Is pharmacy school easy?

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stu0513

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Hi everyone, I have heard people around me (not me pharmacy school) saying that pharmacy school is easy once you get in. The hardest part is to actually get in. Is that true? I have some doubts about that because I thought all medical-related fields are supposed to be challenging

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Hi everyone, I have heard people around me (not me pharmacy school) saying that pharmacy school is easy once you get in. The hardest part is to actually get in. Is that true? I have some doubts about that because I thought all medical-related fields are supposed to be challenging

Pharmacy school, dental school, med school, etc are all very time consuming...not hard but time consuming...its hard in a since b/c most people prefer going out and not studying but it doesn't work like that. LOL....The work is not hard, but its "hard" to be motiviated to studying 6+ hours a day..🙄
The only way pharmacy school can be easy is if you have a photographic memory and can absorb information very quickly. good luck! 🙂
 
Hi everyone, I have heard people around me (not me pharmacy school) saying that pharmacy school is easy once you get in. The hardest part is to actually get in. Is that true? I have some doubts about that because I thought all medical-related fields are supposed to be challenging

No.
 
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To me, the hardest part was actually getting accepted. That being said, I know it's going to demand a ton of studying and effort on my part to succeed and I know it's not going to be easy. It will definitely be challenging.
 
Uh, how about people who are not pre-pharm refrain from answering this. There is no way for you to know, only speculate. While the difficulty will vary from person to person depending on their background, study habits, etc I think you need to have an actual P1, P2, P3, or P4 to answer this one. Not pre-pharms that think they know what they are talking about
 
Uh, how about people who are not pre-pharm refrain from answering this. There is no way for you to know, only speculate. While the difficulty will vary from person to person depending on their background, study habits, etc I think you need to have an actual P1, P2, P3, or P4 to answer this one. Not pre-pharms that think they know what they are talking about

Thank you. With that said... one factor would be the undergrad institution you came from. If it was extremely competitive, and super ridiculous then that helps. But Pharmacy school is not easy... Getting an A in any core science class is extremely hard to do.... b/c its not undergrad. More information, and more specificity of the information. I gained 25 lbs in one semester if you want to know how stressful it is... after every test someone cried (I never saw that in undergrad)... Girls hair was falling out b/c of the stress, one of my classmates has cerebral pausing (sp?)... Its not easy. It can be very challenging and very stressful. Maybe not as stressful everywhere, but I know for a fact it's not easy anywhere.
 
define easy...

if it means not studying much but doing well in the courses; then no, pharmacy school is not easy.

if it means putting in a lot of effort so you can at least pull a decent grade...then perhaps it is.

You only get out of it what you put in
 
My experience has been the same as JamesL1585. Very stressful, very time consuming.
 
Uh, how about people who are not pre-pharm refrain from answering this. There is no way for you to know, only speculate. While the difficulty will vary from person to person depending on their background, study habits, etc I think you need to have an actual P1, P2, P3, or P4 to answer this one. Not pre-pharms that think they know what they are talking about

I was in Columbia Dental school (which is the medical school) for almost a semester so I know how hard it is. They are not hard, just time consuming which sucks.
 
Class of 2013 here. I will not expecting it to be easy. I will definitely study hard. I am a firm believer that what you put in = what you will be harvesting.:eyebrow:
 
It's not difficult, as there is very little actual thinking involved in pharmacy school. The hard part is that there is A LOT of raw memorization, which is mind-numbingly boring, but which you have to endure for most of the first three years. While working in almost any pharmacy setting is fun, pharmacy school itself was so boring, I felt a brain cell die every day... I could never see the point of memorizing minutae that would never matter in real life (and can easily be looked up) instead of actually learning how to use and apply that knowledge, though some professors are better at it than others. Still, even in the perfect world you can't escape that large part is just memorizing drugs, MoAs, AEs, etc. 🙂
 
