in medical school, my friend. I feel you. Also, the "lazies" tend to make a reappearance as not only your patients, but your colleagues as well. So much to look forward to...

 

[CyrilFiggis]

This isn't generational. Laziness is not age specific. I've been in the non-medical workforce for 10 years and there are just as many "do-enough-to-get-through-the-day" 45-50 year olds as there are 20-30 year olds.

Also, the "lazies" tend to make a reappearance as not only your patients, but your colleagues as well.

Hang around a nurses station long enough and you learn who everyone is real fast.

 

[Ad2b]

Guy at work was hired to replace me. I call him "Jabba" probably not nice but accurate, even down to the tongue. 😉

Anyway, I asked him to do a few things that would help him learn what it is that I did for that client. He had to update a table with the names of people (spelled correctly) otherwise, the SQL tool I developed won't recognize the name and the formulas behind all the calculations for their commissions = $0.00 (not a good thing for people used to getting $25,000 checks on the 15th of the month).

He failed to spell people's name's right.
He failed to appropriately put in the correct %s.
He failed to tick-n-tie a spreadsheet with 20 lines on it (3 fields wide)
He failed to log into the system at all
He lied to my client about his background, saying he had SQL (finally telling me he thought it was the macro language in Excel)
He lied to the 3rd party vendor about his background in Excel (he thought pivot tables were ways to make Access speak to Word)

When I asked him what I needed to do to help him finish the tasks so he could learn my job? He responded,

"Well, develop a SQL app'y thing for Facebook so I can just speak to it and it can type out my messages. I'm too lazy to do that myself."

Then he asked me, "Do you think there's anything the client could do to keep you around?" No, Jabba, there's not.

Yeah, Jabba sits on cell phone all day, rubbing his belly, holding it up so he can see the latest FB message and/or post, takes 3 hours lunches, lies and gets paid

... @$55/hr.

 

[Sardinia]

@SSnows123 I think it's amazing you are able to accurately assess and categorize the IQ, emotional state, and work ethic of your classmates taking into account their life as a holistic set of factors before passing judgment on them. Your intuitive non-trad knowledge is truly beautiful and an unparalleled gift.

 

[Sardinia]

@SSnows123 Except most students aren't able to treat school like it was a job... because they actually have to work on the side in order to pay for food, gas, and classes. Considering most of the students you're with are likely starting at minimum wage which in my state is around $8.32 unless they've been working there since high school and probably make $8.50 (wow) they likely are spending a majority of their time making sure they have the means to attend class which isn't an "amazing privilege" even with their parents paying their tuition.

Undergraduate colleges exist to soak money from students. There's no breakdown for why a four credit class at a four year University should cost around $1800 whereas a similar cost at a community college is around $600. To someone who is earning close to minimum wage, the cost of higher education makes absolutely no sense and is an expense that seems created in order to preserve the wealth gap, rather than to assist in closing it. This can be an arguable topic, however what is not debatable is the fact that tuition rates in the United States have skyrocketed exponentially and there are still other countries where tuition is free or a third of the price of our community colleges. And whereas we can argue about taxation, the numbers mean very little when you consider that in the past half-century the hourly purchasing power parity of the blue collar working class American was around $50 factoring in health and pension benefits whereas employees at Walmart were noted to make around $8.81 as of 2012.

In addition, a number of state schools are research oriented so professors are far more concerned about the grants and outcomes of their research results rather than whether they have another group of students going below average. Most of them have the same outlook at you on their students. That they're uninspired or are simply taking their class because it is mandatory and consequently a lot of them don't get to know their students unless the students take the initiative to go out and meet them after class. Treating school like a job when it's clearly an overvalued product is something that touches a nerve to me as I like many fellow students put in the 20-40 hours to pay off our tuition and passed our classes to the extent where we qualified for our $40k+ scholarships without which I wouldn't have been able to afford schooling. Yes, I graduated with above a 3.0 and that's all that really mattered to me because if you look at the current landscape it's ridiculous to pay $20k+ in tuition to simply take a "basic" science curriculum of biology, chemistry, physics, and calculus.

Education is a privilege, but please don't expect the classmates sitting next to you to "enjoy" the experience.

 

[StrongIslandDoc]

OMG! I get forgetting to take pills, but actually declaring your laziness and saying it's hard work to take pills? Wow.

