lors for IMGs

[schmartdoc]

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Hello, I am returning to find out if I have to get LORs from each dept. I am a US citizen in third year MBBS program in India. I plan to apply to residency programs in the US after finishing. The situation is that at my medical school, the subjects are taught by Interns and PG students and we hardly get to see the teachers. There is very little interaction with the head doctors and they are mostly unapproachable during hospital rounds. I have exam in ENT, Opthal, and PSM in November 2010 and OBGYN, Medicine, Surgery, and Pediatrics next year. . How should I approach these depts. to get LORS when time comes?

 

[schandan13]

Hello, I am returning to find out if I have to get LORs from each dept. I am a US citizen in third year MBBS program in India. I plan to apply to residency programs in the US after finishing. The situation is that at my medical school, the subjects are taught by Interns and PG students and we hardly get to see the teachers. There is very little interaction with the head doctors and they are mostly unapproachable during hospital rounds. I have exam in ENT, Opthal, and PSM in November 2010 and OBGYN, Medicine, Surgery, and Pediatrics next year. . How should I approach these depts. to get LORS when time comes?

Professors don't really care about LORs in India. Alot of them don't even know what they are for and alot of the times they might get offended if you tell them you are preparing for the USMLE. You should target to do electives during your internship in the US (called externships) and get LORs from attendings and PDs here. LORs from Indian physicians won't count for too much. If you are interested in a specific field, go and meet the Head during his OPD or ward hours and ask him if he would sign an LORs that you prepare. That should work since it would minimize time/energy/effort for him. But, trust me, he/she might still refuse.🙄 You're much better off with LORs post USCE.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Schandan is correct.

LORs from foreign professors, unless educated in the US, are essentially worthless. LORs from interns and residents/registrars, even US ones, are worth even less.

If your goal is to do your residency in the US, then you should be thinking about spending some time during your final year doing electives in the US. THIS is where you will get your LORs - from US faculty while doing US rotations. Also bear in mind that some programs REQUIRE US clinical experience.

Now if the above is impossible, then recognize that your LORs are not going to mean much in the way of supporting your application and simply try your best to get some good ones (or at least ones that don't sink your application in the event that someone even reads them).

 

[schmartdoc]

Thank you both for taking my worries away. When I go home next time I will try to work (shadow) under one or two doctors. I am glad I asked this question.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Thank you both for taking my worries away. When I go home next time I will try to work (shadow) under one or two doctors. I am glad I asked this question.

Please do not confuse shadowing (which is what pre-med students do) and clinical rotations/electives. Shadowing is akin to an observership - you will have no clinical duties and no way for the letter writer to assess your clinical skills and little way to assess your fund of knowledge.

What you want (and again, what some programs require) is US clinical experience. This is NOT shadowing but an official rotation as part of your medical education.

 

[schmartdoc]

Now I understand. Please tell me how I should go about doing that and any necessary paperwork I need to take care of of.

 

[schandan13]

Now I understand. Please tell me how I should go about doing that and any necessary paperwork I need to take care of of.

Here's the plan.

1. Complete pre final and final prof. The last thing you want is a suppli and delay your graduation.

2. Try and read a bit of First Aid and Kaplan notes during pre final and final years. Spend not more than an hour or something a day. The focus should be MBBS and not the Step right now. Try and find out if any professors at your college are into research. Get in good with them and try to get published. If not, well, read on.

3. Towards the end of final prof, around October-November, start emailing hospitals to check what slots they have available and for which months. Whether they accept international/visiting students for clerkships or not. Whether they charge a fee or not. Whether they require Step 1 or not (most would). Focus on the sub-specialties in your field of interest. And tell hospitals you are looking for something between June - August (intern year)

4. Pass final prof and register for internship. Study hard for 3 months and get done with the step. You should have your scores by end of April. Side by side keep contacting programs and telling them that you want a slot around June-August. If you're lucky you may get 2 months. It's just a matter of where you apply and how early you apply.

5. Study 2 days and give the TOEFL. Aim at a 100+ (Harvard wants a 100 on the iBT).

6. Come here and and start preparing for CS. Before you go back to join internship, give the CS. Go back and start internship (Aug 1) (you'll have 2 months of repeats which you'll have to cover later). Start with CK prep and give it by October end (you have the months Aug, Sept and most of Oct to prepare, and given that you had recently cleared final prof, you shouldn't take longer). Have your scores in by November end. Continue internship and finish that up by March (given that you have 2 months repeats). Get your MBBS and send all transcripts ASAP to ECFMG for certification. Give Step 3 (that needs ECFMG certification). Have everything ready by Sept 1 (the year AFTER your intern year) and apply to ERAS.

If you do well on the steps, get 2 months of solid USCE with 2-3 letters from the senior faculty/PD, are ECFMG certified and have cleared step 3 by the time you apply, you SIGNIFICANTLY increase your chances of matching.

That would've been my plan anyway. 🙄

 

[schmartdoc]

I thank you so much. This road map is extremely useful to me and I am glad I asked this question now.

 

[Shoushu]

I thank you so much. This road map is extremely useful to me and I am glad I asked this question now.

schandan13's posts are very good. Opens eyes for people who are also Indian-American, Chinese-American, Filipino-American , recent European immigrant , who probably considered just doing MBBS in their ancestor's country, and come back, be U.S. doc.



After reading this full thread, makes me think Caribbean MD is less arduous option than Asian MBBS or "Asian MD," U.S. mainland clinical rotations are built in during Semesters 5-10 or 6 to 10.

 

[schandan13]

schandan13's posts are very good. Opens eyes for people who are also Indian-American, Chinese-American, Filipino-American , recent European immigrant , who probably considered just doing MBBS in their ancestor's country, and come back, be U.S. doc.



After reading this full thread, makes me think Caribbean MD is less arduous option than Asian MBBS or "Asian MD," U.S. mainland clinical rotations are built in during Semesters 5-10 or 6 to 10.

Yes, choose wisely. In the attempt to save a few years, you significantly hamper your chances of getting back especially in competitive fields.

 

[alexmax021]

Schandan is correct.

LORs from foreign professors, unless educated in the US, are essentially worthless. LORs from interns and residents/registrars, even US ones, are worth even less.

If your goal is to do your residency in the US, then you should be thinking about spending some time during your final year doing electives in the US. THIS is where you will get your LORs - from US faculty while doing US rotations. Also bear in mind that some programs REQUIRE US clinical experience.

Now if the above is impossible, then recognize that your LORs are not going to mean much in the way of supporting your application and simply try your best to get some good ones (or at least ones that don't sink your application in the event that someone even reads them).

Thanks for sharing.

 

[Jeesan]

Thank you for all the posts. Very helpful! I hope you guys could also advise me with my situation

I'm from Bangladesh and here after completing the final prof and during our internship we're referred to as intern doctors and also are able to use the title Dr. so I don't think we'll be considered medical students and be eligible for the electives but in essence we are 'students' cause we're learning, have presentations, a few exams and have to rotate through all the departments and we aren't 'licensed'. Before completing the prof, we do rotate through wards but we still have lectures and classes to attend so wont be able to do the electives when we'll be 'medical students'. So how can I get LORs from US physicians? Would I be able to get them when I do 'externships' that I see some agents online (such as IMGprep.org) are saying they can arrange? Can someone enlighten me more about these?

Thank You in advance!