Old MD (35 yo) and IMG - Chances for Residency / Practice in US or Aussie

[praetorfenix]

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I started medical school at 30 and I graduated at 34, obtaining my Philippine license at 35. Considering that I'm both a nontraditional graduate + IMG, what are my chances of getting a family / community medicine post in the US or Australia? Will the fact that I had a late calling to medicine be a deciding factor against me? Will my "old" age hurt my chances of matching in the US / Australia?

Is it easier to get into Australia versus the US? I don't mind serving in an AON (Area Of Need) so long as I can get in and practice my profession.

Fellow nontrads, your inspiration and guidance is very much appreciated. 🙂

 

[njbmd]

Moved to General Residency as this is a residency issue rather than pre-health.

 

[sirus_virus]

I started medical school at 30 and I graduated at 34, obtaining my Philippine license at 35. Considering that I'm both a nontraditional graduate + IMG, what are my chances of getting a family / community medicine post in the US or Australia? Will the fact that I had a late calling to medicine be a deciding factor against me? Will my "old" age hurt my chances of matching in the US / Australia?

Is it easier to get into Australia versus the US? I don't mind serving in an AON (Area Of Need) so long as I can get in and practice my profession.

Fellow nontrads, your inspiration and guidance is very much appreciated. 🙂

Dude, if you plan on doing all the things you just mentioned, I don't see any issues. Now if you are planning on getting into plastics or derm, then you are going to have your work cut out for you.

Now also remember that some of these "areas of need" are in fact areas of need for a reason. People don't want to go there for numerous reasons, make sure you are not walking into a brick wall.

 

[Dr.Millisevert]

Dude, if you plan on doing all the things you just mentioned, I don't see any issues. Now if you are planning on getting into plastics or derm, then you are going to have your work cut out for you.

Now also remember that some of these "areas of need" are in fact areas of need for a reason. People don't want to go there for numerous reasons, make sure you are not walking into a brick wall.

Agreed.

To the OP: Doing GP/Family medicine training is actually more competative in Australia than the US because they make on average much higher salaries in than in the US. soo.. You can try both places. But I think you might find it easier getting into a US Family medicine residency. I'm sure there are a few out there that will definitly take you.. esp as you stated.. you are willing to go to an area of need. 👍

Good luck

 

[Winged Scapula]

You are not that old; there are many physicians in the US who started medical school after another career or spent a few years working on improving their application before applying.

As mentioned above, FM is more competitive in Australia than in the US and in general, FM is fairly FMG friendly in the US.

 

[praetorfenix]

AONs in Aussie are really isolated places, right? Hick towns in the middle of nowhere? How would you describe them?

Thank you very much for your advice. I'll give both a try.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Australia definitely suffers the tyranny of distance - both for the country and its towns. The AONs there are not the same as in the US, where you will probably find a large city within a few hours drive. In some areas of Oz, it may take you 24 hours to drive to "civilization", so many would fly in for their supplies. But if you're going to be paid $700K AUD as a general practitioner, you'll have to put up with some adversities.

If you can get a spot in some places in the NT, like near Alice Springs, its not so bad because there is an actual town, and with a suprising number of foreign tourists, glamming up the place.😀

 

[HCE]

I started medical school at 30 and I graduated at 34, obtaining my Philippine license at 35. Considering that I'm both a nontraditional graduate + IMG, what are my chances of getting a family / community medicine post in the US or Australia? Will the fact that I had a late calling to medicine be a deciding factor against me? Will my "old" age hurt my chances of matching in the US / Australia?

Is it easier to get into Australia versus the US? I don't mind serving in an AON (Area Of Need) so long as I can get in and practice my profession.

Fellow nontrads, your inspiration and guidance is very much appreciated. 🙂

35???? you're a pup...

 

[praetorfenix]

Australia definitely suffers the tyranny of distance - both for the country and its towns. The AONs there are not the same as in the US, where you will probably find a large city within a few hours drive. In some areas of Oz, it may take you 24 hours to drive to "civilization", so many would fly in for their supplies. But if you're going to be paid $700K AUD as a general practitioner, you'll have to put up with some adversities.

If you can get a spot in some places in the NT, like near Alice Springs, its not so bad because there is an actual town, and with a suprising number of foreign tourists, glamming up the place.😀

Appreciate the specifics, Winged Scapula. With the crazy oil prices, I sure hope I get to drive a biofuel car.

Off tangent but somehow related -- Do you need to finish a 3Y residency program in Oz before you get to practice like in the US? Or will the MCQs (written & practical parts) do? Aside from an MD, I have an EMT certificate of training here in the Philippines. Not sure if they recognize it though.

35???? you're a pup...

Haha! Thanks for the moral boost HCE! I just hope I don't make you feel so old. 😀

 

[Blade28]

Off tangent but somehow related -- Do you need to finish a 3Y residency program in Oz before you get to practice like in the US?

For all intents and purposes, if you want to practice medicine in the US, you need to complete a residency here.

 

[Dr.Millisevert]

For all intents and purposes, if you want to practice medicine in the US, you need to complete a residency here.

Same in Australia.

 

[Leforte]

I agree that you need to decide on where you want to practice. If it is Australia, you need to do your training there. Conversely, if you want to practice in the US, do your training here. It is easier from GPs to go from the US to Australia than vice-versa, but any specialist will find it extremely difficult. In the US, you will most likely need to repeat residency if you train in Australia and decide to move here. I knew a Peds intensivist fellow who married an American, decided to stay here, and then had to redo her peds residency after her fellowship (at the same hospital) - a bit weird to have your former interns become your seniors. Going to Australia as a foreign trained GP/specialist is similarly difficult. There is the whole 10 year moratorium thing on obtaining a medicare provider number and the fact that you'll need to complete the AMC pathways (which can take several years) or be assessed as a specialist - the specialist assessment pathway nearly always results in additional training requirements, which are obtained competitively against native born Aussies.