I will caution you to avoid passing judgement over patients. Non-compliance/non-adherence is a real issue, and yes, it can be hard work to take medicine you are not fond of taking when you are feeling well. This is an issue that causes relapse disease for people living with chronic illnesses. It's your role to coach them on avoiding the pattern, or identifying what specifically is making it difficult for them to take the meds - dosing schedule, pill size, formulation (liquid/pill/injection). I am one of these patients - I have a chronic illness and the side-effects of the medication suck, and when I'm feeling great its hard to motivate myself to take the medication knowing full well the meds can make me feel like utter ****. Anyway, moral of the story is - your job as a physician will be to lend people your understanding, and when you don't hand understanding to lend, you lend them the respect that you can't understand it but will help them nonetheless - with a smile.

 

[Plastic156600sub3]

Except most students aren't able to treat school like it was a job... because they actually have to work on the side in order to pay for food, gas, and classes. Considering most of the students you're with are likely starting at minimum wage which in my state is around $8.32 unless they've been working there since high school and probably make $8.50 (wow) they likely are spending a majority of their time making sure they have the means to attend class which isn't an "amazing privilege" even with their parents paying their tuition.

It may be true that many students who attend college straight out of high school have jobs now. That certainly isn't anything new. Most people, prior to federal student loans had no opportunity whatsoever to attend.
I would consider that a cop out and really a very poor excuse for lack of motivation. I went to college fresh out of high school. I worked a job. I also worked my butt off in college. It's all work ethic and self motivation. I've worked more than one job at once, long hours of manual labor and night shift. Pay rate means nothing. It's a source of pride to be able to work. I'm not sure how this really fits in the nontrad forum. Most of us chose different careers and are working FT in said career while attending class.

I'm not sure how mommy and daddy paying tuition isn't an "amazing privilege". If you don't feel like college is your calling, you shouldn't be there. Period. We can't self-victimize because of our own poor choices, essentially laying the blame on others. That student needs to cut the cord and figure out what they want from the real world. College isn't high school 2.

 

[Sardinia]

It may be true that many students who attend college straight out of high school have jobs now. That certainly isn't anything new. Most people, prior to federal student loans had no opportunity whatsoever to attend.
I would consider that a cop out and really a very poor excuse for lack of motivation. I went to college fresh out of high school. I worked a job. I also worked my butt off in college. It's all work ethic and self motivation. I've worked more than one job at once, long hours of manual labor and night shift. Pay rate means nothing. It's a source of pride to be able to work. I'm not sure how this really fits in the nontrad forum. Most of us chose different careers and are working FT in said career while attending class.
I'm not sure how mommy and daddy paying tuition isn't an "amazing privilege". If you don't feel like college is your calling, you shouldn't be there. Period. We can't self-victimize because of our own poor choices, essentially laying the blame on others. That student needs to cut the cord and figure out what they want from the real world. College isn't high school 2.

It becomes relatively clear to anyone who is cognizant that the matriculant sGPA for medical schools is around a 3.8 unless you're looking at DO options for grade replacement that the game is rigged for those who are better off and have time to study or do healthcare ECs. If you truly had to work to make ends meet and not do it as a point of pride, then it becomes very understandable that the entire undergraduate process is unnecessarily drawn out and is frankly an overglorified weeding out process that gives medical schools the ability to make an educated decision from a list of very competent candidates, whereas the candidates are trading their earning potential for having a chance to apply.

Having someone else foot the bill on your tuition is an amazing privilege, however if you work full time to be able to commute and feed yourself then you are footing the portion of the bill. Being a student takes away the most desirable asset we all share as human beings which is to have the time to adapt and make chances to improve our financial situation. If you value sitting in a classroom listening to a professor teach you something you will honestly spend teaching yourself to actually be worth the $1800 sticker tag then I honestly can't have a discussion on this topic.

 

[DrDarce]

I should have probably toned this down before posting. Color me abashed.

Going back to lower level pre-reqs as a nontrad can be a little annoying, though. It seems to me that the majority of students that I encounter are just there to fulfill a requirement for their degree and aren't at all interested in actually learning. It's kind of a sad state of affairs when our young are going into huge amounts of debt and viewing college as a necessary evil instead of an amazing privilege that their job is to just LEARN!

