I don't see the difference between MD's and DO's

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rls303

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Hi everyone,
I just want to say before I continue this post, that I am not trying to offend anyone on either side (no MD's or DO's). I'm not trying to instigate anything at all. I am just having a rough time writing my secondaries for DO schools.

Due to personal circumstances, I have decided to pursue my applications further in spite of my flaws ( I am re-taking the MCAT in Jan). I do not wish to take a year off after I graduate this upcoming June. Thus, I'm really trying to explore every route available to become a physician. I don't care what school I get into nor what initials are after my name just as long as I can be a doctor one day.

I have had the pleasure of volunteering at an urgent care with Family Practice Physicians. There was one DO doctor and MD doctor, both of whom I got to work closely with. I tried to observe the differences in treatment between the two, and I didn't see any at all. They both showed the same dedication, followed the same protocols, and had excellent clinical skills.

Granted that I haven't shadowed more DO's, would I really see a difference? I understand OMM and actually agree with it a lot. But in all honesty, I don't see that approach being used by the DO I am shadowing.

Which brings me to my question. I know I'm pretty late in the game for sending out secondaries, but I still want to put myself out there. I just want to be a family practitioner physician at the end of the day. I don't have a specific reason for choosing an Osteopathic School vs. Allopathic school. Because I just want to be a doctor. For my secondary, would it be okay to put that I don't see a difference and just am just applying to fulfill my goal? Or should I BS some answer (which I'm not used to doing) about how OMM is what I agree with and how I am passionate about it (which would not make sense then, because if I was so passionate about OMM, why would I be applying to allopathic as well?) I want to go with the latter, but I just don't want my secondary answer to emanate the view that people think DO's are inferior or they don't know as much as MD's.

I want to reiterate so as to not upset anyone on here. I don't care if I'm an MD or DO, I just want to go to a Medical School. I am not using DO as a back up for MD. If accepted to a DO school and MD school, I would give both equal consideration and look at what works well for me financially and socially.

Thanks for any tips! 🙂
 
You don't need to BS a difference. I never even mentioned DO in my essay. My essay was about becoming a physician, not about becoming a medical degree.
 
The way I see it is that you'll have to learn OMM and many question if OMM is a valid form of treatment and if it is truly scientific. If you believe it is and you have an interest in learning it, you should highlight that in your essay, but I don't see any problem with mentioning that your ultimate goal is to become a physician regardless of what letters are after your name. I think they basically want to know if you are applying just as a backup or it is a degree you're seriously considering.
 
rls303 said:
Hi everyone,
I just want to say before I continue this post, that I am not trying to offend anyone on either side (no MD's or DO's). I'm not trying to instigate anything at all. I am just having a rough time writing my secondaries for DO schools.

Due to personal circumstances, I have decided to pursue my applications further in spite of my flaws ( I am re-taking the MCAT in Jan). I do not wish to take a year off after I graduate this upcoming June. Thus, I'm really trying to explore every route available to become a physician. I don't care what school I get into nor what initials are after my name just as long as I can be a doctor one day.

I have had the pleasure of volunteering at an urgent care with Family Practice Physicians. There was one DO doctor and MD doctor, both of whom I got to work closely with. I tried to observe the differences in treatment between the two, and I didn't see any at all. They both showed the same dedication, followed the same protocols, and had excellent clinical skills.

Granted that I haven't shadowed more DO's, would I really see a difference? I understand OMM and actually agree with it a lot. But in all honesty, I don't see that approach being used by the DO I am shadowing.

Which brings me to my question. I know I'm pretty late in the game for sending out secondaries, but I still want to put myself out there. I just want to be a family practitioner physician at the end of the day. I don't have a specific reason for choosing an Osteopathic School vs. Allopathic school. Because I just want to be a doctor. For my secondary, would it be okay to put that I don't see a difference and just am just applying to fulfill my goal? Or should I BS some answer (which I'm not used to doing) about how OMM is what I agree with and how I am passionate about it (which would not make sense then, because if I was so passionate about OMM, why would I be applying to allopathic as well?) I want to go with the latter, but I just don't want my secondary answer to emanate the view that people think DO's are inferior or they don't know as much as MD's.

