"minimal" lifestyle in med school and beyond?

[SheepInABox]

What are your thoughts about the possibility of living a minimal / zen type lifestyle as a med student, resident and practicing physician, particularly in an academic environment? I'm specifically interested about combining this with a subspecialty or specialty like cardiology, ophthalmology, some surgical subspecialty - not psych / primary care working part time. When I say minimal, I mean things like not having kids / having only one kid, not running on the endless academic treadmill of research/practice/teach, not being on a bazillion committees, not buying the newest apple whatever just because you have the money, having a modest middle class house in a place without a crazy HOA, having only one car, etc.

Is it still possible to be a "successful" academic physician this way, like the MDs whose headshots are floating around on pages like this one: https://med.stanford.edu/profiles/adultcardiac/browse?affiliations=capFaculty&org=VXDF ?

The kind of mindset / lifestyle advocated for by people like Cal Newport (studyhacks.com) and Leo Babauta (zenhabits.net).

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[Brain Bucket]

So long as you don't go about 'sharing the good news', I see no issue.

 

[JoshSt]

I mean... yes, you can be in academics or private practice and choose not to do much. But typically you only advance tenure by doing the bazillion committees, research, etc. So, successful? It depends on your point of view - you would be around a bunch of colleagues who are doing all the things in the world and you may/may not feel self-satisfied.

By your outlooks, optho seems like a good choice for you; definitely not medicine or surgery if you just want to chillax. Look into derm and rad onc as well.

 

[SheepInABox]

So when it comes to being successful in academic medicine / surgery - not possible?

 

[DrBowtie]

So when it comes to being successful in academic medicine / surgery - not possible?

You won't advance if you aren't productive.

 

[hemoglobinemia]

I don't understand the question.

 

[DrEnderW]

Why do you want to do academic medicine but not do research/teach/be on committees? That's the definition of academic medicine.

Why wouldn't you do private practice, work in a community hospital, or smaller academic center and do whatever lower frequency research commitment you desire?

 

[tdram]

If you really want to live a zen / minimalist lifestyle, then the "success" you're looking for is not the kind you'd get from being a big time academic physician.

 

[radkat101]

What exactly do you mean by "successful"? You're already becoming a doctor. It seems like all of this is completely under your control. You're literally asking if it's possible to spend less money while making plenty of it. What do multiple kids, multiple cars, a big house, and apple stuff have to do with your question?

 

[cs24]

What are your thoughts about the possibility of living a minimal / zen type lifestyle as a med student, resident and practicing physician, particularly in an academic environment? I'm specifically interested about combining this with a subspecialty or specialty like cardiology, ophthalmology, some surgical subspecialty - not psych / primary care working part time. When I say minimal, I mean things like not having kids / having only one kid, not running on the endless academic treadmill of research/practice/teach, not being on a bazillion committees, not buying the newest apple whatever just because you have the money, having a modest middle class house in a place without a crazy HOA, having only one car, etc.

Is it still possible to be a "successful" academic physician this way, like the MDs whose headshots are floating around on pages like this one: https://med.stanford.edu/profiles/adultcardiac/browse?affiliations=capFaculty&org=VXDF ?

The kind of mindset / lifestyle advocated for by people like Cal Newport (studyhacks.com) and Leo Babauta (zenhabits.net).

Homework for you. Go back to that website and click on the CV/Bio of the people on the page. Now come to your own conclusions.

You can live however you want to live outside of medicine, but you can't get prestigious academic medicine positions without sacrificing for it like everyone else. Is that worth it to you/compatible with whatever sort of lifestyle you are hoping for? You tell me.

 

[Priapism4tooLong]

What are your thoughts about the possibility of living a minimal / zen type lifestyle as a med student, resident and practicing physician, particularly in an academic environment? I'm specifically interested about combining this with a subspecialty or specialty like cardiology, ophthalmology, some surgical subspecialty - not psych / primary care working part time. When I say minimal, I mean things like not having kids / having only one kid, not running on the endless academic treadmill of research/practice/teach, not being on a bazillion committees, not buying the newest apple whatever just because you have the money, having a modest middle class house in a place without a crazy HOA, having only one car, etc.

Is it still possible to be a "successful" academic physician this way, like the MDs whose headshots are floating around on pages like this one: https://med.stanford.edu/profiles/adultcardiac/browse?affiliations=capFaculty&org=VXDF ?

The kind of mindset / lifestyle advocated for by people like Cal Newport (studyhacks.com) and Leo Babauta (zenhabits.net).

What the hell is a zen type life style?? A zen type life style in my eyes is going to the highest peak you can see and meditating. I don't think thats going to help you with medicine so much.

