Online prereqs but with real labs

[Bribri123]

Hi everyone

I wanted to know if doing my science pre reqs for med school at a community college online but with a lab kit purchased as part of the class and done at home is okay considering I am an RN and I took allied health versions of chemistry and biology from a private 4 year. I have heard MD schools frown upon it but DO schools are a little more lenient which I’m fine with, so will I be okay has anyone done online sciences and been accepted to med schools specifically any in CA ?

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[rdyotz]

Many schools flat out won't accept it. Schools that do accept online coursework usually want the labs in person (not a kit). Many schools will, at best, count it as a negative against you. I would take the class in person at a community College to have a decent chance.

Some have gotten in with online courses, but they applied very broadly across the country. Many schools have a limit to the number of credits /prereqs that can be online.

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

Hi everyone

I wanted to know if doing my science pre reqs for med school at a community college online but with a lab kit purchased as part of the class and done at home is okay considering I am an RN and I took allied health versions of chemistry and biology from a private 4 year. I have heard MD schools frown upon it but DO schools are a little more lenient which I’m fine with, so will I be okay has anyone done online sciences and been accepted to med schools specifically any in CA ?

I teach online chemistry and physics courses. I use lab kits so that students can do experiments at home. I have never received any negative feedback regarding the quality, acceptability, or "transferability" of the courses I teach. By the way, a California community college is accredited by the WASC.

 

[RNthenDoc]

University of Central Florida straight-up will not accept it. That’s the only school I encountered (I did my prerequisites in person but had some stuff such as college algebra completed online, and the MD admissions department was VERY stern about their zero-tolerance).

 

[BTDT]

Hi everyone

I wanted to know if doing my science pre reqs for med school at a community college online but with a lab kit purchased as part of the class and done at home is okay considering I am an RN and I took allied health versions of chemistry and biology from a private 4 year. I have heard MD schools frown upon it but DO schools are a little more lenient which I’m fine with, so will I be okay has anyone done online sciences and been accepted to med schools specifically any in CA ?

Over twenty medical schools that I've found (allopathic and osteopathic) will accept online pre-requisites - some with outright acceptance (regionally accredited, of course) and some case-by-case. By the research I just did (9/2019 - MSAR, school admissions pages and e-mails to admissions for reference) more allopathic than osteopathic schools on this list of twenty I just made.

Don't believe everything you read on SDN (my post included). [EDIT 9/20/19: See post below about the Kaiser school.]

 

[Bribri123]

Over twenty medical schools that I've found (allopathic and osteopathic) will accept online pre-requisites - some with outright acceptance (regionally accredited, of course) and some case-by-case. By the research I just did (9/2019 - MSAR, school admissions pages and e-mails to admissions for reference) more allopathic than osteopathic schools on this list of twenty I just made.

Don't believe everything you read on SDN (my post included). I haven't called or e-mailed but as far as California is concerned, I don't see any issues so far at the new Kaiser school.

Could


Could you get me a list of those schools ?

 

[BTDT]

Could you get me a list of those schools ?

Sure, when I get home from work.

 

[BTDT]

Call and verify; standards are always subject to change. Here's the aforementioned list. There might or might not be others.

ALLOPATHIC MEDICAL SCHOOLS (in no particular order):
Chicago Medical School at Rosalind Franklin University of Medicine and Science
Drexel University College of Medicine
Michigan State University College of Human Medicine
Oakland University William Beaumont School of Medicine
Seton Hall University School of Medicine
Tulane University School of Medicine
University of Missouri-Columbia School of Medicine
University of North Dakota School of Medicine and Health Sciences
University of Oklahoma College of Medicine
University of South Alabama College of Medicine
University of South Dakota Sanford School of Medicine
University of Washington School of Medicine
Wake Forest School of Medicine
West Virginia University of School of Medicine
Emory School of Medicine

OSTEOPATHIC:
Michigan State University College of Osteopathic Medicine
Philadelphia College of Osteopathic Medicine (all three locations)
University of New England College of Osteopathic Medicine
West Virginia College of Osteopathic Medicine
New York Institute College of Osteopathic Medicine (both locations)
Des Moines University College of Osteopathic Medicine
Lake Erie College of Osteopathic Medicine (both locations)
Liberty University College of Osteopathic Medicine
Rocky Vista University College of Osteopathic Medicine

This list a mix of State and Private, Non-Profit and For-Profit schools.

