Organic Chemistry 2: D+ and F

[lotusktn]

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On the UNE website, it states, "All prerequisite courses must be successfully completed with a grade of "C" or better."

I took Organic Chemistry II twice and received a D+ and F. With the grade replacement change, I'm not sure if I should take it a third time or where to go from here. Yes, I have struggled during my undergrad and before deciding to post, I have realized reinvention is needed.

 

[SergeantBuzzKill]

It sounds like you already know what you need to do then. I’m not completely sure about this, but I don’t think every DO school requires OrgoII as a prerequisite. However, that said, doing worse the second time around is a huge red flag.

 

[NOBO]

Do you know why you did so poorly both times? There has to be a reason. It's rare for someone to do worse on retake. You need 2 semesters of organic chem, so don't retake it unless you find out why you failed the course twice.

 

[Blanky]

It is painfully obvious that you have not learned any of the material. You don't just need to show reinvention you literally need to become a student.

 

[Robin-jay]

On the UNE website, it states, "All prerequisite courses must be successfully completed with a grade of "C" or better."

I took Organic Chemistry II twice and received a D+ and F. With the grade replacement change, I'm not sure if I should take it a third time or where to go from here. Yes, I have struggled during my undergrad and before deciding to post, I have realized reinvention is needed.

I taught orgo chemistry, and usually when people earn an "F", there is some attendance issues. In lecture and lab.

If you earn an "F" in a retake after earning a "D-", I would suspect attendance issues being the biggest problem. If your attendance is fine, then you need to get tutors ASAP and try harder...

 

[I'mJustCurious]

Get a tutor and go to the learning center to find ways to ace the class. Also, maybe take the course with a different teacher or institution.

 

[Blanky]

He’s taking it online both times...

 

[Robin-jay]

He’s taking it online both times...

What a terrible way to learn organic chemistry.

 

[precisiongraphic]

On the UNE website, it states, "All prerequisite courses must be successfully completed with a grade of "C" or better."

I took Organic Chemistry II twice and received a D+ and F. With the grade replacement change, I'm not sure if I should take it a third time or where to go from here. Yes, I have struggled during my undergrad and before deciding to post, I have realized reinvention is needed.

Albert Einstein is reported to have said “The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results”.

Take a step back and examine other class results, other study methods, other successes other failures. Then, if possible, see an academic counselor (at a local CC).

Next, start working on Organic Chemistry as a Second Language by Klein (1st and 2nd semester) available on Amazon. You need to be rock solid on semester one concepts.
Don't use your former textbook to review, unless you never read it the first time. The idea is to approach the material in a new way.

Then, follow the syllabus for MIT's MOOC here or some other MOOC. Do the work for OChem I and OChem II.

If you can't get at least a B (80%) in your self-study do not take the class again for credit. Get a tutor and take it in person when the tutor thinks you're ready.

But I have to be realistic (and maybe you do too) that if you can't get a C+ or better maybe med school is not in your future.

 

[Robin-jay]

Albert Einstein is reported to have said “The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results”.

Take a step back and examine other class results, other study methods, other successes other failures. Then, if possible, see an academic counselor (at a local CC).

Next, start working on Organic Chemistry as a Second Language by Klein (1st and 2nd semester) available on Amazon. You need to be rock solid on semester one concepts.
Don't use your former textbook to review, unless you never read it the first time. The idea is to approach the material in a new way.

Then, follow the syllabus for MIT's MOOC here or some other MOOC. Do the work for OChem I and OChem II.

If you can't get at least a B (80%) in your self-study do not take the class again for credit. Get a tutor and take it in person when the tutor thinks you're ready.

But I have to be realistic (and maybe you do too) that if you can't get a C+ or better maybe med school is not in your future.

For basic organic chemistry, Khan academy videos should do wonders.

 

[precisiongraphic]

For basic organic chemistry, Khan academy videos should do wonders.

I agree, though I wonder if it's a step-by-step plan (I'm not too familiar with the series.) Basically I was trying to give OP a step-by-step plan.

 

[adrenocorticotropicana]

stop trying to memorize all the reactions in their every single iteration and try to see the overarching concepts and the individual variants in which they get expressed

 

[CharmCity94]

stop trying to memorize all the reactions in their every single iteration and try to see the overarching concepts and the individual variants in which they get expressed

Cannot emphasize this enough. One you get the basics down and the properties and trends of atoms/small molecules, it gets infinitely easier. I studied super hard on Orgo I, got an A and mastered the basics, which made Orgo II a breeze. Go back and study Orgo I before you retake (if you do).