100% agree. It's a trend I saw throughout undergrad. The problem is that for the majority of kids getting out of high school they are told they HAVE to go to college in order to get a good job. While this is probably true, it forces them to choose majors that will get them a stable job and a lot of the time it's in a field they have 0 interest in whatsoever. As a result they are in class and actively NOT learning and these are the kids who constantly ask what's going to be on the test, and trying to "memorize" formulas instead of understanding them. They used to annoy the crap out of me too, because I was generally interested in what I was learning (for the most part).

 

[QofQuimica]

OP, as others have already pointed out, the world is rife with lazy people, and many of them will be your colleagues and patients. I look at it this way: the reason why I have such good job security is because of stupid people making stupid decisions. In fact, I'm still slightly amazed that I get paid a six figure salary to try to deal with the aftermath of other people's poor choices. I used to feel like you do about it. But now it all rolls off me and I'm pretty libertarian about the whole thing. Trust me when I tell you that other people's laziness and stupidity becomes much less bothersome when that attending paycheck hits your bank account every other week.

 

[DrDarce]

@SSnows123 Except most students aren't able to treat school like it was a job... because they actually have to work on the side in order to pay for food, gas, and classes. Considering most of the students you're with are likely starting at minimum wage which in my state is around $8.32 unless they've been working there since high school and probably make $8.50 (wow) they likely are spending a majority of their time making sure they have the means to attend class which isn't an "amazing privilege" even with their parents paying their tuition.

Undergraduate colleges exist to soak money from students. There's no breakdown for why a four credit class at a four year University should cost around $1800 whereas a similar cost at a community college is around $600. To someone who is earning close to minimum wage, the cost of higher education makes absolutely no sense and is an expense that seems created in order to preserve the wealth gap, rather than to assist in closing it. This can be an arguable topic, however what is not debatable is the fact that tuition rates in the United States have skyrocketed exponentially and there are still other countries where tuition is free or a third of the price of our community colleges. And whereas we can argue about taxation, the numbers mean very little when you consider that in the past half-century the hourly purchasing power parity of the blue collar working class American was around $50 factoring in health and pension benefits whereas employees at Walmart were noted to make around $8.81 as of 2012.

In addition, a number of state schools are research oriented so professors are far more concerned about the grants and outcomes of their research results rather than whether they have another group of students going below average. Most of them have the same outlook at you on their students. That they're uninspired or are simply taking their class because it is mandatory and consequently a lot of them don't get to know their students unless the students take the initiative to go out and meet them after class. Treating school like a job when it's clearly an overvalued product is something that touches a nerve to me as I like many fellow students put in the 20-40 hours to pay off our tuition and passed our classes to the extent where we qualified for our $40k+ scholarships without which I wouldn't have been able to afford schooling. Yes, I graduated with above a 3.0 and that's all that really mattered to me because if you look at the current landscape it's ridiculous to pay $20k+ in tuition to simply take a "basic" science curriculum of biology, chemistry, physics, and calculus.

Education is a privilege, but please don't expect the classmates sitting next to you to "enjoy" the experience.

Who says they can't treat school like a job? You? Just because students have to work to make a living in addition to school (which isn't everyone) doesn't necessarily mean they are going to be lazy. I worked 2 jobs all throughout undergrad because I was basically on my own and I did fine in undergrad. Not sure how you came to the conclusion that "most" students are working minimum wage to make ends meet. Most of the lazier students I knew didn't have a job, they were just lazy and uninterested.

 

[Sardinia]

@StrongIslandDoc Had this issue with my grandparent who would avoid taking her calcium channel blockers because they would make her feel drowsy. It made her feel like she couldn't do anything for the rest of the day after she took it. Another issue was when they avoided going back to buy her Exforge HCT due to the high copay because it wasn't covered by their prescription insurance until I broke it down to just being three generics. Then they had difficulty being consistent with the three generics. Relapse disease is a common issue for people with chronic diseases and it's a shame that most people who don't suffer from it are aware of how difficult it is to be consistent with medications.

 

[Sardinia]

Who says they can't treat school like a job? You? Just because students have to work to make a living in addition to school (which isn't everyone) doesn't necessarily mean they are going to be lazy. I worked 2 jobs all throughout undergrad because I was basically on my own and I did fine in undergrad. Not sure how you came to the conclusion that "most" students are working minimum wage to make ends meet. Most of the lazier students I knew didn't have a job, they were just lazy and uninterested.