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

Call and verify; standards are always subject to change. Here's the aforementioned list. There might or might not be others.

ALLOPATHIC MEDICAL SCHOOLS (in no particular order):
Chicago Medical School at Rosalind Franklin University of Medicine and Science
Drexel University College of Medicine
Michigan State University College of Human Medicine
Oakland University William Beaumont School of Medicine
Seton Hall University School of Medicine
Tulane University School of Medicine
University of Missouri-Columbia School of Medicine
University of North Dakota School of Medicine and Health Sciences
University of Oklahoma College of Medicine
University of South Alabama College of Medicine
University of South Dakota Sanford School of Medicine
University of Washington School of Medicine
Wake Forest School of Medicine
West Virginia University of School of Medicine

OSTEOPATHIC:
Michigan State University College of Osteopathic Medicine
Philadelphia College of Osteopathic Medicine (all three locations)
University of New England College of Osteopathic Medicine
West Virginia College of Osteopathic Medicine
New York Institute College of Osteopathic Medicine (both locations)
Des Moines University College of Osteopathic Medicine
Lake Erie College of Osteopathic Medicine (both locations)
Liberty University College of Osteopathic Medicine
Rocky Vista University College of Osteopathic Medicine

This list a mix of State and Private, Non-Profit and For-Profit schools.

Thanks!

 

[RNthenDoc]

If you can message me the contact information for the person you interacted with, I am willing to send them my syllabi and to have a discussion with them.

Oh sorry, that email got angrily deleted and I moved on to my dozens of other secondaries, so I have no documentation of the exchange.

 

[Bribri123]

Thanks!

Call and verify; standards are always subject to change. Here's the aforementioned list. There might or might not be others.

ALLOPATHIC MEDICAL SCHOOLS (in no particular order):
Chicago Medical School at Rosalind Franklin University of Medicine and Science
Drexel University College of Medicine
Michigan State University College of Human Medicine
Oakland University William Beaumont School of Medicine
Seton Hall University School of Medicine
Tulane University School of Medicine
University of Missouri-Columbia School of Medicine
University of North Dakota School of Medicine and Health Sciences
University of Oklahoma College of Medicine
University of South Alabama College of Medicine
University of South Dakota Sanford School of Medicine
University of Washington School of Medicine
Wake Forest School of Medicine
West Virginia University of School of Medicine

OSTEOPATHIC:
Michigan State University College of Osteopathic Medicine
Philadelphia College of Osteopathic Medicine (all three locations)
University of New England College of Osteopathic Medicine
West Virginia College of Osteopathic Medicine
New York Institute College of Osteopathic Medicine (both locations)
Des Moines University College of Osteopathic Medicine
Lake Erie College of Osteopathic Medicine (both locations)
Liberty University College of Osteopathic Medicine
Rocky Vista University College of Osteopathic Medicine

This list a mix of State and Private, Non-Profit and For-Profit schools.

Thanks a lot ! This is a huge help

 

[jamaica jan sun princess]

Oh sorry, that email got angrily deleted and I moved on to my dozens of other secondaries, so I have no documentation of the exchange.

It should be in your trash folder for ~30 days.

 

[MissRibeye]

Would math and psychology classes count as classes we shouldn't take online through our community colleges? I didn't think those would be a problem since they aren't lab classes.

 

[BTDT]

Would math and psychology classes count as classes we shouldn't take online through our community colleges? I didn't think those would be a problem since they aren't lab classes.

It really just depends on what schools you're applying to. Some schools in list I provided above accept virtual labs in the "regular" sciences, so I'm not sure why psych, math or other non-biology/chemistry classes would be any exception.

 

[MissRibeye]

It really just depends on what schools you're applying to. Some schools in list I provided above accept virtual labs in the "regular" sciences, so I'm not sure why psych, math or other non-biology/chemistry classes would be any exception.

I mean with the other schools that don't accept online courses.