It's not difficult, as there is very little actual thinking involved in pharmacy school. The hard part is that there is A LOT of raw memorization, which is mind-numbingly boring, but which you have to endure for most of the first three years. While working in almost any pharmacy setting is fun, pharmacy school itself was so boring, I felt a brain cell die every day... I could never see the point of memorizing minutae that would never matter in real life (and can easily be looked up) instead of actually learning how to use and apply that knowledge, though some professors are better at it than others. Still, even in the perfect world you can't escape that large part is just memorizing drugs, MoAs, AEs, etc. 🙂

+1. There's a lot of stuff that I'd speculate to say I'd never use later on and a lot of pure memorization. Although I wouldn't go as far to say that a brain cell died every day 🙂 Some classes are better than others, though.
 
P1 is supposedly "easy," P2 is brutally difficult, and P3 "isn't bad," although P3 may not be "that bad," after one incurs the wrath of P2.

I think that if you get into Pharmacy school, it isn't too hard to get by, but it is considerably challenging to do well.
 
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It was posted in the Pre-Pharmacy section and people are upset the PrePharmers are answering. :laugh:

Anyway. I think Pre-Pharm is difficult because theres always SOMETHING ELSE you COULD be doing to get your application up to par. You got a B? Could have gotten an A. Volunteered in the community Pharmacy? Could have done a hospital internship. You only volunteered? Why didnt you work as well?

That was a stressor for me...
 
Well I was chemical engineering before this, and I'm going out on a limb, that pharmacy is noooooo where as difficult. If it is, I quit. I have utmost respect for engineers as they are in my eyes much brighter than just about any profession that I can think of (as far as quickness in learning, not loads-of-information-wise)

Pharmacy is just like learning a new language IMO, which requires a lot of time to memorize a lot of information.
 
Well I was chemical engineering before this, and I'm going out on a limb, that pharmacy is noooooo where as difficult. If it is, I quit. I have utmost respect for engineers as they are in my eyes much brighter than just about any profession that I can think of (as far as quickness in learning, not loads-of-information-wise)

Pharmacy is just like learning a new language IMO, which requires a lot of time to memorize a lot of information.

I beg to differ. There are a lot of stupid engineers out there. Even as a Bio undergrad, I can school many of them in math. Engineering is killer, yes, but a lot of sub-par individuals find a way to squeak by.

On average, the most intelligent group of students are medical students.
 
I beg to differ. There are a lot of stupid engineers out there. Even as a Bio undergrad, I can school many of them in math. Engineering is killer, yes, but a lot of sub-par individuals find a way to squeak by.

On average, the most intelligent group of students are medical students.

I do agree that medical students are intelligent, and in any profession you will get those individuals that squeak by. There are different types of intellects, and I think each profession has different utilizations of these intellects. Linguistic intelligence, Logical-mathematical intelligence, Spatial intelligence, Bodily-Kinesthetic intelligence, Musical intelligence, Interpersonal intelligence, Intrapersonal intelligence, Naturalist intelligence.
I do not think any education program is easy but I feel that people who gravitate toward a specific career is because of the natural intelligence they possess.

A program may seem to be easy because an individual would have the passion and specific intelligence for the area of study.
 
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you have to have good communication skills. yes, engineering is incredibly difficult, but pharmacy is a lot of communication, not just math stuff.

I'm a P1. the first year is soooo time consuming. then it gets better. all least that's how they say it goes at my school.
 
Uh, how about people who are not pre-pharm refrain from answering this. There is no way for you to know, only speculate. While the difficulty will vary from person to person depending on their background, study habits, etc I think you need to have an actual P1, P2, P3, or P4 to answer this one. Not pre-pharms that think they know what they are talking about

Really? What if all my friends were in pharmacy school and I talk to them all the time? I would think, even then I would have a general idea of the difficulty of pharm school.

With that said, some of my pharmacy class, some don't. Some just listen to the lectures online and yes, procrastinate, but do well on their test. When I talked to my pharmacist about it, he said his friends also slacked off by not going to classes and what not, hes around 30 years old.
But, at my institution, you are hammered with test. Some weeks, you'll have 4-5 test in a row, others you'll have none. They come in waves. All in all, I would say it is doable as long as you put in the effort.