Why two jobs. Why not work eight jobs for one hour each. Would make your resume stretch to the bottom of the page.

 

[StrongIslandDoc]

@StrongIslandDoc Had this issue with my grandparent who would avoid taking her calcium channel blockers because they would make her feel drowsy. It made her feel like she couldn't do anything for the rest of the day after she took it. Another issue was when they avoided going back to buy her Exforge HCT due to the high copay because it wasn't covered by their prescription insurance until I broke it down to just being three generics. Then they had difficulty being consistent with the three generics. Relapse disease is a common issue for people with chronic diseases and it's a shame that most people who don't suffer from it aren't aware of how difficult it is to be consistent with medications.

ftfy ;-)

 

[DrDarce]

Why two jobs. Why not work eight jobs for one hour each. Would make your resume stretch to the bottom of the page.

Well one job was for experience but didn't pay well/ have enough hours and the other job was so I could make real money and afford to live. And you still haven't explained how your argument in your original post makes any sense whatsoever.

 

[CyrilFiggis]

Whatever bad day @Sardinia was having, @SSnows123 's post really helped them reach the boil-over point.

 

[Plastic156600sub3]

Why two jobs. Why not work eight jobs for one hour each. Would make your resume stretch to the bottom of the page.

We can all thank Obamacare for that.

 

[Plastic156600sub3]

It becomes relatively clear to anyone who is cognizant that the matriculant sGPA for medical schools is around a 3.8 unless you're looking at DO options for grade replacement that the game is rigged for those who are better off and have time to study or do healthcare ECs. If you truly had to work to make ends meet and not do it as a point of pride, then it becomes very understandable that the entire undergraduate process is unnecessarily drawn out and is frankly an overglorified weeding out process that gives medical schools the ability to make an educated decision from a list of very competent candidates, whereas the candidates are trading their earning potential for having a chance to apply.

Having someone else foot the bill on your tuition is an amazing privilege, however if you work full time to be able to commute and feed yourself then you are footing the portion of the bill. Being a student takes away the most desirable asset we all share as human beings which is to have the time to adapt and make chances to improve our financial situation. If you value sitting in a classroom listening to a professor teach you something you will honestly spend teaching yourself to actually be worth the $1800 sticker tag then I honestly can't have a discussion on this topic.

If you're trying to convey that the system is a set of elaborate, obnoxious hoops for the people who don't belong to the Club and don't know the secret handshake, you're right. I'm not considered a minority, so it makes it difficult as well.

My family wasn't wealthy. I come from a dusty coal mining town. Work is something to be proud to have. I know so many people without.

 

[SSnows123]

@SSnows123 I think it's amazing you are able to accurately assess and categorize the IQ,

I was venting out of frustration so my words should be taken with a grain of salt. I'm referring to people who CLEARLY don't want to put in the work but still expect help. Personally, I would much rather work with a hard working person of less than average intelligence to a lazy, moderately intelligent person. Why do people expect others to help them when they won't help themselves?

The pre-allo thread is a perfect example: "Secondary says "why do you want to be a doctor?" What should I write?"

As for education not being a privledge we can go ahead and agree to disagree. There are women all over the world who will never see a classroom. There are people here in the US who just won't ever have the time or means to study. The small percentage of people who have enough time and means to take time off work and just sit in a classroom and LEARN should feel fortunate, especially those who have someone bankrolling their education but also those who pay for it themselves.

 

[Ad2b]

LOL.. It gets worse every year. Hang around SDN long enough and you'll see people who post things so ridiculous that they are just plain too lazy to Google and read

So, what materials do you think are the best for the MCAT? I've heard x-y-z is good but am not sure if I should buy them or whatever. Also, do you know if there is a schedule we can use to tweak out there on dat innnerwebs so that I can know how much to study every day? And also, do you know if the AAMC materials are good or not? Should I use them?

PLEASE HELP!!! I'm 18 months from the MCAT and feel soooooooooooooooooo confused.

 

[SSnows123]

The problem is that for the majority of kids getting out of high school they are told they HAVE to go to college in order to get a good job.

This. The majority who I meet view college as just something that everyone does after high school. Chemistry class isn't the opportunity to just learn something cool for learning's sake but rather something that must be survived. I don't know. Paying $1000 per class, you would expect people to want to get something, even something as basic as a superficial understanding of elementary chemistry, for their money.