I want to reiterate so as to not upset anyone on here. I don't care if I'm an MD or DO, I just want to go to a Medical School. I am not using DO as a back up for MD. If accepted to a DO school and MD school, I would give both equal consideration and look at what works well for me financially and socially.

Thanks for any tips! 🙂
Click to expand...


If during your interview you are asked directly about your interest in osteopathy or OMM, your response can't be that you are completely uninterested in it. That answer just won't fly (even if it's the truth). You have to "BS" somewhat. Just give them the generic answer of how you're interested in "having another tool, in your toolbelt for treating patients (i.e. OMM)". That's pretty much what everyone says....

I was like you. I hated having to BS stuff for secondaries, and having to tell people what they wanted to hear for interviews..... but you just have to do it. The whole premed/med school process is filled with hoops that you just have to jump through...
 
Flaming hoops. One after another. The flames are what comprise the light at the end of the tunnel.
 
You dont see a difference because for all intents and purposes there is zero difference these days. Will I try OMM from time to time if there is an indication? Sure why not...but I doubt id bill a patient for that. I think thats the stand a lot of modern DOs take. We just had a professor here @ PCOM talking about how great rib raising is for an ileus. He claims it restores motility pretty much instantly. Would I try something like that? Absolutely. If it didnt work after the first few times I would probably stop trying.

The only docs who are totally different are the OMM gurus....ie the guys that run the OMM dept at DO schools.
 
The Personal Essay should be about "why medicine" and leave the interview for "why osteopathic medicine".

"I don't care what school I get into nor what initials are after my name just as long as I can be a doctor one day."

would it be okay to put that I don't see a difference and just am just applying to fulfill my goal? (Do not do this)

Warning to the OP and other readers: be careful with these sorts of attitudes in front of adcoms. You may or may not come off as ignorant towards osteopathic medicine, which is bad. After reading your post, you seem passionate about medicine but you need to think about why osteopathic would be a good match for you. you said you want to do family medicine so maybe talk about how osteopathic philosophy and educatino produces so many primary care docs. Talk about OMM. It's a unique and personal form of healing.
 
I should add that I also didn't cater to this BS line about OMM, or the osteopathic philosophy, or any of that nonsense, in my interview. The closest I came to acknowledging a distinction was telling them that I was drawn to the field by the unique compassion of one of the physician's I came across. It so happened he was a DO and subsequently became my mentor and that's how I learned about the existence of osteopathic medical schools.

I even went so far as to tell them I didn't really even see a distinction between the two. It's just that my experience with a DO was so positive that it broadened my horizons and made me aware of both paths to becoming a physician.

In other words, I pointed out the qualities I admired in a physician and let them play whatever mental gymnastics they chose to play with themselves with respect to DO vs MD.

Why am I recommending this approach vs the tired-ass line of OMM worship and whole-person philosophy? Because the latter is BS. It's drivel. If you want to continue to push DOs into the mainstream in both self-identity AND public perception, then we need to take the initiative to start rejecting these contrived differences. The old guard of DO stalwarts are entering senility, and it's time for the new guard to step up and be physicians FIRST. We're not manipulators, we don't ****ing treat the whole body, whatever that means. We practice medicine. MDs and DOs practice identical medicine. Let's start acting as such.
 
sideways said:
Why am I recommending this approach vs the tired-ass line of OMM worship and whole-person philosophy? Because the latter is BS. It's drivel. If you want to continue to push DOs into the mainstream in both self-identity AND public perception, then we need to take the initiative to start rejecting these contrived differences. The old guard of DO stalwarts are entering senility, and it's time for the new guard to step up and be physicians FIRST. We're not manipulators, we don't ****ing treat the whole body, whatever that means. We practice medicine. MDs and DOs practice identical medicine. Let's start acting as such.
Click to expand...

