Lost in transition after law

[JurisMedical]

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Hello Ladies and Gentlemen!
I can really use some encouraging and substantive advice. I recently finished law school with mediocre grades (school's grading policy-no one over 3.0) and my undergraduate business GPA is at 3.1. I am open to Caribbean and honestly believe I can get good grades in pre-med coursework. I am getting mixed information with some telling me I have no shot at an American Med school while others suggesting a Post-bac but then saying post-bac is as competitive as med schools and that my under graduate work from 10+ years ago will keep me out of all post-bacs. I have considered taking the GRE but don't know how much difference a good GRE sccore will make in post-bac admissions.

My question is whether I should exclusivly pursue Caribbean, take pre-reqs at a community college or take GRE and pursue a post-bac. I would highly appreciate some insight.

Thanks.

JM

 

[PTWOB02]

I am getting mixed information with some telling me I have no shot at an American Med school while others suggesting a Post-bac but then saying post-bac is as competitive as med schools and that my under graduate work from 10+ years ago will keep me out of all post-bacs. I have considered taking the GRE but don't know how much difference a good GRE sccore will make in post-bac admissions.

My question is whether I should exclusivly pursue Caribbean, take pre-reqs at a community college or take GRE and pursue a post-bac. I would highly appreciate some insight.

Who is saying you have no shot at Med School? Let me guess, pre-allo kids? What a bunch of idiots. Talk about blind leading the blind. Anyway, don't kid yourself, you are gonna have to work really hard to get accepted anywhere but I don't think your situation is as dire as you think. Most Post Bacc programs require a minimum of 3.0 undergrad GPA so with your 3.1 GPA you should get accepted somewhere. Make sure to apply broadly to different schools as Post Bacc programs range in their competitiveness. I got accepted to a solid Post Bacc program with my 2.5 undergrad GPA from 10 years ago too, so if I can do it, you can do it too. Also, most Post Bacc schools don't require for you to take GRE. You can submit your SAT / ACT if you have those; some Post Bacc schools don't require neither of those. Search around, here is the link I used:

http://services.aamc.org/postbac/

As far as the Caribbean selection goes, I would highly caution against it. Everything I've read on SDN forums screams to stay away from those schools as it's really hard to get a residency in the States afterwards. Not impossible but much harder.

As far as whether to do a formal Post Bacc program or informal (where you take classes yourself either at the community college or university), it's your call. Personally, I chose to enroll in the formal Post Bacc program because it was the right fit for me given their class selection, high reputation of the program in the area, low cost of living in Texas and valuable guidance provided by the advisors (where you receive an all-important letter of recommendation from the committee upon program's completion). I had to relocate from a different state to go to this school but it was worth it for me.

Your mileage may vary. Feel free to PM me with any specific questions.

 

[Alex557]

Who cares what other people say? If you're willing to do the work and you're committed then go for it.

But are you applying to medical school because you don't want to do law? Why didn't you apply to medical school first instead of law school? Is med school a last resort at doing something "respectable" and that will impress your family?

If you're applying to medical school because you want to please your family, save yourself the time and money by not doing it. But if you want to do it because it's in your heart (be honest!) then go for it.

As far as the Caribbean selection goes, I would highly caution against it. Everything I've read on SDN forums screams to stay away from those schools as it's really hard to get a residency in the States afterwards. Not impossible but much harder.

I would apply to offshore schools as a safety net. I know someone who went to a Caribbean school and she did have a hard time matching into a residency. She had to go off and do research in order become competitive. But if you want to be a doctor bad enough, do what you need to do in order to make it happen. Don't let anything stop you...period!

Again, what's your reason for wanting to transition from law to medicine?

 

[yankswin2011]

(school's grading policy-no one over 3.0)

JM

What kind of law school did you go to -- I've never heard of such a thing -- please be more truthful...Because if that was true, then every student will be screwed in trying to get a job -- I don't think the school is that dumb to do that to its students. Alternatively, if that was really true, then you should have been more sharp before you decided to go to a school with a "no one over 3.0" grading policy!!

It's not that you have NO SHOT but you have to play the percentages -- but based on your history -- your "mediocre grades" in law school (which you attribute to the law school's fault and not yours), and mediocre grades in an arguably easy major (sorry but you will get a lot of flack from these hard-care pre-med students who will judge you and make fun of your business major --I'm not judging you, I'm just letting you know how people will likely react to your "credentials"), you really need to do super well in post-bacs but you can probably get into Carribean medical schools. Good luck.

 

[TriagePreMed]

I think what will hurt you most is the <3.0 in a law degree. If the law school is not regarded as first tier, your chances will be hurting more and more.