Pharm kids also say P2/P3 is the hardest year, because of pathology class or something.

Your mind set of Pharmacy school should start off as being difficult and time consuming so you put the maximum amount of effort into it. As you get a feel of your classes, you can probably adjust from there, like what some of my friends did.
 
For current pharm students/current pharmacists:

What would you consider is the hardest class to be in pharmacy school? Is there a make-you/break-you class (like organic chemistry in undergrad)?
 
For current pharm students/current pharmacists:

What would you consider is the hardest class to be in pharmacy school? Is there a make-you/break-you class (like organic chemistry in undergrad)?


I think you, guys, are neglecting one important factor such that people enter pharmacy school with complitely different backgrounds. Sure everyone has basic pre-reqs but someone people have that background + MS in Analytical Biochemistry, while other people have that background + BA in art history. I'm a stong proponent of the fact that people should always major in what they love and what makes them happiest as an undegrad, however, I imagine that someone who took physical chemistry as an undergrad for example and will be retaking it again for the 2nd time in pharmacy school will probably have a slightly different experience in that class than someone who's never taken it before.
 
I beg to differ. There are a lot of stupid engineers out there. Even as a Bio undergrad, I can school many of them in math. Engineering is killer, yes, but a lot of sub-par individuals find a way to squeak by.
And there are a lot of stupid bio majors out there so what's your point?

Just because you school some engineers in lower division math doesn't say anything about the quality of the engineering students, as a whole. Would it be fair for an engineering student to say that some bio majors are squeaking by just because he schooled them in introductory biology?

The ones who were limping by in lower division math most likely won't be around to take the upper division math.
 
I honestly expect pharmacy school to be a lot of hard work and effort invested into my own education. Will it be hard going through pharmacy school? Well, I like to think that is different for every person, even down to the interpretation of the question.

But if the OP is wondering if pharmacy school is something that requires studying, a lot of time invested into memorizing, understanding, and applying the material presented in class, I would have to say yes. But, if a person is completely understanding of that but is wondering if the material is complex and possibly similar to theoretical physics with no definitive method of proof outside of mathematics and great differences in theories result from disagreements about the number of possible dimensions, then no, it will not be that hard.
 
I think you, guys, are neglecting one important factor such that people enter pharmacy school with complitely different backgrounds. Sure everyone has basic pre-reqs but someone people have that background + MS in Analytical Biochemistry, while other people have that background + BA in art history. I'm a stong proponent of the fact that people should always major in what they love and what makes them happiest as an undegrad, however, I imagine that someone who took physical chemistry as an undergrad for example and will be retaking it again for the 2nd time in pharmacy school will probably have a slightly different experience in that class than someone who's never taken it before.

No offense intended...but, NO ONE gets into a PharmD program without taking physical chemistry. Let alone..ochem, biochem, etc.. They are ALL taking it for the 2nd time, whether or not they have additional coursework in the arts. If you ask me, that additional background in the social sciences makes them more well-rounded candidates and just as qualified, if not more, than those who have pursued only a scientific pathway.
 
No offense intended...but, NO ONE gets into a PharmD program without taking physical chemistry. Let alone..ochem, biochem, etc.. They are ALL taking it for the 2nd time, whether or not they have additional coursework in the arts. If you ask me, that additional background in the social sciences makes them more well-rounded candidates and just as qualified, if not more, than those who have pursued only a scientific pathway.


Actually plenty of people get into pharmacy school w/out taking physical chemistry. (I'm thinking you are talking about general chemistry). I don't know a single school that requires pchem as a pre-req. As for additional coursework in arts, I specifically said, I am A STRONG proponent of non-majoring in science. In fact, if I could go back in time, I would gladly trade my biochemistry and physiology majors for a BA in political science or art history because I feel my written communication skills would be much better if I haven't majored in science. Science can be learned easily, but developing good clear writing style and enriching your verbal and written communication skills is a gradual process, that liberal degree could perfectly assist with. Alas, it's too late for me!
 
