MD/PhD -- if you could do it over, would you?

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drcushing

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My initial post in the physician-scientist forum didn't get many responses which made me think I might have better luck here..


MD/PhD is a long road as we all know it. I'm curious what MD/PhD graduates/residents think? Would you do just an MD if you could do it over again? Current students can comment also..

I'm in the middle of my graduate training and I ask myself that question more often knowing that a research career is increasingly difficult (ultra competitive funding enviornments)...

see:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=500923
 
My initial post in the physician-scientist forum didn't get many responses which made me think I might have better luck here..


MD/PhD is a long road as we all know it. I'm curious what MD/PhD graduates/residents think? Would you do just an MD if you could do it over again? Current students can comment also..

I'm in the middle of my graduate training and I ask myself that question more often knowing that a research career is increasingly difficult (ultra competitive funding enviornments)...

see:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=500923

Nope. Looking back now, it was one of the best decisions I made by leaving the program.
 
I am graduating in May after 8 long years, and thus far I have no regrets. As to whether I would do it ALL OVER AGAIN, medical school and a PhD are harder things to contemplate repeating! 😛 Check me in a few years, when I find out whether my unorthodox plans will bear out.
 
I would not do it again in the specific way that I did it. The experience was just too unpleasant.

If I could go back and make some different choices regarding my graduate work, then yes I would do it again.

I think my major complaint is that I just missed out on too much other stuff in life because I spent four years with my head buried in a test tube.
 
This actually a relatively difficult question.

I probably would do both degrees again, but I also would make different choices regarding my dissertation work. I entered the dual degree program because I planned on eventually entering academia with a predominantly research position and 1 day or so of clinic each week. Now that school is behind me, I'm not sure what the reasearch-to-practice balance is going to be. If I absolutely had to choose one option, I'd choose clinical practice. However, I am glad to have options.

Overall, I do feel that my basic science training does influence my clinical thinking in a productive way.

All that being said, there are days when I wonder how my twenties flew on by. . .
 
I started out as a Ph.D. student right after college, and after a year of doing that, I changed my mind and went into clinical medicine. I may not be as qualified as the true mudphuds to answer this question, but as I do have experience in both clinical medicine and basic science research, I'll go ahead and add my $0.02.

There's no way in hell that I'd give up 7-8 years of my life (or longer) to get an MD-Ph.D. You have the opportunity to do research as an MD (after only 4 years of paying tuition and living off of student loans, not counting undergrad, etc of course...)--even if you want to do basic science only without any sort of clinical patient interaction. For me personally, I have no regrets going from the world of pipettes, PCR machines, and mice that BITE to the world of patient care (though I must admit...some patients may BITE as well).

Just my thoughts...😀
 
I'll go ahead and add my $0.02.

As I am only a STUDENT, like you, I will re-empahsize what the op said:

I'm curious what MD/PhD graduates/residents think?

I'm curious as well, and I'd prefer if the thread doesn't get cluttered up by speculation.
 
I don't know if anyone here read this editorial by Mike Whitcomb. I found it quite poignant. what do you think?

Whitcomb ME.
The need to restructure MD-PhD training.
Acad Med. 2007 Jul;82(7):623-4. No abstract available.
 
As I am only a STUDENT, like you, I will re-empahsize what the op said:



I'm curious as well, and I'd prefer if the thread doesn't get cluttered up by speculation.

But the OP also said this:

Current students can comment also..

thus, the comments from the peanut gallery...
 
Oh crap I missed that bit!!!!

Where's the "I'm a horse's ***" smiley 🙁

As for me, I'd do it again. I'm really burned out right now though. Alot of that is because my personal life is always so ****ed up. I'm having a hard time seeing how this will be worth it in the end. Ask me again how I feel in 2 years.
 
