IMG Hurdle...

[darkmansaad]

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I couldnt find a post that answered this question in this part of the forum so I figured Id ask. If I was from an American school I'd probably be considered an "good" candidate = 248/99 Step 1, good LOR's, have my name on some research/hopefully an abstract or pub in the next 12 months, good work ethic, etc. However I am doing my 3rd year rotations right now from Saba University in the Caribbean and was considering pathology strongly and was wondering what kind of chances or hurdles I face if I wanted to match in a University affiliated program. I heard path is getting harder every year so jus wanted to hear it from the horses mouth, so to speak.

Peace, love

 

[pathstudent]

I couldnt find a post that answered this question in this part of the forum so I figured Id ask. If I was from an American school I'd probably be considered an "good" candidate = 248/99 Step 1, good LOR's, have my name on some research/hopefully an abstract or pub in the next 12 months, good work ethic, etc. However I am doing my 3rd year rotations right now from Saba University in the Caribbean and was considering pathology strongly and was wondering what kind of chances or hurdles I face if I wanted to match in a University affiliated program. I heard path is getting harder every year so jus wanted to hear it from the horses mouth, so to speak.

Peace, love

I think you'll be fine. If you were a US student you would be considered an outstanding applicant at least based on what you wrote down and would be interviewed at every program you applied to.

You may or may not get a shot at the "top 5" (Brigham, Hopkins, UCSF, Stanford and University of Washington (seattle)), but you should get plenty of love if you cast a wide net.

 

[Matte Kudesai]

I couldnt find a post that answered this question in this part of the forum so I figured Id ask. If I was from an American school I'd probably be considered an "good" candidate = 248/99 Step 1, good LOR's, have my name on some research/hopefully an abstract or pub in the next 12 months, good work ethic, etc. However I am doing my 3rd year rotations right now from Saba University in the Caribbean and was considering pathology strongly and was wondering what kind of chances or hurdles I face if I wanted to match in a University affiliated program. I heard path is getting harder every year so jus wanted to hear it from the horses mouth, so to speak.

Peace, love

The more complete your application the better. Try and have all your steps completed (yes even step 3 if possible)and apply as early as possible to a wide range of programs. Your step 1 score is great so it will help quite a bit. It seems that IMG's that are successful in matching have a complete application package.

 

[TMZ2007]

The more complete your application the better. Try and have all your steps completed (yes even step 3 if possible)and apply as early as possible to a wide range of programs. Your step 1 score is great so it will help quite a bit. It seems that IMG's that are successful in matching have a complete application package.

How long does it take to get step 3 scores back? I'm thinking timeline and scheduling.... wondering if I could fit it in and get the score reported in time for it to even matter.

 

[Cloaca]

You can't take the Step III until after you graduate so don't worry about that right now. As an IMG myself, you will do just fine getting lots of great interviews with your credentials. To strengthen your application further, rock Step II, get great LOR from both pathology and non-pathology attendings, get great comments from your core rotation preceptors, apply to a lot of programs.

Good luck!

 

[TMZ2007]

I couldnt find a post that answered this question in this part of the forum so I figured Id ask. If I was from an American school I'd probably be considered an "good" candidate = 248/99 Step 1, good LOR's, have my name on some research/hopefully an abstract or pub in the next 12 months, good work ethic, etc. However I am doing my 3rd year rotations right now from Saba University in the Caribbean and was considering pathology strongly and was wondering what kind of chances or hurdles I face if I wanted to match in a University affiliated program. I heard path is getting harder every year so jus wanted to hear it from the horses mouth, so to speak.

Peace, love

Ahhhhh good to see you on here and considering Path! Haven't talked with you since S. How's B going?? Don't let them send you up to St. M's next!! 😀

Have you done a path elective yet??

Take care,
D

 

[TMZ2007]

You can't take the Step III until after you graduate so don't worry about that right now. As an IMG myself, you will do just fine getting lots of great interviews with your credentials. To strengthen your application further, rock Step II, get great LOR from both pathology and non-pathology attendings, get great comments from your core rotation preceptors, apply to a lot of programs.