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Actually plenty of people get into pharmacy school w/out taking physical chemistry. (I'm thinking you are talking about general chemistry). I don't know a single school that requires pchem as a pre-req. As for additional coursework in arts, I specifically said, I am A STRONG proponent of non-majoring in science. In fact, if I could go back in time, I would gladly trade my biochemistry and physiology majors for a BA in political science or art history because I feel my written communication skills would be much better if I haven't majored in science. Science can be learned easily, but developing good clear writing style and enriching your verbal and written communication skills is a gradual process, that liberal degree could perfectly assist with. Alas, it's too late for me!

So i guess you're saying that Pchem was the hardest class you've taken in pharm school, as an answer to my question?

Most people who go into pharmacy usually majored in a science like chemistry and biology. There are some people who majored in non-science which is also fine. I think it's also obvious that someone with a non-science background like art history would have a different time getting accustomed to a science oriented curriculum in pharmacy than someone with a background in a science.

I understand everyone's different and that the difficulty ranges for different people but for different classes. I think i can speak for mostly everyone that organic chemistry was not a walk in the park during their undergrad. But in GENERAL, (just curious) what would pharmacy students (current/past) students consider to be the most difficult class in pharmacy school?
 
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So i guess you're saying that Pchem was the hardest class you've taken in pharm school, as an answer to my question?

I understand everyone's different and that the difficulty ranges for different people but for different classes. I think i can speak for mostly everyone that organic chemistry was not a walk in the park during their undergrad. But in GENERAL, (just curious) what would pharmacy students (current/past) students consider to be the most difficult class in pharmacy school?


I'm not in pharmacy school, never said I was 😉, therefore as Okie indicated I can't provide an opinion. I just brought up a good point that you can't really ask this sort of question and expect a clear cut answer considering how people enter pharmacy school with such different backgrounds. When I talked to P1s at a certain school and asked them this specific question - which class they struggled most with, they said they struggled most with pchem because they haven't taken it as undergrads.
 
Depends on your educational background, in short.

But no, pharmacy school isn't easy the way a geography class is easy; but it's not hard either. If I don't put forth some effort, I'll probably fail exams.

But yeah...it'll be hard if, say, you've never dealt with K-type questions before and your pathophysiology professor is throwing them at you like they're going out of style.

If you excelled at a difficult/prestigious undergrad, you'll have no problems...if you snuck into pharm school with a sub 3 GPA but are genuinely smart (and you just got caught up in circumstances), you'll be fine.

Now, if you snuck in with a sub 3 GPA and are genuinely a sub 3 certified *******...it's going to be pretty hard for you.

Only YOU know what category you fall into. Just because a pharmacy school hands you an admissions offer doesn't mean you can hack it, kind of like how a bank giving you a $20,000 credit line or a mortgage on a house doesn't mean you're necessarily credit worthy.
 
I'm not in pharmacy school, never said I was 😉, therefore as Okie indicated I can't provide an opinion. I just brought up a good point that you can't really ask this sort of question and expect a clear cut answer considering how people enter pharmacy school with such different backgrounds. When I talked to P1s at a certain school and asked them this specific question - which class they struggled most with, they said they struggled most with pchem because they haven't taken it as undergrads.

I didn't know pharmacy schools make you take PChem!!! I thought it was only offer in undergrad for chem majors. I graduated with a degree in chem and I hated that class with a passion. I was hoping I would never have to take it again. LOL...
 
I didn't know professional school was easy! sweet i'll become go earn a PharmD MD DD alright! haha ok that's out

no pharmacy school isn't easy. I heard year 2 really tests your resolve.
 
I didn't know pharmacy schools make you take PChem!!! I thought it was only offer in undergrad for chem majors. I graduated with a degree in chem and I hated that class with a passion. I was hoping I would never have to take it again. LOL...
whoa i didn't know this either...........pchem blows.....😡
 
I DID NOT take P-Chem in undergrad and I graduated with a BS in a science field. P-chem in pharmacy school is known as "physical pharmacy." Usually it's called pharmaceutics at other schools.

