Is this a good deal?

[medstu2006]

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A Welch Allyn diagnostic set containing Panoptic opthalmoscope with otoscope and lithium-ion battery, no nasal illuminator for $400. Where can I find better deals?

 

[Law2Doc]

A Welch Allyn diagnostic set containing Panoptic opthalmoscope with otoscope and lithium-ion battery, no nasal illuminator for $400. Where can I find better deals?

You don't need the Panoptic unless you are pretty sure you are going to do optho -- the bottom of the line ophthal/otoscope will suffice for all med school needs.

 

[I am Hans]

Do you really need a diagnostic kit?

Even if you do, I think the panoptic is a bit of overkill for most students.

 

[MadameLULU]

Try Ebay or amazon for better deals.

 

[Random]

If it's new, that's a pretty good deal but as people have said above, I wouldn't get the PanOptic scope. Nobody has them in their offices or clinics so you'll need to learn how to use the regular ophthalmoscope, too.

 

[lord_jeebus]

I don't think you even need the panoptic if you do plan on going into ophtho.

I bought the set you describe on ebay for $350 new a few years ago. Will probably sell soon, although I've actually used the otoscope at home a few times...

Although I don't think any diagnostic kit is worth the price for a med student, if you absolutely need one I would recommend something very small, like the Welch Allyn Compac Diagnostic Set.

 

[AmoryBlaine]

You don't need a dx kit. Jerkface salesmen try to tell you it's necessary and the med school administration say that you will want to "practice."

I can teach any M1 how to do a competent oto exam in 5 minutes. Fundo gimme 20. Within one week of starting peds you will be a master at otoscopty. The ophthalmascope is a piss-poor way to visualize the fundus anyway, don't let any attendings try to blow smoke up your arse about "AV nicking."

Save your money.

 

[MattD]

I'm not about to try to get into a spitting war with the people who have already replied. I will say this. If you want to be able to do a competent fundoscopic exam, you can do so with a regular opthalmoscope. The FOV is quite small, but people survived with them for a long time. I personally question how much was gleaned from them though, unless the practitioner spent a LOT of time practicing. The panoptic scope does give a MUCH larger FOV than a regular scope. Sure, it's marketing, but it's also true. Visualization is much easier with it, you can see more at once (think big picture), and less hunting around is necessary. Does this mean you'll do a better exam? Of course not. The quality of the exam depends on your skill with the instrument. In my own opinion, however, you can gain the ability to do a decent exam more quickly and with less practice with the panoptic. You still have to know what you're looking at back there, but you WILL see more. Now, as mentioned before, you're not going to find a panoptic hanging on the wall in a clinic. If you want to use it, you're gonna have to carry it around with you. And it's bulky. You definitely DO want to be capable of using a standard scope. But if you want to use the panoptic primarily, there's no reason not to. Our school lets us use our own equipment in OSCEs, and (correct me if I'm wrong someone) as far as I know you can use your own equipment during S2CS. So, go forth and visualize the disc, young grasshopper 🙂

 

[lord_jeebus]

as far as I know you can use your own equipment during S2CS

Nope. But they're not going to have actors with notable findings on fundoscopic exam.

I will admit that I used the panoptic on a patient with acute retinal necrosis (not diagnosed by me of course) and the view was quite impressive. Attendings who have never tried this thing are often curious and wowed by it.

 

[PeepshowJohnny]

I regret having to buy my diagnostic kit. Second year I avoided buying one because I knew I could get the equipment at any hospital...except, it turns out, the doctor who I was assigned to follow who's only opthalmoscope/otoscope was the one he carried around on his belt. So I bought a used one off ebay...only to have the damn thing break on me after six months.

In clinical years, I've had no reason to have one of my own. None of my attendings has been the old school crumedgeonly type that demands we look in everybodies eyes and ears every day (even if they're there for a broken arm) I kinda wish my fundiscopic exam skill was better, but I agree with previous posters. It's really only practical for looking for papilledema in an emergent situation, or maybe retinal detachment. Looking for retinopathy changes is so much more practically (and recommended) done by an ophthalmologist who can take nice pictures you can enjoy at your leisure.

Unless your father is an oil baron or you've got some scholarship that pays for equipment you need, I'd probably pass.

 

[medstu2006]

Thanks for all the posts guys!! I think I'll go with the PanOptic mainly because I found a good deal on it. $450 for the entire kit. I have used both, the PanOptic and the coxial and I think the PanOptic is easier to use.

 

[medstu2006]

I regret having to buy my diagnostic kit. Second year I avoided buying one because I knew I could get the equipment at any hospital...except, it turns out, the doctor who I was assigned to follow who's only opthalmoscope/otoscope was the one he carried around on his belt. So I bought a used one off ebay...only to have the damn thing break on me after six months.

In clinical years, I've had no reason to have one of my own. None of my attendings has been the old school crumedgeonly type that demands we look in everybodies eyes and ears every day (even if they're there for a broken arm) I kinda wish my fundiscopic exam skill was better, but I agree with previous posters. It's really only practical for looking for papilledema in an emergent situation, or maybe retinal detachment. Looking for retinopathy changes is so much more practically (and recommended) done by an ophthalmologist who can take nice pictures you can enjoy at your leisure.

Unless your father is an oil baron or you've got some scholarship that pays for equipment you need, I'd probably pass.

