Inevitable...

[aydinhatemi]

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Anglos say there are disadvantaged, how about international students See this is even harder!!! You need to be the best and you are almost out of luck for the best medical school. To my knowledge there are only 100+ international students in whole USA. That sucks... Medical education is reserved for the generations who are already financially set. I guess this part of Education is NOT equal oppurtunity as the rest of the college.

 

[drkingdingaling]

So...go to school in your own country🙂

 

[Moskeeto]

Don't international students mostly come from Canada or already have medical degrees? it seems almost impossible to get into a US med school from another country. At UCD theres a med student that has her MD equivalent from AUS and she said it was pretty tough even getting into a school here being a doctor already. She was pretty nice, I felt bad that she had to go through another 4 years of learning the same stuff over again, but I guess I understand why they do it.

 

[Bonds756]

Originally posted by drkingdingaling
So...go to school in your own country🙂

word

 

[aydinhatemi]

You could not get point,

Americans come to my country all the time. Use Turkey as if it is their backyard. If you hate foreigners, always remember the Americans overseas. Since they are considered foreigners there too. Anyway I am still thinking about applying medical school. We already got engineering department, I guess we should expand to medicine too.

Am I right drkingdingaling...


🙂

 

[drkingdingaling]

Originally posted by aydinhatemi
You could not get point,

Americans come to my country all the time. Use Turkey as if it is their backyard. If you hate foreigners, always remember the Americans overseas. Since they are considered foreigners there too. Anyway I am still thinking about applying medical school. We already got engineering department, I guess we should expand to medicine too.

Am I right drkingdingaling...


🙂

sure thang pal...what the hellever!!!

 

[Gleevec]

Originally posted by aydinhatemi
You could not get point,

Americans come to my country all the time. Use Turkey as if it is their backyard. If you hate foreigners, always remember the Americans overseas. Since they are considered foreigners there too. Anyway I am still thinking about applying medical school. We already got engineering department, I guess we should expand to medicine too.

Am I right drkingdingaling...


🙂

It is not a question of "ought" you are asking, but "is". Foreigners arent favored for American public med schools because they have not been paying taxes, they might not practice in the US, and there are so few spots in American med schools for Americans already.

So with my limited knowledge of foreign applicants, it is extremely hard to get into an American public med school (remember, most americans only get into school in-state, so regionality matters). You are not a URM, and it is actually a disadvantage not to be a US Citizen for most schools I know of. I would talk to your advisor for more details.

 

[jennb]

Originally posted by aydinhatemi
You could not get point,
Americans come to my country all the time. Use Turkey as if it is their backyard.

That's true that the Americans use Turkey, but how many billions of dollars do we pay to be there? Without this money, what would be Turkey's source of income? Export more carpet or copper? I think that country will be a lot poorer without the money from the U.S. I mean, how many items do we have that are "Made in Turkey"?


No offense to you aydinhatemi, but getting in med school is very competitive. If you don't like the U. S. Med school's rules, then don't apply.

 

[drkingdingaling]

Originally posted by jennb
That's true that the Americans use Turkey, but how many billions of dollars do we pay to be there? Without this money, what would be Turkey's source of income? Export more carpet or copper? I think that country will be a lot poorer without the money from the U.S. I mean, how many items do we have that are "Made in Turkey"?


No offense to you aydinhatemi, but getting in med school is very competitive. If you don't like the U. S. Med school's rules, then don't apply.

well said, fellow AMERICAN...hahahahahaha

 

[Rapid Decomposition]

Despite the attitude (drking), I think you guys are right about the reasons that international students are seldom admitted to American medical schools.

Aydinhatemi, please realize that unlike engineering, which is taught in countless universities around the country and thus always has spots for international students, medicine does not have nearly enough spots to accomodate everyone who wants to be a doctor, and so the preference goes to Americans first. This country needs doctors, and medical schools can't spare very many spots to people who will likely leave to go practice in other countries. If you are interested in staying in the U.S., perhaps it would be best to apply for citizenship or permanent residence first, or study abroad and then return. It sucks, but that's the way it is.

