LOR check

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DoctreDrey

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1. Microbiology prof
2. Biochemistry prof -- the course is titled "Biochemistry Laboratory" which is kinda misleading bc theres a lecture component + midterms + lab practicals. The course is offered by MCB (Molecular & Cellular Biology) department.
3. Dentist
4. PI (an MD)

I think i will be applying to: UCLA, UCSF, USC, UOP, BU, Tufts, NYU, Michigan, Washington, Columbia, Buffalo, Stony brook, Penn, Temple, OHSU, Maryland

(im a CA resident)

Should I replace PI letter with chemistry prof since a few schools require it?
 
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You need a 3rd science prof for Columbia. Many schools are specific in that they need to be professors that taught you. Not sure if your PI letter will count. (Good to have though, since many schools want it if you've done research.)
 
DoctreDrey said:
Will these cover all the bases for the schools I'm applying to:
1. Microbiology prof
2. Biochemistry prof -- the course is titled "Biochemistry Laboratory" which is kinda misleading bc theres a lecture component + midterms + lab practicals. The course is offered by MCB (Molecular & Cellular Biology) department.
3. Dentist
4. PI (an MD)
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A lab course with a lecture component does not change the course content.
 
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i dunno some schools like tufts specifically say BIOLOGY...i dunno if that's okay with microbiology or any other science...

anyone?
 
sassykat said:
You need a 3rd science prof for Columbia. Many schools are specific in that they need to be professors that taught you. Not sure if your PI letter will count. (Good to have though, since many schools want it if you've done research.)
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Well, i'm getting course units for it and she teaches me the science and physiology behind the research but I am not "graded".It just appears as pass or no pass on my transcript.

I read on some past threads that ppl have gotten into columbia without 3 science LORs. I dunno, anyone else have suggestions?
 
DoctreDrey said:
Well, i'm getting course units for it and she teaches me the science and physiology behind the research but I am not "graded".It just appears as pass or no pass on my transcript.

I read on some past threads that ppl have gotten into columbia without 3 science LORs. I dunno, anyone else have suggestions?
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I know what you mean. A lot of people get credits for research, but it's not the same as a lecture course. You can ask people all you want on SDN but we're not the ones making the decisions, just giving you our advice. In the end it's up to you if you want to play it risky or safe.
 
sassykat said:
I know what you mean. A lot of people get credits for research, but it's not the same as a lecture course. You can ask people all you want on SDN but we're not the ones making the decisions, just giving you our advice. In the end it's up to you if you want to play it risky or safe.
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well, the PI letter will be rly strong, which I'd much rather use over another "good" science letter just for the sake of 1 school, which is probably a reach school for me anyways...am i right?
 
DoctreDrey said:
well, the PI letter will be rly strong, which I'd much rather use over another "good" science letter just for the sake of 1 school, which is probably a reach school for me anyways...am i right?
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Too bad what you would rather use is not what ds would rather have and guess which one is more important?
 
doc toothache said:
Too bad what you would rather use is not what ds would rather have and guess which one is more important?
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hold on, can i submit more than 4 LORs to aadsas and pick and choose which letters to send to each school individually?
 
DoctreDrey said:
hold on, can i submit more than 4 LORs to aadsas and pick and choose which letters to send to each school individually?
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yeah can we do this??? some schools require different LORs than others...I don't want all of my recipient schools to get the same letters
 
well a bio lab is still a bio course. the LOR requirements do not say "excluding labs" (except for USC)...so i think you should be okay?
 
skylark said:
well a bio lab is still a bio course. the LOR requirements do not say "excluding labs" (except for USC)...so i think you should be okay?
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You seem to be oblivious to the intent of the letter of recommendation. But if you believe that a letter from a science lab course is the same one from a professor who taught an advanced course knock yourself out.
 
doc toothache said:
You seem to be oblivious to the intent of the letter of recommendation. But if you believe that a letter from a science lab course is the same one from a professor who taught an advanced course knock yourself out.
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What then is the intent of the LOR? A lab professor would be just as aware of one's academic ability (if not more so as judged from the labs I have had)....
 
bconway52 said:
What then is the intent of the LOR? A lab professor would be just as aware of one's academic ability (if not more so as judged from the labs I have had)....
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Right on. After all, lab courses are so much more challenging academically than any course in science curricula.
 
doc toothache said:
Right on. After all, lab courses are so much more challenging academically than any course in science curricula.
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Why can't you just elaborate your points rather than being sarcastic and rude in nearly all of your posts?

To elaborate my point: in all of the labs I have had we have had to explain the concepts behind what we are experimenting (that is, the concepts we have learned in lecture). Sure, there are not as many tests in lab and you are not tested on as much detail, but a lab professor would know if you are an idiot or if you know the material and understand what you are doing.
 
the lab courses i've had were generally harder than lecture only
 
Unless it is a course offered at a one room college it is unlikely that a professor will be teaching an elementary lab course- more likely it will be a TA (grad student, sometimes a post doc).
 
doc toothache said:
Unless you went to a one room college it is unlikely that a professor will be teaching an elementary lab course- more likely it was a TA.
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I have had multiple PhD professors lead my lab courses...and it wasn't at a one room college - it was a state college with nearly 500 professors.

Also, the OP was talking about biochem lab - I wouldn't classify this as an "elementary lab course".
 