And K-type questions make me question life.

I've heard that Therapeutics and Med Chem are the toughest at our school, but I don't know firsthand.
 
I didn't know pharmacy schools make you take PChem!!! I thought it was only offer in undergrad for chem majors. I graduated with a degree in chem and I hated that class with a passion. I was hoping I would never have to take it again. LOL...

I don't have to take PChem in pharm school and I'm pretty sure it's not too common. You might use some of the stuff from PChem, but it would be more integrated with pharmacy.

The hardest classes I've heard of are Medicinal Chemistry, Therapeutics, and Pharmacology. I haven't gotten there yet.
 
Well now that I read CUBeav's post, yeah we also had to take Pharmaceutics. As a broad overview, everything we learned related to manipulating a drug to make it's delivery better.
 
And there are a lot of stupid bio majors out there so what's your point?

Just because you school some engineers in lower division math doesn't say anything about the quality of the engineering students, as a whole. Would it be fair for an engineering student to say that some bio majors are squeaking by just because he schooled them in introductory biology?

The ones who were limping by in lower division math most likely won't be around to take the upper division math.

What's my point? Read what I responded to, namely, that engineering is inherently "sooooooooo" much more difficult than Pharmacy. I simply took exception to this hyperbole.

Not that it matters, but I know many, many engineering students and they convinced me how stupid some engineers (particularly those on the fringes) are. I didn't believe them until some of them were in my Master's level Math classes 😉
 
you prepharmers have absolutely no clue what you are all talking about. Its all speculation from your point of view. Pharmacy is as difficult as you want it to be, you want to be thesuck when it comes to being a pharmacist, its pretty easy, you scrape by with the bare minimals. You want to make a difference, maybe save a life or 2, or at least improve patient outcomes, you work your ass off, you learn what you need to. After all school is where you build your foundational knowledge, and is the key if you want something more the lick, stick, count and pour, repeat.

It also depends on the school you end up attending. Some focus on the traditional roles of pharmacists in the community, others do more clinical, while others do more research. Some schools focus more on pharmacology and medicinal chemistry, others focus on kinetics and dynamics while others focus on therapeutics.

and oh, by far the hardest class is kinetics
 
you prepharmers have absolutely no clue what you are all talking about. Its all speculation from your point of view. Pharmacy is as difficult as you want it to be, you want to be thesuck when it comes to being a pharmacist, its pretty easy, you scrape by with the bare minimals. You want to make a difference, maybe save a life or 2, or at least improve patient outcomes, you work your ass off, you learn what you need to. After all school is where you build your foundational knowledge, and is the key if you want something more the lick, stick, count and pour, repeat.

It also depends on the school you end up attending. Some focus on the traditional roles of pharmacists in the community, others do more clinical, while others do more research. Some schools focus more on pharmacology and medicinal chemistry, others focus on kinetics and dynamics while others focus on therapeutics.

and oh, by far the hardest class is kinetics

Pharmacogenomics seem to be discussed in more and more schools.
 
I didn't know pharmacy schools make you take PChem!!! I thought it was only offer in undergrad for chem majors. I graduated with a degree in chem and I hated that class with a passion. I was hoping I would never have to take it again. LOL...

It is not the same Pchem that chem and biochem majors take. At our school, it is kind of like an introductory pharmaceutics course. It teaches everything you need to know to understand the actual pharmaceutics and pharmacokinetics courses in the next semester.

In my opinion, pharmacokinetics has been the hardest course so far.
 
Pharmacogenomics seem to be discussed in more and more schools.