You can live minimally or do as much as you want in medicine, the bottom line is you get people from all spectrums, people who just want to do it for a job and people who want to get super involved and do research. We can't decide what kind of life you want to live or how many kids you should have. You should decide that on your own and what you are passionate for. And if you have any idea of how these "academic doctors" live you'll realize they are doing more than well enough to afford more than 1 car and a modest middle class house. And they can definitely afford the new apple whatevers.

 

[Brain Bucket]

haha, I can't believe you guys are taking this seriously.

 

[Priapism4tooLong]

haha, I can't believe you guys are taking this seriously.

i think she's serious, shes even got a website too back it up

 

[Law2Doc]

There are ways to do the minimum in medicine but academics is not for you. you really shouldn't consider academic medicine if you have disdain for the research/teach/work "treadmill" -- that is the essence of academic medicine. And as mentioned people do committees primarily to get ahead -- you don't advance by doing nothing. So in short no, what you are describing is not possible.

Fwiw doing the minimum and being a minimalist/zen follower are not synonyms.

 

[SheepInABox]

Why do you want to do academic medicine but not do research/teach/be on committees?

I'm naïve and haven't gotten very deep into this stuff, so currently my answer is that I want to do academic medicine because I can advance the frontiers of medicine that way. I don't want to just keep reusing someone's algorithms, I guess, because I think we can get better ones / come up with better devices / a better drug / etc.

Homework for you. Go back to that website and click on the CV/Bio of the people on the page.

I did that, that's what made me make this post. A lot of the stuff on there seems extraneous and like filler. What do I have to do so people still consider me "prestigious" enough to hire and let me do my work without having to do a bunch of "fluff" and administrative stuff and teaching that doesn't matter - win a Nobel prize?

 

[SouthernSurgeon]

I'm naïve and haven't gotten very deep into this stuff, so currently my answer is that I want to do academic medicine because I can advance the frontiers of medicine that way. I don't want to just keep reusing someone's algorithms, I guess, because I think we can get better ones / come up with better devices / a better drug / etc.

You are naive. There aren't jobs available in academics where you get paid to sit in a room and think deep thoughts about the future of medicine.

The people I know who are considered top of their field in terms of research - multiple funded grants, multiple NEJM papers, CVs longer than a football field - all still have substantial administrative requirements and meetings.

 

[Leonidis I]

I'm naïve and haven't gotten very deep into this stuff, so currently my answer is that I want to do academic medicine because I can advance the frontiers of medicine that way. I don't want to just keep reusing someone's algorithms, I guess, because I think we can get better ones / come up with better devices / a better drug / etc.


I did that, that's what made me make this post. A lot of the stuff on there seems extraneous and like filler. What do I have to do so people still consider me "prestigious" enough to hire and let me do my work without having to do a bunch of "fluff" and administrative stuff and teaching that doesn't matter - win a Nobel prize?

so this is what you really care about? having people think you're a prestigious academic physician who's face pops up on a med school's website without actually doing many of the required duties of the position?

if you want to be in academic medicine you're going to have to deal with the "fluff" and administrative stuff, teaching, doing research, etc.

if you want to be in private practice you're going to have to deal with running your office, hiring/firing people, seeing enough patients to generate enough revenue, etc.

you can't declare yourself a certain type of physician and want other people to consider you as such without actually doing the things that are required.

btw it's cool that you want a minimalist lifestyle - life is a lot less stressful and a lot more enjoyable when you're not worried about how big your house is or how fast your car goes or how your trophy wife compares to that of your friend's. but you should probably add prestige/what other people think about you to the list of things you don't care about.

 

[Law2Doc]

...
btw it's cool that you want a minimalist lifestyle - life is a lot less stressful and a lot more enjoyable when you're not worried about how big your house is or how fast your car goes or how your trophy wife compares to that of your friend's. but you should probably add prestige/what other people think about you to the list of things you don't care about.

Again I think OP misused the word minimalist, and don't think they were suggesting they didn't want all the trappings of prestige. OP seems to equate that term with "doing the minimum" not all the "fluff" and career building expected in an academic career.

 

[cs24]

I did that, that's what made me make this post. A lot of the stuff on there seems extraneous and like filler. What do I have to do so people still consider me "prestigious" enough to hire and let me do my work without having to do a bunch of "fluff" and administrative stuff and teaching that doesn't matter - win a Nobel prize?

You do realize that being a being a doctor is almost any capacity comes with having to practice, right? And if you go into academics, you then have either research, teaching, or both in addition to your practice. If you just want to push frontiers and win a Nobel prize without any of that, you probably should have gone into research instead of medicine. Of course that field has its own set of administrative bull****. No field is perfect.

 

[BobbyB]

i thought living a zen lifestyle meant not focusing your life on superficial things. your desire for prestige and status is not zen-like at all.