 

[DrMikeP]

This. The majority who I meet view college as just something that everyone does after high school. Chemistry class isn't the opportunity to just learn something cool for learning's sake but rather something that must be survived. I don't know. Paying $1000 per class, you would expect people to want to get something, even something as basic as a superficial understanding of elementary chemistry, for their money.

But many young people are not paying $1000 per class. They are getting grants and loans (loans are viewed just like mom and dad giving them money) and just look at college as getting away from the parents and having friends to party with like in high school. They have no real skin in the game so why play to win. Saw it often as a professor and as a student.

Part of coping with people who for various reasons, whether it's unmotivated or just plain lazy is venting about it. That's why many students often incorrectly think drs are mean or cynical when the doc is just blowing off some steam so he can walk in to the next room and be empathic when treating a kid with head lice for the 5th time because mom doesn't see the need to clean the bedding and pick the nits out of the kid's hair or the dr has to call an insurance company back and waste 30 min because someone was too lazy to read the second page of a precertification form and refused tx for a cancer patient because information was missing. If you don't find a healthy way to vent as a dr you will burn out and regret ever going into medicine and even if you do some days you will.

 

[Goro]

Bu the lazies don't survive very long as med students. Boards will finish them off, if classes don't.

You are in for a treat once you're in medical school, my friend. I feel you. Also, the "lazies" tend to make a reappearance as not only your patients, but your colleagues as well. So much to look forward to...

 

[Goro]

Indeed. College has ruined many a good truck driver.

This. The majority who I meet view college as just something that everyone does after high school. Chemistry class isn't the opportunity to just learn something cool for learning's sake but rather something that must be survived. I don't know. Paying $1000 per class, you would expect people to want to get something, even something as basic as a superficial understanding of elementary chemistry, for their money.

 

[Ad2b]

If you don't find a healthy way to vent as a dr you will burn out and regret ever going into medicine and even if you do some days you will.

I could not understand this aspect of physicians - how they could joke about "stuff" ... until I dated (and almost married) one. Through him, I saw the carnage that he often had to work through, the permanent smile he had one with all of his patients and the public itself; in private, he was not brooding but omgosh, the @#$ that would come out of his mouth after a long, draining day (COPD on DNR with family battling him to do all that was required to keep the patient alive coupled with 100 kids with nits, etc).

Eventually, quite quickly, I learned to just listen and not judge him. Listen to what he'd had to deal and cope with - most days very easy - but on the ones that were gut wrenching he vented; oft time through humor not welcome on most forums 😉

I saw him go from dead asleep to carnage on the interstate where some drunk that had been tagged 5+ times killed a mother and her child. Head on. Because of the small community, he knew both of them AND the driver.

So he vented. I listened. A lot. And got a very good peak into the world of being a doctor on the side that not even shadowing can show.

 

[CyrilFiggis]

But many young people are not paying $1000 per class. They are getting grants and loans (loans are viewed just like mom and dad giving them money) and just look at college as getting away from the parents and having friends to party with like in high school. They have no real skin in the game so why play to win. Saw it often as a professor and as a student.

Part of coping with people who for various reasons, whether it's unmotivated or just plain lazy is venting about it. That's why many students often incorrectly think drs are mean or cynical when the doc is just blowing off some steam so he can walk in to the next room and be empathic when treating a kid with head lice for the 5th time because mom doesn't see the need to clean the bedding and pick the nits out of the kid's hair or the dr has to call an insurance company back and waste 30 min because someone was too lazy to read the second page of a precertification form and refused tx for a cancer patient because information was missing. If you don't find a healthy way to vent as a dr you will burn out and regret ever going into medicine and even if you do some days you will.

My entire education was subsidized, debt-free and with no cost incurred to my parents.... and I squandered it - at least in the eyes of what my GPA reflected. Without skin in the game it wasn't about the means, but the ends. I got a piece of paper with my name on it and within 4 weeks of graduating, had an entry-level career starting job. When I went back to do my post-bacc, that came at a price tag of $1,500/credit. I did the math and realized that was $150/hour of class time. I became a 3.9 student (OChem is a cruel mistress). Some people are naturally motivated, others find their motivation.