 

[BTDT]

The MSAR / admissions pages of the schools you're interested in would give you a better idea as to what they'll accept. The MSAR doesn't always have update-to-date data, so I'd start with the admissions pages.

 

[kbRD2MD84]

UNC is also very anti-online-prereqs. I emailed their ADCOM to confirm what I saw on the website/MSAR and she told me to call her and was super condescending. Basically explained to me that yes I do need to take prerequisite courses and no, online courses are unacceptable DUH why would I ask that. As someone with a 2nd BS fully online (which she already knew) that was kinda rude. Wish some of these schools would get with the times and realize that some of the online science prereqs out there are HARDER than seated classes. Ugh.

 

[emergencydancing]

Wish some of these schools would get with the times and realize that some of the online science prereqs out there are HARDER than seated classes. Ugh.

Sorry about your experience, sounds pretty harsh. However, it is my understanding that for the most part online classes are a lot easier than in classroom. It's also a lot easier to cheat.

Unfortunately your argument that some on line are better than some in classroom does not really hold. I'm sure some water in Africa is cleaner than some water in the United States, but that doesn't mean you should drink it.

 

[deleted555445]

FYI, I reached out to Kaiser in March about online classes I wanted to take due to a military commitment. Here is the response I received: "Online coursework and degrees will not be considered in the application process.". All other California schools, outside of Stanford, that I emailed said they would accept online coursework, but I didn't specifically ask for prereqs, which may be trickier.

 

[BTDT]

Sorry about your experience, sounds pretty harsh. However, it is my understanding that for the most part online classes are a lot easier than in classroom. It's also a lot easier to cheat.

Unfortunately your argument that some on line are better than some in classroom does not really hold. I'm sure some water in Africa is cleaner than some water in the United States, but that doesn't mean you should drink it.

This is inaccurate, though I'll concede there is some subjectivity here. As someone who has taken both online and brick-and-mortar science classes, taking these classes online at reputable institutions is not only difficult, it's been my experience that it's far more work. Africa water analogies aside, the post did not say the courses were "better," just "harder," which some indeed are.

While there are systems in place to discourage cheating, it's no secret people will work to game the system whether it's online or in a physical classroom. I won't name names but as of September 2019, there's a cheating scandal within a special master's program (pre-med) at a university local to me which also has its own allopathic medical school.

FYI, I reached out to Kaiser in March about online classes I wanted to take due to a military commitment. Here is the response I received: "Online coursework and degrees will not be considered in the application process.". All other California schools, outside of Stanford, that I emailed said they would accept online coursework, but I didn't specifically ask for prereqs, which may be trickier.

This is good to know. Thanks for the update.

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

This is inaccurate, though I'll concede there is some subjectivity here. As someone who has taken both online and brick-and-mortar science classes, taking these classes online at reputable institutions is not only difficult, it's been my experience that it's far more work. Africa water analogies aside, the post did not say the courses were "better," just "harder," which some indeed are.

While there are systems in place to discourage cheating, it's no secret people will work to game the system whether it's online or in a physical classroom. I won't name names but as of September 2019, there's a cheating scandal within a special master's program (pre-med) at a university local to me which also has its own allopathic medical school.



This is good to know. Thanks for the update.

I teach both online and on-ground classes.

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

I teach both online and on-ground classes. Each type of class has its positive and negative aspects. For example, in on-ground classes, the students are given lab handouts and have the materials set up for them, while in online classes, the students have to order a lab kit and assemble some of the materials themselves without the direct supervision of an instructor. In on-ground classes, students have to commute in and this can take upwards of 2 hours each way if they live in one of the outlying counties. In contrast, online students can view recorded lectures, but they need self-discipline and time management skills.

From an accreditation perspective (from a Dept. of Education level), online and onground classes have the same learning outcomes and are equivalent.

 

[kbRD2MD84]

This is inaccurate, though I'll concede there is some subjectivity here. As someone who has taken both online and brick-and-mortar science classes, taking these classes online at reputable institutions is not only difficult, it's been my experience that it's far more work. Africa water analogies aside, the post did not say the courses were "better," just "harder," which some indeed are.

