Lots of Questions

[BodaciousCaiman]

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Hello, I've been lurking for a couple of years but this is my first post. I debated whether or not I should post in hSDN, I figured I would be better off here as I have vet specific questions (hopefully this is okay).

First, I am looking to get advice or suggestions on my plans after high school. I know I'm looking years into the future and my career goals are probably going to change slightly, but having some sort of plan laid out really motivates me to get through my tough classes.
So to give a bit of background info, I'm on track to graduate from high school in the spring with an associates (plus tons of pre-reqs for a zoology major knocked out). I'm going to attend the same university next fall to get my bachelors because I'm pretty sure I qualify for a full tuition waiver (*fingers crossed* retaking the ACT in December just to be safe) plus I live near campus so I won't have to worry about finding housing. I have considered other undergraduate programs but keeping costs low is my #1 priority.

For my bachelors I'm minoring in Japanese and tossing around the idea of double majoring in zoology and microbiology since I'd be taking a lot of the required micro classes as electives anyway, but would there be any real benefit to this? If I don't double major I would be able to graduate in about 2-3 years but I think I would take that extra time I'm not in school to get more vet experience and save up money. I'm not in too much of a rush to give my soul to vet school lol ^^;

My 1st choice graduate program is Utah State/Washington State since its my only IS option, any info or comments about the program would be much appreciated. I'm mostly confused about how tuition works (is it Utah IS all 4 years or just the first 2 and then WSU OOS?) and how the application process works. Should I apply to both Utah State and WSU or does an application at Utah State = an application at WSU? My passion is for wildlife and exotic medicine so I would like to look at other schools with above-average curriculum in theses areas, I've read that the Washington teaching hospital is pretty good? My dream has been to someday work part-time with wildlife rehabilitation while working with exotic companions at a private practice ever since I fell in love with the work they do at the rehab center I volunteer at, but I'm pretty open to working in a lot of different areas because I've been told wildlife medicine is difficult to find work in.

I apologize this post was a lot longer than I thought it would be, but thanks for taking the time to read through c:

 

[RedLauren]

Hey there! I can't answer all of your questions but I can help with some.

Concerning your major: vet schools don't show preference to one major over another, however I would think a double major would look impressive but do not underestimate how many required science courses there are. Just so you have an idea, the five schools I applied to this cycle required: Biology I & II, Physics I & II, Gen Chem I & II, O-Chem I & II, Biochemistry, Genetics, Cellular Biology, Statistics or Calculus, and Microbiology. And these are just the science courses, most schools also have some kind of English, communications, and humanities requirement too. On top of this, many schools I applied to also required me to take a few upper level science electives that could not be on this list. The science/ math pre-requisites alone will take you about three semesters to complete if you haven't already started.

I don't know anything about Utah or Washington so I apologize, but the application process for both schools is done through VMCAS. What this means is that you will make one general application and send it to however many vet schools you want, and each school will have a few customized questions for you to answer along with a separate supplemental application. This is helpful because your letters of rec and transcripts only need to be sent to one place.

As far as exotics / zoo programs I've heard great things about the University of Florida, UC Davis, and Texas A&M to name a few. Be sure to apply to programs that let you track. This means your final few semesters you can take electives that focus on your area of interest (such as exotics).

As far as getting experience as an undergrad, yes its very very important. But grades are more important. Stay focused and best of luck to you!

 

[cloverbug]

Hello! Holy cow, you've done a lot already. Just to clarify, you will be graduating from high school with an associate's college degree at the same time? If so, you seem to already have a lot of your pre-req classes out of the way as far as English and some of your humanities. If you feel that you can handle doing a double major with a minor, then you should do it. It may add time until you graduate, but it also means you have a wider job outlook after you graduate if you don't get into vet school right away. Having both would mean you could work in research, which looks good on applications, or possibly get some government work with Fish and Wildlife. Everything about applying was covered well by RedLauren. University of Illinois, my school, is also huge on exotics. We don't track until the last year so you're free to take whatever electives you want and we have plenty about exotic species. We don't allow students to switch from OOS to IS unless the student gets married to a Illinois resident though, just as an fyi. Good luck!

 

[LetItSnow]

For my bachelors I'm minoring in Japanese and tossing around the idea of double majoring in zoology and microbiology since I'd be taking a lot of the required micro classes as electives anyway, but would there be any real benefit to this?

There is no advantage to double-majoring with regard to going to veterinary school. There may be a disadvantage - if you are paying for the extra classes with loans you could potentially increase your long-term debt (coming out of vet school) by that much more.

The only real advantages would be 1) as it would apply to another career if you decide not to pursue veterinary medicine, and 2) personal interest in the classes/major.