I have to say I agree with what doc is saying. Yeah, maybe you can squirm your way around some of the rules, but the INTENT of the letter is that it's coming from a professor that taught you one of the main science lectures. Almost all labs are easier than their lecture component..you can say that your lab had lectures and exams (a lot do), but c'mon..just be real with yourself. They don't contain nearly as much material, and the focus is on lab applications - not the CORE science. Most ds admissions people have been through college so you're not really going to fool anyone, and you're not going to have the opportunity to explain yourself many times over like on this thread. You keep trying to justify your position and I really understand that you want the better letters, but we're not the ones making the rules. Even if you can get your away around the titles, the problem comes with what will be said in the letter. Your lab prof will probably talk about your LAB skills/things concerning lab. Your PI letter won't be about you as a student in their course (after all, research credit is not really a course), it will be about you doing research in their lab. It's a different point of view, see what i mean? I'm not saying to nix these letters...if I were in your position I would get another letter from a science prof. Your bioc lab letter will be perceived as weak IMO. LORS aren't the most important thing in your app so don't stress too much about it. Anyway, that's my 2 cents, i'm out! Good luck 🙂

PS: Keep the PI letter, you will need it for apps that ask you about your research.
 
sassykat said:
I have to say I agree with what doc is saying. Yeah, maybe you can squirm your way around some of the rules, but the INTENT of the letter is that it's coming from a professor that taught you one of the main science lectures. Almost all labs are easier than their lecture component..you can say that your lab had lectures and exams (a lot do), but c'mon..just be real with yourself. They don't contain nearly as much material, and the focus is on lab applications - not the CORE science. Most ds admissions people have been through college so you're not really going to fool anyone, and you're not going to have the opportunity to explain yourself many times over like on this thread. You keep trying to justify your position and I really understand that you want the better letters, but we're not the ones making the rules. Even if you can get your away around the titles, the problem comes with what will be said in the letter. Your lab prof will probably talk about your LAB skills/things concerning lab. Your PI letter won't be about you as a student in their course (after all, research credit is not really a course), it will be about you doing research in their lab. It's a different point of view, see what i mean? I'm not saying to nix these letters...if I were in your position I would get another letter from a science prof. Your bioc lab letter will be perceived as weak IMO. LORS aren't the most important thing in your app so don't stress too much about it. Anyway, that's my 2 cents, i'm out! Good luck 🙂

PS: Keep the PI letter, you will need it for apps that ask you about your research.
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ok ill try to get another science letter from some old profs but the problem is many of them dont know me all that well (if at all) or may not remember me. should i ask them anyway?
 
i think you should get one as a "back-up" in the case that a school will not accept what you have..that way you don't have to scramble at the last minute. better to be prepared right? if they all don't know you very well pick the one you got the best grade with. profs get asked all the time for LOR so don't feel shy. worst case scenario - they say no. good luck!
 
sassykat said:
i think you should get one as a "back-up" in the case that a school will not accept what you have..that way you don't have to scramble at the last minute. better to be prepared right? if they all don't know you very well pick the one you got the best grade with. profs get asked all the time for LOR so don't feel shy. worst case scenario - they say no. good luck!
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ok thanks! I figure I should get one for USC at least, since they explicitly said no lab-based profs.

I started a thread asking about Interfolio since I may have to resort to using that. If anyone could answer my questions regarding Interfolio I'd appreciate it immensely. Thanks!!

this whole app process has been so nerve-wracking for me and the cycle hasn't even started lol. I'm checking studentdoctor practically every moment I'm on break from studying for the DAT. sighhh
 
BUMP

should i replace PI letter with chemistry prof letter? since columbia, buffalo, BU, and some other schools prefer one chemistry letter and USC wants no lab based profs?
 
damn
i already applied and can't really ask for more letters

i have:
1. chem professor
2. bio profesor
3. dentist
4. PI

I'm thinking you can argue that a PI is also a bio professor, and for colombia, they don't specify that the professor must be teaching in a classroom
 
suhshi said:
damn
i already applied and can't really ask for more letters

i have:
1. chem professor
2. bio profesor
3. dentist
4. PI

I'm thinking you can argue that a PI is also a bio professor, and for colombia, they don't specify that the professor must be teaching in a classroom
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Not only the PI needs to be a science professor who teaches at the school, but YOU need to be from his/her class for Columbia. I checked with them.
 
yea, so im asking if i should just play it safe and subtitute the PI letter for a real chem prof
 
2ne1 said:
Not only the PI needs to be a science professor who teaches at the school, but YOU need to be from his/her class for Columbia. I checked with them.
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damn. guess im stuck. thanks for the info though
 
DoctreDrey said:
BUMP

should i replace PI letter with chemistry prof letter? since columbia, buffalo, BU, and some other schools prefer one chemistry letter and USC wants no lab based profs?
Click to expand...

Where did you read/hear that Columbia & BU prefer having a chemistry letter? From what i've read on their websites, Columbia just asks for three LORs from science professors (or 1 composite committee letter) and BU specifies that the LORs should be from "senior faculty members" with atleast 2 of the 3 being from science profs. Am I missing something?
 
dctim211 said:
Where did you read/hear that Columbia & BU prefer having a chemistry letter? From what i've read on their websites, Columbia just asks for three LORs from science professors (or 1 composite committee letter) and BU specifies that the LORs should be from "senior faculty members" with atleast 2 of the 3 being from science profs. Am I missing something?
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well columbia needs 3 letters so i need a 3rd science anyways but a few other schools (maybe im remembering wrong) prefer 1 chem letter and I know my biochem letter wont fulfill USC requirements. So im thinking of substituting my PI letter for a chem one. And maybe send a PI letter through interfolio or smthing. What do you guys think?
 
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