While there are systems in place to discourage cheating, it's no secret people will work to game the system whether it's online or in a physical classroom. I won't name names but as of September 2019, there's a cheating scandal within a special master's program (pre-med) at a university local to me which also has its own allopathic medical school.



This is good to know. Thanks for the update.

Thank you. I've taken both as well - in fact, I have a degree in both. I'm currently finishing prereqs through UNE Online, and overall, they are the most challenging courses I've ever taken (and the proctoring requirements for exams are insane). Not sure where these cheating-friendly online courses are, because these sure aren't 😉

 

[Bonne Nuit]

I teach both online and on-ground classes. Each type of class has its positive and negative aspects. For example, in on-ground classes, the students are given lab handouts and have the materials set up for them, while in online classes, the students have to order a lab kit and assemble some of the materials themselves without the direct supervision of an instructor. In on-ground classes, students have to commute in and this can take upwards of 2 hours each way if they live in one of the outlying counties. In contrast, online students can view recorded lectures, but they need self-discipline and time management skills.

From an accreditation perspective (from a Dept. of Education level), online and onground classes have the same learning outcomes and are equivalent.

You indicated earlier that you teach online chemistry. I mean no disrespect, but I’m having a hard time envisioning how an online chemistry lab could be an equal experience to an in-person teaching lab experience. How can students fully participate the “standard” gen chem labs (e.g., weak acid-strong base titration, solubility, etc.) at home without access to the appropriate equipment and chemicals? Doing an at-home experiment kit is all fine and good, but it is also a severely limited experience compared to working directly with an instructor in a wet lab.

Part of the teaching lab experience is also learning how to use standard lab equipment, proper measurement techniques, lab safety, and general lab etiquette. These are skills that will be important for basic research opportunities and medical school laboratory work.

Just because the US DoE accredits online and in-person lab experiences equivalently does not mean that online/in-person labs are equivalent experiences in terms of preparing someone for medical school.

I sound skeptical, and it’s because I am, a little bit. But I’m genuinely open to changing my mind and I’m very interested in your thoughts. Thanks 🙂

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

You indicated earlier that you teach online chemistry. I mean no disrespect, but I’m having a hard time envisioning how an online chemistry lab could be an equal experience to an in-person teaching lab experience. How can students fully participate the “standard” gen chem labs (e.g., weak acid-strong base titration, solubility, etc.) at home without access to the appropriate equipment and chemicals? Doing an at-home experiment kit is all fine and good, but it is also a severely limited experience compared to working directly with an instructor in a wet lab.

Part of the teaching lab experience is also learning how to use standard lab equipment, proper measurement techniques, lab safety, and general lab etiquette. These are skills that will be important for basic research opportunities and medical school laboratory work.

Just because the US DoE accredits online and in-person lab experiences equivalently does not mean that online/in-person labs are equivalent experiences in terms of preparing someone for medical school.

I sound skeptical, and it’s because I am, a little bit. But I’m genuinely open to changing my mind and I’m very interested in your thoughts. Thanks 🙂

I use commercially available lab kits from vendors such as eScienceLabs, Hands-On-Labs, and Carolina Biological. I encourage you to look on their websites and take a look at the products they offer. I think you will be impressed by the variety of labs that students can do at home using basic equipment. For example, weak/acid strong base titrations are done using vinegar and a solution of NaOH. Students get to use a pocket-size pH meter. Equilibrium constants (and solubility) are measured electrochemically using a $10 digital voltmeter (similar to the kind one can buy at Harbor Freight). There are also lab kits for physics too.

I should mention that a few years ago, I was skeptical about the quality of lab kits, but my opinion did change once I found out more about it.

At the community college I teach at, I do allow online students to come to campus and do on-ground labs. We can make these arrangements since I teach at a small school.

 

[kbRD2MD84]

I use commercially available lab kits from vendors such as eScienceLabs, Hands-On-Labs, and Carolina Biological. I encourage you to look on their websites and take a look at the products they offer. I think you will be impressed by the variety of labs that students can do at home using basic equipment. For example, weak/acid strong base titrations are done using vinegar and a solution of NaOH. Students get to use a pocket-size pH meter. Equilibrium constants (and solubility) are measured electrochemically using a $10 digital voltmeter (similar to the kind one can buy at Harbor Freight). There are also lab kits for physics too.

