MD vs DO class curriculum major differences??

[QAtoPA]

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Many questions have been asked in regards to the MD vs DO difference when it comes to practicing medicine, but I believe I have a different question here.

Most MD schools are seem to have more or less the same curriculum through the 4 years, but what about the differences/similarities in class curriculum between MDs and DOs?

I know both programs start the first two years with basic sciences, DOs adding the OMT Training.

1) Are there any differences in the basic sciences classes taught? Which extra or less classes are in MDs vs DOs?

2) What about the new teaching model on MDs PBL, is this included in the DO school aspect, or what is their model?

3) What about in the last two years? Any differences between the clinical rotations between MD vs DO?

Extra Question:

After Med school graduation, either DO or MD; what is the difference between starting your residency and doing the internship year?

I thought it was four years of med school followed by your residency which goes from 3 years up.

So, does FP or EM do 3 years after med school or is it 4? 1 internship yr, plus 3 of residency?

Also, this question arises because the University of Guadalajara in Mexico lists doing an internship year before starting residency.

Thanks a lot for your help guys.

Eduardo

 

[Instatewaiter]

1) Are there any differences in the basic sciences classes taught? Which extra or less classes are in MDs vs DOs?

2) What about the new teaching model on MDs PBL, is this included in the DO school aspect, or what is their model?

3) What about in the last two years? Any differences between the clinical rotations between MD vs DO?

Extra Question:

After Med school graduation, either DO or MD; what is the difference between starting your residency and doing the internship year?

I thought it was four years of med school followed by your residency which goes from 3 years up.

So, does FP or EM do 3 years after med school or is it 4? 1 internship yr, plus 3 of residency?

Also, this question arises because the University of Guadalajara in Mexico lists doing an internship year before starting residency.

Thanks a lot for your help guys.

Eduardo

1) MD students get more biochem. Outside of that I dont think there are too many differences in basic sciences. MD students on average do significantly better on the USMLE. This may be due to the basic science curriculum or may be due to the fact that the MD students are better students or better test takers at baseline rather than having anything to do with what they are taught.

2) Not all MD schools are purely PBL. Most, however do use at least some PBL intermixed with normal lectures. I can tell you that the PBL that I went through was not great experience.

3) almost all MD schools have their own hospital. There are only a few that do not. On the other hand, almost no DO schools have their own hospital but rather have multiple agreements with neighboring hospitals. So some DO schools really ship their students around the area/country. This leads to a very variable education. Generally, the longer a school has been around, the more well established their rotations will be. MD rotations are very standardized so there is less variablity. This is not to say that DO rotations are bad, just that the education of one student to another will differ greatly.

Residency- not too much difference here. DOs can do the ACGME residencies ("MD" residencies) or their own AOA ("DO only") residencies. Currently about 60% of DOs choose to do the "MD" residencies. The only difference is that in 5 states, DOs have to do a rotating internship before that. You can search more in the pre-osteo or the osteo forums as to which states do this. Internship is the first year of residency. The Guadalajara program may require a 5th year where they have to do some clinical rotations before they will be considered for US residencies. I am not sure though.

FM is generally 2-3 years. EM is 3-4 years depending on the program.

 

[QAtoPA]

Thanks for the reply.

Why is it that MD Schools endure more biochem on their students? Whats the point of this?

Also, ""The only difference is that in 5 states, DOs have to do a rotating internship before that.""

What exactly is a rotating internship and why is the reason behind this? Does this mean it takes A YEAR extra for whatever residency DOs pick at this states in comparison to MDs?

 

[Instatewaiter]

Thanks for the reply.

Why is it that MD Schools endure more biochem on their students? Whats the point of this?

Also, ""The only difference is that in 5 states, DOs have to do a rotating internship before that.""

What exactly is a rotating internship and why is the reason behind this? Does this mean it takes A YEAR extra for whatever residency DOs pick at this states in comparison to MDs?

Biochem- dont know why MD schools do more biochem. My hypothesis is that MD schools have more research so the PhDs that teach the course geta big fat one for some biochem and so we do more of it. Or it may be that the USMLE step 1 has much more biochem on it than COMLEX step 1 (the respective board exams for MD and DO students)

Rotating internship- i dont really know a whole heck of a lot about it. I will have to defer to someone who knows more. I recommend doing a search.