So, it's not a matter of "hating foreigners" - after all, the U.S. has thousands of foreign students like yourself and we take in more immigrants each year than the rest of the world's countries combined. We just can't accomodate everyone who wants to study medicine in the U.S. This goes for Americans too - many of US have to leave the country for med school because there are not enough spots here!

 

[HeWhoExists]

cok gyzel, aydin!

 

[Eyegirl2k7]

Umm actually...
You can't just apply for permanent residency. It has to be marriage based, family based (like you're the kid of an American citizen) or work based (you provide a skill that can't easily be found elsewhere.

I should know. I got my permanent residency on Monday. I waited for five years and paid over $3000 in lawyer's fees. It was a stressful, frustrating process and I don't recommend it. I am very very happy to have gained the adjustment of status, don't get me wrong.

I'm a Canadian. I have a B.A from an American University. I'm an immigrant.

Please don't immediately disparage people who are foreign and tell them to "go to school in their own country." For a lot of them, it's not an option. I think a lot of people take things for granted about how great things are in the US. Granted, Canada's pretty great too. But in some other countries it's much harder to get a really good medical education.

IT's not that I don't understand where you're coming from. My husband sees things the same way sometimes.

Peace.
Eyegirl

 

[e-spin]

Originally posted by drkingdingaling
So...go to school in your own country🙂

Correct me if I am wrong, drking, but I think your response to the OP was such because it seems as though the OP was complaining about a system that he or she doesnt necessarily have to participate in. The OP says that there is only 100+ int'l student that are in American Med schools. Bear in mind there are about 30-40,000 American applicants for approx 12,000 spots. Sorry, but that is an awful lot of American Students who DONT get in.
My point it that this is America...which is made up of people from ALL over the world many of whom are citizens and many who are not. We have enough problems with trying to find a good way to get URMs who are AMERICAN into med school so they can in turn better serbe their communities much less trying to determine the best way for international students. It is unfortunate for you and for the thousands of American students (myself included!!!) who have a tough time getting in, but that is the way it works.
So, eyegirl, I dont think the responders to this thread are disparaging foreign students...and congrats on your acceptance

 

[geromine]

I know some girl who got in a few years back. She had awesome grades but she only got into some low profile school because of lack of perm. residency status. Recently, I heard that she's all finished with medschool and residency. So to international students: don't give up.
The point is that the best and the brightest of the non-citizens are accepted to US med schools and they often outdo American students because they are doubly motivated. They have to pay full tuition, out of state with no aid or subsidized loan or nothing unlike most of the American students. So its basically like they are buying a service and we're not doing them any favors. And, in case they decide to stay in this country we benefit from having some of the best doctors from around world working for us and helping improve our healthcare. How is it that you don't see the benefit in that? Get those Pat Buchanan ideas out of your heads.

Next time you people decide to tell somebody to "go back to your own country" take a look at yourselves and find out where your ancestors came from. For many of us, our ancestors were immigrants too that a hundred years ago, had to put up with the same kind of bigotry that's going on today. America is the great country that it is today because of the multicultural infusion that immigration created. Having the privilege of being born in US doesn't give you the right to prevent others from taking advantage of the resources available here. So please, next time, hesitate before putting the A$$ label on yourselves and giving somebody a hard time for trying to better themselves.

 

[Adcadet]

Originally posted by aydinhatemi
To my knowledge there are only 100+ international students in whole USA.

My small undergraduate college has approximately 360 international students (~90 per graduating class).

 

[MSTP boy]

I have some friends from other countries - they often complain that many of the highly skilled, talented native people end up going to America for money, rather than staying in their homeland. As a result, the country suffers in research, public health, etc.

I think if you are truly dedicated to medicine, then you might consider devoting your career towards the community in which you live. There is a shortage of qualified medical professionals in Turkey, and many who are in need of care. I applaud your ambition, but don't forget to look in your heart, to see why you really want to go into medicine.

 

[Bonds756]

Originally posted by geromine

Next time you people decide to tell somebody to "go back to your own country" take a look at yourselves and find out where your ancestors came from. For many of us, our ancestors were immigrants too that a hundred years ago, had to put up with the same kind of bigotry that's going on today. America is the great country that it is today because of the multicultural infusion that immigration created. Having the privilege of being born in US doesn't give you the right to prevent others from taking advantage of the resources available here. So please, next time, hesitate before putting the A$$ label on yourselves and giving somebody a hard time for trying to better themselves.