 

[hygebeorht]

So long as you keep good grades and do the pre-reqs, your major does not really matter. I majored in English with a minor in Spanish. To decrease your debt long-term, especially since it's your goal to work in zoo med (you will never make any money), you should aim to get into vet school as fast as you can. My main advice though is to make sure your grades are GREAT. You can always get more hours of experience, but it's much harder to fix a crappy GPA.

 

[pp9]

Not that bacteriology or virology is the majority of vet school by any means...but I'm sure as heck wishing my undergrad micro course was actually worthwhile right now. I don't know that you need to double major, but taking a quality high level micro course would give you a decent foundation for these vet school courses, especially since not all schools specifically require micro.

To add on to what Clover said, Illinois is a school known for exotics. I wouldn't say anyone would be inherently prepared to jump right into exotic/wildlife medicine just from our elective offerings, though. Our Wildlife Medical Clinic gives us a much greater foundation for wildlife medicine and husbandry than any of our electives can. You can likely find a decent wildlife rehab center to volunteer at wherever you end up, though. You just may need to drive a bit.

Wildlife medicine is difficult to find paid work in. I know many, many small animal vets that volunteer their equipment (radiographs, for example), time, or surgical suites to local wildlife rehab clinics as needed. Some advertise that they accept wildlife patients to triage and transport to the nearest person with a license to hold wildlife. Some even do vet things at wildlife clinics on weekends unpaid, since tons of rehab places don't actually have a vet on staff and rely on volunteer doctors to come in. There's many ways you can fit wildlife into your career without waiting for a paid job to come up.

 

[KCgophervet]

Thank you all for your responses! They have been extremely helpful. @cloverbug: Yes, I will be completing high school and my associates at the same time. I still have to contact the scholarship adviser to get details on the tuition waiver, but based on replies here I think I'm going to go ahead and do my double major because I love both of the subjects and it won't hurt to have a backup plan in case I don't make it into a vet program. The zool and micro major requirements mostly fulfill each other (taking all of the required zool courses fulfills all of the electives and some core courses for a micro major and vice versa) which I thought was kind of weird. Then if I do go through with this, it would be better for me to apply to vet school right away and worry about experience less? I will have a lot of wildlife experience, (hopefully) completed an internship at a zoo, and (hopefully) have found an exotic vet to shadow but how bad will it be if I have minimal LA experience since I don't really have an interest in this area?

As a side note, I did work at a dog & cat clinic last year for about 8 months because they were understaffed at the time and performed a lot of their deep cleaning and maintenance. It was a little bit disappointing because I originally asked if they took volunteers/shadows but I appreciated learning more about the management side plus the techs were nice enough to teach me a little bit about restraint, vaccines, and other regular tasks they perform. I was wondering if there is a better way to go about asking to shadow because I just went and asked the receptionist about it.

I looked into Illinois and the longer I look at it the more I like it, especially with how structured the program seems. The location is also ideal because I'm trying to avoid southern schools (the weather isn't my favorite) but the killer is going to be having to pay OOS. I'm not familiar with how graduate students pay for school. Do most opt to get loans or are there scholarships I can look at? Also, if I have my undergraduate paid for will I be far less burdened by OOS tuition or is undergraduate insignificant compared to graduate (if that makes any sense)? I'm not too worried about low-paying work so pinkpuppy's suggestion sounds like a really good fit for what I want to do, but I do care about not being in debt for a long time.

Look at the Estimated Costs thread pinned at the top of the Pre-vet forum. There have been some good links posted lately with average tuition and how to calculate what will be the cheapest schools for you to go to. This part is important: ANY school you attend you will get the education you need to become a zoo/wildlife/exotic vet if that is what you want to do. The onus is on you to make the connections and extracurricular experiences necessary to succeed in the field. Your priorities, especially for that field, are to keep your costs low. And typically vet school will cost so much more than undergrad (and there typically are not scholarships or grants to cover vet school like there are undergrad) that you will basically be living off of student loans. The less you can take out for that, the brighter and happier your future will be.

 

[pp9]

Look at the Estimated Costs thread pinned at the top of the Pre-vet forum. There have been some good links posted lately with average tuition and how to calculate what will be the cheapest schools for you to go to. This part is important: ANY school you attend you will get the education you need to become a zoo/wildlife/exotic vet if that is what you want to do. The onus is on you to make the connections and extracurricular experiences necessary to succeed in the field. Your priorities, especially for that field, are to keep your costs low. And typically vet school will cost so much more than undergrad (and there typically are not scholarships or grants to cover vet school like there are undergrad) that you will basically be living off of student loans. The less you can take out for that, the brighter and happier your future will be.