I go to a school that was one of the firsts to have a class devoted to it.
P-genomics has a basis on dynamics and kinetics, to understand and appreciate the implications of genomics, you need to have a basic understanding of the other 2. Its not all about punnett squares and red vs white vs pink roses

for example, debrisoquine is a drug that is used to show the polymorphic nature of CYP2D6 (p-genomics). To understand the implications of this you need to know kinetics, how high intrinsic CL drugs even though may be metabolized by CYP2D6, their peak concentration, bioavailability etc will not be effected by this polymorphism. How if the drug is extensively metabolised, what will be its effect if CYP2D6 is not so active or hyperactive. It depends on whether the drug administered is in its active form, or needs to be activated by the body.

to put it simply, kinetics is still the toughest.
 
I go to a school that was one of the firsts to have a class devoted to it.
P-genomics has a basis on dynamics and kinetics, to understand and appreciate the implications of genomics, you need to have a basic understanding of the other 2. Its not all about punnett squares and red vs white vs pink roses

for example, debrisoquine is a drug that is used to show the polymorphic nature of CYP2D6 (p-genomics). To understand the implications of this you need to know kinetics, how high intrinsic CL drugs even though may be metabolized by CYP2D6, their peak concentration, bioavailability etc will not be effected by this polymorphism. How if the drug is extensively metabolised, what will be its effect if CYP2D6 is not so active or hyperactive. It depends on whether the drug administered is in its active form, or needs to be activated by the body.

to put it simply, kinetics is still the toughest.

I see... Great, now I have to go look up everything to understand what you just said. Thanks your making me feel as nerdy as possible tonight.
 
I go to a school that was one of the firsts to have a class devoted to it.
P-genomics has a basis on dynamics and kinetics, to understand and appreciate the implications of genomics, you need to have a basic understanding of the other 2. Its not all about punnett squares and red vs white vs pink roses

for example, debrisoquine is a drug that is used to show the polymorphic nature of CYP2D6 (p-genomics). To understand the implications of this you need to know kinetics, how high intrinsic CL drugs even though may be metabolized by CYP2D6, their peak concentration, bioavailability etc will not be effected by this polymorphism. How if the drug is extensively metabolised, what will be its effect if CYP2D6 is not so active or hyperactive. It depends on whether the drug administered is in its active form, or needs to be activated by the body.

to put it simply, kinetics is still the toughest.

It's definitely interesting, but can you imagine explaining to people of various ethnic categories because they 'require' higher/different doses of drugs (the arabic population with its hyper CYP metabolisms) because of their race? Imagine if you were a patient and hearing that rationalization - it would sound like blatant racism if things weren't phrased carefully. Then again, I doubt most people would ask about treatment protocol because they don't know any better beyond to take a certain # of whatever color pills they have.

I still think of all the classes, therapeutics is hands down the hardest and most important. There's just way too many details to remember, but it's not even about knowing the material to succeed. They ask you to synthesize what you know into some sort of rational conclusion; the sucky part is that many of our professors forget that we're not clinicians and assume we know things when we don't. I hate the rationalization of "single best answer" when the questions and answers are often phrased poorly 🙂
 
I go to a school that was one of the firsts to have a class devoted to it.
P-genomics has a basis on dynamics and kinetics, to understand and appreciate the implications of genomics, you need to have a basic understanding of the other 2. Its not all about punnett squares and red vs white vs pink roses

for example, debrisoquine is a drug that is used to show the polymorphic nature of CYP2D6 (p-genomics). To understand the implications of this you need to know kinetics, how high intrinsic CL drugs even though may be metabolized by CYP2D6, their peak concentration, bioavailability etc will not be effected by this polymorphism. How if the drug is extensively metabolised, what will be its effect if CYP2D6 is not so active or hyperactive. It depends on whether the drug administered is in its active form, or needs to be activated by the body.

to put it simply, kinetics is still the toughest.

I have heard that therapeutics is the hardest class...I believe you take it during the 3 year in pharmacy school?? I think. I have also heard pharmacology being a pain too. LOL... but in undergrad I thought biophysics and pchem...anything to do with physics was the hardest for me...so I can't imagine any classes being harder then those. Not looking forward to those for sure. LOL...
 