 

[aggie08]

1) MD students get more biochem. Outside of that I dont think there are too many differences in basic sciences. MD students on average do significantly better on the USMLE. This may be due to the basic science curriculum or may be due to the fact that the MD students are better students or better test takers at baseline rather than having anything to do with what they are taught.

Or maybe that our classes are taught specifically geared towards the USMLE. All our tests (at least at my school) are created to "mimic" the USMLE. Who knows?

 

[aggie08]

Don't forget that DOs also have to take osteopathic manipulative medicine (OMM) classes.

I'm sure almost everyone knows this, but some might not.

 

[searun]

Don't forget that DOs also have to take osteopathic manipulative medicine (OMM) classes.

I'm sure almost everyone knows this, but some might not.

Precisely what is OMM? Is this similar to what a chiropractor does when someone comes in with a sore back? I am not being facetious. I am curious.

 

[RySerr21]

1) MD students get more biochem. Outside of that I dont think there are too many differences in basic sciences. MD students on average do significantly better on the USMLE. This may be due to the basic science curriculum or may be due to the fact that the MD students are better students or better test takers at baseline rather than having anything to do with what they are taught.

2) Not all MD schools are purely PBL. Most, however do use at least some PBL intermixed with normal lectures. I can tell you that the PBL that I went through was not great experience.

3) almost all MD schools have their own hospital. There are only a few that do not. On the other hand, almost no DO schools have their own hospital but rather have multiple agreements with neighboring hospitals. So some DO schools really ship their students around the area/country. This leads to a very variable education. Generally, the longer a school has been around, the more well established their rotations will be. MD rotations are very standardized so there is less variablity. This is not to say that DO rotations are bad, just that the education of one student to another will differ greatly.

Residency- not too much difference here. DOs can do the ACGME residencies ("MD" residencies) or their own AOA ("DO only") residencies. Currently about 60% of DOs choose to do the "MD" residencies. The only difference is that in 5 states, DOs have to do a rotating internship before that. You can search more in the pre-osteo or the osteo forums as to which states do this. Internship is the first year of residency. The Guadalajara program may require a 5th year where they have to do some clinical rotations before they will be considered for US residencies. I am not sure though.

FM is generally 2-3 years. EM is 3-4 years depending on the program.

umm.....what? where did you get this info? Just like every course, it varies between schools. I just finished biochem yesterday and we only had the course for 5 weeks and will never have it again.

Most schools ARE NOT strictly PBL. There actually very few that are.

 

[aggie08]

Precisely what is OMM? Is this similar to what a chiropractor does when someone comes in with a sore back? I am not being facetious. I am curious.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osteopathic_manipulative_medicine

It's a musculo-skeletal treatment. Sounds quite effective, actually and I would love to find a DO that actually practiced with it. 🙄

 

[nlax30]

umm.....what? where did you get this info? Just like every course, it varies between schools. I just finished biochem yesterday and we only had the course for 5 weeks and will never have it again.

Most schools ARE NOT strictly PBL. There actually very few that are.

Agreed.

I think there is enough variation among individual schools to outright say something like biochem is covered "more" at MD vs DO schools.

All med schools are pretty much going to cover the same basic science material. The ACTUAL amount is going to vary depending on how the curriculum is setup (Lecture vs PBL vs independent study vs organ/system based vs. subject based, etc......) and not on whether it's an MD or DO school.

My school is strictly PBL for the first 2 years, with the exception of anatomy, clinical exam, and a couple "mini" courses which are still lecture/lab based. We pretty much read through all of our basic science texts and definitely did not skim over biochem.

So as far as the first two years ago, with the exception of OMM, which is usually only like 3 hours/week, there isn't a difference btwn MD and DO. Even during 3rd/4th years it's not going to be that different. Someone else already mentioned that most DO schools don't have their own teaching hospital, and this can be a good or bad thing depending on how you look at it. All I know is I'm able to do all my rotations in the same city/area, have seen a TON of interesting pathology even though I'm not at huge academic centers, but am still mostly at places that have residency programs and structured didactics.

