Interventional Pain fellowships taking Neurology Trained Docs

[igotmyswag]

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Hi All,

I am currently in my third year of neurology training but I am interested in interventional pain. Are there any fellowship programs out there that accept neurology trained docs? Thanks in advance for your input!

 

[lonelobo]

Only if you agree to see all Migraine and Cluster headaches

 

[deleted185747]

Do you believe in fibromyalgia????

 

[hyperalgesia]

Hi All,

I am currently in my third year of neurology training but I am interested in interventional pain. Are there any fellowship programs out there that accept neurology trained docs? Thanks in advance for your input!

I know a neurologist that did pain fellowship at Univ of Kentucky. Awesome pain doc. I think you guys have a lot to offer the pain world. Good luck!

 

[Prof Moriarty]

Portenoy is a neurologist. Check out the Beth Israel program in NYC: http://www.stoppain.org/for_professionals/content/information/painfellowship.asp

 

[PMR 4 MSK]

Portenoy is a neurologist. Check out the Beth Israel program in NYC: http://www.stoppain.org/for_professionals/content/information/painfellowship.asp

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!!

The man who virtually single-handedly is responsible for the incredibly high rates of Rx-opioid addiction and over-prescribing in our country?

The greatest pharma-***** in the industry?

Run Forest! RUN!

 

[Prof Moriarty]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!! The man who virtually single-handedly is responsible for the incredibly high rates of Rx-opioid addiction and over-prescribing in our country? The greatest pharma-***** in the industry? Run Forest! RUN!

Hmm... from what I can tell the guy is well-respected in NY, esp in the palliative care community. I've heard good things about the pain program. You know otherwise?

Either way, it stands to reason that since Portenoy is a neurologist the program is open to apps from neuro, which was the OP's query.

 

[Sandpaper]

Portenoy is a douche. He gives pain physicians everywhere a bad name. In my mind there is little difference between him and some family practice doc in box writing scripts for addicts. The difference is that Portenoy gets to sit in the ivory tower. Further, I would have to disagree that he's well-respected in New York. During my year of fellowship in NYC at another institution, it's understood that he's an opioid shill and we sent the crazies there for him to deal with. Dude never met a script pad that he didn't like.

As for the OP's query, one particular program that take neurologists is the University of South Florida. The program director is a neurologist.

 

[NOSfan]

igotmyswag check your PM

 

[nvrsumr]

i believe bwh took a neurologist as a fellow a couple years ago

 

[Prof Moriarty]

Further, I would have to disagree that he's well-respected in New York. During my year of fellowship in NYC at another institution, it's understood that he's an opioid shill and we sent the crazies there for him to deal with. Dude never met a script pad that he didn't like.

If you thought so poorly of him why send referrals at all?

I have no personal experience to base the opinion on, so I couldn't really say one way or the other. The people who spoke highly of him were in palliative care/hospice, not interventional pain. When someone is immanently dying or facing intractable pain near the end of life, I do not think addiction is a major concern. That's a different population from what you're talking about (I assume) but that's the reference point for my comments.

 

[epidural2009]

the bottom line is that the best interventional pain docs are anesthesiology trained pain med physicians. neuro, psych, pmr... i don't think so.

 

[lobelsteve]

the bottom line is that the best interventional pain docs are anesthesiology trained pain med physicians. neuro, psych, pmr... i don't think so.

Totally agree, they should not even let those guys practice. It's like CRNA's.
I heard some of them want to start their own fellowship programs and even a few have managed to teach at these programs. Crazy.

 

[epidural2009]

Totally agree, they should not even let those guys practice. It's like CRNA's.
I heard some of them want to start their own fellowship programs and even a few have managed to teach at these programs. Crazy.

Yup, i'm glad you agree lobels... people think that just b/c u try to start your own program or just because you teach at a fellowship program, that all of the sudden they must be good. come on. anyone off the street can get a faculty position in academics! clearly you and i know what's going on.

 

[lonelobo]

Yup, i'm glad you agree lobels... people think that just b/c u try to start your own program or just because you teach at a fellowship program, that all of the sudden they must be good. come on. anyone off the street can get a faculty position in academics! clearly you and i know what's going on.

Above is Funny!

Guess I should stop practicing, until epidural"2009" teaches me some things

 

[epidural2009]

Above is Funny!

Guess I should stop practicing, until epidural"2009" teaches me some things

don't get down on yourself lonely lobo... it just wasn't meant to be! sorry man. 😉

 

[lonelobo]

It was meant to be sarcastic,
As Lobel is PMR trained as well as many on this pain thread

 

[lobelsteve]

Sleeps got a girlfriend.

Sorry sleep, didn't mean it, you've been good- didn't deserve it. But its still funny.


Dark Orchid is your friend man, love that Dark Orchid.

 

[SleepIsGood]

Sleeps got a girlfriend.

Sorry sleep, didn't mean it, you've been good- didn't deserve it. But its still funny.


Dark Orchid is your friend man, love that Dark Orchid.

I think youguys know where I stand on this already.

Steve..dont make me call Lax.

On a serious note. I think this push by everyone trying to be 'interventional' is a little out of hand. Being interventional is one thing, being in your scope of practice is a totally other thing. For example. if there's a psych guy that cant even start an IV..should he/she be doing cervical epidurals or MBBs?