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

On the UNE website, it states, "All prerequisite courses must be successfully completed with a grade of "C" or better."

I took Organic Chemistry II twice and received a D+ and F. With the grade replacement change, I'm not sure if I should take it a third time or where to go from here. Yes, I have struggled during my undergrad and before deciding to post, I have realized reinvention is needed.

Perhaps a different instructional method would help you? Do you think you would do better if all assignments/tests were take home and open-book, open-notes, open-internet as well as being encouraged to consult with others?

The reason I ask these questions is that not every student does well in a traditional lecture/exam situation. And the real world is definitely not a traditional lecture/exam situation.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

On the UNE website, it states, "All prerequisite courses must be successfully completed with a grade of "C" or better."

I took Organic Chemistry II twice and received a D+ and F. With the grade replacement change, I'm not sure if I should take it a third time or where to go from here. Yes, I have struggled during my undergrad and before deciding to post, I have realized reinvention is needed.

If you want to be a doctor, you need to pass O Chem II. If not, you won't be a doctor. It's as simple as that

 

[alprazoslam]

If you want to be a doctor, you need to pass O Chem II. If not, you won't be a doctor. It's as simple as that

The most painful words ever haha

 

[Norwood-Sano]

Hey man, I'm a firm believer that its never over, we all have hurdles and it takes some time to recognize our strengths and weaknesses.

You are already aware that some reinvention is necessary, that's good.

I haven't read all the other posts in detail but it sounds like you took it online? I would 86 that the next time for sure.

Also, not sure what your studying habits look like, but I would study for this like the apocalypse was among you. Go to any additional learning sessions offered by the school, TA or whatever, even when it's on something you think you know inside and out. When in doubt, do it again...and then again.

Food for comfort: 1st attempt at Physics I : W
2nd attempt at Physics I: C

1st attempt at Physics II: W
2nd attempt at Physics II: B+

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

Hey man, I'm a firm believer that its never over, we all have hurdles and it takes some time to recognize our strengths and weaknesses.

You are already aware that some reinvention is necessary, that's good.

I haven't read all the other posts in detail but it sounds like you took it online? I would 86 that the next time for sure.

Also, not sure what your studying habits look like, but I would study for this like the apocalypse was among you. Go to any additional learning sessions offered by the school, TA or whatever, even when it's on something you think you know inside and out. When in doubt, do it again...and then again.

Food for comfort: 1st attempt at Physics I : W
2nd attempt at Physics I: C

1st attempt at Physics II: W
2nd attempt at Physics II: B+

I recommend "pre-studying" the material or taking an online course (if you want/need a more structure).

 

[Magus5454]

I recommend "pre-studying" the material or taking an online course (if you want/need a more structure).

OP took it online, I think that was the issue

 

[foreverlearner02]

I failed orgo the first time and 4.0ed the second time and I can say my biggest issues were #1 attendance #2 passive studying #3 go to office hours or a tutor or classmate and get real time help
You can do it! Find where you're struggling and change it. And if you have no idea what you're doing wrong, start with going to every lecture (even if it seems like a waste) and paying attention, doing every practice problem, and seeking help from someone and ask all the stupid questions that you need to. Find a study buddy if possible.

 

[Magus5454]

Why?

I was just replying to someone who suggested online

 

[precisiongraphic]

I really dont see a problem with online courses. Even if you dont take it online, most students just show up for exams and study completely on their own.

My first year at Med school is completely "online". Vast majority of people show up for exams only. We watch recorded lectures or use other materials. I know some people that dont even watch recorded lectures or even look at slides and handouts. They use outside sources and do just fine on exams.

So, I really dont see a problem with online learning. It depends on the student: how they study, how long, what strategies they use , etc.

I love online classes (I've taken online classes and as a professor I teach online classes). But OP (who hasn't been seen since the original post) took these classes online and got an F and a D. She needs to get a new strategy, which in my opinion, should only include in-person classes with or without a tutor.

 

[precisiongraphic]

How, realistically, in-person classes would change anything if student won't change their study habits and strategies. In-person OChem classes, are just 1 hour lectures 3 times a week or so across all undergrad schools. How would that change anything? Complete waste of time. Most tutors are also a waste of time (unless you find a really good one). There are tons of online resources that can help better than that. OChem is the class that really requires student to have a good strategy and just work on those end-of chapter problems.

My suggestions were to try something different. Maybe she doesnt have good study habits and won't change. Maybe a tutor won't help. But if they're going to try again they should try a new tactic. Sometimes it works, sometimes it won't.