During my first two years we had MD and DO lecturers, now I have MD and DO attendings, and have rotated with MD and DO students and residents...... so any perceived difference is pretty much a non-issue in most areas past the pre-med stage.

Someone already posted a link to OMM/OMT on wiki so go read that. But yeah, it's basically therapy/treatment directed at musculoskeletal issues. It's not a cure-all, but just another tool in the tool box. I've heard of some MD schools offering courses and CME type seminars on it.

 

[rkaz]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osteopathic_manipulative_medicine

It's a musculo-skeletal treatment. Sounds quite effective, actually and I would love to find a DO that actually practiced with it. 🙄

I'm a first year DO student. One thing I really like about OMM class is that it gives us a good foundation in palpating structures. Most of OMM is just applied anatomy, and it's nice being able to externally feel the vertebrae, fascia, etc and know exactly which structures and landmarks you are feeling.

To the OP, I personally don't feel there is as much variability between MD and DO programs as much as their is variability between schools in general (whether it be MD or DO). For instance, DO schools have their own formats for the first 2 years... whether it be PBL, traditional curriculum, systems-based, or some other hybrid form.

Although I have previously also heard that MD students get more biochem, I'm not exactly sure how much more biochem we could get - as we are already getting about 6-10 classroom hours of biochem each week. And that doesn't include all the other courses we are taking.... gross anatomy (plus lab), histo/embryo, omm, psych, intro to clinical medicine, etc. We also start physiology next quarter... which will be a large time commitment. So it's a jam packed full schedule.

 

[Bacchus]

Precisely what is OMM? Is this similar to what a chiropractor does when someone comes in with a sore back? I am not being facetious. I am curious.

I am going to bite. You've been around long enough to know its not chiropracty. The approaches are different.

 

[Dissected]

umm.....what? where did you get this info? Just like every course, it varies between schools. I just finished biochem yesterday and we only had the course for 5 weeks and will never have it again.

we have two months of it. Gawd I'm ready for it to be over.

 

[ThaliaNox]

I go to Michigan State, where there is both an MD and DO medical school. We actually take our basic science classes together, in the same room with the same instructors. Therefore... no difference in basic science curriculum. Both colleges have their own interviewing classes, clinical correllation classes, etc. Our second years are also totally different, with mine being PBL. (I go to the MD school)

The only things that really bother me about the DO students being in our classes is that their class is ginormous , (300 this year) which makes our basic science classes HUGE and that their passing grade is 70 while ours is 75. I find that to be odd and probably unneccessary.

 

[Dissected]

The only things that really bother me about the DO students being in our classes is that their class is ginormous , (300 this year) which makes our basic science classes HUGE and that their passing grade is 70 while ours is 75. I find that to be odd and probably unneccessary.

Thats silly

And that is an outrageously big class. Holy crap.

 

[Bacchus]

If anyone wants to see a DO schedule, I've attached BLOCK I for my school.

 

[RySerr21]

we have two months of it. Gawd I'm ready for it to be over.

DoctorB whad uuuuuuuuup! Biochem sucked man, im glad that **** is over 🙂 One day you too will be in my shoes. mwa ha ha. such a good feeling.

If anyone wants to see a DO schedule, I've attached BLOCK I for my school.

Ahh, this must be only the normal stuff....all the secret DO-culty voo doo stuff you cant really show on your schedule b/c then you might have to kill us..is that right?

 

[Bacchus]

DoctorB whad uuuuuuuuup! Biochem sucked man, im glad that **** is over 🙂 One day you too will be in my shoes. mwa ha ha. such a good feeling.



Ahh, this must be only the normal stuff....all the secret DO-culty voo doo stuff you cant really show on your schedule b/c then you might have to kill us..is that right?

As much as I want to say yes, I'm going to have to say no.

 

[MarieMarie]

Thats silly

And that is an outrageously big class. Holy crap.

300 across three campuses. I think it's closer to 150 at the East Lansing location, someone correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[ThaliaNox]

Michigan State's DO school has 200 students in Lansing, with 50 at each of two other sites. There are about 150 MD students, so that's 350 medical students in Lansing sharing a classroom. The students at the DO distance sites are videoed in, so it is a technological hassle at times. So, overall it is one teacher to 450 students. The distance sites do not have different lecturers.