Doesn't the kit come with a life time warranty. So if you broke it, can't you get it fixed? Just wondering...

 

[Gut Shot]

Where can I find better deals?

The scope on virtually every exam room wall is a better deal: $0.00.

Looks like you're set to blow almost half a grand on your own scope, though. I guess a few people in my class didn't regret similar purchases. Good luck.

 

[Bito42]

I'm almost half way through my MSIII year and have NEVER (from MSI till now) had to use my otoscope/opthalamoscope (20 y/o model passed down to me from my mom, who's an FP).

 

[MattD]

Nope. But they're not going to have actors with notable findings on fundoscopic exam.

I will admit that I used the panoptic on a patient with acute retinal necrosis (not diagnosed by me of course) and the view was quite impressive. Attendings who have never tried this thing are often curious and wowed by it.

Aha, thanks, i was misinformed 🙂

One thing to consider is whether you plan on doing any sort of missions or health fair type work. You may need your own equipment in those sorts of settings.

 

[greenmarker]

this is a dumb question, but, how do you charge it? or do you just replace the battery? the family friend that I'm borrowing the oto/optho from said something about the battery not working, but I dont know if he meant that it wasnt charged or that I need to replace the battery.

 

[MattD]

this is a dumb question, but, how do you charge it? or do you just replace the battery? the family friend that I'm borrowing the oto/optho from said something about the battery not working, but I dont know if he meant that it wasnt charged or that I need to replace the battery.

If you're talking about the welch allyn scopes, there are 2 interchangeable handles. One has a built in Li-Ion battery that you charge on the wall. The other one is hollow and accepts C-cell batteries OR Ni-Cad rechargeables. You get either/or, not both.



I'm gonna rant briefly here also about some previous comments. I can understand the argument "save your money, use what's on the wall".. some people have a smaller budget than others, I can dig that. But saying things like the panoptic is 'overkill' for a med student, similar to the stethoscope threads where people say that X or Y high quality steth is 'overkill' for a med student, just doesn't make any sense. You're a student. You ALREADY aren't good at seeing/hearing things. Why would you think it better to buy equipment with the lowest fidelity? So you can make it HARDER to see/hear things than it already is? That's got to be the most asinine concept I've ever heard. Sure, you should learn to use a regular opthalmoscope, but in the meantime if the larger field of view helps you learn what the hell the disk even looks like, why not use it?

 

[karmega5]

My school, FSU, required us to buy a diagnostic set, but I guess very few do. We were allowed to buy the panoptic if we wanted, but our exams on giving exams have to be done with the coax head (you can buy this as an attachment), and boards I believe makes you use the coax.

 

[psipsina]

I'm gonna rant briefly here also about some previous comments. I can understand the argument "save your money, use what's on the wall".. some people have a smaller budget than others, I can dig that. But saying things like the panoptic is 'overkill' for a med student, similar to the stethoscope threads where people say that X or Y high quality steth is 'overkill' for a med student, just doesn't make any sense. You're a student. You ALREADY aren't good at seeing/hearing things. Why would you think it better to buy equipment with the lowest fidelity? So you can make it HARDER to see/hear things than it already is? That's got to be the most asinine concept I've ever heard. Sure, you should learn to use a regular opthalmoscope, but in the meantime if the larger field of view helps you learn what the hell the disk even looks like, why not use it?

I agree. I bought the expensive set and I have loved having it. I practiced at home and have gotten much better with both types of opthalmoscopes (we got the coax head for free with the panoptic), but I don't think I would have even known what I was looking for if I hadn't figured it out with the panoptic first. We are required to have our own sets for our clinical medicine coursework in the first two years and many of the hospitals in this area do not have scopes in every room. Also not every hospital/clinic has them on the walls . . our children's hospital, which is a large well funded private hospital (so not a post-katrina issue) only has 2 sets per floor, when I rotate there third year I'll carry my own set instead of having to hunt those down everytime I have a kid with an earache. I would talk to upperclassmen and see if they think having your own set is worth it.

 

[TRAMD]

I was the only student who missed the day when our class bought stethoscopes and oto/ophtho scopes from the sleazy Welch-Allyn rep. I asked my dean if I really had to buy one, he said no and I was the only person in class without one (I already had a stethoscope). It only affected me once when a crabby old peds doc got angry with me when I explained that we weren't required to buy one and he used his own and I didn't have one. Yes, they actually had a peds clinic WITHOUT oto/ophtho scopes on the wall . . . stupidest thing I have ever seen. I mean . . . urologists have them on their walls in their exam rooms. My dad bought me one shortly therafter and it has sat in its case for over two years except once when my wife thought MY son had an ear infection . . . never used on a patient. Save your money.

Sorry, I become a fan of the ellipsis when it gets late . . .

Oh, my son didn't have an ear infection.

 

[LifetimeDoc]

I bought the "expensive" Welch Allyn 97200-MC 3.5v Halogen Coaxial Ophthalmoscope/Otoscope set with nickel cadmium batter and integrated wall charger. I was able to get it from a M3 for $200 even, so I felt I was getting a good deal for a $550 set (online discount stores at $450). It pays to check your upperclassmen first to buy unwanted supplies and books that you might want before turning to online sources, though I bought some books from half.com because they were cheap and new.

 

[enlightenedhick]

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