ICU elective: what's it like?

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DrDude

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I'm going to be starting an ICU elective. I've never rotated in an ICU before, not even during my internal medicine rotation. What does such an elective generally involve and any advice would be appreciated.

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I have not done a month devoted to ICU but I did spend quite a bit of time in the ICU on IM and Surgery. Typcially you will be writing long notes! However long it took you to write a note on medicine: double it. You have to go into detail about each organ system ranges of pulses, BP's, UOP, NG output etc. etc. These patients usually have multiple organ deficits. Vent settings.

You will probably learn a lot about vent mangament when the pt. should be on SIMV vs. pressure support etc. How to wean them. If you are lucky or with residents you might get to put in some central lines, chest tubes or other procedures under supervision. Get used to talking to ICU nurses. They are usually very knowledgable but very protective of the patients. Probably good to introduce yourself to them before just starting to evaluate an ICU patient. Practice strict sterile and contact precaution procedures with these patients.

Hope that helps..

B-


I'm going to be starting an ICU elective. I've never rotated in an ICU before, not even during my internal medicine rotation. What does such an elective generally involve and any advice would be appreciated.
 
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The 3 things I would definitely know about are vents (settings, weaning, etc.), pressors and inotropes (differences, when to use what, etc.) and what swan numbers mean. There are tons of other things but you really can't make it through an ICU rotation without some basic knowledge of this stuff. Also, be nice to the nurses!! As a rule ICU nurses know about 1000x more than you (and often your resident) and can really help you out. Hope this helps
 
All that was said above, I second. Additionally, it is unique in that most of your patients will be intubated and comatose, so the physical exam definitely takes on a different level of importance as you cannot in most cases get a review of systems. Clearly, the patients are monitored to a great extent and you get most of your critical information from monitors (again, as previously mentioned pay attention to trends and ranges). Trends are huge in the ICU and give you a lot of information.

From a practical standpoint, most patient presentations will be done on a systems-based format...given that almost all of them are experiencing multi-system failure or pathology. I thought this was awesome for learning.

Know your pulmonary pathophysiology, cardiac failure "algorithms," though this will differ by ICU/hospital , and review renal (i.e. indications for emergent dialysis, etc.). This is pimping fodder as well as good practical bits.

It should be a great elective, I often learned more medicine on one patient admission than on the entirety of my floor medicine month...slight exaggeration, but it is a great time to really pull everything together.
 
ICU rotations are really good because you see patients who are very sick, so when you are on the floors and you see a similar patient you know when they might need a higher level of care. You may follow only a few patients, like 1-3, but know EVERYTHING about your patients, i.e. all the meds they are on, what the meds are, what are the adverse events, what all their vitals are and ranges, i.e. Heart Rate 88 t0 133, and the Tmax, i.e. Mr. X spiked a temperature of 101.4 yesterday afternoon, . . . read through the chart a couple times and basically know everything off the top of your head, follow labs and cultures and imaging results very closely, things can change relatively quickly in the ICU so if you are not accostomed to working the ICU you may miss things that happen to your patients, some topics that will be discussed:

1. Management of Ventillator associated pneumoniae
2. SIRS vs. Sepsis Vs. Septic Shock Vs. Multiorgani failure, see survivingsepsis.org
3. Heart Failure
4. Ventillator settings
5. CVP, versus PCWP versus SVo2, alot residents don't even know how to interpret PCWP in the setting of various clinical scenarios, i.e. it is not a straightforward normal or not . . .
6. Renal Failure, when to initiate dialysis, hemodialysis versus other types
7. Hyperglycemia management in the ICU
8. Glasgow coma scale
9. Brain death
10. Differential of Encephalopathy, i.e. anoxic, drugs, . . .
11. Lung Cancer, pulmonary hypertension, Pulmonary function tests
12. Cardiogenic shock versus toxigenic shock, versus septic shock vs. neurogenic shock
13. EKGs, MI, unstable angina,



I would take a look at Marino's ICU book at the following topics briefly, Good Luck!
 
If there isn't more input in this thread I'll try to copy and paste one of my ICU lectures (from my Treo) into this thread...plus a brief primer on vents and Swans if I can find it.

I also have a sample ICU note - broken down by systems, of course.

I'm at the airport now, so can't do it yet. 🙂
 
I'll second what everyone here is saying, but also add in for students to not be afraid of the ICU. My time in the ICU during my medicine rotation was like a blessing from heaven. Sure, I had no idea what I was doing (I learned a hell of a lot but still have no idea what the hell I'm doing) but it was amazing to focus on disease and how to treat it and not "Why did the ED admit this patient?" and "How am I going to get this 76 year old hypochondriac to go home and stay there?" and all the other wonderful social and psychiatric hurdles floor medicine has to face. The ICU attendings appreciated my curiosity and loved to teach.
 
I'll second what everyone here is saying, but also add in for students to not be afraid of the ICU. My time in the ICU during my medicine rotation was like a blessing from heaven. Sure, I had no idea what I was doing (I learned a hell of a lot but still have no idea what the hell I'm doing) but it was amazing to focus on disease and how to treat it and not "Why did the ED admit this patient?" and "How am I going to get this 76 year old hypochondriac to go home and stay there?" and all the other wonderful social and psychiatric hurdles floor medicine has to face. The ICU attendings appreciated my curiosity and loved to teach.

I think that is an excellent point that ICU focuses more on pathphysiology of the disease and treatment, and most patients are stepped down to the floor, so that you can focus on medicine if you are a third year, . . . on the floors I have seen attendings and residents focus alot on the discharge, and less on the workup/differential diagnosis, at least to my students eyes as they already have a good idea what is going on and if a patient has community acquired pneumoniae then they have seen it a zillion times . . . etc. . . I would say though that it is becoming more clear to me that being able to plan discharges well in advance is a great skill to have, as well as to be able to write excellent discharge summaries which of course are actually very important documents. If you can move your patients through the floors quickly you have more time to do "real patient care" i.e. order labs and think about a patient's constellation of problems, otherwise if you are inefficient you get bogged down in the paperwork,
 
If there isn't more input in this thread I'll try to copy and paste one of my ICU lectures (from my Treo) into this thread...plus a brief primer on vents and Swans if I can find it.

I also have a sample ICU note - broken down by systems, of course.

I'm at the airport now, so can't do it yet. 🙂

I'm doing a month in the MICU right now and I would LOVE to see a good ICU note and/or those lectures. I agree with the above that pathophysiology is of the utmost importance in the unit. I feel like I'm finally getting to get the hang of the whole ventilator game. In general I feel like things move at 100 mph and that sometimes I can't keep track of what's going on but it sure as hell beats being on the general medical service any day!
 
Marino's = awesome

The single most important part of an ICU rotation is getting a team of residents that really enjoy the ICU. I had absolutely amazing fellows and attendings, so rounds were unbelievably high-yield. However, I had two R3's who hated the unit and wanted outpatient careers. It sucked the life out of me talking to them everyday (teaching was nonexistent to irrelavent). Even so I learned a ton that month.

If I could do it again (and I may) I will find my favorite residents from last year and find out what months they are on the CCU/ICU/SICU and rotate with them.
 
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