Good luck!

Thanks for posting that because I wasn't sure if we could take step 3 during school or not.

 

[malchik]

You may or may not get a shot at the "top 5" (Brigham, Hopkins, UCSF, Stanford and University of Washington (seattle)), but you should get plenty of love if you cast a wide net.

Like the west coast-centric top 5.😉

 

[docbiohazard]

Like the west coast-centric top 5.😉

Yep, I think MGH and Penn might want to have a word with you...

Of course, as have oft been stated, it's virtually impossible to come up with a universally meaningful "Top" list...

BH

 

[Matte Kudesai]

How long does it take to get step 3 scores back? I'm thinking timeline and scheduling.... wondering if I could fit it in and get the score reported in time for it to even matter.

Not sure ..... Was not sure if you had graduated. Seems like your classmates are seeing success which is good news for you.

The successful IMG's that I am seeing match seem to have complete application packages with decent scores. Many had finished Step 3 as well.

 

[yaah]

Yep, I think MGH and Penn might want to have a word with you...

Of course, as have oft been stated, it's virtually impossible to come up with a universally meaningful "Top" list...

BH

Most peoples' "top 5" lists have about 15 programs on there. 😉

To the OP - if your numbers are good and you interview well I doubt you will have any real problems. The issue will be getting the interviews, and I think with your numbers you should cross whatever barriers are put down by a lot of programs.

 

[darkmansaad]

Ahhhhh good to see you on here and considering Path! Haven't talked with you since S. How's B going?? Don't let them send you up to St. M's next!! 😀

Have you done a path elective yet??

Take care,
D

Haha hey wats up man...they offered me St M's and I did the knee jerk "hell no" reflex and am going to baltimore for surg instead. B is goin good, surprised to see you on here haha everyone recognizes me from the sn

 

[green mantis]

You can't take the Step III until after you graduate so don't worry about that right now.

It's possible that you may not have to take Step 3 at all, for the purposes of residency. Every state has different requirements, so it may be worthwhile for you to look that.

I did my residency in California, which requires IMG's to be licensed by the end of PGY3. We had a fellowship applicant from out-of-state who hadn't even taken Step 3 yet, & she was 4th year.

I recommended all IMG applicants to my residency to have passed Step 3. Many of them weren't currently in school & would have more time to study. 1st year is very busy, & it's tough to find time to learn all of the primary care medicine you need to pass.


----- Antony

 

[exPCM]

I couldnt find a post that answered this question in this part of the forum so I figured Id ask. If I was from an American school I'd probably be considered an "good" candidate = 248/99 Step 1, good LOR's, have my name on some research/hopefully an abstract or pub in the next 12 months, good work ethic, etc. However I am doing my 3rd year rotations right now from Saba University in the Caribbean and was considering pathology strongly and was wondering what kind of chances or hurdles I face if I wanted to match in a University affiliated program. I heard path is getting harder every year so jus wanted to hear it from the horses mouth, so to speak.

Peace, love

You have an excellent Step 1 score but unfortunately Saba medical school is not recognized by all U.S. states (such as Texas):
http://www.tmb.state.tx.us/professionals/physicians/applicants/STDNHPSE.rtf

So IMO you would be wasting your time and money to apply to Texas residencies like MD Anderson, UTMB, UTSW, Baylor, etc.

I believe that Saba is not recognized by Indiana either.

Good luck.

 

[TMZ2007]

You have an excellent Step 1 score but unfortunately Saba medical school is not recognized by all U.S. states (such as Texas):
http://www.tmb.state.tx.us/professionals/physicians/applicants/STDNHPSE.rtf

So IMO you would be wasting your time and money to apply to Texas residencies like MD Anderson, UTMB, UTSW, Baylor, etc.

I believe that Saba is not recognized by Indiana either.