A 3.1 is definitely a low uGPA to get into Med School. This may be reparable by taking enough post-baccalaureate work. If you keep a 4.0 over 50-60 units, very few ADCOM will weigh the initial grades as heavily. And yes, you could get into a post-baccalaureate with a 3.1.

Are you out of the game? No. Are you limping? Yes.

Work on the post-bacc for now. Once you got the grades, come back.

 

[Law2Doc]

Hello Ladies and Gentlemen!
I can really use some encouraging and substantive advice. I recently finished law school with mediocre grades (school's grading policy-no one over 3.0) and my undergraduate business GPA is at 3.1. ...
JM

you did undergrad business and then law. You need to make sure you research the notion of being a physician pretty significantly because you are coming from far afield. I'd spend a while volunteering and shadowing before even considering postbac. And have a really good reason why medicine, since from your credentials it seems like your third career choice, and that's going to make adcoms nervous.

 

[JurisMedical]

What kind of law school did you go to -- I've never heard of such a thing -- please be more truthful...Because if that was true, then every student will be screwed in trying to get a job -- I don't think the school is that dumb to do that to its students. Alternatively, if that was really true, then you should have been more sharp before you decided to go to a school with a "no one over 3.0" grading policy!!

It's not that you have NO SHOT but you have to play the percentages -- but based on your history -- your "mediocre grades" in law school (which you attribute to the law school's fault and not yours), and mediocre grades in an arguably easy major (sorry but you will get a lot of flack from these hard-care pre-med students who will judge you and make fun of your business major --I'm not judging you, I'm just letting you know how people will likely react to your "credentials"), you really need to do super well in post-bacs but you can probably get into Carribean medical schools. Good luck.

Some of you are clearly full of it. I did go to a school with such a policy but did come out of it with no debt 🙂. Also, every single student from my law school is screwed because of this policy. I blame my low gpa on the law school but never said that I ranked the highest, that is on me. I worked over 50+ hours during my undergrad and at least 35-40 hours during law school. The no debt part has to do with a 100% scholarship.

The legal education did what I wanted it to do for me, it made me really good money in the first 2 years, that is why I can afford Caribbean and pay cash. I made more money in 2 years after graduating than most lawyers make over 6 years.

Now, another person asked whether I am going into medicine to impress my family, no, I am grown up. I have gotten all I wanted to out of my law degree. If I work another year before starting post-bac, I will be near retirement. That is why I am going for different kind of fun and a different experience. If I did not want it bad enough, I would not throw away all that I can make by practicing law for just a few more years.

On a positive note, thank you PTW for your encouraging and useful feedback. The others need to learn a thing or two from you.

 

[zorroy2k]

What kind of law school did you go to -- I've never heard of such a thing -- please be more truthful...Because if that was true, then every student will be screwed in trying to get a job -- I don't think the school is that dumb to do that to its students. Alternatively, if that was really true, then you should have been more sharp before you decided to go to a school with a "no one over 3.0" grading policy!!

It's not that you have NO SHOT but you have to play the percentages -- but based on your history -- your "mediocre grades" in law school (which you attribute to the law school's fault and not yours), and mediocre grades in an arguably easy major (sorry but you will get a lot of flack from these hard-care pre-med students who will judge you and make fun of your business major --I'm not judging you, I'm just letting you know how people will likely react to your "credentials"), you really need to do super well in post-bacs but you can probably get into Carribean medical schools. Good luck.

You clearly don't know what you are talking about. His law school grades will play a negligible role in whether he gets into med school. Also, law2doc I hardly think it is fair to say that his business major was a career. Lay off him and maybe embrace the fact that he may be able to bring something more to the table than the typical bio major.

 

[TriagePreMed]

You clearly don't know what you are talking about. His law school grades will play a negligible role in whether he gets into med school. Also, law2doc I hardly think it is fair to say that his business major was a career. Lay off him and maybe embrace the fact that he may be able to bring something more to the table than the typical bio major.

You really think that being a part of a graduate program that requires high skill in memorizing would have "negligible" effect on admissions? I seriously doubt this. Had he been an average student, I would say negligible.

I also think that calling his business degree a "career" is a bit much.

 

[zorroy2k]

Adcoms pay little attention to law school gpa, that is why it is not included in a student's overall gpa. It is not seen in same light as getting a masters in accounting for example. Law school is considered a professional school, not a graduate school. One of the reasons for this is b/c law schools have intense curves. For example, my law school curve is 3.0 and im actually just under this number. Adcoms i speak to r much more concerned with science gpa. Also, law has nothing to do with science/Medicine so it is not a good indicator of med school success. Lastly, if u look through threads on this topic u will see that law school gpa doesnt play big role in admissions process. In fact, I believe law2doc has written about this topic several times on here.

