MD MCAT 519, GPA 3.999, school list help please!

[JackOSU]

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[GrapesofRath]

Looks great. Apply to state schools, a couple lower tiers(which you seem to have), maybe throw in a couple mid tiers as well and the rest can be pretty much anything you want. You're in fantastic shape.

 

[Banco]

First off, being a white female does not hurt your chances, at all. You are not URM or ORM. You have an excellent application. Since you haven't done research and aren't interested, it probably doesn't make sense to apply to most research powerhouses - BUT some of them do focus on underserved communities, so with your numbers if may be worth throwing an app their way.

As to your current list, it is pretty good, but should be expanded; since you want to end up in Cali, might as well add some more of the Cali schools - they are reaches for anyone but you can afford to try with your numbers.

Definitely add: Wright State, Toledo, Case Western (since you're from OH why aren't you adding these?), USC (they like community service and I think you have a good shot here)

Consider adding: UCSF, Stanford, Columbia (emphasize underserved communities), Sinai (emphasize underserved communities), Einstein, Vanderbilt, Duke

Aim for 15-20 schools.

 

[GrapesofRath]

I didn't see the lack of research(hell I did a pretty crappy job reading through it all) so it does make it harder to suggest to apply to research powerhouses without any research experience. But if there are some top 20s you like give it a go and see what happens. Maybe you'll be part of that 5% at the top 20's who didn't participate in research.

 

[Goro]

You have a rock star app, except for the lack of research. I think that this will put most of the top schools out of reach, alas.

I suggest:


U VA (maybe)
U MI (maybe)
U Colorado
U VM
U WI
Ohio State and all other OH schools
The Philly Triplets
U IA
Miami
Tulane
Loyola
Emory
BU
Mayo
Case
Hofstra
Tufts
Gtown
GWU
Rush
Creighton
Keck (maybe)
MCW
SLU
U So FL

 

[JackOSU]

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[WedgeDawg]

I guess I just don't understand these forums. I get that I don't have research. But say I had applied last year, there would have only been 600 out of tens of thousands of other people with the same or better MCAT score and GPA as myself. Yet I should be applying to schools ranked in the 80's and 90's?? I just follow that math there. Say I was the last person out of all 600 of those other people to get accepted, they'd only be filling about the 5 best schools...

One, you must understand that medical school admissions, while exceptionally numbers-driven, is not all about numbers. Numbers are a necessary but not sufficient condition. Now, you have wonderful numbers. Better than my own when I applied! But you also must understand that many of these top ranked schools in the research category of USNWR are ranked that way because they value research! That doesn't mean that research is a requirement for these schools (it's not), but they really do appreciate applicants who have experience using, understanding, and applying the scientific process at a high level (i.e. doing biomedical research via the scientific method and being able to explain the rational behind and conclusions/ramifications of said research).

A 519 MCAT is approximately a 36.5 (let's round to a 36 for argument's sake). There were nearly 4,000 people last year (NOT 600) who had a 36+ MCAT and applied to medical school. If we assume average size of 150 (which is generous), that's nearly 27 schools filled - not 5! You have a solid application, but unfortunately you don't have the research that many schools who so heavily value it like to see.

However, that does not mean you're not competitive there.

If you want to go to California, add all of the California schools except for UC Davis, UC Riverside, and Loma Linda. @Banco has some great suggestions for you.

Honestly, you should apply to any of the top 20 that you want, but just be warned that there are many people who have your stats or better and also have the research experience to back it up.

Add schools like USC-Keck, Rochester, Emory, Einstein, Case Western, Hofstra, and UVA. They'll like your stats and will be willing to overlook your lack of research.

I think that @Goro was very conservative when he gave you his expert opinion. By all means, look into the schools that he suggested, but do not feel the need to limit yourself to them.

