OBC again

[texdrake]

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Trying to setup my rotations for this summer...again approaching the question.

As a 3rd year do you all think it would be better for me to do OBC and thus have one less rotation and have 2 weeks less vacation

or....

Just skip the OBC and do the roations I already have planned and go into the miltary sans OBC.

I would like the experience, but I think it is much better on my education and scheduling if I don't. My rotations are much easier to schedule if I don't have to work it around OBC.

I guess my true question is how much do you all think I will miss by not attending and just doing an extra ADT? I would love to hear from people who have done so as well.

 

[ArmyDoc1999]

Trying to setup my rotations for this summer...again approaching the question.

As a 3rd year do you all think it would be better for me to do OBC and thus have one less rotation and have 2 weeks less vacation

or....

Just skip the OBC and do the roations I already have planned and go into the miltary sans OBC.

I would like the experience, but I think it is much better on my education and scheduling if I don't. My rotations are much easier to schedule if I don't have to work it around OBC.

I guess my true question is how much do you all think I will miss by not attending and just doing an extra ADT? I would love to hear from people who have done so as well.

OK, I haven't done what you are proposing, nor will I, but perhaps I can give you some perspective you haven't considered yet. The Army is all about training, and while medical school, internship, and residency will prepare you to be an excellent doctor, it will do very little to prepare you to be a SOLDIER. Many of the other denizens of this forum may ridicule that statement as irrelevant, but hear me out. As I said before, training is everything. When I was an enlisted soldier, I happend to recieve my promotion to Sergeant conditionally; that is, without having been to PLDC, because of the war. Until I completed PLDC, I was viewed as a "fake" sergeant, despite the fact that PLDC is little more than a course on how and where to reference things in Army FM's. Yes, going was a total waste of my time, and I could have opted not to go since I was leaving the active component to go HPSP and take a commission anyway, but it was about RESPECT. The same thing applies to OBC. While it is likely that no one will ever say anything, you will be viewed by the professional soldiers who serve with you as "unqualified".
If this doesn't matter to you, then do the extra rotation and forgo OBC. But I would encourage you to consider doing it just for the sake of going. The results might suprise you.

 

[DrBloodmoney]

Make sure you do it during med school, or you will have to go to 'real' OBC. I enjoyed 'fake' OBC very much (or as I like to call it... 'Vacationing in San Antonio')

 

[OH58D]

Highly recommend you knock out OBC sooner than later.... previous posters gave some good reasons. Additionally, I think it will make you more comfortable during your ADTs along w/ when you become Active duty. On the other hand.... I would also highly recommend you find a way to rotate at more than one hospital during the end of your third year/beginning of forth (non paid ADT type thing). Military match paperwork/interviews come up fast and furious.... try to rotate in at least two different programs.

 

[Hersey]

I have a couple of questions related to this discussion.

I doubt there are hard statistics to be had, but does anybody have any idea roughly what percentages of HPSP students attend OBC prior to 1st year, prior to 2nd year, etc.?

Has anybody taken the HPSP scholarship for less than four years? The school I've been accepted to has a number of dual degree programs that interest me, but as I understand it there's no mechanism for enrolling in such a program while doing the "standard" four-year HPSP scholarship. Most of the programs are structured so that the 2 preclinical years are followed by 1 or 2 years of grad/professional school for the additional degree, followed by 2 years of rotations. It's crossed my mind that I could take a two-year HPSP scholarship to cover the last 2 years of med school and still have a chance to serve in the military and earn an additional degree. Anybody have thoughts on this?

Thanks in advance.

 

[NateatUC]

I have a couple of questions related to this discussion.

I doubt there are hard statistics to be had, but does anybody have any idea roughly what percentages of HPSP students attend OBC prior to 1st year, prior to 2nd year, etc.?

Has anybody taken the HPSP scholarship for less than four years? The school I've been accepted to has a number of dual degree programs that interest me, but as I understand it there's no mechanism for enrolling in such a program while doing the "standard" four-year HPSP scholarship. Most of the programs are structured so that the 2 preclinical years are followed by 1 or 2 years of grad/professional school for the additional degree, followed by 2 years of rotations. It's crossed my mind that I could take a two-year HPSP scholarship to cover the last 2 years of med school and still have a chance to serve in the military and earn an additional degree. Anybody have thoughts on this?

Thanks in advance.

Here's my take on this stuff:

When I was at OBC (pre-second year, summer 2003), probably >85% of the HPSPers there were doing it between 1st and 2nd year. That being said, a pretty good portion of the OBC class are USUHSers, who are required to do it before they start (i.e. before their first year, so there are a lot - at least 25% - of the class doing OBC prior to first year, but they're not HPSP).

Also, a number of the folks I ended up spending down time with were doing 3-year scholarships. I'd say at least 10-15% of HPSPers, maybe more, may do less than 4 year scholarships (mostly 3 years; I know of VERY few who do 2 year deals, in fact, I don't personally know anyone who is doing one).