I should mention that a few years ago, I was skeptical about the quality of lab kits, but my opinion did change once I found out more about it.

At the community college I teach at, I do allow online students to come to campus and do on-ground labs. We can make these arrangements since I teach at a small school.

Agreed. I've used HOL, and the equipment/chemicals provided in the kit are right in line with what I've used for in-person labs. It's not some obscure computer simulation or "less" than any lab that just happens to be on a college campus. Additionally, you're completely on your own without a lab partner or professor to nudge you in the right direction, and proper lab etiquette and safety are addressed and expected to be followed. Is it perfect? No. Are the techniques and knowledge gained on-par with CC or 4-year in-person labs I've taken? Absolutely.

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

Agreed. I've used HOL, and the equipment/chemicals provided in the kit are right in line with what I've used for in-person labs. It's not some obscure computer simulation or "less" than any lab that just happens to be on a college campus. Additionally, you're completely on your own without a lab partner or professor to nudge you in the right direction, and proper lab etiquette and safety are addressed and expected to be followed. Is it perfect? No. Are the techniques and knowledge gained on-par with CC or 4-year in-person labs I've taken? Absolutely.

Thanks for the input.

In order to save students some money, I do encourage them to work together so they only have to buy one kit. Eventually, I would like to videotape students doing the labs and then post them on YouTube so that other students can benefit.

 

[RNthenDoc]

It should be in your trash folder for ~30 days.

I am an M2, the email exchange happened years ago.

 

[Bonne Nuit]

I use commercially available lab kits from vendors such as eScienceLabs, Hands-On-Labs, and Carolina Biological. I encourage you to look on their websites and take a look at the products they offer. I think you will be impressed by the variety of labs that students can do at home using basic equipment. For example, weak/acid strong base titrations are done using vinegar and a solution of NaOH. Students get to use a pocket-size pH meter. Equilibrium constants (and solubility) are measured electrochemically using a $10 digital voltmeter (similar to the kind one can buy at Harbor Freight). There are also lab kits for physics too.

I should mention that a few years ago, I was skeptical about the quality of lab kits, but my opinion did change once I found out more about it.

At the community college I teach at, I do allow online students to come to campus and do on-ground labs. We can make these arrangements since I teach at a small school.

Thanks for taking the time to address my questions. I'll take a look at those kits - sounds like some advances have been made since I last took an online class (10 years ago now...I'm old).

 

[Jedi_Knight]

University of Central Florida straight-up will not accept it. That’s the only school I encountered (I did my prerequisites in person but had some stuff such as college algebra completed online, and the MD admissions department was VERY stern about their zero-tolerance).

How do they even know it was online? The transcript for my online courses don't say "online."

 

[kbRD2MD84]

How do they even know it was online? The transcript for my online courses don't say "online."

It really depends on the school you took them at. Some will specify "online" (I don't think any of mine have). Others I believe there's some way for adcoms to look at the section and determine that it's online vs in-person.

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

It really depends on the school you took them at. Some will specify "online" (I don't think any of mine have). Others I believe there's some way for adcoms to look at the section and determine that it's online vs in-person.

At the community college I teach at, I had an email discussion with the registrar and there is no way to tell if a section is online or in-person. This was not true in the past, however.

I believe these changes are being implemented through the National Student Clearinghouse and what student data they actually intake.

 

[ruedi]

Thank you. I've taken both as well - in fact, I have a degree in both. I'm currently finishing prereqs through UNE Online, and overall, they are the most challenging courses I've ever taken (and the proctoring requirements for exams are insane). Not sure where these cheating-friendly online courses are, because these sure aren't 😉

Hi I am wondering if you saw some success with the UNE courses! I can describe my situation below:

Hello,

I am turning 30 this year and I am a non-traditional applicant.

I have a BA (psychology, health care inequalities) 3.89; and MA (Sociology) 3.9

I have professional experience in Clinical research coordination and in mental health services (direct services and treatment plan management; worked under supervision of a DO psychiatrist)

This month, I am starting a PhD in Health Sciences in England with a prestigious research grant that had a very competitive application process. I will be working under this grant for the next 3 years, during which I hope to complete the pre-requisites required for medical school.