Apply broadly and hope for the best. With good stats but a lack of research, you're competitive everywhere, but not a shoe-in. You might get lucky, you might not. Not too much you can do at this point but craft your list to the best of your abilities. You've been given solid advice here, so don't squander it.

Best of luck.

 

[JackOSU]

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[WedgeDawg]

I'm not trying to be combative. But I just did the math and there would have been 3,150 people with the same or better score if you're actually considering it a 36. Even though the percentage's released on AAMC would have put me at a 38? Some online sources even convert it to a 39.

I purposely didn't apply to any school that didn't show a heavy emphasis in volunteer service or healthcare in underprivileged areas as those are things I am mostly interested in. I have no interest in applying to the top research schools.

I just didn't realize not having a semester of research would automatically make my GPA and MCAT null and my best shot to apply to schools with averages of 30 MCAT and 3.5 GPA.

The highest school I applied to was ranked #6 and the lowest was #76. More than half of the schools are ranked above the 30's. So I was just surprised when everyone said I was aiming too high. I didn't realize it was a stretch for even a mid-tier school.

I'm looking for mid-tier suggestions as I do want to apply to a range and want to be safe. So if you have any of those? Or if you can tell me what numbers I should be looking for? That would really be great. Thanks

Follow what I said and you'll be fine.

519 is between a 36 and 37 (essentially a 37). Not a 38, not a 39. This is based upon percentile. Sorry. A 37 equivalent is a phenomenal score, so don't worry.

You are statistically competitive for any school. Whether your ECs, interview, and essays measure up is anyone's guess.

 

[GrapesofRath]

One, you must understand that medical school admissions, while exceptionally numbers-driven, is not all about numbers. Numbers are a necessary but not sufficient condition. Now, you have wonderful numbers. Better than my own when I applied! But you also must understand that many of these top ranked schools in the research category of USNWR are ranked that way because they value research! That doesn't mean that research is a requirement for these schools (it's not), but they really do appreciate applicants who have experience using, understanding, and applying the scientific process at a high level (i.e. doing biomedical research via the scientific method and being able to explain the rational behind and conclusions/ramifications of said research).

A 519 MCAT is approximately a 36.5 (let's round to a 36 for argument's sake). There were nearly 4,000 people last year (NOT 600) who had a 36+ MCAT and applied to medical school. If we assume average size of 150 (which is generous), that's nearly 27 schools filled - not 5! You have a solid application, but unfortunately you don't have the research that many schools who so heavily value it like to see.

However, that does not mean you're not competitive there.

If you want to go to California, add all of the California schools except for UC Davis, UC Riverside, and Loma Linda. @Banco has some great suggestions for you.

Honestly, you should apply to any of the top 20 that you want, but just be warned that there are many people who have your stats or better and also have the research experience to back it up.

Add schools like USC-Keck, Rochester, Emory, Einstein, Case Western, Hofstra, and UVA. They'll like your stats and will be willing to overlook your lack of research.

I think that @Goro was very conservative when he gave you his expert opinion. By all means, look into the schools that he suggested, but do not feel the need to limit yourself to them.

Apply broadly and hope for the best. With good stats but a lack of research, you're competitive everywhere, but not a shoe-in. You might get lucky, you might not. Not too much you can do at this point but craft your list to the best of your abilities. You've been given solid advice here, so don't squander it.

Best of luck.

This is the key point. There is alot that goes into admission at top schools. There are MANY MANY people with stats like yours who have research and get shut out at the big names. Numbers alone don't entitle anybody to top tier schools.

Just look at it this way; why would you apply to research powerhouses if you don't have research experience? Ask yourself that first of all; there are valid reasons to still apply but first always ask that.

Then after you finish with that here is something to consider; what would make an ADCOM at a top 20 school at such a research powerhouse at a school with so much invested in research choose someone without any research experience like you over the hoard of top stat applicants with research experience?95% of matriculants at these schools have research experience. What does it take be in the 5% that are the exception? Often time it is hooks; URM status, military veterans etc. Are there applicants like you who have gotten in the past as more "traditional" applicants without research experience? Yes, but you have to realize how much of a minority those are.