Finished MD/PhD training in 6 years and am nearly finished residency. I would do it over again, absolutely. I will not be running in the basic science race and instead will focus on clinical work (not at all what I planned as a mudphud, but exactly what I want to do now); with that in mind here are the reasons I value my training path:

1. No debt for 2 extra years of HARD work seemed like a good deal then and it seems like an even better deal now. Importantly, this allowed me to consider living in places I would not have been able to comfortably afford otherwise.
2. My PhD mentor was (and still is) in my corner, it is great to have influential people looking out for you at different phases of your career.
3. Medical school would have been too boring for me otherwise, I was in the lab from day one and approached learning the basic sciences in a different way than I think I would have as an MD-only student.
4. Leadership – MD/PhD training gave me great opportunities to develop leadership/communication skills … turns out these are pretty important.
5. Professional writing/speaking – The “science” part of graduate training was actually pretty easy in my opinion (read a bunch of papers, hypothesize, design, perform, troubleshoot experiments), but learning to write it all down in some coherent fashion, then get up and convince a room full of scientists that what you did was novel and important, that takes time and an experienced teacher. I can’t imagine I would be nearly as good at this if I had not had the MD/PhD experience and I currently use these skills on a regular basis.
6. Opened doors in the match, no question.
7. Flexibility – Not always a good thing, but turns out I am pretty happy I didn’t just get a PhD, as I originally considered, since this training path has let me choose the career that best fits.

MD/PhD training was a good fit for me intellectually when I started down this path and, though I may not be pursuing an R01 (hats off to anyone who is with the current funding climate), left me with a solid skill set to build on as a resident. That being said, I see some MD/PhD applicants who take 9-10 years and have only one first author paper … I think the return on time invested in MD/PhD training diminishes significantly beyond 7 years, unless you know you want to stay in basic science and it allows you to spend less time as a post-doc.
 
I don't know if anyone here read this editorial by Mike Whitcomb. I found it quite poignant. what do you think?

Whitcomb ME.
The need to restructure MD-PhD training.
Acad Med. 2007 Jul;82(7):623-4. No abstract available.

I found this statement hilarious:
Data from Canada show that physicians who acquired their PhD degrees after graduating from medical school pursued more research-focused careers than did those who acquired the PhD degree before graduation
Selection bias, perhaps?
 
This is another article (below) related to this topic:

repost from a previous thread:
--->recent issue on the near future for MD/PhDs-- "Capital Losses"-- it asks "But can young physician-scientists succeed in building and sustaining the research careers that they hope for during their lengthy training? The difficulties they face are so severe that many abandon the effort.." read here:
http://sciencecareers.sciencemag.org...redit_a0700126
 
I'll weigh in. MD/PhD finishing up my 2nd year of IM and headed to an Onc research pathway fellowship in July. I would absolutely do it again if I had the chance. What I might not have done was take the 3 years off b/w UG and Med/Grad school, but perhaps I would have. In retrospect, I probably would have chosen a different lab to do my thesis work in but otherwise have no regrets. I'm fairly certain I'll have a largely bench research based career but who knows after I finishe my fellowship.
 
I am just finishing up 2 years of basic science research in the midst of my surgery residency....I REALLY wish I had a PhD for all that work and time.

It does open doors, and the skills I learned such as manuscript writing, data analysis and statistics make the mystique of publishing so much less daunting.

I thought I would go into private practice, but I had such a great mentor with a lot of experience that I may very well end up at an academic center.
 
As I am only a STUDENT, like you, I will re-empahsize what the op said:



I'm curious as well, and I'd prefer if the thread doesn't get cluttered up by speculation.

Dude, relax. Not trying to "clutter the thread with speculation", as you say. Just posting my own POV in answer to the OP's question...based on my experiences in both PhD level research and in clinical medicine. If you don't care for my post, don't read it, and don't let it offend you...just move on and post your own opinion.

I think that the mudphud route is great for those who wish to pursue it. I don't want to dissuade anyone from it. It just wasn't the path for me, and I felt that I could contribute to this discussion by telling (briefly) why.

To those who do pursue the dual degree, more power to you. I commend your hard work and dedication, whether you do primarily research, primarily clinical work, or a combination of both. Peace out.

-(The not-quite-Dr) Dr. Serenity
 
MS4 here, I would do it again in a heartbeat. I would probably do it a little differently (take on a less ambitious project and get out a bit sooner) but overall I really enjoyed it.
 
I would definitly do it again. Love the research, great lab etc. Nearly killed myself doing it, but pulled my head out of the lab enough to get married, buy a house and have a kid- so didn't loose my 20's! Also did clinical research, so pulled the two degrees together a bit....
 
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