While in England doing my PhD research, I am planning on taking the needed pre-reqs online through UNE. I can also take on-site lab courses such as biochemistry and molecular biology, but unfortunately the US-specific lab prerequisites are not available.

I have read that online pre-requisites are not ideal, but I am wondering if with a strong academic history and the completion of some on site elective science courses + labs , this might not disqualify me from some of the programs that are on the fence about online coursework.

I have not started the fellowship yet, and a part of me is wondering if I am being foolish by prioritizing this over just staying int he states and doing the lab work in person at an american uni. (I live in the bay area and could do the berkeley extension courses).

I plan to sit for the MCAT in 2021 and apply in the 2022 cycle, when finished with my PhD.

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Bonne Nuit]

Hi I am wondering if you saw some success with the UNE courses! I can describe my situation below:

Hello,

I am turning 30 this year and I am a non-traditional applicant.

I have a BA (psychology, health care inequalities) 3.89; and MA (Sociology) 3.9

I have professional experience in Clinical research coordination and in mental health services (direct services and treatment plan management; worked under supervision of a DO psychiatrist)

This month, I am starting a PhD in Health Sciences in England with a prestigious research grant that had a very competitive application process. I will be working under this grant for the next 3 years, during which I hope to complete the pre-requisites required for medical school.

While in England doing my PhD research, I am planning on taking the needed pre-reqs online through UNE. I can also take on-site lab courses such as biochemistry and molecular biology, but unfortunately the US-specific lab prerequisites are not available.

I have read that online pre-requisites are not ideal, but I am wondering if with a strong academic history and the completion of some on site elective science courses + labs , this might not disqualify me from some of the programs that are on the fence about online coursework.

I have not started the fellowship yet, and a part of me is wondering if I am being foolish by prioritizing this over just staying int he states and doing the lab work in person at an american uni. (I live in the bay area and could do the berkeley extension courses).

I plan to sit for the MCAT in 2021 and apply in the 2022 cycle, when finished with my PhD.

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

You need to call your target schools and check. Online prerequisites are simply not accepted at many medical schools. Other programs may or may not be willing to give you leeway for living abroad.

If your goal is to get into medical school, your best course of action is to take your prerequisites in person at a 4 year university. These prerequisites will be acceptable for all medical schools.

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

Hi I am wondering if you saw some success with the UNE courses! I can describe my situation below:

Hello,

I am turning 30 this year and I am a non-traditional applicant.

I have a BA (psychology, health care inequalities) 3.89; and MA (Sociology) 3.9

I have professional experience in Clinical research coordination and in mental health services (direct services and treatment plan management; worked under supervision of a DO psychiatrist)

This month, I am starting a PhD in Health Sciences in England with a prestigious research grant that had a very competitive application process. I will be working under this grant for the next 3 years, during which I hope to complete the pre-requisites required for medical school.

While in England doing my PhD research, I am planning on taking the needed pre-reqs online through UNE. I can also take on-site lab courses such as biochemistry and molecular biology, but unfortunately the US-specific lab prerequisites are not available.

I have read that online pre-requisites are not ideal, but I am wondering if with a strong academic history and the completion of some on site elective science courses + labs , this might not disqualify me from some of the programs that are on the fence about online coursework.

I have not started the fellowship yet, and a part of me is wondering if I am being foolish by prioritizing this over just staying int he states and doing the lab work in person at an american uni. (I live in the bay area and could do the berkeley extension courses).

I plan to sit for the MCAT in 2021 and apply in the 2022 cycle, when finished with my PhD.

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Plan on spending more time to complete the Ph.D. degree. Things such as that take way longer than you anticipate.

 

[ruedi]

Plan on spending more time to complete the Ph.D. degree. Things such as that take way longer than you anticipate.

well it isn't a traditional phd, it's a research fellowship with a set timeline. Funding and the structure of the program won't allow for it to go longer than 3 years. But yes absolutely, I anticipate the timeline to change over the next few years. 36 months aside, I do plan to slowly complete the prerequisites over the course of the next few years and to take the MCAT only once I'm sure I can attend med school the following year. I realize it's a bit of a make-shift plan, but I think it can work. thanks for the feedback, I agree with you.