You are aware that what you are recommending will never happen. There are professors, students, and D.O.'s out there that truly buy into the D.O. "whole-person" philosophy and actually do believe that OMM works.
 
I have yet to mention OMM in an interview. I speak instead to how the holistic philosophy and belief that the body is a self-correcting system works well with my own ideologies about how medicine should be approached (i.e. a drive toward the primary care model). DO is more than OMM.

My essay was about my reasons for wanting to become a physician and was the same essay for both AMCAS and AACOMAS.
 
I talked about the culture of DO physicians, and that seemed to go over well with my interviews.
 
Postal said:
You are aware that what you are recommending will never happen. There are professors, students, and D.O.'s out there that truly buy into the D.O. "whole-person" philosophy and actually do believe that OMM works.
Click to expand...

It will happen eventually. The only reason things are the way they are, is because of all the old heads in the AOA. The overwhelming majority of DOs practice the same medicine as MDs and dont really identify themselves as being different. I personally love the holistic idea and think OMM definitely has its benefits in some areas of treatment....but its time for DOs and MDs to merge fully and stop pretending there is some insane distinction. That being said; I love my school and 100 percent stand by my decision to go there. I think the education is great, but I can definitely feel that the school sort of has a "the rest of the school...and then the OMM dept" sort of feel. Its not the 1890s anymore. MDs arent prescribing calomel anymore and its time for some change.
 
I'm a DO student, I didnt mention osteopathic medicine in my essay, but did talk about it in my interview. I believe most schools actually prefer aplicants who apply to both. just be honest, you dont have to pretend OMM is the best thing since antibiotics, just dont trash it either. some OMM is unscientific and is probobly no more than a placebo. Some is very effective. Saying it is all ineffective is an idiotic statement. the reason most dont use it is because it takes time and you dont get paid extra for it. and those who dont do an osteopathic residency likely dont learn to incorporate it into their practice.
 
ProtossCarrier said:
MD and DO are supposedly separate but equal.
Click to expand...

According to a perfectly scientific, well researched forbes article 🙄

I was wondering how long it would take for someone to use that piece (pun intended) as some sort of happily internalized quip.
 
OP ... you don't have to show up to your interview wearing an 'I heart A.T.' t-shirt and proclaim that you want to practice OMM exclusively, but honestly ... I'd at least be able to explain 'why our school,' with a little bit of conviction. There are plenty of people who apply both simply because they want to be a physician and are wise enough to explore both parallel paths. These guys made it, and many of them are at DO schools. If I were you, I'd focus a lot (convincingly) on why you want to go into medicine, and then if asked 'why our school,' or 'why DO,' you can integrate the 'I want to be a physician,' with the DO mantra of training FP docs, or practicing a 'whole person approach,' to convey to the admins that you aren't using the school as a backup.

As a funny aside ... I interviewed at a DO school last season with a guy (didn't know him before, just at the interview the same day) who openly told everyone he only applied to the one DO school (local), didn't really care to go DO, was amped for upcoming MD interviews, etc. In the middle of the campus tour, we go through the OMM lab and the guy blatantly raises his hand and asks 'wait, so ... like, what is OMM?' The tour guide was honestly really taken back and could barely even muster much of a response. I'm sure the guy had great stats, etc, but his motives probably shined through in the interview ... don't be that guy.
 
As such:

Pu2T1.jpg
 
I also never mentioned OMM in my applications. When asked, I said I had worked with good DOs and bad DOs, good MDs and bad MDs and that the initials behind my name didn't make me a better or worse physician. I was looking for a school to make me the best physician I could be. I was looking for a fit.

I got in to several schools with that honesty.
 
I just wanted to thank everyone for all the valuable replies! 🙂

I am set on pursuing these applications and I'm just contemplating how to word those secondaries. I think OMM is pretty cool and agree with it for the most part (honestly, I do to a certain degree of course).