No personal experience with trying to get multiple degrees, but I think this is something that you should very seriously sit down with the recruiter and discuss. I think it has the potential to get pretty complicated. Another option you might consider for this goal would be FAP, where you commit to them for after med school and in return they pay back a portion of your loans. You're going to end up having to serve the length of your residency anyway if you take 2 year HPSP, since payback is the length of your scholarship OR the length of your residency (all of which are at least 3 years), whichever is longer. So you may get more bang for your buck this way. Since you're going to have to be in longer than 2 years anyway, you may as well get more than 2 years of school paid for.

Hope that last part made sense. Let me know if it didn't.

Nate

 

[Hersey]

No personal experience with trying to get multiple degrees, but I think this is something that you should very seriously sit down with the recruiter and discuss. I think it has the potential to get pretty complicated. Another option you might consider for this goal would be FAP, where you commit to them for after med school and in return they pay back a portion of your loans. You're going to end up having to serve the length of your residency anyway if you take 2 year HPSP, since payback is the length of your scholarship OR the length of your residency (all of which are at least 3 years), whichever is longer. So you may get more bang for your buck this way. Since you're going to have to be in longer than 2 years anyway, you may as well get more than 2 years of school paid for.

Hope that last part made sense. Let me know if it didn't.

Yeah, that makes perfect sense. I keep forgetting to factor in the residency obligation. A related question: that obligation only applies to military residencies, correct? That is, if one defers and does a civilian residency, no additional service obligation is incurred? Of course, I've gotten the distinct feeling that isn't a lot of certainty as to whether any given person will end up in a military vs. nonmilitary residency, so that wouldn't be anything to plan on. . .

Thanks for your input!

 

[texdrake]

I could rearrange my schedule, it is possible. My thinking is that I would enjoy it more....although I am about 10 pounds to heavy right now.....

Still I was concerned because I figured I would be one of the only 3rd year students at OBC...also I would have to then spend the entire summer is south texas...which is damn hot...I know I am a Texan after all.

I figured if I did OBC then I would just do a month at either El Paso or San Antonio directly following it and leading up to boards. It would also mean that I wouldn't get any time off before boards, i would have to just study after work every day...I had been hoping to take 2 weeks off to prep...Do you guys think that could have an affect?

Again just looking for more info as I need to change my rotation soon if I am going to do OBC.

Of course I suppose I could study during the evenings at OBC...seeing as I will have 4 less weeks of training before taking boards then most people.

 

[NateatUC]

Yeah, that makes perfect sense. I keep forgetting to factor in the residency obligation. A related question: that obligation only applies to military residencies, correct? That is, if one defers and does a civilian residency, no additional service obligation is incurred? Of course, I've gotten the distinct feeling that isn't a lot of certainty as to whether any given person will end up in a military vs. nonmilitary residency, so that wouldn't be anything to plan on. . .

Thanks for your input!

I believe you are correct. If you defer, you don't get any military benefits, pay, etc. while you're a resident, so nothing else to pay back. Here's the caveat - I don't know what specialty you're interested in, but I have reliable info (from COL Raines, the head of Army GME, who visited our school last spring) that regardless of specialty, your overall chance of matching to the Army is somewhere in the neighborhood of 70-80% (unless you want to do something really out there like neurosurg). So if I were you, I'd plan on the military residency (I know I am, and I want a fairly competitive specialty).

 

[texdrake]

What he failed to mention though is that some of the "military" residencies are actually outsourced to civillian hospitals

 

[SheroDoc]

Right now I am a second year. I was planning to take boards early to go to OBC by June 13th and I just wanted some input from anyone who has done it. It seems like a big rush now since everything is going by so fast and I don't even get out of school until May 15th so I'll only have a little time to study. I got advice from someone else to take the time to take the review course offered by my school that ends June 12th and take USMLE a week or two later and take the 11 week course after 4th year.
Feel free to let me know what you think.

Trying to setup my rotations for this summer...again approaching the question.

As a 3rd year do you all think it would be better for me to do OBC and thus have one less rotation and have 2 weeks less vacation

or....

Just skip the OBC and do the roations I already have planned and go into the miltary sans OBC.

I would like the experience, but I think it is much better on my education and scheduling if I don't. My rotations are much easier to schedule if I don't have to work it around OBC.

I guess my true question is how much do you all think I will miss by not attending and just doing an extra ADT? I would love to hear from people who have done so as well.

 

[denali]

Step I should be your first priority. DO NOT rush to get to OBC this summer if doing so will compromise your performance on the boards.

 

[CaptainJack02]

Step I should be your first priority. DO NOT rush to get to OBC this summer if doing so will compromise your performance on the boards.

I haven't had the chance to ask my recruiter this question: Can I do OBC before starting MS1? I need the pay ASAP to buy a car, plus I'd love to get some extra leadership training and maybe do some shadowing at Army hospitals before I ever reach the wards - better performance on the wards and more exposure to milmed 👍

also, one of the earlier posters mentioned nsurg. walter reed has only 1 nsurg position, does that mean that a qualified applicant will have a better chance of deferment for nsurg to a civvy residency than with other specialties? plus, an army res in nsurg also equals 7 years of payback. that's insane, even if you're gung ho about the military!!