That said, you HAVE a ton of really good options to choose from. Goro recommended Michigan and UVA; if those aren't "top tier" enough for you perhaps re-adjust some of your perspective. The thing about an application like yours with such high stats is many public schools that aren't often recommended for OOS'ers because they favor their own are in play for you. You have lots of flexibility there. UNC, Wisconsin, Maryland etc; these schools when they are looking for who they want OOS it's applications like this. These are the ones who can be amongst the 15-30% OOS at those schools.

And with all this said nobody is telling you don't apply to top schools. Hell, if I were in your spot I would take a stab at some of the big guns. The message is simply without research experience it will be very tough. It's just keep your expectations realistic. Apply wherever you would like in the top 20; just have a sufficient backup plan with enough schools to those.

As for mid tiers to answer your question: the standard ones you'll always see cited are ones such as Emory, Case Western, USC, Boston U, Hofstra, Einstein and Rochester. Like I said there are many public schools in play for you here; UVA, Ohio State, perhaps schools like Wisconsin and UNC. Mayo could be an interesting school to look at. Goro's list is an excellent guide; the best one you'll get on here.

If you want some safeties Ohio provides some fantastic options for that. Throwing in some schools like Creighton, Saint Louis, Tulane, Miami and Medical College of Wisconsin should also do the trick. Given you have a top GPA and 36-37 MCAT I would try and avoid schools where your MCAT is above or right at the 90th percentile.

 

[Banco]

No one said your application is bad, everyone said you should still throw your application to some top schools even without research...

We also said that if you have no interest in research it may make more sense to apply to schools that cater to what you want (this doesn't exclude top schools). You have gotten defensive for no reason.

 

[mw18]

I'm confused. Banco suggested UCSF, Stanford, Duke, and Columbia. In addition to vandy, Sinai, and Einstein. That's easily 4 of the "top 10" schools in the country. And 7 of the "top 25" or so.

Goro suggested Michigan out of state which, if only considering their out of state students, may have the most gaudy stats of any school.

I'm not trying to pile on, but I'm just curious what you're upset about? I guess you wanted the "You're golden, apply anywhere." from Goro. But in your interests, he thought that you may not be seriously considered at Harvard/JHU/Penn/WashU because they are such research powerhouse schools.

I will tell you this, with your numbers you can get into any school in the country. But unless you have unlimited secondary money it may not make sense to apply to all the top 20s because some of them would reject you with research (just the name of the game) and others won't have interest because you don't have interest in it. So it just seemed low yield. So you could end up depending on your app other places.

But if you want to avoid heavy research places, I would suggest UNC, Mayo, UAB, Dartmouth, UVA, maybe Emory and some more mid-tier privates that may not have as much interest because of your high numbers like SLU and Miami.

I just think having your type of numbers and no research puts you in an odd, rare, no-man's land of applicants. I don't think anyone meant offense, and I certainly don't.

 

[Doug Underhill]

We don't know what percentage of people will score 519 for the new MCAT because the new numbers haven't been released yet. I think 4000 is a bit high: the value is closest to a "36.5". Wouldn't it be better to approximate this by adding half the number of 36-scoring applicants to the pool of people the TC is competing with instead of all of them? I think 3000 is a more fair estimate of the total number of people with a 519 or better.

Furthermore, I suspect that there are also a sizable number of "high MCAT low GPA" applicants in that pool who score 36-45 but have GPAs too weak to be considered at top schools. If you look at Table 24, 2532 out of 10981 applicants (23.1%) of applicants scoring above 36 had a GPA in the 3.4 to 3.59 bracket OR LOWER , which is below the 10% percentile for GPA at most of the top schools.

If you take this percentage into account, the OP is only competing with 2307 people for admission to a top school.