 

[ruedi]

You need to call your target schools and check. Online prerequisites are simply not accepted at many medical schools. Other programs may or may not be willing to give you leeway for living abroad.

If your goal is to get into medical school, your best course of action is to take your prerequisites in person at a 4 year university. These prerequisites will be acceptable for all medical schools.

Thank you for the feedback! I am just not sure I can afford to pass up this opportunity, so I think I will try to find as many on-site courses with labs as possible but to complete the requisites online. I hope that doing the courses in person will illustrate my capability to do lab work at a 4 yr institution.

 

[Bonne Nuit]

Thank you for the feedback! I am just not sure I can afford to pass up this opportunity, so I think I will try to find as many on-site courses with labs as possible but to complete the requisites online. I hope that doing the courses in person will illustrate my capability to do lab work at a 4 yr institution.

You have to be careful with that approach. Unless you are absolutely certain that your state schools (and any other schools you're interested in applying to) accept online prerequisites, you could be ruining your chances for medical school. Why not take your prerequisites when you're back in the U.S.?

 

[ruedi]

yes I am contacting each school to see if they'll accept online credits. I am being clear that most, if not all, of my prereqs will be online. I am worried this will make my application less competitive but hoping that my reason will allow for some flexibility in their evaluation (I'm not just taking courses online out of convenience)

I know it isn't PERFECT, but I hope it will be "enough" to get into some DO programs that I am looking into!

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

well it isn't a traditional phd, it's a research fellowship with a set timeline. Funding and the structure of the program won't allow for it to go longer than 3 years. But yes absolutely, I anticipate the timeline to change over the next few years. 36 months aside, I do plan to slowly complete the prerequisites over the course of the next few years and to take the MCAT only once I'm sure I can attend med school the following year. I realize it's a bit of a make-shift plan, but I think it can work. thanks for the feedback, I agree with you.

I wish you the best in your endeavor.

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

yes I am contacting each school to see if they'll accept online credits. I am being clear that most, if not all, of my prereqs will be online. I am worried this will make my application less competitive but hoping that my reason will allow for some flexibility in their evaluation (I'm not just taking courses online out of convenience)

I know it isn't PERFECT, but I hope it will be "enough" to get into some DO programs that I am looking into!

It will probably be "enough" since you are a bit of a special situation. Your situation makes you stand out in a positive way and that is overall good as compared to the "routine" applicant.

Be sure to have a plan of exactly which schools you will take your online pre-requisites at before embarking down this path. I mention this because not all courses are offered during the times/semesters that you need. For example, physics 1 might only be offered during fall and not spring--this can throw you off schedule. That being said, if a student contacts me and asks for a specific course during a specific term, I make it available for them. I would recommend contacting the instructors at the institutions that you plan on taking the courses at and letting them know about your situational requirements. Also, you may want to alert the instructors that you may need to change due dates for assignments in order to fit your research/project schedule.

And by the way, full-time research will take almost all of the energy out of you (trust me, I've been there) leaving you with little energy to do courses. Be wary of overloading/over-committing yourself.

 

[ruedi]

It will probably be "enough" since you are a bit of a special situation. Your situation makes you stand out in a positive way and that is overall good as compared to the "routine" applicant.

Be sure to have a plan of exactly which schools you will take your online pre-requisites at before embarking down this path. I mention this because not all courses are offered during the times/semesters that you need. For example, physics 1 might only be offered during fall and not spring--this can throw you off schedule. That being said, if a student contacts me and asks for a specific course during a specific term, I make it available for them. I would recommend contacting the instructors at the institutions that you plan on taking the courses at and letting them know about your situational requirements. Also, you may want to alert the instructors that you may need to change due dates for assignments in order to fit your research/project schedule.

And by the way, full-time research will take almost all of the energy out of you (trust me, I've been there) leaving you with little energy to do courses. Be wary of overloading/over-committing yourself.