P.s. Law school has nothing to do with memorizing. Where did u get ur j.d. Btw?

 

[Law2Doc]

You clearly don't know what you are talking about. His law school grades will play a negligible role in whether he gets into med school. Also, law2doc I hardly think it is fair to say that his business major was a career. Lay off him and maybe embrace the fact that he may be able to bring something more to the table than the typical bio major.

First, adcoms don't care about law school grades UNLESS you do poorly. If you do poorly in a professional school, that is a red flag. Most (although not all) grad and professional schools have some degree of grade inflation, and doing badly at one can worry some adcoms. This is a hurdle that can be overcome, but it is a hurdle nonetheless. I think if you want to reference me on this topic (which is fine with me), you need to be more precise in documenting my views. My view is that a law degree is treated as an EC, and the grades are generally ignored UNLESS you do poorly. This caveat seems to have gotten lost in your paraphrase of my prior posts.

Second, a person who points in multiple direction over his career and then says he wants to go into med school has to lay a better track record for "why medicine" than the guy who always wanted it and had majors and a career that suggested that. I'm not saying business was a career. I am saying the guy has a "tell" as to what he was interested in at various stages of his life, and it wasn't health. First he was interested in business in college. Then he went into law, which dovetails nicely with business if he did transactional stuff. Now he is looking at medicine. You need to connect these dots much better or it sounds flighty. My suggestion is to spend a year of shadowing/volunteering first, to show you looked before you leaped. And then, IF YOU LIKE IT, then by all means try postbac. If you jump into postbac without demonstrating that you spent the time to learn what medicine is about, that along with the business schooling and law background is going to look flighty. Instead, if you make it a natural trajectory into healthcare, with plenty of knowing what you are getting into, it seems a lot less like you are still trying to find yourself. that's all I'm saying. I am far enough down the law to doctor road to know of what I speak.

 

[Smiler]

Can you be a little more precise about what u mean by "poorly"?

 

[Law2Doc]

Can you be a little more precise about what u mean by "poorly"?

OP suggested a GPA in law school of below a 3.0. I would say that would be concerning to adcoms.

 

[yankswin2011]

Also, law has nothing to do with science/Medicine so it is not a good indicator of med school success. .

A big part of law school classes requires analytical and critical thinking skills -- are you trying to say that medicine does not require such skills? Are you saying that hard work, which is normally required in law school, is not a good indicator of your success in medical school?

If I work another year before starting post-bac, I will be near retirement.

If you are near retirement -- how old are you? 65? If so, please don't waste your medical school seat for someone who can actually live to practice medicine and save some lives. Have a nice life.

 

[Alex557]

Some of you are clearly full of it. I did go to a school with such a policy but did come out of it with no debt 🙂...

The legal education did what I wanted it to do for me, it made me really good money in the first 2 years, that is why I can afford Caribbean and pay cash. I made more money in 2 years after graduating than most lawyers make over 6 years.

Now, another person asked whether I am going into medicine to impress my family, no, I am grown up. I have gotten all I wanted to out of my law degree. If I work another year before starting post-bac, I will be near retirement. That is why I am going for different kind of fun and a different experience. If I did not want it bad enough, I would not throw away all that I can make by practicing law for just a few more years...

I was the one who made a comment as to why you were switching from law to medicine. And I asked if you were doing it to look impressive and competitive.

Based on what you're saying, law isn't that interesting to you anymore and you want to do something else to do, something more challenging. Fair enough. Also, I'm in no way discouraging you from getting into medicine.

But I would like to know, how has the legal field not met your intellectual needs? Apparently money isn't a problem, but emotionally-intellectually, being a lawyer isn't challenging enough for you. Maybe you do need to try something else. But you also need to explore medicine a bit before jumping into post-bac classes. Law2Doc gave you great suggestions about shadowing doctors and volunteering in a clinic.

So look, I'm not trying to shoot you down but I do want to help you become more concrete as to why you want to get into medicine. Saying "I want more challenging work" is too vague. What does "challenging work" mean to you on a personal level? Describe it.

You seem to only want information on How do I get into medicine ASAP? without taking into context WHY do I want to get into medicine? As an adult, you really need to get clear as to what you're doing and WHY. And I'm going to say this, it seems you only want to get into medicine because it's prestigious (like law) and you don't know what else do to. And I don't care if you disagree with me or not.

So explain to us what's your reason for wanting medicine and why you want to do to it. Of course you can excel in your post-bac and get A's. But if you can't explain to an admissions board why you want to be a physician, then what's the point? Clear this up and tell us why medicine is going to be more challenging for you than law. And drop the whole I'm close to retirement and all that jazz. Just be yourself.

- Peace