It's definitely interesting, but can you imagine explaining to people of various ethnic categories because they 'require' higher/different doses of drugs (the arabic population with its hyper CYP metabolisms) because of their race? Imagine if you were a patient and hearing that rationalization - it would sound like blatant racism if things weren't phrased carefully. Then again, I doubt most people would ask about treatment protocol because they don't know any better beyond to take a certain # of whatever color pills they have.

I still think of all the classes, therapeutics is hands down the hardest and most important. There's just way too many details to remember, but it's not even about knowing the material to succeed. They ask you to synthesize what you know into some sort of rational conclusion; the sucky part is that many of our professors forget that we're not clinicians and assume we know things when we don't. I hate the rationalization of "single best answer" when the questions and answers are often phrased poorly 🙂

well lucky for them we only worry about this with drugs that there is a narrow therapeutic index with. There was an episode on House MD that covered this with a drug that only worked in "black people" (no racism intended here), in typical TV fashion, the guy was offended that his drug didn't work in white patients or something like that and he wanted a different med. Luckily, we use genomics here to genotype these sorts of things or various other tests that one can do. Certainly drugs like aminoglycosides, warfarin, phenytoin, lithium and others, which are used more often then not require a careful consideration of kinetics.

im not going to argue the difficulty and importance of therapeutics, but a preceptor once told me, its the kinetics, its what happens in that time between administration and end result effect that separates you from doctors. They wont understand it and won't bother, this is your chance to shine. Its harder then therapeutics at our school, maybe because we specialize in it. It may also help in making therapeutic choices such with comboing imipenem with cilastatin (Primaxin). Cilastatin blocks the metabolism of imipenem which leads to the efficacy of the antibiotic.

Therapeutics is difficult because you are forced to make a decision on the patient when all the cards are laid out. Its not about memorization, its about taking the case into context and what is best for the patient. There is no memorization here, and maybe thats why its difficult for people. But if you know the options and you know the patient, the choice may be just that much simpler.

the more important message from comparing the classes is that school isn't a fact finding mission. its not memorizing everything for 4 years. Its more then that.
 
well lucky for them we only worry about this with drugs that there is a narrow therapeutic index with. There was an episode on House MD that covered this with a drug that only worked in "black people" (no racism intended here), in typical TV fashion, the guy was offended that his drug didn't work in white patients or something like that and he wanted a different med. Luckily, we use genomics here to genotype these sorts of things or various other tests that one can do. Certainly drugs like aminoglycosides, warfarin, phenytoin, lithium and others, which are used more often then not require a careful consideration of kinetics.

im not going to argue the difficulty and importance of therapeutics, but a preceptor once told me, its the kinetics, its what happens in that time between administration and end result effect that separates you from doctors. They wont understand it and won't bother, this is your chance to shine. Its harder then therapeutics at our school, maybe because we specialize in it. It may also help in making therapeutic choices such with comboing imipenem with cilastatin (Primaxin). Cilastatin blocks the metabolism of imipenem which leads to the efficacy of the antibiotic.

Therapeutics is difficult because you are forced to make a decision on the patient when all the cards are laid out. Its not about memorization, its about taking the case into context and what is best for the patient. There is no memorization here, and maybe thats why its difficult for people. But if you know the options and you know the patient, the choice may be just that much simpler.

the more important message from comparing the classes is that school isn't a fact finding mission. its not memorizing everything for 4 years. Its more then that.

Fascinating - how does UB integrate genomics and kinetics into the curriculum viably and reliably? I thought there was too much individual variation and thus there were no official guidelines in school that we were taught from the genomics/kinetics point of view.

We were taught the basic science kinetics which was far more then what we'd ever have to use in clinical practice, and then afterwards were advised that everything we learned should be used as a background for sound clinical judgment. An interesting point, but if that were the case, was all that suffering needlessly incurred? 🙂 We haven't really gotten into the application/dosing of the material as everything in therapeutics seems thus far emphasizing disease states and pathophysiology of pharmacotherapy, but we were made aware of certain racial traits. I definitely sense an air of authority whenever our clinicians speak, as they sense that everyone looks to UofM for guidelines and recommendations when it comes to treatment protocol. I chuckle every time that our professors say "at UofM, WE do it this way..." and expect us to pass on those clinical pearls to the decidedly unenlightened outside of our academic setting where pharmacists aren't expected to be called Dr. I don't deny UofM's stature, but I wonder how much of a difference are found between these selective stances on treatment protocol. I guess I'll see once I graduate in two years or so.