Thank you for taking the time to weigh in on this! I definitely plan to start the PhD without any pre-req course commitments in order to gain a better understanding of which semesters I'll be the most available to split my time between the fellowship duties and the online coursework. I am reaching out to programs individually, and hope to hear back from at least 15-20 that say that online coursework won't be an issue.

I am curious about top programs, such as NYU, which list no specific course requirements and state that they look at competencies in areas such as chemistry, biology and physics and a high MCAT score. I may be too ambitious in my anticipation, but I hope that I can do well on the MCAT and with the successful (again, hopeful!) completion of a PhD in health sciences will "excuse" my not doing the pre-requisite coursework onsite at a 4 year institution.

Again, thank you very much for bringing up the timing and balance that it will take to pull this off.

 

[ruedi]

I wish you the best in your endeavor.

Thank you

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

Thank you for taking the time to weigh in on this! I definitely plan to start the PhD without any pre-req course commitments in order to gain a better understanding of which semesters I'll be the most available to split my time between the fellowship duties and the online coursework. I am reaching out to programs individually, and hope to hear back from at least 15-20 that say that online coursework won't be an issue.

I am curious about top programs, such as NYU, which list no specific course requirements and state that they look at competencies in areas such as chemistry, biology and physics and a high MCAT score. I may be too ambitious in my anticipation, but I hope that I can do well on the MCAT and with the successful (again, hopeful!) completion of a PhD in health sciences will "excuse" my not doing the pre-requisite coursework onsite at a 4 year institution.

Again, thank you very much for bringing up the timing and balance that it will take to pull this off.

If you want to reach out to me and start a conversation, I would be happy to share some situation-specific advice for your pre-requisite courses.

 

[kbRD2MD84]

It will probably be "enough" since you are a bit of a special situation. Your situation makes you stand out in a positive way and that is overall good as compared to the "routine" applicant.

Totally agree. If online courses weren't a thing, I wouldn't be able to go after that dream right now. I'm very upfront about it (and why) with the schools I'm applying to, specifically only applying to those that honor online courses, and you know what? I'm crazy enough to think it will work.

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

Totally agree. If online courses weren't a thing, I wouldn't be able to go after that dream right now. I'm very upfront about it (and why) with the schools I'm applying to, specifically only applying to those that honor online courses, and you know what? I'm crazy enough to think it will work.

The lines between online and on-ground are getting blurrier. As far as accreditation goes, online and on-ground and hybrid courses are accredited the same at the institution that I teach at. My online and on-ground students take the same tests and do the same labs, so there should be no difference in their learning outcomes...I am currently gathering data to support this assertion.

 

[venusdream]

I use commercially available lab kits from vendors such as eScienceLabs, Hands-On-Labs, and Carolina Biological. I encourage you to look on their websites and take a look at the products they offer. I think you will be impressed by the variety of labs that students can do at home using basic equipment. For example, weak/acid strong base titrations are done using vinegar and a solution of NaOH. Students get to use a pocket-size pH meter. Equilibrium constants (and solubility) are measured electrochemically using a $10 digital voltmeter (similar to the kind one can buy at Harbor Freight). There are also lab kits for physics too.

I should mention that a few years ago, I was skeptical about the quality of lab kits, but my opinion did change once I found out more about it.

At the community college I teach at, I do allow online students to come to campus and do on-ground labs. We can make these arrangements since I teach at a small school.

This is a very questionable practice. Many chemicals are corrosive, flammable, toxic and harmful to the environment. They must be properly handled, stored and disposed in a setting that is supervised by qualified personnel.

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

This is a very questionable practice. Many chemicals are corrosive, flammable, toxic and harmful to the environment. They must be properly handled, stored and disposed in a setting that is supervised by qualified personnel.

Almost all of the chemicals used in the lab kits are readily available from hardware stores and home improvement stores. For example, calcium chloride is used and that is also sold as a de-icer at the local TruValue store. Part of the challenge of developing these lab kits is to have the chemicals be as innocuous as possible.

To put things in perspective, your car battery and drain cleaner (which you should never use, by the way) contain sulfuric acid. Your cell phone contains toxic lithium and your car's gas tank contains extremely flammable gasoline.