We'll see how it goes and I will keep you guys posted. I don't want to sound clueless. Rest assured that I am genuinely considering DO schools not just as a backup

Have a GREAT weekend guys! 😀
 
rls303 said:
I just wanted to thank everyone for all the valuable replies! 🙂

I am set on pursuing these applications and I'm just contemplating how to word those secondaries. I think OMM is pretty cool and agree with it for the most part (honestly, I do to a certain degree of course).

We'll see how it goes and I will keep you guys posted. I don't want to sound clueless. Rest assured that I am genuinely considering DO schools not just as a backup

Have a GREAT weekend guys! 😀
Click to expand...

Make sure to ask questions about OMM here if you're confused at all. Granted, you don't have to understand the techniques or anything, but you want to be informed if you are going to bring it up. I know for a fact that one of our OMM instructures (who is BC in NMM/OMM) is an interviewer at my school, and if you got someone like him and then used OMM as a buzzword, but couldn't really discuss it any further, you might be in a bit of trouble.
 
JaggerPlate said:
Make sure to ask questions about OMM here if you're confused at all. Granted, you don't have to understand the techniques or anything, but you want to be informed if you are going to bring it up. I know for a fact that one of our OMM instructures (who is BC in NMM/OMM) is an interviewer at my school, and if you got someone like him and then used OMM as a buzzword, but couldn't really discuss it any further, you might be in a bit of trouble.
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Don't you just slap people around and bill them for it?
 
MDs practice medicine for a living and DOs massage people for a living. Some are even known to give you a happy ending. 😉
 
ILikeDrugs said:
MDs practice medicine for a living and DOs massage people for a living. Some are even known to give you a happy ending. 😉
Click to expand...

Uhh really? Wow. This forum stoops to a new low every time I log on. Which is probably why thats thankfully only like once a week now.
 
I mostly mentioned my interest in Primary care and how I felt learning OMM would help me to better treat my patients and provide an alternative option to prescription meds.
 
ILikeDrugs said:
MDs practice medicine for a living and DOs massage people for a living. Some are even known to give you a happy ending. 😉
Click to expand...

I think this deserved a re-post here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humayun_Chaudhry

Humayun Chaudry D.O. Graduate of NYCOM- President and CEO of the Federation of state medical boards (which is also in charge of the USMLE and MD licensure)

Major- US Air Force,Major and serving as a Flight Surgeon with the 732nd Airlift Squadron and as the Medical Operations Flight Commander for the 514th Aeromedical Staging Squadron (ASTS) of the 514th Air Mobility Wing

Former Commissioner of health for Suffolk County, NY

Voting member of the USMLE Composite committee

He is one of the most powerful Doctors in the United States below the surgeon general, controls the USMLE, Controls all of the state medical boards and licensures in the U.S., BTW his position also makes him in charge of all Doctors MD and DO in the U.S., and he is a DO from NYCOM
 
NYEMMED said:
He is one of the most powerful Doctors in the United States below the surgeon general, controls the USMLE, Controls all of the state medical boards and licensures in the U.S., BTW his position also makes him in charge of all Doctors MD and DO in the U.S., and he is a DO from NYCOM
Click to expand...

Umm, the FSMB does not "control" the state medical boards, however amusing that thought is. If you would like to see the Federation's self-described mission and goals check here.

The USMLE is a collaborative effort between the FSMB and the NBME, so the Federation doesn't exactly "control" that, either.

Dr. Chaudhry does appear to be the head of the executive staff of the FSMB, but the Chair of the BOD is someone named Freda Bush, MD.
 
This thread definitely has that awkward mix of confusion, anxiety, sarcasm, and misguided anger that really defines SDN as a horrible whole.
 