Ya, yah everyone's got to know ACLS. But again, if you practice in a PP and it's just you (the MD who was trained in psych or neuro), a MA, and a secretary and you get an anaphlxis or an MI,etc. Guess what. The MD is it. There's no 'back up'. I highly doubt that MD has enough experience to resuscitate a patient. He might pull a Conrad Murphy (Michael Jackson's doc).

Again, it's a patient care issue. I dont think a non interventionally trained specialist can do a one yr fellowship and automatically switch gears and become competent and safe. It's a total different skill set one has to learn.

 

[onewithpain]

I am currently working in a hospital that had an anesthesiology trained pain doc doing procedures. He was implanting a pump and the patient coded on the table. He walked out of the room and left it for the anesthetist to handle. If you're motivated then you can learn what you need in a psych residency, but if you're not then you can do formal pain training forever and you're still a liability. If you can't display morals, ethics, bedside manner, and good clinical skills, then youre leaving the door open for an anesthetist to compete.

 

[SleepIsGood]

I am currently working in a hospital that had an anesthesiology trained pain doc doing procedures. He was implanting a pump and the patient coded on the table. He walked out of the room and left it for the anesthetist to handle. If you're motivated then you can learn what you need in a psych residency, but if you're not then you can do formal pain training forever and you're still a liability. If you can't display morals, ethics, bedside manner, and good clinical skills, then youre leaving the door open for an anesthetist to compete.

I dont understand. IN that situation, it's the anethesia provider's job to resuscitate the patient primarily. The Pain MD is the "surgeon' in that case. He should help, but again, he has an anesthesiologist there to manage the patient so that he/she can concentrate on what they need to.

 

[onewithpain]

He had an anesthetist there. He stopped the procedure, did not help with the code, terminated the procedure and left the room. This from the person with the most experience in resuscitating the patient.

 

[PMR 4 MSK]

the bottom line is that the best interventional pain docs are anesthesiology trained pain med physicians. neuro, psych, pmr... i don't think so.

Oh, we who are unworthy, may we please bow down in your presence, kind sir? May we have the privilege of begging forgiveness for encroaching on your sacred turf?

If only I had planned my life better and gone into anesthesia so that one day, God willing, I might have been able to see myself as superior to everyone else.

Oh, the shame of it all....

 

[epidural2009]

It was meant to be sarcastic,
As Lobel is PMR trained as well as many on this pain thread

oh, Lobels was being sarcastic? i had NO idea! thanks lonlely lobos for the heads up!

 

[docnyc]

I find it hard to believe that a physician would physically leave the room while their patient is coding on the table. Even if they had nothing to offer, any doc who would abandon his patient in that situation is an a*$. When I did anesthesia, I had a few patients code on the table and even though the surgical team looked to me to take over, they never LEFT THE ROOM. It doesnt matter what his initial background is, he is a terrible doctor.

I was in an ASC the other day and another pain doc had a patient who coded in the PACU after a lumbar TFESI. I took over to help resuscitate the patient even though it wasnt my patient. She ended up being fine and was transferred to the hospital for further monitoring.

The pain doc was PMR and greatly appreciated my help. He is also a good colleague of mine. At this juncture, the focus should be on maintaining our specialty (and not letting it slip out to the hands of CRNAs and non MDs), otherwise this will be a useless discussion.

He had an anesthetist there. He stopped the procedure, did not help with the code, terminated the procedure and left the room. This from the person with the most experience in resuscitating the patient.

 

[Tenesma]

don't get me started on Portenoy.... he has ruined the lives of MANY patients...

as far as neurology, i know 2 interventionalists who are neurologists.... both of them are AWESOME... really, really bright guys - w/ great skillz...

while i'd love to keep interventional pain the domain of anesthesia... it really isn't....

again the need for a combined residency in pain...

what i do have an issue w/ are the ER docs, the FPs, the IMs who are doing interventional pain fellowships.... they literally have no background of any use whatsoever...

 

[emd123]

don't get me started on Portenoy.... he has ruined the lives of MANY patients...

as far as neurology, i know 2 interventionalists who are neurologists.... both of them are AWESOME... really, really bright guys - w/ great skillz...

while i'd love to keep interventional pain the domain of anesthesia... it really isn't....

again the need for a combined residency in pain...

what i do have an issue w/ are the ER docs, the FPs, the IMs who are doing interventional pain fellowships.... they literally have no background of any use whatsoever...

Yeah, Tenesma, I have no idea why you'd want someone who takes care of chronic pain patients daily, and does lots of procedures including lumbar punctures, IVs , nerve blocks, joint injections/aspirations, intubations and procedural sedation do a pain fellowship...hmh?

 

[Tenesma]

i agree w/ you EMD123 --- i also think that Anesthesia is no good background for a painfellowship... however, anesthesiologists DID create the field of pain mgmt and interventional pain...

*your sarcasm was noted, though.

 

[TheAssMan]

Hi All,

I am currently in my third year of neurology training but I am interested in interventional pain. Are there any fellowship programs out there that accept neurology trained docs? Thanks in advance for your input!

We took a neurologist last year at Cornell (Anesthesia based fellowship). He did well, was hired this year at Hosp Special Surgery. It is as much about finding the right person as well as the right specialty.

 

[olafa]

To the original question-- I know some neurologists that are fellowship trained and are great. It's just not the most popular route, but a route as good as the others - PMR and Anesthesia (anesthesia the most popular route with the most number of fellwoships). Apply broadly if seriously interested in pain management. There are a few programs run by neurology depts or at least affiliated with them. Good luck and don't get caught up with the crazy turf battle, you have plenty to contribute to treatment in pain management.