 

[CodeBlueMD]

Texdrake,

I'm in a similar situation, an M2 who took a 3 yr scholarship and I haven't done OBC. I decided last week to postpone the start of my 3rd year and go ahead and do OBC this summer. We finish class the first week of May so I'll still have 4 weeks to study for boards, which I'm hoping is enough. Have you decided one way or the other?

 

[texdrake]

Texdrake,

I'm in a similar situation, an M2 who took a 3 yr scholarship and I haven't done OBC. I decided last week to postpone the start of my 3rd year and go ahead and do OBC this summer. We finish class the first week of May so I'll still have 4 weeks to study for boards, which I'm hoping is enough. Have you decided one way or the other?

I did actually. I based it off the following email....although I will leave out the names:

As far as OBC - constructive credit is almost uniformly given to anyone that completes residency - if you fill out the proper paperwork your senior year. I had 3 residents apply and get credit last year. If you demonstrate that you have done at least one year as an AD officer, the understanding is that you have figured out the system. As far as being "behind the eight ball", I wouldn't worry. While there are things you will pick up at OBC, most of Active Duty is OJT. The fact that you are doing ADTs and rotating in medical centers will catch you up quickly with your peers. I went to med school in ******, did not attend OBC, and never even met my recruiter - but I figured out most of the stuff on my own as a medical student. Some of it through the school of hard knocks - but all very manageable.

This person is actually in charge of a major army medical education center

I was torn, but frankly this allows me to do a few more things in my schedule which is important seeing as I started out wanting to do FP and now am undecided between FP, Peds, ER, and maybe even cardiology

 

[CodeBlueMD]

Sounds like reasonable advice. Off topic - are there any Drake grads in your class at DMU? I graduated in '02.

 

[texdrake]

Yes there are a couple, don't remember who though. They always take a couple Drake people it seems.

 

[colbgw02]

I know I'm a little late joining this discussion, but I'm not on scholarship, so I don't have a recruiter or any familiar POC to whom I can ask these questions.

It sounds like completing OBC before residency isn't required, even if you are an HPSP student. Then, after you complete your residency, the Army figures you're good-to-go, so you apply for and receive credit for OBC. Is this right?

 

[texdrake]

Yep, thats correct. But, they highly encourage you to go and you have to go if you can.

I was on a 3 year scholarship so I couldn't go prior to my first year and received the scholarship to late to go after my 1st year. Then my school was still in session when it started the following year making it very difficult for me to go.

You have to have a good reason and proof to bypass it.

 

[Datko]

Im an army Guard ROTC grad (AUG 2003) and have been able to postpone my MSC OBC but was wondering If I will have to complete an additional OBC Medical Corps in order to be a physician in the army guard. I will be in San Antonio on January 23rd, 2005 to start my MSC OBC. I was there in 2001 completing my 91B (combat medic) training. I am still waiting on an acceptance to medical school though, should find out by friday if Im in.

 

[texdrake]

Im an army Guard ROTC grad (AUG 2003) and have been able to postpone my MSC OBC but was wondering If I will have to complete an additional OBC Medical Corps in order to be a physician in the army guard. I will be in San Antonio on January 23rd, 2005 to start my MSC OBC. I was there in 2001 completing my 91B (combat medic) training. I am still waiting on an acceptance to medical school though, should find out by friday if Im in.

No, you shouldn't have to.

 

[DoctorDoom]

Anyone attend OBC after medical school? I am signing on as a licensed GS without previous HPSP/UHSU obligation and no prior service experience.

Thanks.

 

[NateatUC]

Anyone attend OBC after medical school? I am signing on as a licensed GS without previous HPSP/UHSU obligation and no prior service experience.

Thanks.

I'm not in your situation, but I can tell you that in my OBC class we had one guy who had been a civilian ENT for like 20 years, got fed up with the BS of private practice, and joined up. They comissioned him as an O-5, and slipped him into our 6-week HPSP OBC, rather than having him do the 12-week all-corps session. I guess they wanted him to get started doing his job ASAP. So I can tell you that it is done, and you probably should do it, especially if you have no prior military experience.

 

[DoctorDoom]

I'm not in your situation, but I can tell you that in my OBC class we had one guy who had been a civilian ENT for like 20 years, got fed up with the BS of private practice, and joined up. They comissioned him as an O-5, and slipped him into our 6-week HPSP OBC, rather than having him do the 12-week all-corps session. I guess they wanted him to get started doing his job ASAP. So I can tell you that it is done, and you probably should do it, especially if you have no prior military experience.

Based on your post, I should clarify. I am definitely doing the All Corps course and the prep course, so my question wasn't intended to query whether I should do OBC. Rather, I was looking for those in my situation, if any, to share their experience at OBC, particularly if they did the All Corps course, if possible.

Sorry about the confusion!