Good luck.

haha he isn't wanting Texas. LOL!

 

[paleman]

haha he isn't wanting Texas. LOL!

what is up with that?

 

[Cloaca]

I recommended all IMG applicants to my residency to have passed Step 3. Many of them weren't currently in school & would have more time to study. 1st year is very busy, & it's tough to find time to learn all of the primary care medicine you need to pass.


----- Antony

Just to repeat and clarify, you cannot take, or even apply for, the USMLE Step 3 unless you have obtained an MD/DO (i.e. graduated) AND gotten your ECFMG certification (if you are an IMG).

 

[TMZ2007]

Just to repeat and clarify, you cannot take, or even apply for, the USMLE Step 3 unless you have obtained an MD/DO (i.e. graduated) AND gotten your ECFMG certification (if you are an IMG).

And to clarify further, the OP and I are MS3 at international med schools.

 

[Cloaca]

Yeah, I had a lot of PDs on the interview trail say that they prefer IMGs to have taken the Step 3 and I was kind of annoyed by that, nor did I understand why it's necessary...isn't stellar performance on Step I and II enough???

 

[Matte Kudesai]

Yeah, I had a lot of PDs on the interview trail say that they prefer IMGs to have taken the Step 3 and I was kind of annoyed by that, nor did I understand why it's necessary...isn't stellar performance on Step I and II enough???

If you get an IMG (or anyone)that cannot pass step 3 it is a disaster for the program.

Especially if the hospital requires passing the test prior to advancing to PGY-3. (Its bad for the resident and bad for the program)

The background of IMG's differ (so no disrespect intended) but some graduated medical school years ago...

Others have shady clinical rotations in hospitals with no accountability.

You know the type that takes money from an offshore school to take their students and then really does not train them in any way...

So the first real experience some of these trainees have in a US system is as a pathology resident...

It is not as difficult to rock Step 1 and Step 2 if you have a year to study and access to review courses. (99 is still pretty darn stellar)

When you are elbow deep in the gross room and trying to learn surg path and CP.... you may not have time to study for step 3... and its bread and butter US family practice type medicine.... Something you will not see as a pathology resident..

That is why PD's are careful with this test...

 

[Cloaca]

If you get an IMG (or anyone)that cannot pass step 3 it is a disaster for the program.

Especially if the hospital requires passing the test prior to advancing to PGY-3. (Its bad for the resident and bad for the program)

The background of IMG's differ (so no disrespect intended) but some graduated medical school years ago...

Others have shady clinical rotations in hospitals with no accountability.

You know the type that takes money from an offshore school to take their students and then really does not train them in any way...

So the first real experience some of these trainees have in a US system is as a pathology resident...

It is not as difficult to rock Step 1 and Step 2 if you have a year to study and access to review courses. (99 is still pretty darn stellar)

When you are elbow deep in the gross room and trying to learn surg path and CP.... you may not have time to study for step 3... and its bread and butter US family practice type medicine.... Something you will not see as a pathology resident..

That is why PD's are careful with this test...

Fair enough - I did notice that the PDs that seemed the most concerned about Step 3 were at my "backup" programs where they may have more marginal IMG candidates applying. I guess I was personally annoyed because there wasn't anything in my application that might suggest I would have a hard time passing Step 3 so why give me grief about it? Also, I couldn't take it anyway because I was still in med school and I expect PDs to know about that rule.

 

[Matte Kudesai]

Fair enough - I did notice that the PDs that seemed the most concerned about Step 3 were at my "backup" programs where they may have more marginal IMG candidates applying. I guess I was personally annoyed because there wasn't anything in my application that might suggest I would have a hard time passing Step 3 so why give me grief about it? Also, I couldn't take it anyway because I was still in med school and I expect PDs to know about that rule.

Its probably the 99% pass rate of Step 3 for USgrads vs. 60 % IMG/FMG number and increasing pressure from hospitals to have residents passing prior to PGY-3 advancement.