E-spin said it best, if you cared to read it, that people weren't objecting to foreign students, but that the OP was complaining about the system. Of course just about everyone in this country has roots abroad and benefitted from this country's policy of "multicultural infusion that immigration created." No one is, or could, argue this. So please, next time, read before putting the A$$ label on yourself.

 

[Ryo-Ohki]

Citizens have more rights then non-citizens. Period.

 

[wolferman]

Originally posted by Ryo-Ohki
Citizens have more rights then non-citizens. Period.

That hardly seems fair though. If illegal aliens are able to receive multi-organ transplants from institutions like Duke, they ought to be able to obtain medical educations as well. 😉

 

[Big Lebowski]

This is hardly worth arguing over....a lot of people seem to forget Gleevec's remarks...

The largest factor is taxpayers' dollars. Since most spots are supported by state funds....why would a school like University of Illinois use the money payed by the residents of that state to train an applicant who has not provided any of those tax dollars and than most likely leave the state and country. That is tax dollars completely wasted. Medical education in the U.S. is an "investment" by the American people for their healthcare. Hence the reason, as mentioned earlier, that not only is it easier to get in if you are a U.S. resident...but also a resident of a particular state. Illinois taxpayers do not want to train doctors who are going to leave and treat another population...makes no sense. If there were an abundance of spots...then things would be different...but there are not. In areas of the U.S. like the midwest and southeast...there is an extreme "braindrain". Retention of trained professionals is the key issue...

 

[geromine]

1)Bonds756, I did read the posts, and I thought many of them, though not all, were terribly insensative so I felt that something had to be said. If you feel that rules concerning the admitance of international students are fair(and I would agree with you on that) you need to explain it to them because maybe people don't understand why things are the way they are, instead of saying "go to school in your own country".

If you don't think that's true, then you go ahead and go about life your own way and tell people to accept your opinions or go to hell and see where that gets you. It's for people like you that we can't get any freakin' allies in the war.

2)Big Lebowski, I don't believe that the tax thing applies to international students. Very few of them are accepted to state schools, if any. They usually get into private schools or even if they do get into state schools then they pay out of state tuition I'm sure. You would be right, if they did in fact get their tuitions subsidized by the states, however, I just don't believe that that is the case.

 

[kito]

the policy on medical school admissions is what our national economic and immigration policy should be: nationalistic. americans should benefit most from the privelages afforded to them by their great nation. besides, the rest of the world thumbs their nose to our foreign policy and customs, why are these same people so eager to come to the united states for economic aid, jobs, an education or freedom?

 

[Big Lebowski]

Geromine...

You're right about private vs. in-state vs. out-of-state. What I was trying to do was to make the generalization about the desire to produce American physicians who are planning to remain in the States and practice. Despite the fact that private tuition and out-of-state tuition is exceedingly high compared to in-state, there is still federal dollars supporting all institutions, ie. the NIH. Believe me...the private instituitions are not functioning on tuition dollars alone. Someone had quoted at one time that it costs $250,000 over four years to educate one student....if you took away all forms of federal or state aid.

I just used state schools as an example. You can argue the same thing with the private schools. They still receive government support, though not state. The same rule applies...why divert funds to educate an international student, risking the fact that they might leave the country to practice. There is still preference to U.S. students as part of a financial investment....in-state, out-of-state, or private.

 

[Bonds756]

Originally posted by geromine

If you don't think that's true, then you go ahead and go about life your own way and tell people to accept your opinions or go to hell and see where that gets you. It's for people like you that we can't get any freakin' allies in the war.

This is a nice extrapolation. I am sure that this is the reason France doesn't want to go to war.
I was pointing out that you called people A$$ES when in fact the majority of the people who have been posting have supported their thoughts on why it is so difficult for foreign apps to earn acceptances. But I guess you don't like your own words quoted back to you, so I won't press you any more in fear that we will lose even more allies in the war.