JaggerPlate said:
This thread definitely has that awkward mix of confusion, anxiety, sarcasm, and misguided anger that really defines SDN as a horrible whole.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I don't think people got ILikeDrugs' humor/sarcasm, which I thought was pretty funny, personally.
 
Longshanks said:
Yeah, I don't think people got ILikeDrugs' humor/sarcasm, which I thought was pretty funny, personally.
Click to expand...

Hahaha, me too. I thought it was pretty obvious sarcasm too ... not the kind of joking that could potentially confuse some pre-med searching the site down the road. Oh well ... welcome to SDN.
 
Longshanks said:
Yeah, I don't think people got ILikeDrugs' humor/sarcasm, which I thought was pretty funny, personally.
Click to expand...

What did you find funny? ILikeDrug's original post or the fact that people thought he was serious and posted detailed responses to it? I like the latter.
 
LastPolarBear said:
What did you find funny? ILikeDrug's original post or the fact that people thought he was serious and posted detailed responses to it? I like the latter.
Click to expand...

PolarBear! Haven't seen you in forever, I think maybe our MCAT day thread. I hope things are going well.

LOL - both are funny, but the latter is even more ridiculous.
 
The only difference I've SEEN between MD and DO is the +\-200 extra hours in medical school learning OMT for a DO. I've HEARD differences beyond that, but they tend to be subjective opinions about philosophy. I feel these subjective differences are primarily significant on a personal level and liable to change and differ. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Ps. Where do I get a 'A.T. Still is my homeboy' shirt?
 
Longshanks said:
PolarBear! Haven't seen you in forever, I think maybe our MCAT day thread. I hope things are going well.

LOL - both are funny, but the latter is even more ridiculous.
Click to expand...

Yeah brother, I've been on and off this forum for a while. MCAT didn't go as well as I wished, so I picked up those TBR books to see what it's all about.
 
LastPolarBear said:
Yeah brother, I've been on and off this forum for a while. MCAT didn't go as well as I wished, so I picked up those TBR books to see what it's all about.
Click to expand...

Good luck! I feel TBR helped me out a lot when I retook. You'll do fine this time around.
 
In the end, it all comes down to who will win in a fight? MD or DO? READY! FIGHT!
 
Postal said:
You are aware that what you are recommending will never happen. There are professors, students, and D.O.'s out there that truly buy into the D.O. "whole-person" philosophy and actually do believe that OMM works.
Click to expand...

Go ahead and leave the "actually believe OMM works" thing until AFTER you have some OMM experience.

Have I totally drank the KoolAid? No. But, if you want to be logical / evidence based, how can you possibly discount OMM in its entirety if you can't even name or perform a single technique?
 
Charlie Kelly said:
In the end, it all comes down to who will win in a fight? MD or DO? READY! FIGHT!
Click to expand...

AFAIK, we had a inter-school "track and field" day between some SoCal medical schools (all MD except us). I think COMP took first place in a few sports and just barely lost out on first place in Volleyball.

Just sayin'.
 
DO probably has self rejuvenation abilities through OMM. Also the death grip, if they can get close enough to an MD. An MD have a higher tendency to specialize in procedural areas so they'll be good with bladed weapons. So MD with scalpel vs. DO with fists of fury...hmmm hard to say. Toss up if you ask me. I'll have to run it through a simulation program to see all the possible outcomes. Big question is whether they are allowed to use magic or not.
 
Charlie Kelly said:
DO probably has self rejuvenation abilities through OMM. Also the death grip, if they can get close enough to an MD. An MD have a higher tendency to specialize in procedural areas so they'll be good with bladed weapons. So MD with scalpel vs. DO with fists of fury...hmmm hard to say. Toss up if you ask me. I'll have to run it through a simulation program to see all the possible outcomes. Big question is whether they are allowed to use magic or not.
Click to expand...

But.. DOs have "the healing touch." :meanie:

http://www.vgcats.com/comics/images/060529.jpg
 
Maybe if he was wearing Kitten Mittens® or knew anything about bird law.
 
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