Do you mean the foundation to enter this field/pursue further training? Just for the OP's understanding.

Thank you all for your responses! They have been extremely helpful. @cloverbug: Yes, I will be completing high school and my associates at the same time. I still have to contact the scholarship adviser to get details on the tuition waiver, but based on replies here I think I'm going to go ahead and do my double major because I love both of the subjects and it won't hurt to have a backup plan in case I don't make it into a vet program. The zool and micro major requirements mostly fulfill each other (taking all of the required zool courses fulfills all of the electives and some core courses for a micro major and vice versa) which I thought was kind of weird. Then if I do go through with this, it would be better for me to apply to vet school right away and worry about experience less? I will have a lot of wildlife experience, (hopefully) completed an internship at a zoo, and (hopefully) have found an exotic vet to shadow but how bad will it be if I have minimal LA experience since I don't really have an interest in this area?

As a side note, I did work at a dog & cat clinic last year for about 8 months because they were understaffed at the time and performed a lot of their deep cleaning and maintenance. It was a little bit disappointing because I originally asked if they took volunteers/shadows but I appreciated learning more about the management side plus the techs were nice enough to teach me a little bit about restraint, vaccines, and other regular tasks they perform. I was wondering if there is a better way to go about asking to shadow because I just went and asked the receptionist about it.

I looked into Illinois and the longer I look at it the more I like it, especially with how structured the program seems. The location is also ideal because I'm trying to avoid southern schools (the weather isn't my favorite) but the killer is going to be having to pay OOS. I'm not familiar with how graduate students pay for school. Do most opt to get loans or are there scholarships I can look at? Also, if I have my undergraduate paid for will I be far less burdened by OOS tuition or is undergraduate insignificant compared to graduate (if that makes any sense)? I'm not too worried about low-paying work so pinkpuppy's suggestion sounds like a really good fit for what I want to do, but I do care about not being in debt for a long time.

Most students rely on loans, 100%. I'm OOS at Illinois, so I take out somewhere around $70k each year and send back whatever is leftover. First years don't get access to competitive scholarships until they're accepted and done with their second quarter, and you still have to apply for each one you want to try to get. Some IS first years with exceptional GPAs get an automatic scholarship. There are external (not through the school) scholarships you can Google for, but remember that the entire population of vet students in the country will look at those as well. Having your undergrad paid for is a huge relief, but $200k (Illinois OOS) is an enormous burden regardless of your undergrad tuition. Don't assume you'll be okay with really, really bad pay once you get your first loan repayment bill in the mail. I know you will probably sit there now and tell me you're "not in it for the money" until you're blue in the face, but don't commit yourself to really, really low pay right now.

Keep in mind that schools don't care what major you pick and they will not give you any more points for a science based major. You definitely should not worry about experience less. The average applicant applies with 1000 hours of varied veterinary experience (so under the supervision of a veterinarian). You also need to ensure vet med is something you want to do, as your goals may change during undergrad. Experience in a veterinary setting is the only way to make sure the career of a clinical vet is for you. It's more common than you'd think to have 0 LA hours, but getting that experience will make your application stronger.

Also...just to put more info in your brain, Illinois is probably looking at curriculum and clinics changes soon. How soon? Not sure, but I wouldn't be surprised if what I went through is different than the Illinois you may attend.

Last thing-I think you misunderstood. Wildlife work is low pay, yes, but I was trying to say that there's a pretty low chance you'll actually find a paying job at all in a rehab setting. There have been numerous discussions about the wildlife/zoo path, so use the search tool...but here are a few links:

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/wildlife-vet.1181257/

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/want-to-be-a-vet-but-dont-want-to-work-with-pets.1167967 -Discussion about backup plans to wildlife/zoo

 

[Teepster87]

Thank you all for your responses! They have been extremely helpful. @cloverbug: Yes, I will be completing high school and my associates at the same time. I still have to contact the scholarship adviser to get details on the tuition waiver, but based on replies here I think I'm going to go ahead and do my double major because I love both of the subjects and it won't hurt to have a backup plan in case I don't make it into a vet program. The zool and micro major requirements mostly fulfill each other (taking all of the required zool courses fulfills all of the electives and some core courses for a micro major and vice versa) which I thought was kind of weird.

You should look into your college's graduation/degree requirements or talk with a counsellor about the requirements. I had initially planned on double majoring when I transferred from community college to a 4 year university, but after talking with both of my potential major departments I learned that there could only be x amount of overlap between the two majors. Find out what your school's policies on that are

 

[KCgophervet]

Do you mean the foundation to enter this field/pursue further training? Just for the OP's understanding.