Long story short - figure out where you want to live/work/raise a family and get into that system as early as possible.

 

[praetorfenix]

For all intents and purposes, if you want to practice medicine in the US, you need to complete a residency here.

Obviously. I'm just clueless about Oz. 😕

I agree that you need to decide on where you want to practice. If it is Australia, you need to do your training there. Conversely, if you want to practice in the US, do your training here. It is easier from GPs to go from the US to Australia than vice-versa, but any specialist will find it extremely difficult. In the US, you will most likely need to repeat residency if you train in Australia and decide to move here. I knew a Peds intensivist fellow who married an American, decided to stay here, and then had to redo her peds residency after her fellowship (at the same hospital) - a bit weird to have your former interns become your seniors. Going to Australia as a foreign trained GP/specialist is similarly difficult. There is the whole 10 year moratorium thing on obtaining a medicare provider number and the fact that you'll need to complete the AMC pathways (which can take several years) or be assessed as a specialist - the specialist assessment pathway nearly always results in additional training requirements, which are obtained competitively against native born Aussies.

Long story short - figure out where you want to live/work/raise a family and get into that system as early as possible.

Yes I've heard about the moratorium thing and the time it takes from conditional to full registration system. It really sucks big time. Perhaps settling for an AON down under would facilitate things.

My cousin got matched at Johns Hopkins but opted for an hick town (in US parlance - Area of Physician Shortage) in North Dakota. You even had to cross the Canadian border to get to a Chinese resto. That isolated! Well it turned out to be a good decision since he's so happy there.

 

[Leforte]

For Oz, it's not just the moratorium - I remember looking at statistics a few years ago that list each specialty and how successful foreign trained physicians/surgeons were in their applications. The lowest was ophthalmology where < 10% of foreign surgeons who applied were successful in having their qualifications recognized. Other surgeons, in general, had about 1/3 successful, 1/3 needed to complete part II of the fellowship exam and 1-2 years of supervised practice and another 1/3 who required additional training. In essence 2/3 of applicants had additional requirements for registration. While the whole supervised practice thing may not sound like a big deal - it is. The hospital that agrees to sponsor you will need to pay a fully qualified surgeon (or two) to come out 4 times a year to audit your clinical and surgical records to ensure you are meeting the standard of care (which, I agree, is a good thing). This cost, however, is paid by either you or your employer. Not only that, to lodge an application as a foreign surgeon is quite expensive and, I am told, can easily exceed $15k.

Also, with the 10 year moratorium - you'll be working in an AON. I think alot of people feel that they can do their time and then move towards the bigger cities - but my personal opinion is that it would be very difficult to pick up your practice and start all over again in a new place when you would be in your prime years professionally.

One benefit of doing your training in Oz is that your time in training counts towards the moratorium. So if you spend 7 years in surgical training, you'd owe an additional 3 years in an AON. Much more palatable than moving there in your mid-thirties ++ (when you've finished you training in what-ever country, completed the assessment process and actually located a position) and then having the moratorium requirements to fulfill.

 

[praetorfenix]

Thank you Leforte! Surgery isn't my field, more of IM/FM with minor surgery.

I got three Filipino friends in Oz now. One is already an RMO (after parts I & II of MCQ right) and the other one is reviewing for part I. Is it true that in Oz they prefer MDs with experience (i.e. 2-3 years moonlighting or 3 year residency grads) to fresh licensed MDs who are just out of internship? I'm a 35yo GP with EMT training.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the age of an OTD doesn't matter there right? If you're 35-40 and you'd like a fresh start, especially in an AON, why not?

 

[Leforte]

I don't know about the moonlighting thing there - I am sure there are a few people in the Australia forum who could answer that for you. I also do not know how the moratorium would effect your being able to moonlight and see people in a facility not in an AON.

As far as age goes, I have not heard that age plays any factor when the AMC/Specialist colleges are considering your qualifications. It is more about where your were trained (UK physicians/surgeons are more easily accepted than their US counterparts - the UK and Oz training models are very similar), and how far out of your training that you are (more is better).

Age may play a role in the immigration part of the process, as I think they do award points based on age and younger is scored higher, in general.

I would talk to whatever medical/surgical college has the training programs that you want and get the scoop from them.

 

[AlternateSome1]

My cousin got matched at Johns Hopkins but opted for an hick town (in US parlance - Area of Physician Shortage) in North Dakota.

I call shenanigans. How did he opt out of the match?

 

[AlternateSome1]

I started medical school at 30 and I graduated at 34, obtaining my Philippine license at 35. Considering that I'm both a nontraditional graduate + IMG, what are my chances of getting a family / community medicine post in the US or Australia? Will the fact that I had a late calling to medicine be a deciding factor against me? Will my "old" age hurt my chances of matching in the US / Australia?

Is it easier to get into Australia versus the US? I don't mind serving in an AON (Area Of Need) so long as I can get in and practice my profession.

Fellow nontrads, your inspiration and guidance is very much appreciated. 🙂

34 isn't too far off from the typical applicant. Sure, some people go straight through and are 25-27 when they apply, but many applicants have had a few years off and are in their early thirties by the time residency starts. IMG status makes residency positions harder to obtain in the US, but applying broadly to FP, IM, and/or Psych programs will help.

 

[Winged Scapula]

I call shenanigans. How did he opt out of the match?

I suspect what the OP meant is that his cousin got offered a contract from Hopkins but turned it down for some hick town in North Dakota rather than his cousin MATCHED to a position at JHU (for which turning down a position would be a match violation).

But who knows..maybe shenanigans are afoot.