And I did see that episode of House where the patient wanted the drug that "the white people get." I had the thought the first time I made the post, but I assumed it was so obscure that no one else would remember it.
 
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Fascinating - how does UB integrate genomics and kinetics into the curriculum viably and reliably? I thought there was too much individual variation and thus there were no official guidelines in school that we were taught from the genomics/kinetics point of view.

We were taught the basic science kinetics which was far more then what we'd ever have to use in clinical practice, and then afterwards were advised that everything we learned should be used as a background for sound clinical judgment. An interesting point, but if that were the case, was all that suffering needlessly incurred? 🙂 We haven't really gotten into the application/dosing of the material as everything in therapeutics seems thus far emphasizing disease states and pathophysiology of pharmacotherapy, but we were made aware of certain racial traits. I definitely sense an air of authority whenever our clinicians speak, as they sense that everyone looks to UofM for guidelines and recommendations when it comes to treatment protocol. I chuckle every time that our professors say "at UofM, WE do it this way..." and expect us to pass on those clinical pearls to the decidedly unenlightened outside of our academic setting where pharmacists aren't expected to be called Dr. I don't deny UofM's stature, but I wonder how much of a difference are found between these selective stances on treatment protocol. I guess I'll see once I graduate in two years or so.

And I did see that episode of House where the patient wanted the drug that "the white people get." I had the thought the first time I made the post, but I assumed it was so obscure that no one else would remember it.
I haven't taken genomics yet, only got little bits n pieces from other classes, but these pharmaceutics/kinetics/dynamics/genomics classes are taught by the pharmaceutical sciences department, since the school also offers a PhD in that field of study. Anyways they are just their own separate class. We learned qualities of the various dosage forms in P1, including absorption characteristics, components, excipients etc. P2 is basic pharmacokinetics in first semester (little bit of PD); half life calculations, models of distribution, steady state kinetics, multiple dosing kinetics, absorption kinetics, metabolism and elimination kinetics. Second semester is all about specific drug issues such variability in kinetics of drugs, aminoglycoside kinetics/dosing, phenytoin, digoxin, etc. P3 1st semester I believe its more of the same. But i don't know cuz i haven't got there.

In terms of therapeutics: which is a 4 semester sequence, we focus on tying the loose ends together, combining pharmacology, kinetics, and physio/pathophysio together and applying them to treatment guidelines and other patient issues. Unfortunately for our school, there is only some overlap between courses, they don't organize the overlap of the courses efficiently as they could, so we might be forced to learn pharmacology along with therapeutics.
 
and oh, by far the hardest class is kinetics
A common opinion, but not necessarily true. This is the only class that requires thinking, rather than raw memorization, on the daily basis, and thinking is what American schools generally suck at teaching (and vast majority of American students suck at doing). And if you did bother taking quantitative analysis or analytical chemistry in undergrad, kinetics in pharmacy school is a breeze, even the three-compartment model.
 
i've talked to a few of my pharm school friends... and most of them compare pharm school as having a full time job.
 
i've talked to a few of my pharm school friends... and most of them compare pharm school as having a full time job.
That's because they haven't worked full-time, most likely. I remember pharmacy school fondly, as I was far less tired and had A LOT more free time when I was in pharamcy school, even with all the extracurriculars and working about 15 hours/week, than I do now.
 
That's because they haven't worked full-time, most likely. I remember pharmacy school fondly, as I was far less tired and had A LOT more free time when I was in pharamcy school, even with all the extracurriculars and working about 15 hours/week, than I do now.


haha well that makes me feel a bit better about pharmacy school.
 
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