I guess I mean to say you can become a zoo vet coming out of any vet school. Yes some have stronger exotics programs, but not having that available will not stop anyone from that work if that is their goal and they put the effort into it.

 

[deleted806434]

Hello, I've been lurking for a couple of years but this is my first post. I debated whether or not I should post in hSDN, I figured I would be better off here as I have vet specific questions (hopefully this is okay).

First, I am looking to get advice or suggestions on my plans after high school. I know I'm looking years into the future and my career goals are probably going to change slightly, but having some sort of plan laid out really motivates me to get through my tough classes.
So to give a bit of background info, I'm on track to graduate from high school in the spring with an associates (plus tons of pre-reqs for a zoology major knocked out). I'm going to attend the same university next fall to get my bachelors because I'm pretty sure I qualify for a full tuition waiver (*fingers crossed* retaking the ACT in December just to be safe) plus I live near campus so I won't have to worry about finding housing. I have considered other undergraduate programs but keeping costs low is my #1 priority.

For my bachelors I'm minoring in Japanese and tossing around the idea of double majoring in zoology and microbiology since I'd be taking a lot of the required micro classes as electives anyway, but would there be any real benefit to this? If I don't double major I would be able to graduate in about 2-3 years but I think I would take that extra time I'm not in school to get more vet experience and save up money. I'm not in too much of a rush to give my soul to vet school lol ^^;

My 1st choice graduate program is Utah State/Washington State since its my only IS option, any info or comments about the program would be much appreciated. I'm mostly confused about how tuition works (is it Utah IS all 4 years or just the first 2 and then WSU OOS?) and how the application process works. Should I apply to both Utah State and WSU or does an application at Utah State = an application at WSU? My passion is for wildlife and exotic medicine so I would like to look at other schools with above-average curriculum in theses areas, I've read that the Washington teaching hospital is pretty good? My dream has been to someday work part-time with wildlife rehabilitation while working with exotic companions at a private practice ever since I fell in love with the work they do at the rehab center I volunteer at, but I'm pretty open to working in a lot of different areas because I've been told wildlife medicine is difficult to find work in.

I apologize this post was a lot longer than I thought it would be, but thanks for taking the time to read through c:

I don't know much about the Utah program, but a quick google search led me to this information about tuition (which would be resident tuition for all four years for you) http://www.vetmed.usu.edu/htm/admissions/tuition-fees.

Also, I just applied to WSU, so I at least know how to apply to the Utah State program. You will still apply to WSU through VMCAS. On their supplemental application, you indicate that you would like to be considered for the Utah program by checking a box.

Hope this helps a bit 🙂

 

[hygebeorht]

Then if I do go through with this, it would be better for me to apply to vet school right away and worry about experience less? I will have a lot of wildlife experience, (hopefully) completed an internship at a zoo, and (hopefully) have found an exotic vet to shadow but how bad will it be if I have minimal LA experience since I don't really have an interest in this area?

It should not matter at most schools.

As a side note, I did work at a dog & cat clinic last year for about 8 months because they were understaffed at the time and performed a lot of their deep cleaning and maintenance. It was a little bit disappointing because I originally asked if they took volunteers/shadows but I appreciated learning more about the management side plus the techs were nice enough to teach me a little bit about restraint, vaccines, and other regular tasks they perform. I was wondering if there is a better way to go about asking to shadow because I just went and asked the receptionist about it.

Nope, that's a good way to do it. Part of getting veterinary hours is grunt work. It's not the private business' duty to train you, in fact volunteers can be legal liabilities. But if you keep a good attitude, work hard, and do great work (even when that work is laundry or mopping up diarrhea) then people notice. Every time I showed up the laundry room was a wreck, and every time I left it was spotless. It was not glamorous. But it's good for you.

There are options that will likely lead to more of the work you're hoping for. Emergency clinics, depending on state and local laws, are sometimes willing to hire someone like you and train you on the job to work as a nurse. Even if you volunteer, they are often short-handed and when it hits the fan, they will put you to use. I also had great experiences working with laboratory animals, which often includes exotics. You can knock on doors or email people at your university to see if anyone is looking to hire for lab animal work.

I'm trying to avoid southern schools

Hey now!

I do care about not being in debt for a long time.

Then you should seriously consider NC State. Cheapest school out there, OOS tuition is cheaper than IS in many other places, it's top-ranked and it has great zoo/wildlife options. Could you deal with some southern weather to save $20-200k?

 

[cloverbug]

I'm very heat sensitive and lived in North Carolina for 7 years. I survived just fine so I agree with hygebeorht in looking into NC state. It was on my list of schools when I was applying.