 

[stickgirl390]

It’s interesting how many people are anchoring on attendance being the issue. Anyone with enough self discipline and motivation can teach themselves ochem 2 without attending a single class. The issue is, that amount of self discipline is extremely high and not many people have it, hence universities making money off an in-person course.

I just don’t want OP to get the impression that making his/her rear-end meet a seat in a lecture hall every day means they’re going to see a grade increase for certain. Sure a change of strategy will help, but the majority of OPs success has to come from within.

 

[puahate]

It’s interesting how many people are anchoring on attendance being the issue. Anyone with enough self discipline and motivation can teach themselves ochem 2 without attending a single class. The issue is, that amount of self discipline is extremely high and not many people have it, hence universities making money off an in-person course.

I just don’t want OP to get the impression that making his/her rear-end meet a seat in a lecture hall every day means they’re going to see a grade increase for certain. Sure a change of strategy will help, but the majority of OPs success has to come from within.

Ok, that doesnt make the advice of taking an in person class invalid though. The immedidate goal is to pass the class. If in person helps then it helps.

I agree tho most of ochem i did just use the online lectures but office hours were critical for a decent amount of people as well.

 

[Robin-jay]

It’s interesting how many people are anchoring on attendance being the issue. Anyone with enough self discipline and motivation can teach themselves ochem 2 without attending a single class.

Give me an example of a science course in which one could not learn if they didn't go to class.

The significance in most science courses is the labs.

 

[stickgirl390]

Give me an example of a science course in which one could not learn if they didn't go to class.

The significance in most science courses is the labs.

My point exactly

 

[Magus5454]

My whole point was OP tried online. Twice.it didnt work for them

 

[de Ribas]

My whole point was OP tried online. Twice.it didnt work for them

Still, it doesn't mean the problem is taking a course online.

OP could do it wrong twice.

Also, lots of students that take on campus OChem classes still fail.

At my med school, most of students take classes "online" and do just fine.

 

[Mike Bagwell]

Take orgo at a CC.

 

[Biochemistry69]

OP,
I ****ed up a few times during undergrad. I'm a person of extremes, so I either really excel, or I really fall hard. My advice for you is to learn to welcome failure. "Failure" is a fancy word for "opportunity to grow and become stronger". We all fail. What you do with this failure is what matters. Sit down and reflect:
Why did you do so poorly? Certainly not because you're stupid. You made it to organic chemistry 2, and you're smart enough to seek help from SDN. Did you have too much fun? Did you study like everyone else does?
How does failing make you feel? Don't define yourself by your failure, but allow yourself to observe the sting.
What are the steps you will take to show us that you have grown? Perhaps it's best to stop going out until you can get your grades in order. It sucks, but failing organic chemistry 2 for a third time is going to suck even more. Do you have a set plan? How will you change your studying? If you want medicine, you will do whatever it takes to come out on top.

One of the biggest problems with premeds that I've seen at my school is that they don't know that they're being judged as decision makers when submitting their app. Acknowledge your limitations and act accordingly. Overwhelming yourself impresses no one. When in doubt, play it safe. This is a marathon, not a sprint. Move too fast and you'll fall right into the hole at the finish line that you could have seen had you gone slower and took your time.

As far as studying advice, do away with the flashcards. Flashcards help you memorize single reactions, but **** gets real when you have a 8 step synthesis problem and you have to integrate everything you've learned (which will be hard since you haven't practiced integrating these steps together). Read your textbook. Don't have one? The Klein book is the GOAT book and you can find it for free if you go where smart people go for free stuff 🙂. Do all of your assigned book problems. Hell, do them twice or even three times. Assign yourself extra problems and go over your notes. Allow yourself to get stuck and frustrated. Frustration means you're trying, and as time goes on, you WILL get better as your brain adjusts to recalling all this information. Growth mindset, friend. This is the formula for success.

 

[chemphysicsinstructor]

On the UNE website, it states, "All prerequisite courses must be successfully completed with a grade of "C" or better."

I took Organic Chemistry II twice and received a D+ and F. With the grade replacement change, I'm not sure if I should take it a third time or where to go from here. Yes, I have struggled during my undergrad and before deciding to post, I have realized reinvention is needed.

If the online UNE courses do not suit your learning style, then perhaps try a different online course with a different learning/teaching style? Not all online courses are the same. Some are strict and proctored while others are open book, open notes, open internet, and you are encouraged to consult with others. As a teacher, I realize that students do better when they find courses that best suit their educational/learning style.