MS I and retrospective research???

[ECGcali]

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I just started my first year and I want to go in to RadOnc, the reason for going to medical school in the first place. My initial career course was to be a Medical Physicist but found out medicine is what is for me.
My medical school doesn't have a radonc program and there are only two radoncs that are actually with the university. The good thing is that I have been paired with one of them as my mentor, so I hope that helps. I want to get some research in and he said that he could easily set something up for me to do a retrospective paper in their department because there is no actual specific radonc research going on (i think that most of it is in medical oncology).
So, I was wondering since I have been searching the threads for this answer that someone could tell me where retrospective papers stand with the application process for residencies??? 😕
My heart is set on radonc so if this is not enough, please some research advise for my school situation, outside of traveling to a different school for a summer research opportunity (i'm married with a little girl, < 1 yr.).

Thanks a lot everybody!!!

 

[napoleondynamite]

Get in on whatever you can. The important thing is, you are starting early and have plenty of road ahead of you to beef up your CV. The one piece of advice I have for you is that in these early stages of exploring this research project, you need to be very up front about authorship in my opinion. It is an uncomfortable and bold conversation, but a necessary one to avoid hard feelings later on. Define expectations on both ends. Tell your mentor exactly what you are after. For example, "what work would be expected on my end in order to be first author on this project if it is published?" I've known more than one med student who has slaved over a project only to get completely stiffed in the end. So now is the time to take care of that up front. I think most mentors would respect your candor and also your situation. I would say something like, "as you know, radonc has become extremely competetive. First authorship on a publication is becoming increasingly important. Is this the type of project that I could expect to be a first author on if I do x, y and z?"

 

[G'ville Nole]

Don't be alarmed, but you're suffering from "Student Doctor Message Board" bias. Contrary to the general tone of the board, applicants with 1st author publications of prospective data in JCO are few and far between. A retrospective study is a perfectly respectable research effort for rad onc applicants. The fact you're early in the game makes it possible for you to have several of these under your belt by the time you apply, if you're motivated to do so.

Remember, 22% PhDs in the "accepted" bin means that 78% aren't, and in my experience, the vast majority (including the PhDs) are just regular joes. Take care of business in your pre-clinical studies, rotations, etc., get a couple of abstracts and a pub or two under your belt, and don't let this board freak you out.

 

[Bruce Banner]

Don't be alarmed, but you're suffering from "Student Doctor Message Board" bias. Contrary to the general tone of the board, applicants with 1st author publications of prospective data in JCO are few and far between. A retrospective study is a perfectly respectable research effort for rad onc applicants. The fact you're early in the game makes it possible for you to have several of these under your belt by the time you apply, if you're motivated to do so.

Remember, 22% PhDs in the "accepted" bin means that 78% aren't, and in my experience, the vast majority (including the PhDs) are just regular joes. Take care of business in your pre-clinical studies, rotations, etc., get a couple of abstracts and a pub or two under your belt, and don't let this board freak you out.

Great advice G'ville Nole.

 

[ghgi8]

Get in on whatever you can. The important thing is, you are starting early and have plenty of road ahead of you to beef up your CV. The one piece of advice I have for you is that in these early stages of exploring this research project, you need to be very up front about authorship in my opinion. It is an uncomfortable and bold conversation, but a necessary one to avoid hard feelings later on. Define expectations on both ends. Tell your mentor exactly what you are after. For example, "what work would be expected on my end in order to be first author on this project if it is published?" I've known more than one med student who has slaved over a project only to get completely stiffed in the end. So now is the time to take care of that up front. I think most mentors would respect your candor and also your situation. I would say something like, "as you know, radonc has become extremely competetive. First authorship on a publication is becoming increasingly important. Is this the type of project that I could expect to be a first author on if I do x, y and z?"

When exactly is the right time to request something like this? Is it appropriate etiquette to contribute towards a project and then ask for your own or is it plausible to (boldly) request your own project from the onset of working with someone? I suspect that mentors may want us to prove our dedication/skill before such a responsibility is granted....

 

[napoleondynamite]

You gotta give yourself some credit..you're in medical school. Undergrad may have been a time to expect to be an assistant on any project, but as a budding physician I think it is perfectly appropriate to look for opportunities where you will be able to display your own scientific genius and creativity. Like I said, it's a bold move to address authorship up front and many are uncomfortable with this..but I've seen a lot of people get burned by not addressing this and having wrong expectations about authorship. During 4th year when I wanted to get in a project, I used this dialogue with my radonc mentor and she responded very favorably. She outlined exactly what would be expected for me to obtain first author on my project vs second author. But even if you walk away from a discussion like that with a rejection of the first author idea, you've at least outlined your intentions that you are definitely looking to get a publication under your belt and not just "the honor" of the experience and tutilage that the working with your mentor provides.. (which some are arrogant enough to believe..you could walk away with not only no pay for your time, but no publication and lots and lots and lots of time sunk into it).

 

[Gfunk6]

I absolutely agree w/ napoleondynamite. Ask about authorship upfront. It may seem a little "forward" but the bottom line is this . . . you need to put your name on any publication that results from your work (preferrably as close to first as you can).

 

[dilated]

A pubmed search will also help. Some faculty are fine with being last/corresponding author. Others (especially young assistant profs) always want to be first author. It really has less to do with what YOU do and more to do with what the faculty person is like - I've known ones who never want to be first author and ones who insist on it always.

 

[ECGcali]

Thanks for the advice!!! I meet with my mentor tomorrow afternoon and I'll give it a shot. He's really cool. When I first told him that pretty much everybody applying to radonc has to have their hands in research, preferably first or second author, he said he would set up this project for me for the sole purpose of me being published.

Thanks again for the time and advice!

 

[napoleondynamite]

Thanks for the advice!!! I meet with my mentor tomorrow afternoon and I'll give it a shot. He's really cool. When I first told him that pretty much everybody applying to radonc has to have their hands in research, preferably first or second author, he said he would set up this project for me for the sole purpose of me being published.

Thanks again for the time and advice!

That's great, glad that worked out for you. Now the hard part: actually doing the research