As for venting, I volunteered for two years, 10pm-2am in the busiest Level 1 trauma center in the country. Being the same age as the residents, I got to know many of them socially. They are some of the kindest, most empathetic people I've met. But when you have 6 TTAs in 4 hours and no one survives, you need to vent. You need to find a release. I know that just reiterates what DrMike said, but it's worth repeating. We're human. If we can't bitch and moan into the abyss of anonymous message boards without judgement, where can we?

 

[trev5150]

Was I this annoying when I was 20-22? If so, I apologize to humanity!

You might have been annoying for different reasons

I keed, I keed.

 

[DrMikeP]

My entire education was subsidized, debt-free and with no cost incurred to my parents.... and I squandered it - at least in the eyes of what my GPA reflected. Without skin in the game it wasn't about the means, but the ends. I got a piece of paper with my name on it and within 4 weeks of graduating, had an entry-level career starting job. When I went back to do my post-bacc, that came at a price tag of $1,500/credit. I did the math and realized that was $150/hour of class time. I became a 3.9 student (OChem is a cruel mistress). Some people are naturally motivated, others find their motivation.

As for venting, I volunteered for two years, 10pm-2am in the busiest Level 1 trauma center in the country. Being the same age as the residents, I got to know many of them socially. They are some of the kindest, most empathetic people I've met. But when you have 6 TTAs in 4 hours and no one survives, you need to vent. You need to find a release.

Amen.. One of the worse consults I was ever called on involved a 3 yo who drowned and was resuscitated after what the parents said was 5 min but it was longer. The kid was dead the moment he was wheeled in and everyone but the parents knew it. The peds ER docs did what they could and transferred him to PICU where he was on every life supporting thing possible. The young parents begged the doctors to do anything to save their child, not much worse that having a 21 yo couple crying on each shoulder over their child and them not understanding that sometimes medicine can't fix everything. The family felt super guilty over the drowning so that made it worse. After 3 days and the child's organs were completely shutting down so drs had the 3rd meeting with the family to discuss how the child was brain dead and there just was nothing more they could do. By that point everyone in the PICU was exhausted and the emotional investment in the child by everyone involved was tremendous. The family finally decided to let nature take it's course. Even at that the drs still had many pts to care for and couldn't just stop and grieve with and support just that family, they had to keep going and put on the happy face for every other patient there. It's easy to criticize someone's venting or twisted sense of humor until you've been in their shoes.

 

[trev5150]

It's like a lot of problems: there really isn't more of it, it's the same percentage, there's just more people with the same chances of being useless.

 

[MountainManMike]

Breathe! Once you're in med school, you'll be amongst "your people."

All of high school they told us that college would be hard and that professors wouldn't slow down lectures for students or cater to the weakest links. This thread gives me hope. Nothing against the weak links, just against the INTENTIONAL weak links.

 

[MountainManMike]

My entire education was subsidized, debt-free and with no cost incurred to my parents.... and I squandered it - at least in the eyes of what my GPA reflected. Without skin in the game it wasn't about the means, but the ends. I got a piece of paper with my name on it and within 4 weeks of graduating, had an entry-level career starting job. When I went back to do my post-bacc, that came at a price tag of $1,500/credit. I did the math and realized that was $150/hour of class time. I became a 3.9 student (OChem is a cruel mistress). Some people are naturally motivated, others find their motivation.

As for venting, I volunteered for two years, 10pm-2am in the busiest Level 1 trauma center in the country. Being the same age as the residents, I got to know many of them socially. They are some of the kindest, most empathetic people I've met. But when you have 6 TTAs in 4 hours and no one survives, you need to vent. You need to find a release. I know that just reiterates what DrMike said, but it's worth repeating. We're human. If we can't bitch and moan into the abyss of anonymous message boards without judgement, where can we?

I lost all of my scholarships last year and now I'm having to use my own money to pay for college in the fall. Calculating the price of classes, I cannot believe I wasted all of that money by choosing to not go to class, or doing whatever else while the class was going on. When my parents flat out said, "you wasted your scholarships, you're making money at your job, you're gonna have to pay for it yourself, we'll help with med school when you get there" it occurred to me that I absolutely have to make the best grades possible since I'm having to dish out roughly $3500 a quarter for classes and take out student loans. If more people had to pay for their own school, they wouldn't waste it.